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Social Spoon Sword Social

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Hey, is anyone aware that an update might occur tomorrow? @Metalex told me about this.
If it will happen tomorrow, what do you guys think will happen?
Obviously a Bayonetta nerf, but I am a bit scared of Mewtwo nerfs. Though, out of all the high tiers he's pretty much the least deserving of one.

Oh, and on the topic of people dropping Mewtwo, I will pretty much never drop him; he is basically the character that completely fits me. He's very comfortable in your hands.
Wait, how do we know there's going to be a update.I'll never drop M2, so I don't really care about nerfs I'm more excited for the low tiers. I hope they get something, to make them a threat in competitive play.
 

420quickscoper

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Wait, how do we know there's going to be a update.I'll never drop M2, so I don't really care about nerfs I'm more excited for the low tiers. I hope they get something, to make them a threat in competitive play.
Well, quoting Metalex in the Discord PM we have:
"It was a server maintenace yesterday without a patch, and the 11th they have announced another server maintenance, all other patches have followed this pattern too."
My bad, it's a Monday patch, probably :I
 
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Well, quoting Metalex in the Discord PM we have:
"It was a server maintenace yesterday without a patch, and the 11th they have announced another server maintenance, all other patches have followed this pattern too."
My bad, it's a Monday patch, probably :I
Awww well that's disappointing I'm still hoping for some low tier buffs
 

Krysco

Aeon Hero
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I'm willing to drop any and every character I enjoy if they get nerfed to the point of not being fun including my top 3 :4cloud::4mewtwo::4robinf:. It's all a matter of whether a patch of that magnitude happens. It's very unlikely, especially for :4robinf: and unless fun to you is having a kill confirm then I can't say many characters became 'unfun' via a nerf if any at all.

As for Roy, he's interesting. Like, if you look at Marth and where his sweetspots are, you can tell that he wants you at a particular range. Not too far since he lacks projectiles but not too close since that's where his sourspots are. So you'd think with Roy having his sweetspots closer to him, he'd want to be right up in your face but at that range, most characters can simply outbeat his frame data, leaving him relying on his weaker, further hitboxes.
 

420quickscoper

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I'm willing to drop any and every character I enjoy if they get nerfed to the point of not being fun including my top 3 :4cloud::4mewtwo::4robinf:. It's all a matter of whether a patch of that magnitude happens. It's very unlikely, especially for :4robinf: and unless fun to you is having a kill confirm then I can't say many characters became 'unfun' via a nerf if any at all.

As for Roy, he's interesting. Like, if you look at Marth and where his sweetspots are, you can tell that he wants you at a particular range. Not too far since he lacks projectiles but not too close since that's where his sourspots are. So you'd think with Roy having his sweetspots closer to him, he'd want to be right up in your face but at that range, most characters can simply outbeat his frame data, leaving him relying on his weaker, further hitboxes.
And, that's made much worse by the fact that Roy's weak hitboxes are actually nearly useless. They have no good angle for tech chases or combos, and they can only damage, and even THEN, Roy's sourspots do little damage!
 
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I'm willing to drop any and every character I enjoy if they get nerfed to the point of not being fun including my top 3 :4cloud::4mewtwo::4robinf:. It's all a matter of whether a patch of that magnitude happens. It's very unlikely, especially for :4robinf: and unless fun to you is having a kill confirm then I can't say many characters became 'unfun' via a nerf if any at all.

As for Roy, he's interesting. Like, if you look at Marth and where his sweetspots are, you can tell that he wants you at a particular range. Not too far since he lacks projectiles but not too close since that's where his sourspots are. So you'd think with Roy having his sweetspots closer to him, he'd want to be right up in your face but at that range, most characters can simply outbeat his frame data, leaving him relying on his weaker, further hitboxes.
That was the design flaw I was talking about if roy had better frame data for a rushdown he'd be so much better
 

420quickscoper

Smash Ace
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That was the design flaw I was talking about if roy had better frame data for a rushdown he'd be so much better
If Roy's endlag was decreased then he'd be so much better, yeah... unfortunately he has terrible auto cancels and a lot of landing/ending lag on a lot of his moves.
 

Krysco

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Yeah, I'm no expert on the character but it seems like Roy's gameplan is 'outspace them with my weak hits until they get hit by one of my sweetspots trying to get in'. It's funny since that's not his only weakness, his physics make him easy to combo and his recovery is on the lower end since it's linear and rather easy to hit through. He doesn't even have a combo breaking move with his fastest move in the air being uair at frame 5.
 

Mario & Sonic Guy

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Roy can be a decent fighter when used right, but his problems are quite clear, which includes an inconvenient sweetspot for his sword, and his recovery is on the mediocre side for someone who has a very good air speed value.
 

Sonicninja115

Experiment. Innovate. Improve.
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Just a heads up, the Mewtwo Guide is still being updataed almost daily for anyone interested. I am about to finish the Neutral section, within the next hour probably, so check it out! And, if you want anything added to the guide that is missing, please tell me so I can get too it!
 
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Roy can be a decent fighter when used right, but his problems are quite clear, which includes an inconvenient sweetspot for his sword, and his recovery is on the mediocre side for someone who has a very good air speed value.
This is true but I still think something has to be done here's my list
1.Auto cancel Fair and Bair
2.less endlag on down throw
3.less endlag on down smash
4.a kill throw or kill setup
Just a heads up, the Mewtwo Guide is still being updataed almost daily for anyone interested. I am about to finish the Neutral section, within the next hour probably, so check it out! And, if you want anything added to the guide that is missing, please tell me so I can get too it!
What guide are you talking about my friend
 

Sonicninja115

Experiment. Innovate. Improve.
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This is true but I still think something has to be done here's my list
1.Auto cancel Fair and Bair
2.less endlag on down throw
3.less endlag on down smash
4.a kill throw or kill setup

What guide are you talking about my friend
The forum guide, the stickied one, the one that is almost as long as the Melee Fox one. (not quite, but hey.....)
 

Quantumpen

Smash Apprentice
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Highly unlikely that Mewtwo will get a nerf in upcoming patches. I don't expect any changes at all. I's very clearly they are buffing him towards a specific design (fast movement speed, high kill power, fragile) and I don't see them going back on that because an elite player won a tournament with him. He doesn't have any overpowered or spammable tools. It's hard to point to any part of his kit which is overtuned or broken, and he already has considerable weaknesses.

The balance team has not been acting randomly for a long time. They've gotten better and better at balancing as the game has progressed, 1.1.3 - 1.1.5 have honestly been pretty on point. They have a very specific agenda and honestly they've been doing a great job. They saved us from Diddy, they saved us from Sheik... they pay attention. Right now, they are trying to bring down historic top tiers who have dominated the game for a long time (Shiek, ZSS), balance DLC characters who haven't yet been tuned (Cloud, Bayo) and bring up characters who previously had serious design problems (Mewtwo, Zelda, Ganondorf, Samus, Charizard) and remove cheese they don't want in the game (MK lost his 0-to death).

I think the devs are pretty happy with where he is and how he plays. He has a coherent design, and no particularly cheesy buttons or kill combos. In the next patch (if there is one), expect further touch ups to recent DLC characters, large buffs to a couple more low tiers who need it, and some top tier nerfs (My money is on Bayo and Rosa). Mewtwo won't get touched, I'll bet on it.
 
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Highly unlikely that Mewtwo will get a nerf in upcoming patches. I don't expect any changes at all. I's very clearly they are buffing him towards a specific design (fast movement speed, high kill power, fragile) and I don't see them going back on that because an elite player won a tournament with him. He doesn't have any overpowered or spammable tools. It's hard to point to any part of his kit which is overtuned or broken, and he already has considerable weaknesses.

The balance team has not been acting randomly for a long time. They've gotten better and better at balancing as the game has progressed, 1.1.3 - 1.1.5 have honestly been pretty on point. They have a very specific agenda and honestly they've been doing a great job. They saved us from Diddy, they saved us from Sheik... they pay attention. Right now, they are trying to bring down historic top tiers who have dominated the game for a long time (Shiek, ZSS), balance DLC characters who haven't yet been tuned (Cloud, Bayo) and bring up characters who previously had serious design problems (Mewtwo, Zelda, Ganondorf, Samus, Charizard) and remove cheese they don't want in the game (MK lost his 0-to death).

I think the devs are pretty happy with where he is and how he plays. He has a coherent design, and no particularly cheesy buttons or kill combos. In the next patch (if there is one), expect further touch ups to recent DLC characters, large buffs to a couple more low tiers who need it, and some top tier nerfs (My money is on Bayo and Rosa). Mewtwo won't get touched, I'll bet on it.
I just touched M2 what do I get
 

Mario & Sonic Guy

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Rosalina already got nerfed hard before Smash Wii U's release. She really does not need any more nerfs, unlike with Sheik and Zero Suit Samus.
 

Mario & Sonic Guy

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As a Rosa semi main I can say she deserves some nerfs mostly up air knock back and Luma being able to break grabs
The Luma breaking grabs is completely irrelevant if you know to throw Rosalina immediately upon grabbing her. And if Yoshi grabs Rosalina, the Luma can't do anything against Yoshi at all. Heck, I can't even stop a CPU from throwing Rosalina, even when the Luma is close by.

As for the up aerial, without the Luma, it's becomes more difficult to try to make KOs with it.
 
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The Luma breaking grabs is completely irrelevant if you know to throw Rosalina immediately upon grabbing her. And if Yoshi grabs Rosalina, the Luma can't do anything against Yoshi at all. Heck, I can't even stop a CPU from throwing Rosalina, even when the Luma is close by.

As for the up aerial, without the Luma, it's becomes more difficult to try to make KOs with it.
That's not the easiest thing to do for some characters besides it makes no sense anyway and what if a character has a kill throw and gets a grab but the opponent is 3% percent away so they have to pummel so you can't throw immediately

It doesn't have to stop killing just kill later on TAC when I get grabbed I feel like I'm already about to die without Luma it is near useless Im not suggesting they destroy as I like to use her to just tone her down a bit but overall Bayo takes priority
 

Mario & Sonic Guy

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That's not the easiest thing to do for some characters besides it makes no sense anyway and what if a character has a kill throw and gets a grab but the opponent is 3% percent away so they have to pummel so you can't throw immediately

It doesn't have to stop killing just kill later on TAC when I get grabbed I feel like I'm already about to die without Luma it is near useless Im not suggesting they destroy as I like to use her to just tone her down a bit but overall Bayo takes priority
If you separate Rosalina and the Luma from each other, then you can pummel Rosalina more easily without having to worry about the Luma interfering.
 
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I'm ****ing triggered.
And that buddy is why I said semi I only use her for like one matchup and that's lucas and Ness and thats just because I like being a d*** other wise I use Pit so calm down ;)
If you separate Rosalina and the Luma from each other, then you can pummel Rosalina more easily without having to worry about the Luma interfering.
I suppose that's true lol
 

Mario & Sonic Guy

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Basically, if you're letting the Luma attack you whenever you grab Rosalina, then you're not doing a good job of keeping it contained. Sure, some fighters contain the Luma better than others, but as long as you can knock it off the stage or fully deplete its HP, Rosalina will be left without a partner for a while.
 
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Basically, if you're letting the Luma attack you whenever you grab Rosalina, then you're not doing a good job of keeping it contained. Sure, some fighters contain the Luma better than others, but as long as you can knock it off the stage or fully deplete its HP, Rosalina will be left without a partner for a while.
OK we've been talking about killing Luma and stuff what about Zelda what can she do to Luma and don't say Fair or Bair
 

Mario & Sonic Guy

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OK we've been talking about killing Luma and stuff what about Zelda what can she do to Luma and don't say Fair or Bair
Din's Fire is pretty much an issue for the Luma, since it can't defend itself, and Gravitational Pull has no effect against that attack either. Also, Nayru's Love reflects Luma Shot right back at Rosalina.
 

BlazGreen

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Bayo is the only character that needs nerfing. Rosa and Cloud are very good but have enough flaws and bad MUs to not be a problem.
 
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