Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[---]

On a related note, I thought more of you all would be talking about this:

http://www.polygon.com/2013/6/26/44...es-mega-man-smash-bros-s-other-new-characters

Tried to but Krystal won out.

It's definitely interesting to hear that Villager's uniqueness won out. Despite some claims I really wouldn't take it as an example for all previously dismissed or "peaceful" characters matter again. Kinda funny to hear that Wii Fit Trainer got in due to having a dancing-like charm to her movements.

Personally I thought it was awesome to hear to that Sakurai was against MvC Mega Man. That moveset was god awful and didn't reflect the series well.

 

[Shorts]

Yes, Sakurai seems to placing a lot of emphasis on unique characters. Granted, he always has, even though we ended up with characters like Dr. Mario and Toon Link. Somehow I really believe this time around we'll see some pretty fantastic additions. This might bode well for Ridley.

Me and FMOI were just talking about this, but I think it has as much to do with a character's personality/presence/essence, as it does their literal moveset potential. I agree that the character inclusion has likely always been based around this Which is funny considering Pre-Brawl and Pre-Smash4 speculators all believed it had everything to do with "logical choices" and "properly representing franchises", when his inclusions really were based on interesting/popular characters. I think in a sense, it just happened that a lot of his choices were characters we deemed (Or after they were included, scrambled to make a case for them being) important.

 

[Mr.Showtime]

Yes. It takes no skill to stay at first place. It takes no skill to know what bump can stop a red shell. It takes no skill to use drift bashing appropriatly. It's all luck. That was what I was commenting on. Might as well say Meta Knight pros are just lucky. Because they know how to play the character.

I'm not saying Mario Kart was built for competitive play. But it sure as hell ain't running on luck. The item boxes are nerfed at higher positions and the karts themselves must be modified to the users liking. I've played Mario Kart for many years, and I never held a four leaf clover to be good. How Mario Kart was made to play is different from how it is played.

It does take skill to stay in first...this is not what I'm saying. If you took it that way, then I may have worded something wrong there. There is skill in every game regardless of competitive or casual factors. I could play My Little Pony and make that game competitive if I wanted to by doing a super speed run of it and having the fastest clear time. Avoiding a shell has lots to do with luck. I guess you can call this skill similar to knowing all the tricks to a stage for....let's say.....Halo (I know every trick to this map!), but it's perceived to be luck because you were just at the right place at the right time. It's not like there is an infinite number of bumps at every location so its always possible to avoid a red shell.

 

[Hoots]

I'm hoping we get Bowser Jr., Dry Bowser, Ghirahim, and Bandana Dee personally.

That's, uhhh, an... Interesting batch of favorite newcomers.

 

[TheTuninator]

The 2/3 was something from last year, when some troll photoshopped it. He actually has an account here. It's fake, guys...

Yeah, that's what I thought. It's pretty safe to assume that literally anything which purports to be Sakurai confirming or dis-confirming characters is fake. The man plays the secrets of the roster extremely close to the vest.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Yeah, that's what I thought. It's pretty safe to assume that literally anything which purports to be Sakurai confirming or dis-confirming characters is fake. The man plays the secrets of the roster extremely close to the vest.

I still feel bad for bringing up something More then a year old >.>

 

[Shorts]

That's, uhhh, an... Interesting batch of favorite newcomers.

Well, none of them are that bad, minus Dry Bowser. I was thinking, we all (at various points) pretty much called this MM moveset. Which really got me thinking. I really wanna try and guess every potenntial character's moveset. We always predict rosters, and Star predicts levels, but no one's really tried to predict movesets, which is sad considering how close a lot of people were with Mega Man (In some ways)

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Well, none of them are that bad, minus Dry Bowser. I was thinking, we all (at various points) pretty much called this MM moveset. Which really got me thinking. I really wanna try and guess every potenntial character's moveset. We always predict rosters, and Star predicts levels, but no one's really tried to predict movesets, which is sad considering how close a lot of people were with Mega Man (In some ways)

It is hard to predict or come up with movesets for some characters. Bowser Jr. has rarely fought directly, and his paintbrush hasn't shown many powers outside of making goop and creating monsters, he's a good exampe.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Well, none of them are that bad, minus Dry Bowser. I was thinking, we all (at various points) pretty much called this MM moveset. Which really got me thinking. I really wanna try and guess every potenntial character's moveset. We always predict rosters, and Star predicts levels, but no one's really tried to predict movesets, which is sad considering how close a lot of people were with Mega Man (In some ways)

I was happily surprised to see the Slash Claw and Flame Sword in his set. But I already said that last page. The rest I pretty much expected, especially the blades.

 

[FlareHabanero]

When it comes to predicting move sets, there are logical conclusions you can make out by simply looking at a character. Like for example, Ridley is a large space dragon, so logically a lot of his attacks would involve stuff like his claws, tail, wings, and jaws. However, how that is exactly utilized is very hard to pin point right down to a tee. There is a difference between knowing a character and how the character will use their abilities.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

That's true. I don't think any of us expected Bowser to be suddenly good at kicking for example.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

When it comes to predicting move sets, there are logical conclusions you can make out by simply looking at a character. Like for example, Ridley is a large space dragon, so logically a lot of his attacks would involve stuff like his claws, tail, wings, and jaws. However, how that is exactly utilized is very hard to pin point right down to a tee. There is a difference between knowing a character and how the character will use their abilities.

He had better use his damn tail as a pogostick.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

He had better use his damn tail as a pogostick.

That would make a good D-Special!

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

It does take skill to stay in first...this is not what I'm saying. If you took it that way, then I may have worded something wrong there. There is skill in every game regardless of competitive or casual factors. I could play My Little Pony and make that game competitive if I wanted to by doing a super speed run of it and having the fastest clear time. Avoiding a shell has lots to do with luck. I guess you can call this skill similar to knowing all the tricks to a stage for....let's say.....Halo (I know every trick to this map!), but it's perceived to be luck because you were just at the right place at the right time. It's not like there is an infinite number of bumps at every location so its always possible to avoid a red shell.

Whoa there! As a seasoned MK player, I know how each item functions and the various defenses against them. It's easy to predict a Green Shell's path because of the course it takes. Even then, there are interactive stage elements, counter items, etc. But if you know how the Red Shell works, there are ways to guard against impact with one. Holding a Banana or Shell at the rear for defense and having another item in slot can make for smooth sailing for a good lap or even the whole match. A luck factor, IMO, is something that the player can't exploit or determine the factor of which usually happens unexpectedly. Like if the Red Shell didn't target me because of the aim it was thrown at or it hits a bump. As for knowing the tricks of the stage, that takes skill to exploit. It's overall knowledge of the game needed to use these skills.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I spy a double post.

 

[Oasis_S]

When it comes to predicting move sets, there are logical conclusions you can make out by simply looking at a character. Like for example, Ridley is a large space dragon, so logically a lot of his attacks would involve stuff like his claws, tail, wings, and jaws. However, how that is exactly utilized is very hard to pin point right down to a tee. There is a difference between knowing a character and how the character will use their abilities.

Ridley is a pretty good example of that, since there's really a lot you could do with him just from his basic design alone. Then there's the whole "well would he be standing or on all fours?" There's so many angles you can go with for Ridley. I think, though, one thing that is for sure is that Sakurai would try to play up the whole "bloodthirsty" personality of his. Very ...feral? A real monster. I think that sort of "flavor" is something the roster could use.

ALSO HOW DARE SOMEONE SAY BOWSER JR. AND HIS PAINTBRUSH WOULDN'T BE AMAZING.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

ALSO HOW DARE SOMEONE SAY BOWSER JR. AND HIS PAINTBRUSH WOULDN'T BE AMAZING.

Get that poser out of here! The true artist of Nintendo is Adeline! [In all seriousness I'd like Bowser Jr. with the Paintbrush]

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Ridley is a pretty good example of that, since there's really a lot you could do with him just from his basic design alone. Then there's the whole "well would he be standing or on all fours?" There's so many angles you can go with for Ridley. I think, though, one thing that is for sure is that Sakurai would try to play up the whole "bloodthirsty" personality of his. Very ...feral? A real monster. I think that sort of "flavor" is something the roster could use.

ALSO HOW DARE SOMEONE SAY BOWSER JR. AND HIS PAINTBRUSH WOULDN'T BE AMAZING.

I did not say that. lol. What I mean is that they couldn't really use abilites the Paintbrush has used so far, it makes goop and monsters. Maybe they could use some of kind of damage over time effect like what happens in SMS when Mario stands in the graffiti/goop for to long.

 

[Admiral Pit]

None know the power of Jr's paintbrush. May its red goop burn that guy who thinks it isn't cool.

 

[Oasis_S]

Yeah, sometimes it's best not to get bogged down with source material. Some hate to hear that, but it's really not important.

Just kind of take a basic concept, and play it up specifically for how it can work best in a fighting game.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I still wonder to this day if Dedede's D-Special was the inspiration behind Masked Dedede's weapon, or if it was the other way around. I believe Kirby Super Star Ultra was in development at the same time as Brawl.

 

[Arcadenik]

Seeing how unique and interesting Sakurai made Villager and Wii Fit Trainer, I firmly believe that Duck Hunt Dog could be very unique and interesting if Sakurai decides to add him to the roster. If Villager fights by doing chores and Wii Fit Trainer fights by exercising, then why not Duck Hunt Dog fight by hunting ducks?

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Seeing how unique and interesting Sakurai made Villager and Wii Fit Trainer, I firmly believe that Duck Hunt Dog could be very unique and interesting if Sakurai decides to add him to the roster. If Villager fights by doing chores and Wii Fit Trainer fights by exercising, then why not Duck Hunt Dog fight by hunting ducks?

So magically a duck appears in front of a character and the Dog attacks the duck, therby hurting the player behind it?

 

[Starphoenix]

It seems interesting that he's putting an especially large amount of focus on uniqueness this time when it comes to adding characters. I think King K. Rool will also benefit from the increased focus on uniqueness because of his personality and his huge move set potentials.

You could say that about any character, really. Trying to gauge and quantify "uniqueness" only will end up a trojan horse for our own personal bias.

Me and FMOI were just talking about this, but I think it has as much to do with a character's personality/presence/essence, as it does their literal moveset potential. I agree that the character inclusion has likely always been based around this Which is funny considering Pre-Brawl and Pre-Smash4 speculators all believed it had everything to do with "logical choices" and "properly representing franchises", when his inclusions really were based on interesting/popular characters. I think in a sense, it just happened that a lot of his choices were characters we deemed (Or after they were included, scrambled to make a case for them being) important.

Nope, it's just characters that danced to Sakurai's beat.

Yeah, sometimes it's best not to get bogged down with source material. Some hate to hear that, but it's really not important.

Just kind of take a basic concept, and play it up specifically for how it can work best in a fighting game.

There are a lot of characters like that already. Capt. Falcon and Wolf come to mind right off the bat.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

There are a lot of characters like that already. Capt. Falcon and Wolf come to mind right off the bat.

It's ironic that Captain Falcon has so many powerful moves, yet he rarely if ever uses them in F-Zero games. (I've never played F-Zero, any of them)

 

[kackamee]

If Bowser Jr. got in, it'd be really cool if he could change the color of his paintbrush for different effects, kinda like the different pikmin colors.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

If Bowser Jr. got in, it'd be really cool if he could change the color of his paintbrush for different effects, kinda like the different pikmin colors.

Like the red goop for fire/lava, and the blue and yellow goop has electric effects. (I'm not sure if Bowser Jr. could originally use the electro goop though)

 

[Jedisupersonic]

It's ironic that Captain Falcon has so many powerful moves, yet he rarely if ever uses them in F-Zero games. (I've never played F-Zero, any of them)

The Falcon Punch was mentioned in song in GX. Used a grand total of once in the Anime. Other then that nope.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

The Falcon Punch was mentioned in song in GX. Used a grand total of once in the Anime. Other then that nope.

I am aware of the Falcon Punch that caused a massive explosion in the anime, but not the song.

 

[FlareHabanero]

The Falcon Punch didn't cause the explosion.

 

[Opossum]

And it was Pikachu that caused the seizures, not Porygon. But look where Porygon is now...

 

[KingofPhantoms]

The Falcon Punch didn't cause the explosion.

Aware of that too.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

And it was Pikachu that caused the seizures, not Porygon. But look where Porygon is now...

Certainly not aiming for the horn or using Thunder as armor

 

[Arcadenik]

So magically a duck appears in front of a character and the Dog attacks the duck, therby hurting the player behind it?

Something like that... but I was thinking of something like this.... Duck Hunt Dog pointing fingers at opponents... the hunter who is the person playing Duck Hunt with the NES Zapper shoots from the fourth wall at wherever the dog is pointing at.

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

Guys, I just came up with the ULTIMATE newcomer for Smash 4!





Scrapper from Skyward Sword!

There are so many characters he could beat just by calling them Master Shortpants! He'd be broken!

He WAS broken...in the past.

If Bowser Jr. got in, it'd be really cool if he could change the color of his paintbrush for different effects, kinda like the different pikmin colors.

Do you guys think Bowser Jr. should transform into Shadow Mario for his Down B and then have a whole new set of moves like Sheik?
Yay or nay?

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Do you guys think Bowser Jr. should transform into Shadow Mario for his Down B and then have a whole new set of moves like Sheik?
Yay or nay?

Could be interesting. I wouldn't be against it.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Something like that... but I was thinking of something like this.... Duck Hunt Dog pointing fingers at opponents... the hunter who is the person playing Duck Hunt with the NES Zapper shoots from the fourth wall at wherever the dog is pointing at.

That's actually pretty clever. but my first reply was a joke if you didn't know.

 

[Admiral Pit]

Certainly not aiming for the horn or using Thunder as armor

Random BS miracles at the last minute? We got 2 tropes for that:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DeusExMachina
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NewPowersAsThePlotDemands

 

[KingofPhantoms]

He WAS broken...in the past.


Do you guys think Bowser Jr. should transform into Shadow Mario for his Down B and then have a whole new set of moves like Sheik?
Yay or nay?

Neither. Shadow Mario was litterally a clone of Mario in SMS. Let's hope if such an ability is implemented in Smash 4 he won't be a Mario clone...again.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Random BS miracles at the last minute? We got 2 tropes for that:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DeusExMachina
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NewPowersAsThePlotDemands

Yay a fellow Troper! ^^