Social Sora Unlocks the Door! The Sora Social Thread

[HyruleHero]

Honestly, I would find this a more disappointing approach to implementing the character, as 1) Sora has his own unique moves originating from his own game, 2) the magic started as an adaptation of Final Fantasy magic into action combat, and 3) Cloud has already shown that he can use abilities other than staple magic. Those staple magic attacks I feel should be reserved totally for a black mage character.

I mean I do agree, when I play KH I don't use magic to often but I think its a huge part of what makes sora, sora. I said my thoughts on specials but I think he would be similar to Robin in the fact that specials are spells and smashs and tilts are swords (keyblade for sora)

Thinking about it though he could be like shulk and cycle through magic with Standard special and then use down special to compute spell. as well as this he could have a magic charge up bar like in the games where you have to hit the heartless to restore magic.

I don't know im just spit balling it here.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net...o_KHBBS.png/revision/latest?cb=20100420172621
in case the image doesn't work.
this is from a kingdom hearts game. the Kingdom Key has a crown on it rather than Mickey mouses head. All the Keyblade keychain reasons are irrelevant.

Also your tinker bell point is true, she cant appear in the game but haveing sparkles appear around sora is only eluding to the fact she make no appearance.

I think Sora's specials would be more focused on his magic abilities to be honest.
standard special:
some projectile magic like fire (KH1) or blizzard (KH2) and I assume Thunder (KH3).
Side Special:
Gravity or something (could use sonic blade like fox and falco's side special but can use it twice like pikachu's up special)
Down Special:
Reflect or Aero (could also use fire from KH2 with the area of effect
Up Special:
I wouldn't use a magic move for this id use Sora's signature up swing when enemies are in the air where he twirls around (Aerial Sweep I think the ability was called)

I'd give Sora's character the ability to reflect projectiles if the tip of the keyblade hits it (with a Tech. text showing up) it wouldn't have a multiplier to keep it balanced and probably slows down the projectile or leaves the speed constant.

The picture you showed isn't Sora's Keyblade. That's the Keyblade Graveyard logo. And it still wouldn't look right if Sora's Kingdom Key had the crown instead of the Mickey. And Sonic Blade would make a better Side Special than Gravity, especially if you can chain it into a combo.

 

[HyruleHero]

The picture you showed isn't Sora's Keyblade. That's the Keyblade Graveyard logo. And it still wouldn't look right if Sora's Kingdom Key had the crown instead of the Mickey. And Sonic Blade would make a better Side Special than Gravity, especially if you can chain it into a combo.

while it isn't technically Sora's keyblade at the beginning of the animation for this world it starts with a key that looks almost identical to the kingdom key and it forms into those words.
Honestly I didn't notice that the keyblade had a mickey mouse keychain until KH2 so i think replacing it with a crown is perfectly fine.
I think the Kingdom keyblade would look better with the crown anyway.

 

[FirestormNeos]

Look, as long as Sora is as agile and flashy as he is in KH2, I'll be fine. I'd rather not weigh him down with some slow-*** command deck gimmick like they do in Flash 2.

 

[fogbadge]

Well even so, characters from the Disney version of Peter Pan shouldn't even make cameos. If there was a Tinker Bell in a Nintendo game that was only based on the public domain parts of JM Barrie's stories, then yeah she could make a cameo in Smash. But not the Tink from Kingdom Hearts who is explicitly the same Tinker Bell from Disney's 1953 film. The idea of Disney cameos in Smash when Sakurai forbids non-video game characters is just crazy. Oh, and look at what's hanging off Sora's weapon: A Mickey Mouse cameo!

peter pan isnt in the public domain

 

[Double0Groove]

Well even so, characters from the Disney version of Peter Pan shouldn't even make cameos. If there was a Tinker Bell in a Nintendo game that was only based on the public domain parts of JM Barrie's stories, then yeah she could make a cameo in Smash. But not the Tink from Kingdom Hearts who is explicitly the same Tinker Bell from Disney's 1953 film. The idea of Disney cameos in Smash when Sakurai forbids non-video game characters is just crazy. Oh, and look at what's hanging off Sora's weapon: A Mickey Mouse cameo!

Correction: It is a reference! Not a cameo. The key difference being that the mouse himself is not attached to the end of that keyblade. To drive home that point, according to Nomura himself, his team was contractually obligated to only use Mickey Mouse in one scene in the first Kingdom Hearts game (you know the one). If that keychain was an actual cameo of Mickey Mouse, that would've caused issues and the design would have been forced to change. Keep this in mind, a keychain that is shaped as Mickey's head is nothing more than a novelty design, that's it. The keychain is not a character, so it's safe.

And incase you're interested, here's the link to the interview: http://kh13.com/interviews/kingdom-hearts-ultimania-x-tetsuya-nomura/

 

[Sean Wheeler]

peter pan isnt in the public domain

Well, there is a crazy anamoly with Pan's copyrights. A children's hospital in England has a permanent copyright, but outside of the UK, Pan's stories are public domain. Well the ones that had already entered public domain by the time Disney and other companies pushed the copyright expiration to 70 years after author's death to protect characters like Mickey Mouse from going into the public domain. And since Barrie died in 1937, which is 81 years ago, Peter Pan should be public domain in the US. Still the fact that Disney played a big part of changing copyright laws and how they keep buying up companies like Marvel, Lucasfilm and Fox makes Disney untrustworthy as a third-party license for Smash Bros.

 

[Double0Groove]

Well, there is a crazy anamoly with Pan's copyrights. A children's hospital in England has a permanent copyright, but outside of the UK, Pan's stories are public domain. Well the ones that had already entered public domain by the time Disney and other companies pushed the copyright expiration to 70 years after author's death to protect characters like Mickey Mouse from going into the public domain. And since Barrie died in 1937, which is 81 years ago, Peter Pan should be public domain in the US. Still the fact that Disney played a big part of changing copyright laws and how they keep buying up companies like Marvel, Lucasfilm and Fox makes Disney untrustworthy as a third-party license for Smash Bros.

But Nintendo and Disney have worked together in the past, them allowing Nintendoto use a characterthat isn't even apart of their A-list roster shouldn't be any cause for concern. Plus, Square Enix is safe, and they work directly with Disney.

 

[fogbadge]

Well, there is a crazy anamoly with Pan's copyrights. A children's hospital in England has a permanent copyright, but outside of the UK, Pan's stories are public domain. Well the ones that had already entered public domain by the time Disney and other companies pushed the copyright expiration to 70 years after author's death to protect characters like Mickey Mouse from going into the public domain. And since Barrie died in 1937, which is 81 years ago, Peter Pan should be public domain in the US. Still the fact that Disney played a big part of changing copyright laws and how they keep buying up companies like Marvel, Lucasfilm and Fox makes Disney untrustworthy as a third-party license for Smash Bros.

somebody's been googling

are you absolutely sure you want sora in smash? never seen anyone throw up so many arguments against a character they want

 

[zabimaru1000]

Well, there is a crazy anamoly with Pan's copyrights. A children's hospital in England has a permanent copyright, but outside of the UK, Pan's stories are public domain. Well the ones that had already entered public domain by the time Disney and other companies pushed the copyright expiration to 70 years after author's death to protect characters like Mickey Mouse from going into the public domain. And since Barrie died in 1937, which is 81 years ago, Peter Pan should be public domain in the US. Still the fact that Disney played a big part of changing copyright laws and how they keep buying up companies like Marvel, Lucasfilm and Fox makes Disney untrustworthy as a third-party license for Smash Bros.

Disney has allowed Sega to use Wreck-It Ralph in Sonic All Stars Racing and Kingdom Hearts in World of Final Fantasy.

I don't see how Disney allowing Sakurai to use Kingdom Hearts would be any different.

 

[Red Dead Redeemed]

As much as I'm aware of all the hurdles necessary for Sora to get in, the sheer power that Kingdom Hearts nostalgia has over me makes it impossible for me to not support my boy Sora for Smash. Sign me up!

Plus it's not as though Disney is completely adverse to lending their IP to other companies or allowing companies they own to lend their IP to others (Marvel Vs. Capcom Infinite and EA's license deal with Star Wars comes to mind). Also, now that Disney has dropped out of the video game market with the cancellation of Disney Infinity, Disney is no longer in any competition with Nintendo, making potential cross-promotional deals a much smoother affair.

 

[CloudedSun]

https://smashboards.com/threads/which-second-non-echo-square-enix-character-do-you-want.458122/

Let's show our support for Sora!

 

[fogbadge]

https://smashboards.com/threads/which-second-non-echo-square-enix-character-do-you-want.458122/

Let's show our support for Sora!

well hes not technically square enix

 

[HyruleHero]

well hes not technically square enix

Well to me he's the defining character of Squaresoft and that is what Square Enix became. (although I think cloud is the face of Square)

 

[CloudedSun]

He's not OWNED by Square Enix, but there's no denying Sora was conceptualized by Square Enix (Nomura). People forget, even Sora supporters, that owning is different. Just 'cause a game is published by Nintendo doesn't mean they made it, same logic here.

Sora is a Square Enix character, heavily inspired by Final Fantasy and owned by Disney. Disney would not have come up with Kingdom Hearts or their characters and designs otherwise.

 

[zabimaru1000]

The unofficial ballot gathered over 20k votes. Sora made top 5, so I guess I can't deny that he isn't a highly requested character lol.

 

[fogbadge]

The unofficial ballot gathered over 20k votes. Sora made top 5, so I guess I can't deny that he isn't a highly requested character lol.
View attachment 162175

i think thats more than kingdom hearts 3 on the switch support, sheesh

 

[CloudedSun]

i think thats more than kingdom hearts 3 on the switch support, sheesh

I wish we could have KH3 on the Switch, but Nomura already said he's running outta space on Blu Ray, and apparently the cartridges Nintendo makes are very expensive. The publishing branch of SE wouldn't like that at all.

 

[fogbadge]

I wish we could have KH3 on the Switch, but Nomura already said he's running outta space on Blu Ray, and apparently the cartridges Nintendo makes are very expensive. The publishing branch of SE wouldn't like that at all.

its a shame but what can you do

 

[Double0Groove]

The unofficial ballot gathered over 20k votes. Sora made top 5, so I guess I can't deny that he isn't a highly requested character lol.
View attachment 162175

I mean, top 5 is still highly requested.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

Fighters that can't be realized have been excluded? What would the rankings look like when the joke votes with low chances and the Goku and Shrek supporters were counted?

 

[Double0Groove]

Fighters that can't be realized have been excluded? What would the rankings look like when the joke votes with low chances and the Goku and Shrek supporters were counted?

Then, uh... Goku would be on the list I guess. Not too sure about the other characters like Shrek or whoeverelse is considered a joke/chance character.

 

[Jetsurge]

You're wrong. I know now, without a doubt, Kingdom Hearts... is

Spoiler

SUPER SMASH BROTHERS!!!!!

 

[Sean Wheeler]

You're wrong. I know now, without a doubt, Kingdom Hearts... is

Disney!!!

As fun as it is to fight Heartless, and while there are some cutscenes without a Disney character in sight, and there's a lot of original characters like Sora, Riku, Axel, Ventus, Aqua, Roxas, Kairi, Xion, Xehanort, Organization XIII, etc. and you can just think of the keychain at the end of the Kingdom Key as just three circles and not something that represents Mickey Mouse himself, I still think Kingdom Hearts and Sora has very little chance of getting into Smash. If characters like Goku, Shrek, Starkiller, Mickey Mouse, Android 21, Darth Vader, Batman, James Bond, Superman, Spider-Man or Spongebob get confirmed for Smash Ultimate, then I would gladly support Sora for Smash. But for now, when those characters aren't even allowed support threads, and Starkiller and Android 21 debuted in video games, I don't think games tied to the Disney license like Kingdom Hearts should be allowed threads. Unless you give me an example of game made by Disney Interactive that doesn't use any characters from any other Disney property.

Checking Wikipedia

Okay, I guess someone from Club Penguin and Spectrobes could have a support thread. But Sora and the Kingdom Hearts series as a whole, I'm still a little iffy about. You know what fine, we can support Sora. I'm not a mod, so maybe I shouldn't be asking for this thread to get closed.

 

[fogbadge]

You're wrong. I know now, without a doubt, Kingdom Hearts... is

Disney!!!

As fun as it is to fight Heartless, and while there are some cutscenes without a Disney character in sight, and there's a lot of original characters like Sora, Riku, Axel, Ventus, Aqua, Roxas, Kairi, Xion, Xehanort, Organization XIII, etc. and you can just think of the keychain at the end of the Kingdom Key as just three circles and not something that represents Mickey Mouse himself, I still think Kingdom Hearts and Sora has very little chance of getting into Smash. If characters like Goku, Shrek, Starkiller, Mickey Mouse, Android 21, Darth Vader, Batman, James Bond, Superman, Spider-Man or Spongebob get confirmed for Smash Ultimate, then I would gladly support Sora for Smash. But for now, when those characters aren't even allowed support threads, and Starkiller and Android 21 debuted in video games, I don't think games tied to the Disney license like Kingdom Hearts should be allowed threads. Unless you give me an example of game made by Disney Interactive that doesn't use any characters from any other Disney property.

Checking Wikipedia

Okay, I guess someone from Club Penguin and Spectrobes could have a support thread. But Sora and the Kingdom Hearts series as a whole, I'm still a little iffy about. You know what fine, we can support Sora. I'm not a mod, so maybe I shouldn't be asking for this thread to get closed.

why does this bother you so much?

 

[zabimaru1000]

You're wrong. I know now, without a doubt, Kingdom Hearts... is

Disney!!!

As fun as it is to fight Heartless, and while there are some cutscenes without a Disney character in sight, and there's a lot of original characters like Sora, Riku, Axel, Ventus, Aqua, Roxas, Kairi, Xion, Xehanort, Organization XIII, etc. and you can just think of the keychain at the end of the Kingdom Key as just three circles and not something that represents Mickey Mouse himself, I still think Kingdom Hearts and Sora has very little chance of getting into Smash. If characters like Goku, Shrek, Starkiller, Mickey Mouse, Android 21, Darth Vader, Batman, James Bond, Superman, Spider-Man or Spongebob get confirmed for Smash Ultimate, then I would gladly support Sora for Smash. But for now, when those characters aren't even allowed support threads, and Starkiller and Android 21 debuted in video games, I don't think games tied to the Disney license like Kingdom Hearts should be allowed threads. Unless you give me an example of game made by Disney Interactive that doesn't use any characters from any other Disney property.

Checking Wikipedia

Okay, I guess someone from Club Penguin and Spectrobes could have a support thread. But Sora and the Kingdom Hearts series as a whole, I'm still a little iffy about. You know what fine, we can support Sora. I'm not a mod, so maybe I shouldn't be asking for this thread to get closed.

It's really absurd that Sora is compared to something like Shrek or Goku. You're missing the key point in all of this. Sora is a VIDEO GAME originated character, the whole Disney ownership argument is really idle speculation. Sega and Square Enix already use him in their games. Pretty much every character poll has categorized Sora as a video game character, and all the joke requests were bundled up in non-games.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

When has Sega used Sora?

 

[zabimaru1000]

When has Sega used Sora?

Haven't edited the post, what I meant to say was Sega using Wreck It Ralph in Sonic All Stars Racing. Practically being the same thing according to your logic since both are owned by Disney, except one is a video game character and one is from a movie. And as we know, any character with a video game origin is fully realizable.

I've already said it earlier. There's no problem with Disney as they allowed others to use their content. Additionally, Sakurai has said he has some misgivings if Cloud didn't appear on a Nintendo system. Chain of Memories and re: coded are included in the list of the few games Cloud appeared in on a Nintendo system. He is well aware of the existence of Kingdom Hearts as he congratulated Nomura when the series hit 15 years.

Anyways this is what I meant to say:

Sega - Wreck It Ralph (Sonic All Stars Racing)
Square - Sora (World of Final Fantasy)

 

[Sean Wheeler]

Vader's Apprentice also had a video game origin but can't get a thread because of his connection to Star Wars.

But anyway, if Sora's chances really are greater than the other licensed game characters, I should probably stop bashing on this thread. I love Kingdom Hearts and me wanting Goku and Starkiller in Smash but not Sora just makes me look like a total hypocrite. A Goku thread was let in for a day and was treated as a special case because of his long video game history, before a whole bunch of people started attacking that thread. And since I'm the only one who opposes the Sora thread, it's not likely that I would win. So, whatever. #Sora4Smash.

 

[FirestormNeos]

Hold on, Starkiller was in SoulCalibur 4 as well. I remember because his fight in arcade mode made me ragequit. Why isn't he allowed to have a thread, anyway?

 

[Shadowchao121]

As cool as i think it would be i wouldn't count on it. A shame but yeah.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Hold on, Starkiller was in SoulCalibur 4 as well. I remember because his fight in arcade mode made me ragequit. Why isn't he allowed to have a thread, anyway?

Because he's tied to a non-game franchise and just like Android 21, they are effectively only video game characters by pure debut, not really made purely for them. Starkliler might be a decent exception, but the debut alone isn't enough. Lucario did not debut in a game either, but he was made for the games. Android 21 is owned by the same company that owns Dragon Ball as is. Meaning it's not like they're truly realistic enough choices to get in. He won't get in before Goku, period. Meaning that making the thread won't actually do much since most of it would be just "he's impossible due to them might as well not being a game character", which would turn the thread into a huge argument.

Starkliler barely appears outside of the games, so I feel he has a legit case to be made. He's from that universe, yeah, but also is effectively a game character. On the other hand, being his franchise is basically full of non-game characters, he has the same chance as ones like Goku or Darth Vader; none.

But that was pretty much the main reasoning behind it. Because their debut doesn't really change that they're tied to a non-game franchise. Another good way to look at it is the only reason they're getting a thread is simply because they only barely fit the ideal criteria of "game character". Unless they're legitimately wanted, it's a fruitless idea as is. Especially if you consider how it is unlikely to have really good and reasonable discussion. Keep in mind I had to shut down the Captain N thread, despite him being owned by Nintendo, due to a lack of any official game appearances, a key criteria as well.

A case absolutely can be made to allow these two, but I would bring it up with the Smash Ultimate Mods(via PM) why you believe a thread is fair. We will listen. I'm just explaining why there hasn't been one yet. Technically speaking, they are allowed threads, but nobody wanted to make one due to nobody legit wanting either character in and all.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

Okay then, since you say Starkiller's technically allowed a thread, I went ahead and started it. If he gets closed for being Star Wars, then Sora would have to be closed for being Disney.

 

[HyruleHero]

Okay then, since you say Starkiller's technically allowed a thread, I went ahead and started it. If he gets closed for being Star Wars, then Sora would have to be closed for being Disney.

do you actually want Starkiller in smash or are you just trying to prove a point that has been refuted on almost every page of this thread?

 

[CHAMPIONX9]

The whole keychain discussion is silly because since Sora is owned by Disney why would they allow the character and not the logo. People acting like Disney don't want this logo to show up in nintendo when they wanted Mickey Mouse to meet Mario at some point.

 

[Red Dead Redeemed]

Okay then, since you say Starkiller's technically allowed a thread, I went ahead and started it. If he gets closed for being Star Wars, then Sora would have to be closed for being Disney.

I think where you're being disingenuous is that you're ignoring the fact that Starkiller's game was not created as a gaming franchise but rather as a supplementary material for a movie universe. Kingdom Hearts uses Disney IP but it was made as a video game franchise first and foremost.

 

[zabimaru1000]

I'm not sure why I'm seeing all this pettiness on every page

that new thread was made just to "prove a point" against another character, so of course it's going to get taken down

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Let's just say we are not going to entertain these kinds of arguments that intentionally are made to Rules Lawyer.

I think where you're being disingenuous is that you're ignoring the fact that Starkiller's game was not created as a gaming franchise but rather as a supplementary material for a movie universe. Kingdom Hearts uses Disney IP but it was made as a video game franchise first and foremost.

Wait, Starkiller has non-game appearances? I thought he was made to be a character for the games themselves. And that almost all his appearances(if any) were pretty much games. I mean, sure, his franchise is not really meant to be a game one strictly(nor first game-based), but I would call him a game character at this point, just not one that is realistic due to how licensing works.

 

[Mic_128]

To clarify, we've been discussing this of late and the current rule is - A character is valid if they and their franchise originated as a game. So, no Goku, no Yoda, ect.

 

[Double0Groove]

To clarify, we've been discussing this of late and the current rule is - A character is valid if they and their franchise originated as a game. So, no Goku, no Yoda, ect.

Ummm... No. It was just the character that had to be a videogame original character. I don't know where this whole franchise business came from, but just like how Cloud's cameo Nintendo appearances on handheld devices were enough to justify his inclusion (even though no FF7 game was ever ported to a Nintendo platform), the franchise that an original videogame character originates from has very little to do with their inclusion. If anything at all.

Okay then, since you say Starkiller's technically allowed a thread, I went ahead and started it. If he gets closed for being Star Wars, then Sora would have to be closed for being Disney.

Disney isn't the name of the Kingdom Hearts franchise, dude. And don't get this twisted, Starwars is a non-videogame franchise, while Kingdom Hearts IS a videogame franchise that happens to feature animated Disney characters. So this thread is safe even if they wrongfully shut your thread down.