Sumting Sumting Maifa | Game Over

3DSNinja

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I assume it's because I'm providing reasoning for upping him.

But I'm confused on how your points still stand on me dead when I was explicitly saying that the reason I was inactive was because of finals, which kinda invalidates your points.
 

Pythag

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Perhaps I should've qualified.
Tonally your reads list was very town.
I disagreed with a lot of your reasoning though
you rebuffed pretty much anything I said about them, then started your big fight with xivii.

I think it's pretty fair for me to be asking questions as far as if I actually find you town or not after all of that has happened.
 

Deadbananas

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I assume it's because I'm providing reasoning for upping him.

But I'm confused on how your points still stand on me dead when I was explicitly saying that the reason I was inactive was because of finals, which kinda invalidates your points.
While it explains you posting less it doesn't explain what I see as a role that doesn't make sense in the game and doesn't explain the lack of reasoning behind your stances, since certainly your shadow would have time to write out full messages for you with reasoning included from the get go.
 

Ranmaru

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I didn't exclude that, I presented the quote a few posts later. If he believes that, he can say it in that post. Yet he's biding his time to build up to a scum read of me. Plus he hasn't actually analyzed Xivii's play.
 

3DSNinja

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Eh, my shadow just hasn't been doin that.

Ran, maybe you should unvote on your self vote, that's just makin ya look worse.
 

Spak

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OK, I've scanned everything else up to the now. The self-vote isn't as much of a town!Ran show as I thought it was (since he's at no real danger of dying), but other than that I'm mostly just confused at the Banana push. It seems to be unanimously a good option right now, but it seems like he's just being overwhelmed by the amount of thread that's happening right now and trying to make sense of it. If someone has proof to the contrary please show me, but I don't see anything that bad out of his corner.
While it explains you posting less it doesn't explain what I see as a role that doesn't make sense in the game and doesn't explain the lack of reasoning behind your stances, since certainly your shadow would have time to write out full messages for you with reasoning included from the get go.
Could you give examples of where he justified his stances by exclusively the shadow's opinion? From what I was reading, he was getting advice from the shadow but not just taking it at face value. If he's just parroting the shadow exactly, I'd consider that concerning (since I don't think he would have any way of knowing the shadow's alignment).
 

Deadbananas

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Eh, my shadow just hasn't been doin that.

Ran, maybe you should unvote on your self vote, that's just makin ya look worse.
if it is wisp (doubtful) I find that kinda uncharacteristic, granted I've only played one game with them and I think they filled a slot but IIRC they gave reasoning a lot.
 

Deadbananas

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OK, I've scanned everything else up to the now. The self-vote isn't as much of a town!Ran show as I thought it was (since he's at no real danger of dying), but other than that I'm mostly just confused at the Banana push. It seems to be unanimously a good option right now, but it seems like he's just being overwhelmed by the amount of thread that's happening right now and trying to make sense of it. If someone has proof to the contrary please show me, but I don't see anything that bad out of his corner.

Could you give examples of where he justified his stances by exclusively the shadow's opinion? From what I was reading, he was getting advice from the shadow but not just taking it at face value. If he's just parroting the shadow exactly, I'd consider that concerning (since I don't think he would have any way of knowing the shadow's alignment).
Ah I meant the reasoning behind the shadows stances, but from what I can tell Ninja and the shadow have very similar stances, I'll go find some examples.
 

Spak

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Also, it looks like people are assuming the shadow isn't a part of the game, but I don't know why 3DS wouldn't want to share who it is if it's that's the case. Did he say somewhere that the shadow is an unaligned party?
 

LaserGuy

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When you made this discussion was it influenced by my post?
The biggest factor on making me reconsider was probably my mistake on whether this was majority vs. plurality lynch. I'm not sure if I would have moved to Bananas at all if I hadn't been concerned about actually consolidating to a giant 9 person wagon.

Was I influenced by your post? Probably on some level. I don't think I ever consciously thought that this is something I should look at because BoomFrog doesn't like the wagon. But the whole idea that this is something I should look for the first place is an idea that I learned from you, so I imagine that your comment may have twigged something in my mind.

If yes, what was your interpretation of my "secret reason"?
I assumed that you didn't like Bananas because I had moved onto his wagon. This is fairly standard play for you when you think I'm mafia. Although it hadn't occurred to me just until now, retrospectively having both me and Handorin who you are also scumreading on the same wagon was probably a big red flag for you.
 

3DSNinja

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The shadow can be brought into the game at any point, which is why I don't want to reveal who it is.

And I'm using my shadow as advice, not parroting UNLESS I'm simply telling their opinions.
 

3DSNinja

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Probably a good move, especially since I'll probably be killed by mafia before Day 3.

But then I'll probably get killed tomorrow... crap.
 

Ranmaru

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If you are worried about being killed why did you claim it at all?
 

3DSNinja

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Yea, I'm almost 100% certain I'm gonna be revealed as dead tomorrow.

But here's my POV; if Ran or Xivii gets killed, they're both innocent. It would be the most obvious frame job ever.
 

Spak

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Also, wouldn't it be the same as bringing them in tomorrow if you brought them in at end-of-phase today?
 

LaserGuy

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Logic is strong town lean from meta. Token Power Mafia was a really quick game if anyone wants to skim through it for town jack and scum logic and z meta.
Okay, I had a look and I buy this as plausible enough for D1. Logic is completely different in that game.

I'll follow you on Handorin for now.

Vote: Handorin
 

Spak

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Oh, so they get to speak for one day? I assumed it was they get to speak for the rest of the game (like a tree stump).
 
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And no Spak, it wouldn't. If I brought them in tomorrow, we would have an extra voice for a whole day phase.
You implied that the shadow gets to vote as well. And I assume it's confirmed in your role PM that the shadow is here to help you, they can't have a separate alignment. If those are both true then you should probably wait until the latest day you can to bring them in. However, don't confirm or deny any of this stuff I just said. No reason to fully give details of your role to scum. Also I doubt you will be NKed, you are too suspicious.
 

Spak

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Spak Spak Who is your bottom four players you'd be open to lynch?
Triss and Laser are still my bottom two (although I haven't had time to go back and dissect Laser's response to Z25; I'll go do that during the night phase). I feel like Triss would give us more info out of the two of them (and I don't like her logic, plus it felt like she was making stuff up on the spot early in the phase). So I'll go with

Vote: Trisscar

And change it if we need to hammer (because pretty much anyone is better than nobody right now, although we do have a free night later on if there's no vig since it's an even-numbered game). Jack looked a little too eager to jump on the banana train and then kinda disappeared imo, so he's a scum lean in my book. Other people I'd consider are Handorin (hasn't really contributed much to the conversation, although I'd miss the memes) and deadbananas for the semi-inactive lynch (it seems like most of the only times he's active are when he's defending himself and shortly thereafter).
 

Deadbananas

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Pretty sure Trisscar is townie, and my shadow agrees with me.

"Trisscar is >rand town at this point via his posts and his claim makes it even more likely"
Alright, me shadow is sayin that y'all should lay off Triss for now.
Makes posts on Triss consecutively but fails to give any reasoning in both, like just saying lay off and not giving reasons why isn't going to help.

This is kinda my shadow's read list

"there are just too many people I would put at Nulls, there is no need for a read list
I think the PoE below is likely to have a minimum of one wolf
Malak/Lasor/Hand

P.S: if one more person FoS's Trisscar I will be fuming, the dude is literally so genuine, and pure. Seriously go do other things with these 120 hour days"
no reasoning again, was asked multiple times but only answered recently, can be accepted by busy I guess.
Alright, so, reads.... I don't have many.

I think that Ran is acting slightly suspicious, but also I don't think he's scum. I mean, he was suspcious in Oasis as well... and he was town there. I think that mafia usually try to blend in and hop on to bandwagons, which is why I feel like Xivii is still closer to the scum scale, but I'm not sure if he is scum because while he could be trying to go risky as scum, I genuinely don't get why you would do that when that means you're immediately gonna become a lot more suspicious the next day. Scum are generally the people who seemingly go with the crowd, which is also why I'm certain Sabrar is town; he's gueinenly thinking and not trying to go along with the crowd, and what he's saying makes a lot of sense, even if I know I'm town. You guys don't, and you shouldn't assume a power role is town because it's a power role.
Best post so far, actually had a lot of reasoning on it and their covering of the Ran v Xivii has been good.

Alright, my shadow is most suspicious of dead rn and is strongly against a Ran exe d1
I'm also suspicious of dead, (no, not just because of my shadow) and hell my shadow brought it.up so
vote: deadbannanas
again two posts with no reasoning given at the time of posting.
 

3DSNinja

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Wasn't planning on it Boom.

Eh, I doubt I won't be NK'd. If I was scum, I would get out the only power role that's been claimed, as that would be extremely useful to get out ths early in the game.
 

3DSNinja

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Alright here's the reasoning for Triss banana.

Triss was putting himself way too out there to be scum. Him claiming vanilla townie is very risky, and he's an experienced player that my shadow has played in games with, which means that it's not like he's a noob like I was last game.
 
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Laser is doing all the things town Laser should do. I'm annoyed I got played last game by him, so that's clouding things, but I don't think I want to lynch him D1. I'm not against moving back to Handorin but I think I prefer Trisscar.

Vote Trisscar

Ninja'd by Spak. We are on the same wavelength.
 

Deadbananas

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My main problem with Triss is their defenses have been incredibly weak and they have kinda contradicted themselves a few times and seem to be making up stuff. I think that outweighs the argument that claiming VT is risky for scum. Scum can take risks now and then.
 

Spak

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Makes posts on Triss consecutively but fails to give any reasoning in both, like just saying lay off and not giving reasons why isn't going to help.


no reasoning again, was asked multiple times but only answered recently, can be accepted by busy I guess.

Best post so far, actually had a lot of reasoning on it and their covering of the Ran v Xivii has been good.




again two posts with no reasoning given at the time of posting.
I agree that the vote on you without reasoning was weird (unless 3DS has a reason he stated earlier that I missed), but it looks like he's been pretty clear when he vs his shadow have been talking. Seems fine to me; I don't think he can control how much his shadow says (and we can get the shadow to confirm this later on, if 3DS is what he says he is and survives the night).
 
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I assumed that you didn't like Bananas because I had moved onto his wagon. This is fairly standard play for you when you think I'm mafia. Although it hadn't occurred to me just until now, retrospectively having both me and Handorin who you are also scumreading on the same wagon was probably a big red flag for you.
It's not that scummy people were jumping on the wagon, I do mostly evaluate people individually D1. But just SO many people were very willing to immediatly jump on the DeadBanana's wagon, it felt very opportunistic. Basically exactly what you were saying.
 

Spak

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Alright here's the reasoning for Triss banana.

Triss was putting himself way too out there to be scum. Him claiming vanilla townie is very risky, and he's an experienced player that my shadow has played in games with, which means that it's not like he's a noob like I was last game.
If they were an experienced player, they've been lying about their forum experience and have been playing the noob card since page 2 to justify their actions (which, if they were experienced, rendered them useless to scumhunting). It was a bad move any way you cut it, but if they're experienced, that makes their actions (which they know are bad) to be inherently anti-town and are trying to coast by on everyone's good graces.

I still believe the story that they've played IRL mafia, but if they have done forum mafia and are just faking it, that's just sad.
 

Deadbananas

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Deadbananas Deadbananas Deadbananas Deadbananas Ninja3DS is very new to forum mafia. He has a lot of difficulty reading people and was basically suspicious of everyone last game.
That makes a bit more sense but also makes me a bit more confused since posts with his suses and evidence have had more reasoning in them than posts with his shadow.
Also I feel the difficulty of making reads lol. My first game of forum mafia I was vt and my 3? games since then I've been scum so being town again is a different experience for me. Maybe I have been too harsh on you Ninja. I'd hate to be in the position you claim to be in lol because I'd feel bad to have an experienced player have to be conduited through me.
 
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