Time for Round 31 grades!
psb123's grades:
Po Town by Ya Boi Guzma
Iconic Status: 4/5
Maybe I'm being a bit critical, but for as memorable as Team Skull is, they are so for their mannerisms rather than there home base. A high score for Po Town still fits since it's such a team skull heavy location. But on your journey you don't spend a lot of time here and without Team Skull, it's kind of a generic spooky mansion. A high score for sure. But not a full one.
Originality: 8/10
This one's kind of a weird one to grade on originality for me. Technically speaking it doesn't really have anything going on besides a big platform to fight on. But at the same time that also means it doesn't have any problematic gimmicks that do more harm then good. Plus, there isn't really anything inherently wrong with simple stages like this anyway. Truth be told, there aren't a lot of Pokemon stages that go for this level of simplicity. So in that regard, this would actually me one of the most unique Pokemon stages in Smash Bros.
There are some good factors in this category, and some questionable factors. I think an 8 works out well enough.
Playability: 10/10
A simple layout with no gimmicks or iffy design typically leads to no issues in Playability. And that's exactly the case with this stage.
Overall Score: 22/25
And yes guys, I know this stage was submitted by
Kevandre
, not Guzma
Sprout Tower by
TKOWL
Iconic Status: 5/5
An early game area that has a lot tied to the first gym and seems like one of Gold and Silvers most notable landmarks. Looks like this stage was considered for Melee for a reason.
Originality: 10/10
I mean yeah the layout has got some similarities to Tomodachi Life. But at the same time it's got enough differences and the layout of Tomodachi Life doesn't tilt. Day & Night Cycle with fitting Pokemon cameos for both is a nice touch as well.
Playability: 9/10
This score is mainly because of the tilting. I think the amount of time the stage spends tilted is reasonable enough. But it is the kind of hazard that just prevents a perfect playability score by nature.
Overall Score: 24/25
Battle Royal Arena by
GolisoPower
Iconic Status: 3/5
Well it does feature the faces of some notable Pokemon and having kept up with the Sun & Moon trailers I know this feature was advertised enough to where people know about it. But does anyone even use it that much? You're only required to do it once in the story and after that it's just kind of.......forgettable.
Originality: 3/10
I'm not sold on this one. Obviously Punch-Out's boxing ring is a thing. But beyond that this is overall a bland idea compared to other options for a Sun & Moon stage. The general lack of memorability is part of that, but it also just doesn't fit well thematically as a Gen 7 area when compared to some kind of island or ultra space locale.
I also find it weird that the tents of Gyarados and Tyranitar do things to affect the battle while those of Charizard and Haxorus are just platforms. And the things that Gyarados and Tyranitar do don't really fit them all that well. Gyarados isn't exactly known for being a debuffer in actual Pokemon battles and Tyranitar effectively just uses Mirror Coat. Which I'm pretty sure he can't learn. Some kind of Sandstorm like thing for Tyranitar probably would have been better.
Playability: 5/10
Not really sure what to think about the elevation of the platforms here given the limited amount of info on that your drawing gives me. Most of the tents are alright all in all except for Haxorus. Those blades make it hard to get to the center without taking damage, which would encourage camping if you do get there, and they've got a hefty amount of knockback when you collide with them. Though the knockback does decrease if you collide with it at a slower speed so there is that.
But the real big problem here are the buffs granted to those who KO others. Those make it pretty likely that this stage would only be chosen for non-serious matches. Granted within those matches players would (hopefully) not get too salty over it. But the cause for irritation is there and it would make sense to feel that way. And if it's a situation where you have to play this stage because the mode you're in chose it for you? Then you'd best hope things work out in your favor on who's KOing who.
Overall Score: 11/25
Aether Paradise by
Luminario
Iconic Status: 5/5
There's a reason that this was the most common idea for a Sun & Moon stage before Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon expanded on Ultra Space. It was once the most prominent location for utilizing the potential of Ultra Beasts as a stage hazard and is the home base of the games more threatening villainous team.
Originality: 10/10
First of all the.............Mamoswine in the room? Is that seriously the closest thing there is to an Elephant Pokemon because I can't remember anything else.
Anyway, what I was about to talk about is the fact that using Pokemon as stage hazards in Pokemon stages is very common. So much so that one could easily knock this stage a few points for doing the same thing. So why didn't I? A couple of reason.
For starters the Ultra Beasts are a rather interesting kind of Pokemon in that you can't actually catch them with regular Poke Balls. You have to use Beast Balls. That's probably why we haven't seen any Ultra Beasts as Pokeball Pokemon yet. And with no Beast Ball item in sight, I think it would make a lot of sense for them to be reserved as a hazard for a Sun & Moon stage.
Sure that's talking more about likeliness, but even so there's also the reason why I didn't remove points from you score despite Ultra Beasts being used as hazards in submissions to previous rounds. Picture this, an Aether Paradise stage, WITHOUT any Ultra Beasts. That just doesn't work. The Ultra Beasts as hazards makes too much sense for this idea and the stage would be incredibly bland without them.
Playability: 8/10
Despite the sizable wealth of Ultra Beasts in this stage, all but one of them are pretty well balanced. A decent amount of them don't do any damage and some, most notably Celesteela, can actually be a help instead of a hindrance. Truth be told, that one UB is the only reason the stage is losing points here. As you can guess, that UB is Guzzlord. Now for as dangerous as he is, he is the rarest of them all. But while it is separated into 3 instances, he still can spend 30 seconds trying to gobble you up. There are two things in particular that you could have done here that would have helped. Those going for the route of just one suction that tries to pull you in for 15 seconds, and clarifying exactly how powerful the suction is.
Had you implemented one of those two things, I would have bumped your score up to a 9. And if you implemented both, it would have been a perfect 10.
Overall Score: 23/25
Poke Pelago by
S
SkySkipper
Iconic Status: 3/5
Another one of those minor, lacking in notability features like the Battle Royal. This one at least has some more use since it means you can technically all the items like Evolutionary stones that you want. And if nothing else, Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon did reveal that the guy who runs this place is Lusamine's missing, amnesiac husband.
Originality: 7/10
Not too bad all in all. It fits the island theme of Alola quite well and the gimmicks, while minor, get the job done of spicing things up without making the stage too dangerous. The only real concern, which will apply more to playability, is the length of the stage. You've basically got 2.5 final destinations here and that makes for a stage that's too big without the right kind of layout to compensate it like what Temple has.
I get what you were going for by trying to include all 5 islands which I do think would be a good idea. I just think there are better ways to execute it. You'll see the other judges mention further down the idea of transitioning between each Island one by one and I think that would have been a good way to implement the idea. Personally though I think an even better alternative would be to do what TKOWL did with his Golden Pyramid stage in the Gameboy Advance Round (Round 26). In that stage he combined the themes of the various areas of Wario Land 4 into one stage. That kind of thing would have worked well here too. Just make one big island that combines all 5 islands into one.
Playability: 5/10
Naturally the long length of the stage is more of a problem here. I suppose the hot spring damage could present an issue if you get stuck there as well but the overly long amount of ground this stage covers and the distance that would need to be closed to even fight in it really is the bigger concern here.
Overall Score: 15/25
Wigglytuff's Guild by
PeridotGX
Iconic Status: 5/5
My knowledge of Mystery Dungeon is limited. But according to your information these guilds are a big part of the games because it's where you get assigned your missions. Sounds iconic enough to me. And since this one is particular is based on Explorers, which is the fan favorite, more power to it.
Originality: 9/10
That's a pretty fitting gimmick for the kind of game Mystery Dungeon sounds like. My only real gripe is that the items you can get out of rewards are exclusive to this stage. That has some potential to cause confusion unless you take the time to memorize what they all do and how to use them. Which probably wouldn't be very hard all things considered. But it would still probably be best to have them just be the regular items.
Playability: 9/10
Most of it turned out pretty good. Only real negative is another case of time durations needing fine-tuning. The Pokemon who help you are on screen for too long. 15 seconds at max is what should be done for this kind of circumstance. The delay between Wigglytuff putting things on the notice board can probably be shortened to 20 seconds as well.
Overall Scorce: 23/25
Cosmic77's grades:
"Po Town" by Kevandre:
Iconic Status: 5/5
I don't think a vandalized mansion screams "Pokemon", but the cameos from the other characters help you here. Plus, it's a Su/Mo stage, so you have the advantage of relevancy as well.
Originality: 7/10
I love the layout of your stage. Doesn't look like anything else we've had in Smash before. Just wished you would've been a tad more descriptive. You didn't necessarily need a gimmick, but adding more background elements like what you did with those grunts walking past the windows would've been much appreciated.
Playability: 10/10
I don't have any issues with your stage. Layout seems fair and there aren't any hazards.
Overall Score: 22/25
"Sprout Tower" by TKOWL:
Iconic Status: 4/5
I know this was originally planned to be an actual stage for Melee, but I don't think it stood the test of time. For people who have played this game, it'd be extremely iconic. Newer fans... Debatable.
Still, the old Pokemon make it clear what franchise this comes from. That was a nice touch.
Originality: 8/10
I like the concept. Having a tower that tilts back and forth is extremely unique for a stage.
However, to contradict what I just said, we already have two Pokemon stages that involve the stage being moved around somehow. This feels really similar to Zekrom's attack in the Unova stage.
Playability: 8/10
So my biggest concern is the structure of the tower. Reminds me of Wrecking Crew, and believe me, ladder combos are absolutely terrible on that stage.
Aside from that, no real complaints. I appreciate the lower platforms for the bad jumpers.
Overall Score: 20/25
"Battle Royal Arena" by GolisoPower:
Iconic Status: 5/5
I know exactly why you chose this stage. Not the most memorable area from Su/Mo if you ask me, but it might actually have the highest chance of getting in Smash.
I guess the likelihood of a stage appearing in Smash is a completely separate thing from iconicness, but whatever.
Originality: 6/10
I really don't want to say this every time we get a boxing ring stage, but this feels like a rehash of a stage we already have in Smash. Take a guess which one I'm talking about.
Statues were cool though. Helped your stage feel a little more different.
Playability: 3/10
I'm so sorry, but there's many many things going on with your stage that I have to nitpick.
- No image provided for Gyarados and Tyranitar.
- Sheer size of statues.
- No clarification on which parts of the statues can be stood on and how they wouldn't be solid platforms.
- Rewarding winning players more than the losing players.
Overall Score: 14/25
"Aether Paradise" by Luminario:
Iconic Status: 5/5
Aether Paradise is one of my favorite areas in Su/Mo.
Biased opinions aside, this is an important part of the story. Definitely a memorable area to anyone who's played this game.
Originality: 6/10
You were very descriptive with your stage, and I appreciate that. Unfortunately, the gimmick you chose gets used all the time in this contest (Seriously, I think you're the fourth person to implement Ultra Beasts).
But to point out something you did that was unique, the layout is nice. It's simple, but very different from the other Pokemon stages.
Playability: 7/10
I don't think I need to explain much here. The UBs can be a nuisance at times, and some feel a little overpowered.
I mean, the UBs are supposed to be overpowered, but perhaps just not in Smash.
Overall Score: 18/25
"Poke Pelago" by SkySkipper:
Iconic Status: 4/5
Well, you have relevancy on your side. Other than that, I don't think this was the best choice for a stage. There are a plethora of other options you could've went with that would honestly make a lot more sense as a stage.
Originality: 6/10
Ehh... It's a decent stage. I think you were on the right track, but you implemented the idea in the wrong way. Personally, I would just drop the gimmicks entirely and have this stage travel from island to island. If you had done that, I actually would've loved this as stage.
Playability: 4/10
Too much water.
But seriously, this stage is loooooong. Getting a KO is gonna be nearly impossible if you camp out in the middle island. I
still say you should've let this stage travel from island to island.
Overall Score: 14/25
"Wigglytuff’s Guild" by PeridotGX:
Iconic Status: 4/5
Man, I wish I knew how to grade this. It's obviously Pokemon, and this is pretty good representation of the Mystery Dungeon series, but does it stack up against stages from the main series?
It's good, but not completely up to par with everything else.
Originality: 9/10
I think this is a fantastic way to represent the Mystery Dungeon series. Completing small tasks and being rewarded with a power-up is very suiting for this stage.
I would've liked more details on the background though. Seeing Pokemon walking around on the sidelines would've been a great touch.
Playability: 8/10
My only issue is that random Pokemon you might have to battle. Needless to say, anything that draws your attention away from the real fight warrants a few points getting deducted.
Overall Score: 21/25
TheMarioAddict's grades:
"Po Town" by Kevandre:
Iconic Status: 5/5
I love Po Town. I love it so much that, had I not been late to the first pokemon round of this contest, that’s what I would have made my stage based on. I will admit I’m unsure if the top of Guzma’s mansion would be distinctly “pokemon” enough on it’s own, but you thankfully added some cameos from Gladion and Team Skull, which neatly solves that issue.
Originality: 8/10
I’m taking off just a couple points for a complete lack of unique gimmicks. Not that there’s anything wrong with a purely neutral stage (personally, those tend to be my favorites), but I
am judging originality, and it’s hard to say something unique when you don’t bother to speak up in the first place. Even so, there’s a lot here that I like - the platform layout is pretty interesting, and very different from other large stages, plus Po Town would be a huge change in tone from other Pokemon stages. So all in all, even with a lack of defining gimmicks, this is a pretty solid stage!
Playability: 7/10
Most of the points you’re losing are from that topmost platform - it’s not by much, but it looks just far enough away from the platform below it that I could see some characters struggling to reach it. Which, in turn, means some characters could camp it, which would be in addition to the high risk this stage poses for circle camping. Still, a purely neutral stage means a pretty high playability score, so well done!
Overall Score: 20/25
"Sprout Tower" by TKOWL:
Iconic Status: 5/5
This hits all the right spots for me - Sprout Tower is one of the more interesting structures in all of Pokemon, and it’s encountered early enough in Johto that a lot of people would have seen it. Like Kev’s stage, I was somewhat worried that the stage on it’s own wouldn’t be “Pokemon” enough, but like with his stage you remedied that with a healthy smattering of Pokemon cameos. Beautifully done!
Originality: 9/10
I mean, you yourself admitted a slight similarity to the layout of Tomodachi Life, so I have to take off a point for that. That said, it’s not 1-for-1, so you’re only losing the one point. The tilting is a nice mechanic, and I did debate taking off a point for it sharing some similarities to Palkia’s thing on Spear Pillar, but then again Palkia completely changes the gravity, where this stage just tilts the tower. And of course, the japanese tower is a very unique aesthetic, both for Smash
and Pokemon. I love it!
Playability: 8/10
So to bring up Tomadachi Life again - one of the big problems with that stage is that, because of the sheer size of it, it becomes a playing ground for circle camping. Though your stage appears to be thinner, I think it would suffer from the same issue. The tilting of the Tower goes some way towards fixing that, but I don’t think it’s quite enough. Still, the rest of the stage seems perfectly fine to me, and I know I’d love playing on this stage from time to time!
Overall Score: 22/25
"Battle Royal Arena" by GolisoPower:
Iconic Status: 3/5
Ok, I gotta be honest: I completely forgot that this area existed, and considering how memorable most of the mainline Pokemon games are, that’s saying a lot. But by all other accounts, this seems to hit the right buttons - memorable game, very obvious “Pokemon” elements to it, so in that regard, it’s a decent pick.
Originality: 8/10
Gotta say, I don’t think I’d have come up with the interchangeable side platforms if I were making this stage, plus some of the effects are pretty interesting, so that’s a pretty nice originality boost there. However, while it’s definitely different from other Pokemon stages, we’ve seen a setting like this in Smash before - the Boxing Ring. Granted that stage doesn’t have the big Pokemon structures on the sides, but still, I’m looking for things that Smash as a whole has never seen. Either way, there’s lots of unique stuff here!
Playability: 1/10
Forgive me, GolisoPower. I don’t want to tear you to shreds, but there’s far too many problems with this stage in a playability sense. Prepare for a lecture, this is a long one.
First: Haxorus, all by himself, is a nightmare. Not only do his blades do a problematic amount of damage and knockback, but - at least going by your picture - they’re
huge!! And because of their size, they both serve as a really easy hazard to knock opponents into
and serve as a near impenetrable shield for the platform on his head, making it the perfect camping spot (even more so when you consider how high up it is, meaning many characters straight up won’t be able to reach it).
Additionally, with no images for Gyarados or Tyranitar, I can’t say for certain if they would be good or bad strictly as platforms. It’s also a shame because it means I can’t see where Gyarados’ eyes are/can affect, nor can I see where Tyranitar’s crest sits. But even so, dropping stats of someone who just happened to be in Gyarados’ line of sight is worrying, as is the possibility of errant reflected projectiles.
And the hidden mechanic… jeeze. From the sounds of it, you’re buffing the surviving players based on how many stocks they have. Which is a terrible idea, because it creates what we in the game design industry call a Positive Feedback Loop - to put it simply, it means players who are already winning win more, and players who are already losing lose more. If you want to reward a player like this, reward them for doing a specific action - that way, even the guys in last place have a chance at getting a reward. Doing things based on stock count or KOs just lets the guy who’s already winning run away with the lead.
It’s… it’s just a mess. And unfortunately, I just don’t see any way that players could work around these issues.
Overall Score: 12/25
"Aether Paradise" by Luminario:
Iconic Status: 5/5
Aether Paradise is a really cool spot from Sun and Moon, and if we ever do get a Sun/Moon stage in Smash, I’d be willing to bet it’d be the Aether Paradise. It hits all the right spots for me, so a perfect score is the only choice.
Originality: 8/10
First off, love the platform layout - it’s simple, but it’s still unlike most other stages in Smash, which is surprisingly difficult to achieve at this point. The aesthetic of the Aether Paradise is nice, though I will note that clean, almost mechanical looking platforms (like in the Aether Paradise) are seen in a good number of Pokemon stages. However, that’s not why you lost points here: the points were for the gimmick. Pokemon stages, even going all the way back to Smash 64, have had a tendency to rely on the gimmick of “Pokemon show up and mess with the stage.” We’ve seen it in Saffron City, Spear Pillar, and Unova Pokemon League (you could also argue that Kalos Pokemon League and both Stadiums do this as well). So while I admit that the Ultra Beasts work within the context of the stage (I even really like Nihilego’s mechanic, very cool!), I’m not going to shy away from calling out the trend.
Playability: 7/10
Platform layout is fine to me, though I’ve seen people say that heavily sloped stages like this can give unfair advantages to some characters. I don’t know how true that is, so you’re not losing points for it, but something to keep in mind. I
am taking a couple points for some of those Ultra Beasts, though. Xurkitree, Kartana and Celesteel, for instance, have effects that last for
way too long (I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again: these kinds of things should be 15 seconds,
max). Guzzlord also seems a bit strong for my tastes, but you say he’s pretty rare, so I’ll be lenient on him. Bottom line, the UBs make this stage somewhat problematic, but far from ruin the stage.
Overall Score: 20/25
"Poke Pelago" by SkySkipper:
Iconic Status: 3/5
Not my first choice of location, considering it exists solely in a side mode of Sun and Moon, but I can’t say I didn’t remember it. Still, it’s not exactly the most iconic location you could’ve picked from those games.
Originality: 6/10
This was a tough one for me to grade, so I’m just going to go point by point. The good points are that it has a unique platform layout and isn’t too similar to any other Pokemon stage, so no point loss there. We have, however, had a few island/ocean stages before, so that dropped a few points. The gimmicks you implemented were the hard part to score - they all fit the stage pretty well, but a few of them just felt kinda… bland. In the end, I’m not super impressed with the gimmicks, so they lost you a point or two, but nothing massive.
Playability: 4/10
I’m not entirely sure you realize just how massive of a stage this is.
Each island is half a Final Destination long!? That would mean that, if we squished each and every island right next to each other, the stage would be
well over double the length of Final Destination (2.5x as long, to be precise). And again, that’s only if we shove the islands right next to each other - with the gaps included, it’s looking more like
triple the length. That’s just comically oversized, considering that you can't even fit it in with the other "huge" stages due to the very horizontal terrain.
And it gives a massive advantage to anyone with long range (Pit would go
nuts here).
And I wish that were the only problem, but Isle Avue is another big problem all on it’s own. It takes 15 seconds of being on land for the timer to reset? Well then you better pray you can move the fight to a different island (or keep from getting launched in the air), because if you get stunlocked over there, you’re gonna start taking
massive damage with no escape.
The one good thing I can say is that it doesn’t look too difficult to navigate the stage - it would take a while, but it’s not hard to do. You’d really have been better off basing the stage on just one island, or having it transition between each island. With all of them at once, it becomes a huge chore just to move around the stage.
Overall Score: 13/25
"Wigglytuff’s Guild" by PeridotGX:
Iconic Status: 4/5
Ah, Pokemon Mystery Dungeon… I only played Red Rescue Team, but I can’t deny it was a very successful spinoff series. I don’t know if it’s quite as notable as the mainline games, which is the only reason I’m taking off a point for this stage, but it’s certainly got it’s fans. And if I remember correctly, the guild was pretty important in those games, so I’m sure players would remember it.
Originality: 6/10
Ok, I have to talk about the platform layout.
You know how everyone harps on Metroid stages for constantly using the lava gimmick? Well I don’t know why, but for some reason people seem to give the Pokemon stages a pass for constantly using the same layout - a flat base with two passable platforms, one on the left, and one on the right. It's in almost every Pokemon stage - the two Stadiums and Unova Pokemon League practically have identical layouts, Kalos Pokemon League is the same thing but with the platforms spread apart, and Spear Pillar manages to be the most different by having a second base platform
and making the passables move up and down. And now, here in the Pokemon round, you’ve presented yet another stage that fits that description. For that reason alone, I’m taking a huge chunk of points out of your score.
The rest is fine though. Really cool mechanic with the missions! Perfectly fits the Dungeon games.
Playability: 8/10
My only playability concerns come from some of the missions. Fighting a Pokemon mid-battle could really mess up the flow of things, and a couple of those rewards sound problematic (30 seconds is
way too long for a partner pokemon to hang around). Other than that, it’s pretty solid. Well done!
Overall Score: 18/25
Total Scores:
Kevandre: 64 points
TKOWL: 66 points
GolisoPower: 37 points
Luminario: 61 points
SkySkipper: 42 points
PeridotGX: 62 points
The Winner is.................
Sprout Tower by TKOWL
CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
