[SPOILER ALERT] - The Sevens Squares. - A Square-Enix general support threads.

[Sigran101]

Square is immune to text leaks, Final Fantasy 14 is notable for having quite a few of its updates leaked by one guy. Yes Square spreads bad info, but inevitably whoever the real character is will get transferred down the drain-pipe to lower levels who leak what they’ve heard. The real character is still gonna be heard a lot by a lot of different people. With every leaker claiming they’ve heard Erdrick the most, it would make sense.

Unless you can provide sources as to how this works, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. We don't have to expect the same smash characters as long as we can be civil about it, which you have been.

 

[PsySmasher]

OK guys. I’m gonna be blunt and cut to the chase.

Can anyone give me any piece of evidence that can prove, without a shadow of doubt, that Erdrick is 100% guaranteed to be the Brave character/Square Rep.

Because if you can’t, I don’t see why you can blame people for not being 100% confident in Erdrick.

 

[Hydrualic Hydra]

Worse is absolutely subjective. I'm trying to say that I have no incentive to believe it's slime over Erdrick, because I'd like Erdrick better. What's this about in game stats changing? I wasn't aware of this.

Piranha Plant's stats have changed between patches since they were first datamined. The same can and likely will apply to Brave, considering it currently has identical landing lag frames to Jack. And even if things like height and speed don't change, we can't act like we know exactly how the character would look or function until we actually see for ourselves how Sakurai intends it to work. Would you have believed me if I said before E3 that Ridley would end up not even a superheavyweight, and below Samus' eye level? It's a double veil that prevents the specific data from actually meaning anything about the character definitively.

The main point I (and I think @Shishœ ) am trying to get across is that people are leaping to use any means possible to deny the claims of multiple trusted leakers, at this point including the guy who was able to leak Cloud, even when those means don't actually prove anything. I'd know, I did the same thing for weeks on end trying to defend a fake panorama made by a crafty gang of trolls. 'It's leakbait' and 'but this data on a fighter we've never seen before' are in no way strong cases against Erdrick.

And yes, Square does put out leakbait. But they've had leaks honestly more and more as of recently. Between the leak with the Final Fantasy expansion, and 2B coming to Soul Calibur, they've proven to be far from airtight.

I mean no aggression with this, I've got no beef with you, just recognize that it's the same 'but it's possible that...' rhetoric I used in an attempt to justify the Grinch leak when literally everyone in the know was in agreeance it was fake.

 

[Deleted member]

OK guys. I’m gonna be blunt and cut to the chase.

Can anyone give me any piece of evidence that can prove, without a shadow of doubt, that Erdrick is 100% guaranteed to be the Brave character/Square Rep.

Because if you can’t, I don’t see why you can blame people for not being 100% confident in Erdrick.

I think he’s in and I’m never wrong.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I think he’s in and I’m never wrong.

Don't get cocky.

It's not a good look.

I realized this myself the base roster of this game. I was so certain Ken and Incineroar were not it and we'd get at least them, plus two other fan requests.

I used the ''I called Bayonetta and ya'll called me stupid." card a lot.

Now I realize I just looked like a god damn fool.

 

[Deleted member]

What happened with the stat data?

 

[Deleted member]

Don't get cocky.

It's not a good look.

I realized this myself the base roster of this game. I was so certain Ken and Incineroar were not it and we'd get at least them, plus two other fan requests.

I used the ''I called Bayonetta and ya'll called me stupid." card a lot.

Now I realize I just looked like a god damn fool.

Pretty sure that was sarcasm

 

[Flyboy]

I think he’s in and I’m never wrong.

But you're in the game! That's cheating!

 

[Deleted member]

Don't get cocky.

It's not a good look.

I realized this myself the base roster of this game. I was so certain Ken and Incineroar were not it and we'd get at least them, plus two other fan requests.

I used the ''I called Bayonetta and ya'll called me stupid." card a lot.

Now I realize I just looked like a god damn fool.

Was a joke my guy. Although I will now act annoyingly cocky from now on just to spite you.

 

[Sigran101]

Piranha Plant's stats have changed between patches since they were first datamined. The same can and likely will apply to Brave, considering it currently has identical landing lag frames to Jack. And even if things like height and speed don't change, we can't act like we know exactly how the character would look or function until we actually see for ourselves how Sakurai intends it to work. Would you have believed me if I said before E3 that Ridley would end up not even a superheavyweight, and below Samus' eye level? It's a double veil that prevents the specific data from actually meaning anything about the character definitively.

The main point I (and I think @Shishœ ) am trying to get across is that people are leaping to use any means possible to deny the claims of multiple trusted leakers, at this point including the guy who was able to leak Cloud, even when those means don't actually prove anything. I'd know, I did the same thing for weeks on end trying to defend a fake panorama made by a crafty gang of trolls. 'It's leakbait' and 'but this data on a fighter we've never seen before' are in no way strong cases against Erdrick.

And yes, Square does put out leakbait. But they've had leaks honestly more and more as of recently. Between the leak with the Final Fantasy expansion, and 2B coming to Soul Calibur, they've proven to be far from airtight.

I mean no aggression with this, I've got no beef with you, just recognize that it's the same 'but it's possible that...' rhetoric I used in an attempt to justify the Grinch leak when literally everyone in the know was in agreeance it was fake.

I didn't know that. That does change things, although regardless I still have my doubts since the data sounds nothing like Erdrick, but thank you for adding something constructive.

I actually am not convinced Cloud was legitimately leaked. The guy never made any other leaks. Thousands of people post fake leaks on 4chan every day. One was bound to get lucky. It was likely just that.

I do understand the similarities to the Grinch situation, but I would still argue that this is very different. Grinch was an out of hand hoax. This is just me being generally distrustful of text leaks, as 95% of them are wrong, and noticing that in game data seems to contradict the current narrative, even though I like the current narrative better. I'd rather be 100% on Erdrick than have a chance of Geno with a chance of Slime. I really really don't want slime.

Thank you for being respectful about it though.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

The "Square wouldn't let Erdrick leak! Cloud never leaked!" thought of line is so faulty because Cloud was the ONE DLC from Smash 4 that did leak from inside sources.

Admittedly though, Tansut did leak Cloud, but it was only on the same day as the Direct where Strife got annouced. Things could be going a bit differently this time, especially if Square and Nintendo have wizened up to his connections from before.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Was a joke my guy. Although I will now act annoyingly cocky from now on just to spite you.

Or you could realize text doesn't always translate well and just you know.....not.

 

[Calane]

I'm now fully expecting "Brave" to not be Erdrick. But that's okay, he may still have a shot as long as it's not another SE character.

If it does turn out being Geno or something, then that's great for that character's fans, and I'll be very happy for them.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

If this is leakbait, then props to Square for being so efficient with it. Impressive how they managed to fool pretty much every reliable leaker and convince them that it’s Erdrick while also making a list of characters just to spread doubt as to who it is before tricking people into thinking it’s Erdrick as a way to dismiss doubt. Very impressive show all around.

It's certainly not outside the realm of possibility, given how much everyone got bamboozled by Joker's reveal, a trailer that's already amassed quite in shift in support based of certain leakers effectively.

 

[Deleted member]

Or you could realize text doesn't always translate well and just you know.....not.

Yeah but then how would people realise how big brain I am?

 

[MajoraMan28]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

If Erdrick wasn't by far the most probable DQ rep, I'd say these stats remind me of Slime.
How slippery he is, and how he can't walljump.

Cool, but then again, we know nothing of the possibility of the stats being final.

 

[Sigran101]

My hang up on the "stats changed for Pirahna Plant" argument is that the stats don't fit Erdrick at all to begin with. Logically, if it's Erdrick and the stats change, then Brave's stats were Erdricks current stats at the time of the update, but they will be changed later. Which means at least at one point, Erdrick was designed to be Ness sized and second slowest in the game anyway. It still doesn't make any sense, even in planning stages.

Remember how everyone said the square character would be at the game awards? And how no one predicted Joker? Leakers are very often wrong. Even Verg said there was a Minecraft boss. I only trust what I can see for sure is official, and right now that's only the datamine, which points away from Erdrick.

I'm a little confused as to why everyone wants me to believe it's Erdrick so bad though. Does it really matter if a person on the internet disagrees with you?

 

[GoodGrief741]

My hang up on the "stats changed for Pirahna Plant" argument is that the stats don't fit Erdrick at all to begin with. Logically, if it's Erdrick and the stats change, then Brave's stats were Erdricks current stats at the time of the update, but they will be changed later. Which means at least at one point, Erdrick was designed to be Ness sized and second slowest in the game anyway. It still doesn't make any sense, even in planning stages.

Remember how everyone said the square character would be at the game awards? And how no one predicted Joker? Leakers are very often wrong. Even Verg said there was a Minecraft boss. I only trust what I can see for sure is official, and right now that's only the datamine, which points away from Erdrick.

I'm a little confused as to why everyone wants me to believe it's Erdrick so bad though. Does it really matter if a person on the internet disagrees with you?

I'll update when more is known, but apparently height as a stat is pretty inconsistent.
Bowser is 24
Ridley is 18
K Rool is 21
Samus is 18.

I’ll just quote this since you don’t appear to have read them.

Erdrick being the second slowest in the game I remember being a mistake by somebody here, as well.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Okay but why Erdrick? Why out of all characters on the list would you use Erdrick as leakbait, when he’s pretty unknown in the west which is where most leaks happen?

Hmm? Oh this? This is easy to explain.

First off, he's popular in Japan. That wouldn't effect which sides of the companies hear about them, he'd be in the works.

Even if that isn't enough, it's a common bait-and-switch tactic. Make prying eyes think they're getting something not as longed, only to surprise with something more surprising.

One thing's for sure, we know that Sakurai, Nintendo and Square Enix all hate leaks something fierce. Not saying he's leak bait for sure, but Erdrick would be a viable fall guy to mask a newcomer like say, Sephiroth.

And there's nothing dictating that the codename "Brave" has to actually do with the series or character. Could just be a random codename for whoever .

 

[Deleted member]

If I remember correctly, the current stats for brave denoted that while on the heavy side, the character was relatively agile and speedwise I believe it was on the average side in the 170s far off the slowests one (Incineroar is in the 110s for reference).

 

[Deleted member]

Hmm? Oh this? This is easy to explain.

First off, he's popular in Japan. That wouldn't effect which sides of the companies hear about them, he'd be in the works.

Even if that isn't enough, it's a common bait-and-switch tactic. Make prying eyes think they're getting something not as longed, only to surprise with something more surprising.

One thing's for sure, we know that Sakurai, Nintendo and Square Enix all hate leaks something fierce. Not saying he's leak bait for sure, but Erdrick would be a viable fall guy to mask a newcomer like say, Sephiroth.

And there's nothing dictating that the codename "Brave" has to actually do with the series or character. Could just be a random codename for whoever .

For that first point, okay, but Square would likely realise that leaks tend to happen in the West, making erdrick’s Japanese popularity less relavent. The rest of this is in the realm of “It could happen, but why and we have no reason to really believe so”. That’s the trouble with this, we ultimately don’t know how leak-bait really works and how square chooses it, and to what extent they use it. I just think it’s more likely that we’re hearing Erdrick because he’s in.

 

[MajoraMan28]

My point is that Erdrikc being leskbait would be, IMO, far too elaborate a situation for it be really feasible. I don’t think leak bait on this scale is really all that likely my guy.

Ironically, this bold part is the thing I heard the most when I was arguing against those who were pro-Grinch leak.
Would be pretty ironic if it ended up the same way again, huh

 

[Sigran101]

I’ll just quote this since you don’t appear to have read them.

Erdrick being the second slowest in the game I remember being a mistake by somebody here, as well.

I don't know what that is supposed to prove. I did my own research and Brave is faster than Pirahna Plant, the slowest, and faster than Incineroar, who is right above Pirahna Plant. I'm not sure how those characters relate.
Edit: oh, those are size, not speed. I get it. I'm going to look into that.

 

[Deleted member]

Ironically, this bold part is the thing I heard the most when I was arguing against those who were pro-Grinch leak.
Would be pretty ironic if it ended up the same way again, huh

Realised that while I was typing. Smash bros really does run in cycles I suppose lol.

 

[-Coco-]

Brave was never said to be the 2nd slowest iirc he was supposed to be average speed.

 

[Deleted member]

The brave character is Porky without his mech

 

[Deleted member]

The real brave was inside us all along.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

For that first point, okay, but Square would likely realise that leaks tend to happen in the West, making erdrick’s Japanese popularity less relavent.

Doesn't stop Japanese leaks from happening either. We've had some already, and it's noir Erdrick is practically unheard of overseas, unlike someone like Katalina for obvious reasons.

The rest of this is in the realm of “It could happen, but why and we have no reason to really believe so”.

Considering Smash's past history with Kuala, they have very good reason to believe that leaks can happen and to prepare for them accordingly.

And again, let's not forget how Joker's reveal spat in the face of what pretty high every insider was saying. We can't be sure it isn't happening again.

That’s the trouble with this, we ultimately don’t know how leak-bait really works and how square chooses it, and to what extent they use it.

Leak bait is used to catch leakers' sources and/or outrightrfool people.

Also, it's not necessarily just Square who'd plan the leak bait all on their own in a scenario like this. Nintendo could be involved. Heck, wouldn't be surprised if they traded notes with Bamco. Could even be from a big list that was given to Xander to read.

 

[Deleted member]

The brave character is Porky without his mech

That would be quite an ironic nickname.

 

[Deleted member]

Wait....

Spoiler

 

[Sigran101]

Instead of just buying what people tell you about the speed, look at it yourself. It's pretty easy to just compare the datamined stats with the other character stats. I did this and found that he is right between Pirahna Plant and Incinerroar, so I'm sticking to that. Do your own research.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

The real brave was inside us all along.

no brave was the friends we made along the way

 

[Deleted member]

Doesn't stop Japanese leaks from happening either. We've had some already, and it's noir Erdrick is practically unheard of overseas, unlike someone like Katalina for obvious reasons.

Considering Smash's past history with Kuala, they have very good reason to believe that leaks can happen and to prepare for them accordingly.

And again, let's not forget how Joker's reveal spat in the face of what pretty high every insider was saying. We can't be sure it isn't happening again.

Leak bait is used to catch leakers' sources and/or outrightrfool people.

Also, it's not necessarily just Square who'd plan the leak bait all on their own in a scenario like this. Nintendo could be involved. Heck, wouldn't be surprised if they traded notes with Bamco. Could even be from a big list that was given to Xander to read.

You gotta remember though, we’ve been hearing about the Square rep since August, and even before that. It’s been in the rumour mill for quite a long time. In that sameness timeframe, most of ultimate’s roster was leaked, notably incineroar and Simon. My point is, if in the timeframe the square rep leaked, we also got legitimate leaks for ultimate’s roster, and erdrick has been heard as far back as then, then why would only he be lekabiat? Yes square uses lekabait themseves, but gain they aren’t invulnerable, as shown with FFXIV. They wouldn’t know how vulnerable the game was to leaking as far back as then, which would suggest Erdrick is legit.
have to sleep in a bit so can’t keep posting now.

 

[-Coco-]

In case anyone hasn't seen it.

 

[Flyboy]

It's the Dragon Quest Builders protagonist.

1. It explains why Nekoo heard the rep was "Hero".
2. It explains the "Minecraft content".
3. It explains the possible chibi-ness.
4. It explains why tansut says they have male and female alts
5. And if they were wearing the legendary armor it'd explain their weight stat.

Look into your heart.

(I kid.)

 

[Ovaltine]

In case anyone hasn't seen it.

The boneset thing makes me wonder...

Erdrick is fine and all, but can I order the boneless option? Boneless DQ rep is Slime. Let's go boneless. I'll order one boneless DQ rep to go, please. Make that with barbecue sauce.

 

[Deleted member]

In case anyone hasn't seen it.

It looks like the main thing about the character we should pay attention to is his/her/its weight, then

 

[Sigran101]

In case anyone hasn't seen it.

This is just what everyone has already been saying. My response is that he'd have to be sitting down or something to be that small. Which leaves us with kid Erdrick being slower than Incineroar.

 

[MajoraMan28]

I haven't voiced my opinion as much here, and when I do, it's not even on this thread, bc I'm editing my comment from a thread that is currently dead.
I do believe that there's a very real possibility of Erdrick being leakbait. This isn't saying that Erdrick isn't the one or that the leakers were wrong, but that the info we got could very well be intentionally put out there to get the leakers in their internal environment and create a narrative that will keep us surprised once the character is revealed. I'm honestly thinking that this could very well be the case bc never in S-E's history has there ever been a leak this bad. Sure, there's always a first time, but this is far too much.
Erdrick and DQ in Smash makes a ton of sense, and I would be extremely happy if Erdrick was picked. But I need to be realistic here.
The Smash characters were revealed bc the parties involved were a lot larger and there was a lot more room for people to leak. DLC planning is stuff that is a lot less out there. The fact that a S-E character is coming I can definitely stand by it. But the exact character is only known by the higher ups at the negotiation table and the development staff in Japan. This isn't some bottom tier NoA stuff that happens all the time.
My hunch tells me that the character IS one of the 7 of the list, hence someone being fired and all, but the info that has come forth surrounding this is either circumstancial evidence or outright void claims that can be disproven by the reveal itself, since stuff like data and stats are malleable.

It's the Dragon Quest Builders protagonist.

1. It explains why Nekoo heard the rep was "Hero".
2. It explains the "Minecraft content".
3. It explains the possible chibi-ness.
4. It explains why tansut says they have male and female alts
5. And if they were wearing the legendary armor it'd explain their weight stat.

Look into your heart.

(I kid.)

The best part in all of this is how convincing this actually sounds.
Even if the pick would be absolutely underwhelming, in my eyes

 

[shinhed-echi]

Time for a new headache.

If a codename can be leakbait, then what about stats? Couldn't they also just mess around with numbers to throw dataminers off? Stats change either way.