Social Swamp's Social Thread 3 - And now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...

[ChikoLad]

Skinship

"In Japan and Korea, the term "skinship" is used to describe the intimacy, or closeness, between a mother and a child. Today, the word is generally used for bonding through physical contact, such as holding hands, hugging, or parents washing their child at a bath. The earliest citation of this word appears in Nihon Kokugo Daijiten in 1971."

They are doing a little more than holding hands

"used to describe intimacy and closeness"

Which is exactly what the skin-shipping in FE Fates represents.

Just like kissing, there are different versions and contexts for it. FE Fates depicts a romantic one, as opposed to a maternal one described here.

Yes, it goes into sexual territory with some of the quotes, but the localisation team should have just cut those and not the entire feature.

 

[Baskerville]

Not even a bid deal to me. Getting the game anyway. I just have a negative opinion towards the change.

but thanks for randomly popping up to choose the "mock" option

It is what I do.
*thumbs up*

 

[Luigi The President]

I bet you some goons are losing their minds over the censorship and demanding riots against Nintendo for the Fire Emblem Fates "censorship". Like it wasn't for the better.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

"used to describe intimacy and closeness"

Which is exactly what the skin-shipping in FE Fates represents.

Just like kissing, there are different versions and contexts for it. FE Fates depicts a romantic one, as opposed to a maternal one described here.

Yes, it goes into sexual territory with some of the quotes, but the localisation team should have just cut those and not the entire feature.

You know what, I don't really care they removed it

It's creepy

 

[Coricus]

I wouldn't go that far and say he was somewhat right but it's just that they don't know when to hold their damn water and know when to say stop.

I mean Hyrule Warriors has cleavage all over place but it doesn't feel really weird because it's just fun fanservice and didn't have a "rub Cia's boingy bits" section to increase strength.

What upsets me is that Awakening didn't go that far in design characters (maybe Aversa and Tharaja but they are tame compared to Camila no matter how much I have a guilty pleasure for her) and features and it's gonna get blamed for this

It's like wherever are, there is controversy

. . .Should I have never bothered asking for Fates for my birthday and making Corrin my avatar?

Is trying to like this game going to get the same response liking the Sonic series does?


. . .am I allowed to like anything at all. . . :'/

 

[Z25]

The whole bikini thing with Lin is honestly the stupidest thing I have ever heard. If I were to go to a beach in the summer, I guarantee you, every 13yr old I find there, would be in a bikini.

Hell even parents of much younger girls will have them in Bikinis.

It's just really stupid and a huge overeaction to such a simple and no risque matter.

 

[Strofirko]

People complain about sexy interactions being otaku pandering.
People complain about the nintendo series not being mature enough.
Nintendo just can't win.

 

[IceBreakerXY]

Just wanna say we live in the united States of America.13 year old girls wear the same amount if not less than that when at the Beach... sometimes on the street so excuse me by not being bother that some virtual girl is wearing a skimpy two piece. People are quick to angry over little things

 

[Captain Shwampy]

I dont understand the waifu/husbando complaints

Marriage is a main stay in FE and has always been since FE4 I believe

Get over it

Children tho?
Get rid of that unless there's a good reason to have them in like Genealogy

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

People complain about sexy interactions being otaku pandering.
People complain about the nintendo series not being mature enough.
Nintendo just can't win.

Since when is that the definition of mature?

 

[ChikoLad]

. . .Should I have never bothered asking for Fates for my birthday and making Corrin my avatar?

Is trying to like this game going to get the same response liking the Sonic series does?


. . .am I allowed to like anything at all. . . :'/

It's 2016 man.

The "you can't like Sonic" meme ended a loooooong time ago.

Especially since Ruby took over the social media, and with the 25th Anniversary coming up.

Since when is that the definition of mature?

The issue is that people demand mature things, Nintendo puts things that classify as that in games, and people complain.

Because they never defined what they meant by "mature" in the first place.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The whole bikini thing with Lin is honestly the stupidest thing I have ever heard. If I were to go to a beach in the summer, I guarantee you, every 13yr old I find there, would be in a bikini.

Hell even parents of much younger girls will have them in Bikinis.

It's just really stupid and a huge overeaction to such a simple and no risque matter.

It's because of the nature of the swimsuit. It has underboob and a crotch cut. Ew. If it was a sensible swimsuit, it wouldn't matter.

 

[Frostwraith]

The face-rubbing has obvious sexual undertones. Like, it's obvious.

Characters blushing, sexual innuendo in the characters' lines, the use of sparkles which is often used in Japanese media to indicate a character is feeling excited (which given the context only furthers the sexual connotations).

And the fact it's used to strengthen the bonds between the character and the player's avatar... When the player is touching the character's face.

It's not just the feature itself, but the whole context and the way it's presented.

Uuuh... That's not even true in the slightest. Putting minors in risqué clothing has been a thing in Japan for as long as I can remember. Face petting is really tame. In real ecchi/hentai games it's way worse.

Hence, why I did say "in a sense". Those features are shoehorned and only for the sake of pandering to otakus.

I don't agree with MTP, by the way, and hate the guy. By no means hentai either, but still shoehorned and nonsensical in the context.

I'm also aware of the cultural differences, as Shroob pointed out. Speaking of XCX, I did disagree with the removal of the breast slider. It was a stupid decision.

I wouldn't go that far and say he was somewhat right but it's just that they don't know when to hold their damn water and know when to say stop.

I mean Hyrule Warriors has cleavage all over place but it doesn't feel really weird because it's just fun fanservice and didn't have a "rub Cia's boingy bits" section to increase strength.

What upsets me is that Awakening didn't go that far in design characters (maybe Aversa and Tharaja but they are tame compared to Camila no matter how much I have a guilty pleasure for her) and features and it's gonna get blamed for this

It's like wherever are, there is controversy

Agreed. Awakening had fanservice, but it was tame. Yeah, there was Tharja and Aversa, who are fanservicey characters and all, but no big deal. They're sexy ladies. Nothing wrong with sexy ladies. (I do hate Tharja as a character, though Aversa is actually one of my favorite ones.)

Likewise with HW's Cia or Bayonetta in Smash. I don't feel there's anything wrong with sexy characters. For the record, I don't mind Camilla either.

Face-rubbing does rub me the wrong way. (Pun was intentional, by the way.)

I don't know, it just feels wrong and unnecessary for the game. It's catering to the kind of otaku who have body pillows of their favorite fictional characters.

 

[Champ Gold]

. . .Should I have never bothered asking for Fates for my birthday and making Corrin my avatar?

Is trying to like this game going to get the same response liking the Sonic series does?


. . .am I allowed to like anything at all. . . :'/

No I think Fates is decent and fun game but it's just the so many craziness tied to it makes it harder to enjoy from sense anymore.

For God sakes, I love Camila's design and would be upset if she got neutered just for no reason

 

[Coricus]

People complain about sexy interactions being otaku pandering.
People complain about the nintendo series not being mature enough.
Nintendo just can't win.

Either they want only want Gorn and Gorn alone in their Nintendo games, or Nintendo is the Devil and indies/Sony/Microsoft are our perfect saviors and can never, ever, EVER do any wrong.

 

[Strofirko]

Since when is that the definition of mature?

Since when fantasy series like "the witcher " started bring "sex interactions" on the table and the average western gamer started demanding more just because.

 

[Z25]

It's because of the nature of the swimsuit. It has underboob and a crotch cut. Ew. If it was a sensible swimsuit, it wouldn't matter.

Oh I know what it looks like. I've seen a lot more disgusting one's at beaches. I honestly don't think it really mattered. Plus it's an optional outfit, it's not like it's forced. Either way I don't care much, as the game is still really good.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Oh I know what it looks like. I've seen a lot more disgusting one's at beaches. I honestly don't think it really mattered. Plus it's an optional outfit, it's not like it's forced. Either way I don't care much, as the game is still really good.

It should never be an option. Was removed in the original too to my knowledge.

Glad it's gone, though. Optional outfits still should have standards, basically.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Oh I know what it looks like. I've seen a lot more disgusting one's at beaches. I honestly don't think it really mattered. Plus it's an optional outfit, it's not like it's forced. Either way I don't care much, as the game is still really good.

Just because it's accepted in public doesnt mean it's acceptable as a product that WILL be scrutinized, by both critics and consumers.

And even then for a lot of people that isn't acceptable.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

All this waifu talk reminds me of based TP's ****posts

@DanganJacob Strange
Let's take the make-up off and
GASP pic.twitter.com/jSF7bC8qn9

— TP (@MasterTP1) January 25, 2016

 

[Schnee117]

Either they want only want Gorn and Gorn alone in their Nintendo games, or Nintendo is the Devil and indies/Sony/Microsoft are our perfect saviors and can never, ever, EVER do any wrong.

It's the latter (usually born out of sheer ignorance too) but take MS out of the "perfect saviours"
MS are typically treated as the devil because of something that's nearly 3 years old now.

 

[ChikoLad]

The face-rubbing has obvious sexual undertones. Like, it's obvious.

Characters blushing, sexual innuendo in the characters' lines, the use of sparkles which is often used in Japanese media to indicate a character is feeling excited (which given the context only furthers the sexual connotations).

And the fact it's used to strengthen the bonds between the character and the player's avatar... When the player is touching the character's face.

It's not just the feature itself, but the whole context and the way it's presented.

Blushing isn't sexual by nature. People very often blush in the context of pure romantic love, and skin-shipping is a form of "confession" and expression of romantic love.
The "excitement sparkles" would have more connotations to romantic/general excitement than sexual (which is usually denoted by something like a nose bleed). Really you're definitely reaching with that one.

The lines are the only sexual aspect here, and removing/changing them to more obviously indicate romantic affection as opposed to lust, would have fixed the whole issue for prudes in the West. Since skin-shipping itself does not seem to be the issue for most, it's more the lines that make it into a sexual context (and the lines themselves are often overly corny even for erotic material).

 

[Captain Shwampy]

Funny how I can go watch a movie like Hateful Eight and see the whole audience in the theater laugh their butts off when the one of the characters gets their heads blown off or when they laughed at Kurt Russel character elbowing a girl in the face and messing her face up

But apparently a silly face rubbing minigame where you blow on the mic to your fav FE characters face is TOO much to handle for some people

 

[Z25]

It should never be an option. Was removed in the original too to my knowledge.

Glad it's gone, though. Optional outfits still should have standards, basically.

Fair enough, and I'm pretty sure the Japanese version has it.

Just because it's accepted in public doesnt mean it's acceptable as a product that WILL be scrutinized, by both critics and consumers.

And even then for a lot of people that isn't acceptable.

Again fair enough, but it may not be acceptable, but at the same time, no one called for it's removement either.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Since when fantasy series like "the witcher " started bring "sex interactions" on the table and the average western gamer started demanding more just because.

They have to display it in a mature manner for it to be mature

A child can talk about sex but that doesn't make his conversation mature

They are displaying their "Mature content" in a childish manner

 

[Z25]

So gamexplain, posted a translated version of the Detective chu trailer:

 

[Frostwraith]

My problem with Fates is that the face-rubbing and that crap is out of place for FE.

It's not even the marriage stuff, which is essentially an extension of the support system that's been around for a good while in the series. The supports need better writing as of Awakening, though. Same for the characters overall.

If the face rubbing was completely optional, with no effects on the gameplay, I probably wouldn't have minded it as much, though I'd still criticize it for being otaku bait, shoehorned into the game for no plausible reason.

The fact there was divide in the development team about this speaks volumes about how distasteful it is. FE is not a ****ing dating sim for players to imagine relationships with fictional characters through their self-insert character. It's an SRPG. It should be treated as such.

But I'm done talking about this crap. I'm not getting FE Fates anyway, so the game can cause all the noise, but I don't care. I'll be into the FE series once it becomes a strategy game again with memorable characters, emphasis on managing the army and resources and so on.

Blushing isn't sexual by nature. People very often blush in the context of pure romantic love, and skin-shipping is a form of "confession" and expression of romantic love.
The "excitement sparkles" would have more connotations to romantic/general excitement than sexual (which is usually denoted by something like a nose bleed). Really you're definitely reaching with that one.

The lines are the only sexual aspect here, and removing/changing them to more obviously indicate romantic affection as opposed to lust, would have fixed the whole issue for prudes in the West. Since skin-shipping itself does not seem to be the issue for most, it's more the lines that make it into a sexual context (and the lines themselves are often overly corny even for erotic material).

It's still in poor taste and unnecessary in a strategy game about warfare, managing an army and so on.

It's still done in a way that the player's self-insert is rubbing the other characters' face for no reason whatsoever.

The player, who's the commander of the army, spends the time privately rubbing the subordinate's faces. Like it makes sense.

If this was a game about dating people and love, yeah, it would be alright since that's the point of such games. In a strategy game about warfare, it's out of place and shoehorned only to cater to certain audiences.

But I'm done talking about this. Don't bother replying about this. I don't like it and I want to stay away from this kind of stuff. I'll probably miss out on an otherwise great game, which is admittedly a disappointment (even for me), but I've made a decision.

I'm not supporting the FE series with my money if it continues to go down this path.

 

[BandanaWaddleDee]

I swear Detective Pikachu sounds like Sanji from One Piece

 

[Deleted member]

Characters blushing

If blushing means sexual intercourse, I've gotten laid more times than any of you in here

 

[Cutie Gwen]

My problem with Fates is that the face-rubbing and that crap is out of place for FE.

It's not even the marriage stuff, which is essentially an extension of the support system that's been around for a good while in the series. The supports need better writing as of Awakening, though. Same for the characters overall.

If the face rubbing was completely optional, with no effects on the gameplay, I probably wouldn't have minded it as much, though I'd still criticize it for being otaku bait, shoehorned into the game for no plausible reason.

The fact there was divide in the development team about this speaks volumes about how distasteful it is. FE is not a ****ing dating sim for players to imagine relationships with fictional characters through their self-insert character. It's an SRPG. It should be treated as such.

But I'm done talking about this crap. I'm not getting FE Fates anyway, so the game can cause all the noise, but I don't care. I'll be into the FE series once it becomes a strategy game again with memorable characters, emphasis on managing the army and resources and so on.


It's still in poor taste and unnecessary in a strategy game about warfare, managing an army and so on.

It's still done in a way that the player's self-insert is rubbing the other characters' face for no reason whatsoever.

The player, who's the commander of the army, spends the time privately rubbing the subordinate's faces. Like it makes sense.

If this was a game about dating people and love, yeah, it would be alright since that's the point of such games. In a strategy game about warfare, it's out of place and shoehorned only to cater to certain audiences.

But I'm done talking about this. Don't bother replying about this. I don't like it and I want to stay away from this kind of stuff. I'll probably miss out on an otherwise great game, which is admittedly a disappointment (even for me), but I've made a decision.

I'm not supporting the FE series with my money if it continues to go down this path.

So...You aren't getting Fates because of your hatred of the thing they took out in your version. And STILL whining on and on about the 'muh otaku bait' IGNORING how EVERYONE complained about it, ergo, it WILL change in future installments. Just go demod yourself so I can finally block you

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I don't think I've ever blushed

 

[Fenriraga]

Really hope I don't get any misunderstandings from this, but...

I'm actually pretty peeved it's removed. Not because I wanted to feel up some girl, or because I feel it's required, but... It's a portion of the game that they removed entirely due to censorship. That's what bothers me.

I mean look, dumb premise aside, it WAS a way to build relationships/affinity with your party members that had a means of boosting that. It was a way to help grind out affinity ranks and such (Oh god did I just say grind out for something like this)

Even if it WASN'T used to help build relationships, it is still a part of the entire, 40 dollar package that localization literally tore out and went "nope, you can't have it" even with how long we have been waiting for them to translate this damn game. Sure, in the grand scheme of things it's maybe taking away like 2 dollars worth of the 40 dollar package, but considering I have to buy TWO VERSIONS OF THIS GAME AND A DLC PATH in order to get the full story here, I'd prefer to have ALL the features the game has

I'm not like, devistated about this or anything, but there at LEAST needed to be something they added to justify ripping out content and making us wait MONTHS while they did so. It's why games like XCX gave us all the DLC , or Kingdom Hearts giving (timed) exclusive bosses to the western releases of 1 and BBS.

 

[Naoshi]

So...You aren't getting Fates because of your hatred of the thing they took out in your version. And STILL whining on and on about the 'muh otaku bait' IGNORING how EVERYONE complained about it, ergo, it WILL change in future installments. Just go demod yourself so I can finally block you

uh geez thats going a bit too far don't you think?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

uh geez thats going a bit too far don't you think?

Not when I've disliked the user since I met them and could never block their posts which I hate

 

[Captain Shwampy]

Replace Face rubbing with Meme jokes

Talk through the 3ds mic about funny memes with you favorite FE characters

 

[Coricus]

Honestly, after having been in one of the milder sects of the Sonic fandom for a couple years I think it's safe to say that any instance of people ranting about how much they hate that something has changed and that they're going to bail because they hate it so much now is a pretty big trigger for me.

Or hearing people incessantly mock and insult a game that they literally know nothing about except that other people hate it.

Or the concept of nostalgia in general.


Everything about the FE meltdown is giving me PTSD right now and it's making me a little sick to my stomach.

Fire Emblem "fans" are essentially identical to Sonic "fans" at this point.

I don't approve of the fanservice either, but I've taken too much psychological damage in the past to tolerate this kind of response to it as I'm getting massive Deja Vu.

Sonic Fans, FE Fans, Smash Fans, Pokémon Fans: You're all the same. All of you. You say you're fans, but you sputter venom from every word without any substance or aim to it. You all exist solely to destroy the series' you are supposedly fans of instead of attempt to rescue it from the depths like any true fan would at least vaguely try to.

Then again, considering all the other horrible things the human race does, perhaps it shouldn't be a surprise that we as a species are incapable of level-headed, comprehensible construsctive criticism. I have to wonder if anyone even counts as sentient, we seem to solely act based upon predation and a mating instinct with no higher calling whatsoever.

. . .Aurgh.

 

[A Distant Demon]

So...You aren't getting Fates because of your hatred of the thing they took out in your version. And STILL whining on and on about the 'muh otaku bait' IGNORING how EVERYONE complained about it, ergo, it WILL change in future installments. Just go demod yourself so I can finally block you

This . . .was both unnecessary and rude.

There are much less hostile ways to tell someone to change a little.

Not when I've disliked the user since I met them and could never block their posts which I hate

Dislking someone doesnt give you the right to be rude

 

[Shroob]

A friend pointed out that some companies are already poking fun at the removal of the petting feature.

https://twitter.com/sekaiproject/status/692063916554194948

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

If blushing means sexual intercourse, I've gotten laid more times than any of you in here

No, no you haven't.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I've ultimately made my decision against getting Fates.

I've never played a Fire Emblem game before, but I would like to get into the series sometime. I'm perfectly fine with the Marriage feature in Awakening, but the features that were implemented in Fates take things in a direction that I don't personally like.

That's just the boat that I'm in. I have nothing to add to my views on whether or not I believe it has a place in the FE series.