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Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

SonicLink125

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I’m really happy how well this turned out! Almost felt like I had dev tools here. If only...

Isaac: Venus Adept said:
Time to break the dour mood of this chat as of late with this awesome piece of work
Also don't forget the 20th anniversary celebration this August, keep sharing!
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I’d LOVE a Golden Sun anime/show. If Avatar TLA/Korra can work, so can GS.
 
SirCamp

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So I just had a... concerning thought.

As much as I want and would love to see a Golden Sun revival, I was thinking about what that would look like were that to happen. More specifically, if it were to happen in the Switch's lifetime, given that Camelot just revealed Mario Golf I imagine it would end up being near the end of the Switch's lifecycle. And I am just worried that we would end up in an all too familiar scenario where people are moving on to the next big thing and Golden Sun just sorta gets passed by due to circumstance. Anyone else worried about that being a possibility? I suppose I'm getting a bit ahead of myself since who even knows if it would ever happen anyway, but like if it were maybe it would almost be better to wait? But then they would probably just go back to making a new Tennis and Golf first, so I dunno how you would get around that.

Maybe the best chance is for the Switch Pro revision rumor to be revealed and for Golden Sun to be made for that. What does everyone else think could happen or how would you hope things go down in order to give the game/s the best chance at success?
 
THE 6r

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SirCamp said:
So I just had a... concerning thought.

As much as I want and would love to see a Golden Sun revival, I was thinking about what that would look like were that to happen. More specifically, if it were to happen in the Switch's lifetime, given that Camelot just revealed Mario Golf I imagine it would end up being near the end of the Switch's lifecycle. And I am just worried that we would end up in an all too familiar scenario where people are moving on to the next big thing and Golden Sun just sorta gets passed by due to circumstance. Anyone else worried about that being a possibility? I suppose I'm getting a bit ahead of myself since who even knows if it would ever happen anyway, but like if it were maybe it would almost be better to wait? But then they would probably just go back to making a new Tennis and Golf first, so I dunno how you would get around that.

Maybe the best chance is for the Switch Pro revision rumor to be revealed and for Golden Sun to be made for that. What does everyone else think could happen or how would you hope things go down in order to give the game/s the best chance at success?
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Honestly I don't worry about that sort of thing. Regardless of when a GS revival were to happen we will move heaven and Weyard to get people to buy it.
 
N3ON

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SirCamp said:
So I just had a... concerning thought.

As much as I want and would love to see a Golden Sun revival, I was thinking about what that would look like were that to happen. More specifically, if it were to happen in the Switch's lifetime, given that Camelot just revealed Mario Golf I imagine it would end up being near the end of the Switch's lifecycle. And I am just worried that we would end up in an all too familiar scenario where people are moving on to the next big thing and Golden Sun just sorta gets passed by due to circumstance. Anyone else worried about that being a possibility? I suppose I'm getting a bit ahead of myself since who even knows if it would ever happen anyway, but like if it were maybe it would almost be better to wait? But then they would probably just go back to making a new Tennis and Golf first, so I dunno how you would get around that.

Maybe the best chance is for the Switch Pro revision rumor to be revealed and for Golden Sun to be made for that. What does everyone else think could happen or how would you hope things go down in order to give the game/s the best chance at success?
Click to expand...
Whatever Camelot's next project will be will probably arrive during the twilight years of the Switch. That is, unless Nintendo changes their operation and the Switch just becomes an iterative platform of continual upgrades for the foreseeable future. Assuming Nintendo will veer more towards business as usual, it comes down to how successful the successor is. Nintendo has an interesting pattern where success and underperformance tend to habitually fluctuate.

Hopefully Nintendo has learned from their Wii U mistakes and the next system doesn't drag them back down. However, if that's the case, and that system does strike a chord with the market, then yeah, it would ensure the game more commercial viability to release at the outset of the system. Like the original GS.

Because the alternative of releasing on an aging platform is how a lot of smaller titles end up getting overlooked. If Nintendo can maintain the install base, hopefully this will be less of an issue, but there is indeed the unfortunate chance that history repeats itself if not in quality of Dark Dawn then in timing and resulting commercial reception. I hope that's not the case, but it's possible.

On the bright side, if the Switch is coming to a close, then that probably means plans for a new Smash are getting off the ground, and if Golden Sun releases in that timeframe, it will, for once, put it in a beneficial window for consideration. Mixed with the dwindling first-party competition and the popularity for Isaac that Nintendo has on record, hopefully it will be enough to leverage a spot for the series among the roster next time. Granted, that entails the stars coming together to some extent. But if GS does get on the roster, it will then receive perennial attention and the resulting requests for more like F-Zero and Kid Icarus.
 
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Isaac: Venus Adept

Isaac: Venus Adept

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I don't think there's anything wrong with releasing at the end of the Switch, if it isn't a few months before the arrival of the next console and the game gets a lot more attention, praise from fans and room to breathe I could see it boding a lot more well than Dark Dawn did. Regardless of the outcome we'll be there to push the word for this game out.
Also Miitopia is a lot more customisable than everyone expected. It's going to fun seeing what people create Golden Sun wise for this game.
There was a problem fetching the tweet
Finally this awesome Golden Sun shirt is only available for less than six hours so if you want one you better pick it up fast 👀
 
SPEN18

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I think that most people here would take a Golden Sun at the end of the Switch's lifetime over no Golden Sun at all
But also I thought the hope was that the Switch would last long enough that even having GS after Tennis+Golf would not push it too close to the Switch's dying days
 
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THE 6r said:
The recent news surrounding Toys For Bob makes me more grateful that at least Nintendo doesn't force all their studios to work on the same franchise and that we at least have some hope of a new GS.
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Be glad Nintendo has multiple cash cows full of milk and not just one. Be very, very glad.
 
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N3ON

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THE 6r said:
The recent news surrounding Toys For Bob makes me more grateful that at least Nintendo doesn't force all their studios to work on the same franchise and that we at least have some hope of a new GS.
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Them taking a page from Activision would be horrible. On the other hand, they can't get away with doing that, since they have a system to keep afloat, and they can't do that with just one IP. Activision is just a third-party, their obligations are less.

But it is funny to say that here specifically when Camelot has just been pumping out Mario games for a decade.
 
SirCamp

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SPEN18 said:
I think that most people here would take a Golden Sun at the end of the Switch's lifetime over no Golden Sun at all
But also I thought the hope was that the Switch would last long enough that even having GS after Tennis+Golf would not push it too close to the Switch's dying days
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Oh absolutely. I was just thinking in terms of the future health of the series in that hypothetical. Also my concerns have been somewhat assuaged (to the extent that it even matters right now given that nothing is probably happening anyway lol). Mostly I just feel like Nintendo has a track record of throwing out smaller titles to die at the end of a consoles lifespan with little to no advertisement and then being like well I guess people didn't want it.
 
SonicLink125

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Also looks like a performance trick by Ganondorf with Jigglypuff as his assistant and Isaac was chosen from the audience for the trick. Lmao

Hope everyone had a good weekend! Just one more month till we finally get to E3!
 
pofehof

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N3ON said:
But it is funny to say that here specifically when Camelot has just been pumping out Mario games for a decade.
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It's not just this decade. Golden Sun is basically a blip compared to everything Camelot has done under Nintendo, which is just Mario Golf and Tennis. (and Mobile Golf I guess).

As for Golden Sun at the end of the Switch's lifespan, think it would be fine if a new console wasn't announced, or if the new console at least had full backwards compatibility with Switch games.
 
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Isaac: Venus Adept

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That new Mario Golf trailer really pleasantly surprised me. I'm not going to buy it at full price anytime soon but Camelot is really getting more ambitious with this game than Aces did and I have high hopes they can still deliver a good Golden Sun game with some help.

Also Nazyrus Nazyrus did a good job envisioning his idea for a potential Isaac trailer that harkens to Golden Sun's GBA roots
 
FlawedAI

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To me, the RPG elements that can be found in both Mario Tennis and Mario Golf seem like pretty good indications that at the very least Camelot wants to make RPGs again. With the Switch's lifespan continuing to last, they have more than enough time to put together a new Golden Sun and get it out before another Dark Dawn situation happens.
 
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FlawedAI said:
To me, the RPG elements that can be found in both Mario Tennis and Mario Golf seem like pretty good indications that at the very least Camelot wants to make RPGs again. With the Switch's lifespan continuing to last, they have more than enough time to put together a new Golden Sun and get it out before another Dark Dawn situation happens.
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I'm wondering if the models/textures from the golf courses are meant to be shared with a Golden Sun game. They did reuse its engine for the GBA sports games, after all.
 
Kalaam

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Guynamednelson said:
I'm wondering if the models/textures from the golf courses are meant to be shared with a Golden Sun game. They did reuse its engine for the GBA sports games, after all.
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Reusing assets is a core part of game developpment. All the environnement we saw are staples of jrpgs and a lot of those would likely be repurposed (aside from the obvious mario looking structures)
 
SonicLink125

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Silver Moon! lol


Isaac: Venus Adept said:
That new Mario Golf trailer really pleasantly surprised me. I'm not going to buy it at full price anytime soon but Camelot is really getting more ambitious with this game than Aces did and I have high hopes they can still deliver a good Golden Sun game with some help.

Also Nazyrus Nazyrus did a good job envisioning his idea for a potential Isaac trailer that harkens to Golden Sun's GBA roots
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Seriously, the way a lot of these Golf Courses can easily be GS areas with minor tweaks. Heck, Mario Golf GBA used Golden Sun assets. It's time for Golf to return the favor. Hehe.
Also, I'd freak out if we got that kind of trailer. It would be amazing!

What this user said, a lot of the courses in Super Rush don't have that "Mario Touch" compared to the other Golf games. I wonder why...... 😏
 
TheSpaceKing12

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It's my personal belief that Golden Sun could succeed, even at the end of the switch, because the trend for the switch has been increased levels of success across the entire board for basically all first-party titles. We have yet to hear a story of a major commercial failure. To that angle, Golden Sun's prospect of success increases significantly. Especially in the event that the old pokemon tradition of staying on the older platform for an extended duration of time, holds true once again.

I think it's also very safe to say that Nintendo is not abandoning the hybrid model ever again, and Switch will have a nonstandard life span. Supporting one software ecosystem is drastically easier than supporting two, this is a lesson that Sony and Nintendo both were forced to learn. We have further evidence of this from Nvidia's comments on the nature of their Nintendo partnership, suggesting it'd last decades. Simply put, Nintendo needs very high-end but also affordable mobile tech, and Nvidia needs a horse in the console race, in that regard, switch and the potential extended family it likely entails, is a dream come true for both companies involved at that level. Backward compatibility will be a certainty too, as it's something that a lot of the existing Tegra series chips already have, so we could also benefit there. So even if we do move on, it's safe to say the general concept will be the same. Heck they may just play it as straight as possible and simply call the follow-up "Switch 2"

Another realm we have to consider is, what if Nintendo adopts the Sony and Microsoft model of enhancing end-of-life switch 1 title's for Switch 2? Several games that may have been hurt by being the end of PS4, such as Ghosts of Tsushima, benefitted from having patches to be overall better experienced on PS5. Which significantly helped said game's legs at the market. Golden Sun Switch may very well receive a similar kind of treatment, imagine a locked 60FPS and a DLSS 4K picture on an amazing-looking Golden Sun? It could very well be a showpiece title at that scale. Nintendo could then afford to only launch with only one or two major games on the next system, and rely on some patches for older stuff to bring it up to snuff, Golden Sun may very well be in a perfect window of opportunity there.
 
Nazyrus

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TheSpaceKing12 said:
It's my personal belief that Golden Sun could succeed, even at the end of the switch, because the trend for the switch has been increased levels of success across the entire board for basically all first-party titles. We have yet to hear a story of a major commercial failure. To that angle, Golden Sun's prospect of success increases significantly. Especially in the event that the old pokemon tradition of staying on the older platform for an extended duration of time, holds true once again.

I think it's also very safe to say that Nintendo is not abandoning the hybrid model ever again, and Switch will have a nonstandard life span. Supporting one software ecosystem is drastically easier than supporting two, this is a lesson that Sony and Nintendo both were forced to learn. We have further evidence of this from Nvidia's comments on the nature of their Nintendo partnership, suggesting it'd last decades. Simply put, Nintendo needs very high-end but also affordable mobile tech, and Nvidia needs a horse in the console race, in that regard, switch and the potential extended family it likely entails, is a dream come true for both companies involved at that level. Backward compatibility will be a certainty too, as it's something that a lot of the existing Tegra series chips already have, so we could also benefit there. So even if we do move on, it's safe to say the general concept will be the same. Heck they may just play it as straight as possible and simply call the follow-up "Switch 2"

Another realm we have to consider is, what if Nintendo adopts the Sony and Microsoft model of enhancing end-of-life switch 1 title's for Switch 2? Several games that may have been hurt by being the end of PS4, such as Ghosts of Tsushima, benefitted from having patches to be overall better experienced on PS5. Which significantly helped said game's legs at the market. Golden Sun Switch may very well receive a similar kind of treatment, imagine a locked 60FPS and a DLSS 4K picture on an amazing-looking Golden Sun? It could very well be a showpiece title at that scale. Nintendo could then afford to only launch with only one or two major games on the next system, and rely on some patches for older stuff to bring it up to snuff, Golden Sun may very well be in a perfect window of opportunity there.
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Super solid points you brought there.

Not only Takahashi said in an interview long ago that he would want GS to return when a hybrid concept existed (and laughed back then at the idea), but also the Switch is literally hunting down the PS2 and NDS in terms of success at this pace and rate, it could eventually manage to, specially via upgraded models. It's a situation that hasn't presented before that actually makes it seem way more likely now, rather than previously when people expected a return of the series for no particular solid or concrete reason.

And seeing how Camelot has behaved for the past 2 decades, they don't put 2 titles of the same sport in the same console, so with Tennis and Golf out of the way now, it's not hard to see Camelot going back to their RPG series with how much life time the Switch concept is gonna last now. We are not gonna get another Tennis right after Golf, specially with how hard it's gonna be to top Aces right away, and we obviously aren't gonna get two Golf games in a row either.

The only "potential" brief stop Camelot could make now before fully going back to GS is by doing a collab again with Bamco for a new Mario Sports ( Superstars 2.0 ) where they would, as usual, only help on the Tennis and Golf modes, because that's the only sports Camelot specializes on and that's the only modes they helped on in Superstars, so it's not like it would take them as long as making a full game, we saw how little time their involvement in superstars took them from working and having Aces literally ready the year afterwards. But that's only if that type of collab ever happens again, considering how garbage Superstars did sales-wise compared to Mario Sports Mix by Square Enix, Nintendo might as well have Camelot investing their time and efforts working on GS, which is a series that easily sold around 3 millions in total in the past, and it would do just as well or even better in present time by combining old fans already interested in buying again AND new players feeling interested in trying it out. We know jrpgs of this kind still do well these days, you just gotta look at recent examples such as Octopath and others.

Anyways, I just came back to reply this because your post actually brought some solid points there. Nicely said, and good research 👍

–––––

See you all by E3 for whatever mess we encounter smash-wise, lol.
 
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SirCamp

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Is it terrible that I would almost rather another studio like Monolith took over for GS? Like, I would of course want the Takahashi bros leading it and whatnot still. Gotta have the creative visionaries involved, but especially if they make the jump to 3D like it was originally going to be on the 64, I would be more confident in an overall studio with more experience in that regard.

tbh tho, I may also just be scarred by how Pokemon development has been going recently... lol
 
ZelDan

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SirCamp said:
Is it terrible that I would almost rather another studio like Monolith took over for GS? Like, I would of course want the Takahashi bros leading it and whatnot still. Gotta have the creative visionaries involved, but especially if they make the jump to 3D like it was originally going to be on the 64, I would be more confident in an overall studio with more experience in that regard.

tbh tho, I may also just be scarred by how Pokemon development has been going recently... lol
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I just want to see Golden Sun to be a thing again, I don't care if its because of Camelot or Monolith Soft or Grezzo or whoever as long as it is done well.
 
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FlawedAI

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SirCamp said:
Is it terrible that I would almost rather another studio like Monolith took over for GS? Like, I would of course want the Takahashi bros leading it and whatnot still. Gotta have the creative visionaries involved, but especially if they make the jump to 3D like it was originally going to be on the 64, I would be more confident in an overall studio with more experience in that regard.

tbh tho, I may also just be scarred by how Pokemon development has been going recently... lol
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To be fair, Dark Dawn was in 3D and it's not like the team has never worked in 3D or HD development before - they're the ones making the Sports games.
 
SirCamp

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FlawedAI said:
To be fair, Dark Dawn was in 3D and it's not like the team has never worked in 3D or HD development before - they're the ones making the Sports games.
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true. I just meant more like 3D games for home console. Which seems a bit different to me. Obviously they’ve done the sports titles, but it seems like a full blown RPG would be a fair amount different than that.

Having said that, most of all I just want to see Golden Sun return, in whatever form that takes. I just also want it to be as successful as it can.

In that sense I kinda hope they do remakes first. Both because I think it would be hard to get new people into the games if they started with 4 on Switch and also because it would be a nice way to get experience in since they would already have the blueprints to base everything on rather than having to start from scratch in an environment they don’t have as much experience with.

Either way, here’s to hoping we get something, anything, in the Switch’s lifespan!
 
pofehof

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Guynamednelson said:
Camelot clearly isn't done with RPGs yet.
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Going to hold my breath until the game comes out to see if this is actually a good Story Mode. Both World Tour and Mario Tennis Aces had a bunch of activities to do (latter even had a boss rush added in), and neither of them were RPGs.

SonicLink125 said:
What this user said, a lot of the courses in Super Rush don't have that "Mario Touch" compared to the other Golf games.
Click to expand...
It's likely due to how they had to build the game around Speed Golf this time around, which means everything has to be connected. A lot of courses have Mario elements at least (similar to how Advance Tour added Mario elements to the basic courses postgame). Still hoping to see them remake the Toadstool Tour courses for future DLC.

On another note, if Golden Sun comes out on the Switch Pro instead, really hope that Nintendo will be able to allow OG Switch owners to play it through cloud gaming. If not, sales will unfortunately be cannibalized.
 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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I mean, did one of the earlier Mario Golf's since the Gameboy game actually have some rpg element? If not, then I wouldn't count on it. Leveling up counts overall, and the two Gameboy Tennis/Golf games were part-rpg intentionally. But only a small part.

Albeit, that's before Golden Sun. I don't think they've had rpg elements in Golf/Tennis since?
 
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Wyvy - Phoenix Mode said:
I mean, did one of the earlier Mario Golf's since the Gameboy game actually have some rpg element? If not, then I wouldn't count on it. Leveling up counts overall, and the two Gameboy Tennis/Golf games were part-rpg intentionally. But only a small part.

Albeit, that's before Golden Sun. I don't think they've had rpg elements in Golf/Tennis since?
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Both the GBC and GBA Mario Golfs had RPG elements. Golden Sun's engine was even modified for Mario Golf Advance Tour.
 
FlawedAI

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pofehof said:
On another note, if Golden Sun comes out on the Switch Pro instead, really hope that Nintendo will be able to allow OG Switch owners to play it through cloud gaming. If not, sales will unfortunately be cannibalized.
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Honestly, I doubt a Switch Pro would have many exclusive games (and probably not Golden Sun if it did). I'd compare it more to the PS4 Pro - some games run better on the Pro system, but still run on the base system.
 
Nazyrus

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FlawedAI said:
Honestly, I doubt a Switch Pro would have many exclusive games (and probably not Golden Sun if it did). I'd compare it more to the PS4 Pro - some games run better on the Pro system, but still run on the base system.
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100%. The next model is an upgrade, not a next gen type of jump situation where you will end with 2 separate different libraries. You will just be able to play things better, and the library will still be the same on both current and new model.


Guynamednelson said:
Both the GBC and GBA Mario Golfs had RPG elements. Golden Sun's engine was even modified for Mario Golf Advance Tour.
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This.
Also, I believe they are including RPG elements in Super Rush as well…? so yeah.
 
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Isaac: Venus Adept

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Our friends at the GSHC (Golden Sun Hacking Community) have the Golden Sun Hack a Thon competition coming up. If you're interested or have anyone that could be potentially interested feel free to check it out =)
 
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FlawedAI said:
Honestly, I doubt a Switch Pro would have many exclusive games (and probably not Golden Sun if it did). I'd compare it more to the PS4 Pro - some games run better on the Pro system, but still run on the base system.
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Yeah, I'm pretty sure it won't have too many exclusives. And if it does, it likely wouldn't be for a long time.

The New 3DS didn't start getting any exclusives until much later on when games started becoming too strong for the regular 3DS.
 
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dream1ng

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I think you'll see more third-party exclusives than first-party exclusives for the Switch Pro, since those games have to be scaled down, but Nintendo software is deliberately developed for the Switch. Of course it also depends on how successful the Pro SKU is.

And a Golden Sun game doesn't seem like it'd be the most taxing thing for the Switch since it'd probably be a mid-budget experiment (potentially a remake) just to see if the series still has an audience. I doubt Nintendo would invest so much into the game so as to necessitate exclusivity to the more powerful hardware.
 
Isaac: Venus Adept

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Golden Sun is trending on Twitter today thanks to this post generating a lot of responses for wanting Golden Sun to come back,
There was a problem fetching the tweet

It's done a lot to expose our movement for the #GoldenSun20 movement which I hope a lot of you will take part in ✌
 
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