Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[Arcadenik]

I just feel like there are enough Mario characters as it is. I'm not saying Toad has absolutely no chance, I'm just saying me personally, I wouldn't add him for the sake of adding characters to other franchises.

I probably won't expect Toad unless I see Peach return with a new special.

In other words, you are biased towards other franchises.

And it doesn't matter if Peach still pulls Toad out of her crotch... there are millions of other red-spotted Toads with blue vests and we don't know which one is THE Toad anyway.

 

[Big-Cat]

The obvious Awakening rep is Tharja.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Just a personal preference, I like him, but I'd prefer he stay as an AT instead.

You know what would be hilarious? Next character reveal: "OMG SHY GUY PLAYABLE!1!" And he becomes the most unique and diverse character in the history of Smash.

 

[smashmachine]

The obvious Awakening rep is Tharja.

no

Hey! Starfy would be awesome! You guys should play The Legendary Starfy for the DS (not 3DS)... you would get some idea how Starfy would be like in Smash.... the Starfy Assist Trophy is not a good representative of Starfy as a character.

doesn't Sakurai hate Starfy

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

doesn't Sakurai hate Starfy

I hate how people think that's true.

 

[FlareHabanero]

The obvious Awakening rep is Tharja.

Ass too big, cannot get in.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

This is all I found regarding Stafy/Starfy in Brawl. From the Brawl Dojo. I have no idea where this hatred idea sprang from.

http://www.smashbros.com/wii/en_us/items/assist/assist13.html

 

[Johnknight1]

TOPIC POWERS, ACTIVATE!

Smash Demo. Yay or nay? Which stages? Characters? When? Discuss.

Demo - No (I don't want the game to be worse like what they did to Brawl)... at least not until say a month or so before release.
Stages - All of the ones we've seen so far.... or at least Battlefield, Skyloft/The Spirit Train, The Mario 3D Land stage/a Mario Galaxy stage.
Characters - The original 8, Captain Falcon, Ness, the 3rd party newcomers, and all the newcomers that you unlock at the beginning.
When - A month before release or so.

 

[Moon Monkey]

In other words, you are biased towards other franchises.

And it doesn't matter if Peach still pulls Toad out of her crotch... there are millions of other red-spotted Toads with blue vests and we don't know which one is THE Toad anyway.

Yeah, pretty much. I would hate to see a roster where we have 5 to 6 Mario and Pokemon characters and no Ridley, Dixie and/or K. Rool, or new series addition to the roster.

While it is true that all Toads look the same (Which I guess is considered to be a racist remark in the Mushroom Kingdom), I think it says a lot if a character is reduced to be apart of another character's moveset.

To me that shows how Sakurai views them as newcomer contestants. I mean being an Assist Trophy and Pokeball summon is one thing, where a character can shine on their own, but to only be considered as an expendable move makes me view Waddle Dee and Toad as only supporting cast characters.

 

[Arcadenik]

This is all I found regarding Stafy/Starfy in Brawl. From the Brawl Dojo. I have no idea where this hatred idea sprang from.

http://www.smashbros.com/wii/en_us/items/assist/assist13.html

No way! The Brawl Dojo is still around? I thought it was replaced with SSB4 Dojo... if you can call it a dojo... when SSB4 was officially announced at E3 2013.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Yeah, pretty much. I would hate to see a roster where we have 5 to 6 Mario and Pokemon characters and no Ridley, Dixie and/or K. Rool, or new series addition to the roster.

While it is true that all Toads look the same (Which I guess is considered to be a racist remark in the Mushroom Kingdom), I think it says a lot if a character has been reduced to be apart of another character's moveset.
To me that shows how Sakurai views them. I mean being an Assist Trophy and Pokeball summon is one thing, where a character can shine on their own, but to only be considered as a move makes me view Waddle Dee and Toad as only supporting cast characters.

Well, Waddle Dee (the Return to Dreamland one) has a unique appearance, unique abilities (Spear ability), and he's been appearing since Super Star with this unique appearance.

 

[Moon Monkey]

Well, Waddle Dee (the Return to Dreamland one) has a unique appearance, unique abilities (Spear ability), and he's been appearing since Super Star.

Bandana Dee has a chance. Waddle Dee no.
I know it sounds like a double standard seeing how its just a Waddle Dee with a Bandana and Spear.

No way! The Brawl Dojo is still around? I thought it was replaced with SSB4 Dojo... if you can call it a dojo... when SSB4 was officially announced at E3 2013.

Actually at the bottom of the SSB4 site there is a link to the old Dojo

 

[Fastblade5035]

*** too big, cannot get in.

Chrom's ass is too big.
Ike's sword is too big. (Ifunowutimsayin)
Palutena's staff is too big.
Tetra's pirate ship is too big.
Mewtwo's head tail thing is too big.
Tom Nook's apron is top big.
K. Rool's crown is too big.
Hades' stomach is too big.
Dixie Kong's hair is too big.
Waluigi's WAAAA is too big,
Dillon's hat is too big.
Black Shadow's horns are too big.
Waddle Dee's blandness is too big.
Krystal's staff is too big. (Ew...)
Shy Guy's mask is too big.
Tingle's balloons are too big. (No, not THOSE balloons.)
Daisy's sport outfit is too big.
Starfy's spin is too big.
Isaac's hand is too big.
Roy's fire is too big.

This list is too damn big. Ridley is the perfect size, though.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Bandana Dee has a chance. Waddle Dee no.
I know it sounds like a double standard seeing how its just a Waddle Dee with a Bandana and Spear.

Oh, okay. I was confused, considering Bandana Dee in the Roster Maker is referred to as Waddle Dee.

 

[Johnknight1]

Who cares what franchises get characters as long as we get the best possible playable characters=???

Also, Toads are generic as heck. No one is going to stop what they are doing to go play or buy smash bros. because Toad is playable.

Meanwhile, The Villager, Mega Man, and The Wii Fit Trainer are taking up quite a storm, and all have been very well received because they are different.

What's with Plusle and Minun being popular?

Just the very concept is something that once you think about it, you realize the potential for it is off the charts awesome.

Once it was revealed they were a part of the Forbidden Seven, myself and others both realized this (long after I used to dread the idea, actually). That is when myself and others developed potential movesets, playstyles, and skillsets for said characters, many of which were amazing, which made many of us love the idea of them in smash. It is such an overlooked and yet potentially amazing idea, and they could be the best newcomers ever (potentially).

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Also, Toads are generic as heck. No one is going to stop what they are doing to go play or buy smash bros. because Toad is playable.

Arcadenik would.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Wonder why everyone is thinking it was Plusle and Minun.

 

[Moon Monkey]

Who cares what franchises get characters as long as we get the best possible playable characters=???

Every person that was/is excited for Megaman's arrival and everyone that has made or supported any thread in the SSB4 Character Sub-Forum.

That is not to say that the characters people want can't be the best possible characters if Sakurai and his team put their minds to it. If Wii Fit Trainer can work anyone can.

 

[Big-Cat]

It helps that the Villager is now a memetic homicidal maniac.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Who cares what franchises get characters as long as we get the best possible playable characters=???

Best is subjective.

 

[Johnknight1]

Every person that was/is excited for Megaman's arrival and everyone that has made or supported any thread in the SSB4 Character Sub-Forum.

That is not to say that the characters people want can't be the best possible characters if Sakurai and his team put their minds to it. If Wii Fit Trainer can work anyone can.

That has nothing to do with "representation" though, which is the heart of what I was discussing (though i do agree with you on the matter). People keep talking about representative this, representative that.

TO BLOODY HELL WITH REPRESENTATIVES!!! WE PLAY AS CHARACTERS, NOT REPRESENTATIVES!!!

Keep the focus on the characters, how they would play, what they would do, how they would be unique, why they should be added (hint: the previous reasons), what moves they would use, and all of that crazy, cool, and fun jazz, not this anemic awful "representative because Pokahmahz needs more characturzs" crap.

 

[Arcadenik]

Arcadenik would.

You know me so well.

 

[~automatic]

John's right. The representatives deal is such a lame excuse to add characters.

EDIT: Or replace characters.

 

[Johnknight1]

Best is subjective.

Best is the characters who moves the most consoles and units and/or the characters that keeps you coming back for more years and years after the games' release.

That is something that is subjective, but there are definitely universal qualities to it, which is why people got pissed when Mewtwo was cut (that and he didn't quite reach his potential, or get even close to it), and why people were so happy when Ness was finally revealed to be in Brawl.

It helps that the Villager is now a memetic homicidal maniac.

Ever since that Animal Crossing web comic back in 2006 or 2008 or something like that, the Villager has had such memes.

Arcadenik would.

Arcadenik is already going to buy both games.

 

[Arcadenik]

Arcadenik is already going to buy both games.

Damn straight!

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Keep the focus on the characters, how they would play, what they would do, how they would be unique, why they should be added (hint: the previous reasons), what moves they would use, and all of that crazy, cool, and fun jazz, not this anemic awful "representative because Pokahmahz needs more characturzs" crap.

Which is why I, in my opinion, believe Shy Guy is the best. He literally has dozens of forms to take his moves from, and all of the forms are fairly diverse on their own. Fly Guys, Pyro Guys, Snifits, etc.

Sure, I think Yoshi needs a pal, but that's not my major reason behind wanting Shy Guy. He'd be a bag of tricks character, with so many different tools and abilities that he couldn't possibly be anything BUT unique and fun to mess around with.

 

[Johnknight1]

Not gonna lie Arc, I would buy the game even if all the newcomers were Waluigi clones... probably!

John's right. The representatives deal is such a lame excuse to add characters.

EDIT: Or replace characters.

This... so much. The only time "representatives" or any likewise idea should even be considered (and it should only be a minor part) is if a series is blatantly ignored, and there are many potentially great playable characters (for instance, if Brawl didn't have Diddy Kong with the Donkey Kong [Country] franchise).

We don't have that kind of situation (well, maybe with Metroid or Donkey Kong, but even then, we got two great potentially playable characters in Ridley and K. Rool, as well as several other Donkey Kong character; plus those are the two most wanted potential newcomers), so thus, this kind of argument is null and void.

 

[FlareHabanero]

John's right. The representatives deal is such a lame excuse to add characters.

Worse if people don't really think things through with implementations and are simply saying crap just for the sake of saying crap. As in, not actually talking about the pros and cons of inclusion. You think I'm so pissed off towards Chrom and Lucina for my health?

 

[Johnknight1]

@ Poppy
But see, that's not representation, but rather, wanting Shy Guy because of how Shy Guy could play, which is thus a good reason.

I never bothered making a roster on account of the fact that by the time I settle on my decisions, the game will have probably been out for a week.

That is why I made a roster for every character amount (from 38 to 88), plus 4 or 5 rosters with 51 characters (3 of which I shared in the BRoom).

Wonder why everyone is thinking it was Plusle and Minun.

1. What is Plusle and Minun=???
2. My ideas on how they could work have converted several people from full blown haters of the idea of them playable to open to it.
3. Literally a tag team idea of them being playable is something unexplored, and unlike a Diddy/Dixie combo, a team aspect wouldn't hinder either character or not fully show them off, especially since Plusle and Minun were designed to fight as a team in team battles in Pokémon Gen III games.
4. This makes me wonder if we could ever see a trio Pokémon (fighting at the same time) as playable characters (maybe those Gen V fire/water/grass monkeys).

 

[Moon Monkey]

That has nothing to do with "representation" though, which is the heart of what I was discussing (though i do agree with you on the matter). People keep talking about representative this, representative that.

TO BLOODY HELL WITH REPRESENTATIVES!!! WE PLAY AS CHARACTERS, NOT REPRESENTATIVES!!!

Keep the focus on the characters, how they would play, what they would do, how they would be unique, why they should be added (hint: the previous reasons), what moves they would use, and all of that crazy, cool, and fun jazz, not this anemic awful "representative because Pokahmahz needs more characturzs" crap.

Oh, I whole heartedly agree. We play characters not representatives. I get urked when people put "Gen 4, 5,6" in their rosters like we play generations and not the pokemon
But the statement "Who cares what franchises get characters as long as we get the best possible playable characters" is questionable.

 

[IsmaR]

The characters are representatives. Of themselves. As animated trophies/figures.

 

[CatRaccoonBL]

If we are going to talk about adding a Mario character, I might as well put in my opinion.

I personally would like to see Bowser jr. the most. Sure, he isn't iconic, but I personally like him, and think he would be fun to play as.

The lucky thing about Shy Guy is that he could be counted as a Yoshi character, meaning he doesn't technically have to fight with Toad, Bowser Jr., and waluigi, (if it works like that at least) or the unproven limit of mario character. (I personally don't believe they put a limit on it).

I think shy guy would be a pretty cool character. I wouldn't mine seeing him.

 

[Johnknight1]

Oh, I whole heartedly agree. We play characters not representatives.
But the statement "Who cares what franchises get characters as long as we get the best possible playable characters" is questionable.

How is that statement questionable=???

We got 3 playable characters from Fire Emblem, maybe like the 150th best selling Nintendo-owned franchise ever, all because those 3 characters added something unique (specifically Marth and Ike).

We also got 3 playable characters from Star Fox, a series that has aside from the original, its' remake, and its' remake's remake (3 of the 6 games) has sold maybe 1 million copies, and even with those games is probably still under the 5 or 6 million mark.

If we're talking about franchises, the Wii franchise deserves a playable character (seeing as how it has outsold every Nintendo franchise not named Mario, Super Mario, or Pokémon), and the Miis should be playable.

Oh, and playable Nintendogs, Wii Sports, and Mario Kart characters too.

@ IsmaR
Exactly what I am getting at. The only thing characters represent is themselves in their playable character form.

 

[FlareHabanero]

"Who cares what franchises get characters as long as we get the best possible playable characters" is questionable.

It's not really questionable. There isn't anything that states we're restricted to a certain amount of characters or we're forced to get a certain character because of bullcrap, what matters is if said character can be likable and fun.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

If we are going to talk about adding a Mario character, I might as well put in my opinion.

I personally would like to see Bowser jr. the most. Sure, he isn't iconic, but I personally like him, and think he would be fun to play as.

The lucky thing about Shy Guy is that he could be counted as a Yoshi character, meaning he doesn't technically have to fight with Toad, Bowser Jr., and waluigi, (if it works like that at least) or the unproven limit of mario character. (I personally don't believe they put a limit on it).

I think shy guy would be a pretty cool character. I wouldn't mine seeing him.

Nice to see someone else who accepts Shy Guy.

 

[Big-Cat]

Ever since that Animal Crossing web comic back in 2006 or 2008 or something like that, the Villager has had such memes.

Yes, but it was the Smash 4 reveal that really made that portrayal popular. Likewise, I wouldn't be surprised if you couldn't find Rule 34 of Miss Fit that was made BEFORE her reveal trailer.

 

[Johnknight1]

Yes, but it was the Smash 4 reveal that really made that portrayal popular. Likewise, I wouldn't be surprised if you couldn't find Rule 34 of Miss Fit that was made BEFORE her reveal trailer.

Well I remember reading quite a few things about The Animal Crossing characters (including the Villager) all being psychopaths, including, again, that web comic.

But alas, you are right: It made it go from something only popular amongst serious Animal Crossing fans to video game/meme fans everywhere.

And can we keep anything Rule 34/4chan-related out of all future discussions=??? I don't want to throw up reading posts guys...

 

[Moon Monkey]

How is that statement questionable=???

We got 3 playable characters from Fire Emblem, maybe like the 150th best selling Nintendo-owned franchise ever, all because those 3 characters added something unique (specifically Marth and Ike).

We also got 3 playable characters from Star Fox, a series that has aside from the original, its' remake, and its' remake's remake (3 of the 6 games) has sold maybe 1 million copies, and even with those games is probably still under the 5 or 6 million mark.

If we're talking about franchises, the Wii franchise deserves a playable character (seeing as how it has outsold every Nintendo franchise not named Mario, Super Mario, or Pokémon), and the Miis should be playable.

Oh, and playable Nintendogs too.

Oh, and something from Wii Sports.

Oh, and something from Mario Kart.

Tell me would you rather have a roster that has roster that looks like this:

With all unique movesets and competitively viable characters? (ditto is the random )

Or would you have a roster that looks like this:

With all unique movesets and competitively viable characters?

 

[IsmaR]

There's something wrong with your head if you don't want Tyrogue, Moltres or Dragonite with unique movesets.

 

[FlareHabanero]

And can we keep anything Rule 34/4chan-related out of all future discussions=??? I don't want to throw up reading posts guys...

Said the guy that promotes "bromance" where ever he goes.