So...which of the pokemon does Kirby destroy the worst?

[Zephramrill]

If you are near the edge of the stage and you get hit with a fresh fsmash with zard you are dead at 115 or lower, even with DI.

 

[typh]

doesnt kirby kill at like 40% with his fsmash

thats what it seems like anyway

 

[Steeler]

i'm guessing kirby will die at 90-100 to charizard's dtilt from the same spot.

 

[CaliburChamp]

Aren't you the same guy who came up with the brilliant PT strategy of switching pokemon during invincibility frames after dying?

Which is of course funny cause its impossible. Your PT experience does not impess me and your comments do not mean much of anything.

Yes, I am that guy. I didn't bothered doing it in a match, so I just thought about it, and didn't put it into practice since I don't have a available TV accessible to try it out immediately or I'm too busy to get on my Wii and check it. I don't care if my comments don't mean much to you, cause I already know I'm good with Pokemon Trainer, I just ran out of memory cards preventing me from recording and uploading my PT matches online.

You, sir, are, how can I put this, out of your mind. You're views on the pokemon seem to come from people who absolutely sucked with PT that you were able to destroy.

First, Squirtle. Kirby simply can't keep up with him. If you play aggainst someone who is close to decent, let alone good, their Squirtle will not hold still long enough for you to do jack. Yeah, you can hurt him, but not as badly as he'll hurt you. On the ground, his jab and ftilt come out as least as fast, if not faster, than anything Kirby has. In the air, it's a nightmare for Kirby because of Squirtle's insane combo ability with his lagless aerials. before you know it, you'll be in the 130 range, and then all it takes a grab and dthrow and you're gone. Oh, and about stealing his special move, don't. You won't be able to prevent his recovery and your suck is better and more useful.

Charizard. Yeah, you can steal the flame, but that only means that now you both have it. You do not all of a sudden magically become better than him. If Charizard lands a sweet spotted Rock Smash on you, which isn't all that hard, it chains right into a front smash. That kills Kirby at very low percentages. Charzard gets rid of Kirby very easily. Kirby is so light. Charzard has some very quick attacks, i.e., dtilt, that can kill Kirby quickly.

Finally, Ivysaur. Yeah, he's gimpable, but you have to get him off the stage first. Bullet Seed is a great equalizer and punishing move, not to mention the various poison bulb manifestations that can easily kill the pink puff. Yes, Ivy is the worst against Kirby, but a front smash or up air will kill Kirby at around 100.

Now, don't get me wrong, it's a fairly close matchup. But you are seriously mistaken if you honestly believe that Kirby has an advantage over all three pokemon. At best, for Kirby, I'd say it's at least 55-45 in favor of PT.

I appreciate your opinion, but I know how PT plays, and I know how Kirby plays. Kirby can out range and out prioritize Squirtle, and Kirby's aerial attacks can compete against Squirtle's, they both have a great aerial game. Kirby can kill Squirtel much faster than Squirtle can kill Kirby since Kirby has more combo's that lead to KO moves like D-air to F-smash for one example. Squirtle's jab won't hit as much when Kirby is in the air the majority of the time.

Charizard is bad in the air compared to Kirby, Kirby wins in the air. Charizard can KO Kirby sooner, but Charizard will have a hard time touching Kirby, up-tilt combos really put Charizard in a bad position whenever he is in the air.

Ivysaur has good range and power, but Kirby can gimp Ivysaur hard, its easy to get Ivysaur off the stage. 60:40 in Kirby's favor for all the pokemon.

 

[Ryusuta]

Ivysaur has good range and power, but Kirby can gimp Ivysaur hard, its easy to get Ivysaur off the stage.

Never, EVER assume that based on personal experience, man. At least, not unless you're fighting Link.

 

[Phoenix812]

EDIT: After a few fights with some Kirbies, I've decided to remove this old post for the simple reason that I proved my own thoughts wrong. Forget that you read this.

 

[Bestiarius]

I respect your thoughts, Calibur, but 60-40 is waaaaay too over-ambitious. I've already given my reasons, but at best it is neutral. Plus, any matchup this close, the matchup numbers don't matter all that much. Nobody is perfect, people will make mistakes, and both sides will have plenty of chances to win. In this matchup, the better player will probably win.

 

[Zephramrill]

I agree Calibur Champ probaly 60:40 for Kirby. Hes like a more well rounded version of squirtle, with a way better recovery and better killing options. Most people agree squirtle has a good matchup on char, so why wouldnt Kirby? Ivy and Kirby are like 50:50 onstage but once Ivy is somewhat far offstage its gonna be tough as hell to get back.

 

[Charizard92]

OK, from what I can get, Kirby is primarily aerial with a few grabs here and there, which is essentially squirtle, except more rounded. I am not an expert on Squirtle or Ivysaur (I got the basics and a few advanced parts down). However, as the resident Charizard expert, I can put in two cents here:

OK, Kirby and Charizard each have their own goals in the match. For Kirby, that is to try to hit Charizard then run away. For Charizard, it's to KO the little pluff ball real fast (note: this is not to disrespect Kirby. In fact, I like the little guy). For both of them, surprise surprise, it's whoever gets the first shot basically. For Kirby, Charizard hates hit and runners, and while he ain't fast, he definitely can do so, no problems here. Also, Kirby is apparently efficent with grabs, so he can easily lead Charizard above him. If there is one thing Charizard hates, it's jugglers (that and projectile users), so Kirby, if he gets the first shot, gets away with him. Charizard, is, the same thing. While Kirby has a good grab game, Charizard also, has a good grab game (actually, sometimes it's primarily grab), and he has a larger grab range (I think), so that isn't the way to go under most circumstances. Another asset for charizard and boon for Kirby is Charizard's moveset, many of Charizard's moves are either meant to hurt you (ex. flamethrower), kill you (dtilt), or BOTH (rock smash), so after a flamethrower or sweetspot rock smash, he could easily just smash you to bits any way he likes. If he didn't get you then, Charizard is the one of two characters with a meteor smash (kirby is the other), and the only one with a move that is purely a meteor (That dair also doubles as a drill attack after the first hit, Charizard's Dair is a meteor 100% of the time it connects), so he can gimp you, although it ain't exactly likely.

It's either even, or 55:45 in either direction. I'd go with 50:50, because it's pretty much who gets the first shot.

 

[PkTrainerCris]

Shall we not do this one pokemon at time????
Lets begin with Squirtle:
Kisby has a bad air speed and good aerials, that means that squirtle can **** on the air but he must be careful because kirby can defend himself pretty well, a forward hydroplane means death to kirby at like 75%... which is scary as hell... on the ground kirby has more range, but squirtle has more movement, quiker attacks and a very good grab game
I feel its like 55/45 kirbys slight adv

 

[Bestiarius]

Zeph, Squirtle doesn't have a good matchup against Zard, at least, not according to the matchup thread. It's about neatral. Plus, Squirtle's best killing moves are water-based, which would be better against Zard. Kirby doesn't have water-based KO moves. Now, I know it's not that big of a deal, but it matters some.

 

[Zephramrill]

Bestiarius, its well agreed that Ivy >> Squirtle, Squirtle > Char, Char >= Ivy. Squirtle only has usmash and dsmash that kill with water, and later than kirbys fsmash anyways, and its harder to hit with than kirbys fsmash...

 

[Onxy]

Umm, Squirtle beating Charizard? No. The only thing he can do is zone Charizard, and he has a very hard time starting that.

 

[Zephramrill]

Umm, Squirtle beating Charizard? No. The only thing he can do is zone Charizard, and he has a very hard time starting that.

/wrists

lets just agree to disagree on this matchup in general ok?

 

[Ryusuta]

I'm actually inclined to agree with Zeph on this one. Only because 90% of the PT boards overrate Charizard and underrate Squirtle. That, and Squirtle does VERY well against large opponents for the most part.

 

[PkTrainerCris]

Squirtle is pretty even with zard, because charizard outranges (and has fast long ranged attacks ), has an easy time shieldgrabbing ( even easier against kirby) and kills pretty soon (again, even sooner against kirby).....
So.. can we start discussing Squirtle vs kirby??? (or unless any pokemon against kirby)

 

[Fearmy]

*inserts faceplam here*

okay let's focus on squirtle right now, and be civilized...

 

[Zephramrill]

^ people are being civilized, facepalming is pretty uncivilized.



Anyways, i think the kirby boards and some PTs think this is 60:40 Kirby, whereas some other PTs think this is Neutral. Sounds like slight advantage Kirby to me.

 

[Ryusuta]

^ people are being civilized, facepalming is pretty uncivilized.

I agree with this. We've been doing very well in this conversation thus far.

 

[The Derrit]

Well I havent seen anything good come out of any of them so i`m generalizing until then for the benefit of the kirbys. And if it takes one comment for you to label someone as ignorant, perhaps you should get your hypocritedar fixed.

look i disagree with bestiarius on this for sure, kirby has an advantage, and yeah i don't have any tourney placements because i live in new freaking hampshire, but don't act as if you're the best here. hell even if you are the best here don't act like you're the best here.

and i hardly think its unfair of me to say calibur doesn't know what he's saying because he doesn't even know you can't change pokemon during invincibility frames.

Bestiarius, its well agreed that Ivy >> Squirtle, Squirtle > Char, Char >= Ivy. Squirtle only has usmash and dsmash that kill with water, and later than kirbys fsmash anyways, and its harder to hit with than kirbys fsmash...

This is correct.

Now back to the matchup.

 

[Zephramrill]

Well I dont think what I said there was correct really, that is just what Steelers thread said. Also way to open old wounds lol... Retro, someone ahs been a naughty boy, time to spank him

 

[Retro Gaming]

Everyone in this thread needs to relax and stop the hostilities. I've already handed out punishments where they are due, and I will continue to punish anyone who brings up this dispute again. The point of this thread is to discuss the match-up with Kirby and thus there is the posibility that someone will disagree with you. However, there is a way to disagree and disprove someone else's arguement without being offensive and disrespectful.

 

[Zephramrill]

Thank you Retro, now lets try and look at the facts to come to the conclusion.

Kirbys Fsmash > Us =(

Rocksmash = Win

Seriously though I think this is a slight advantage to kirby mainly because its hard to use ivy well here due to the gimpyness, and kirby does well vs squirtle and char and kills nice and early.

 

[Haunted]

I'd say Kirby hurts Charizard the most, simply because he's a heavy character.

At zero percent, Kirby is able to do the foward throw > up air > and grab, twice in a row.

 

[Zephramrill]

I'd say Kirby hurts Charizard the most, simply because he's a heavy character.

At zero percent, Kirby is able to do the foward throw > up air > and grab, twice in a row.

Please read the thread before posting something that's been brought up like 8 times... --'

I need an Ivy expert to break down the matchup for me so I can see what its really like lol.

 

[Fearmy]

ivy expert would be reflex and onxy. and shouldn't we try to focus on 1 pkmn at a time? the way this is going, everyone is going to get ticked off :o

oh and about the facepalm.... PT facepalms when he loses

 

[zeta]

I'd say Kirby hurts Charizard the most, simply because he's a heavy character.

At zero percent, Kirby is able to do the foward throw > up air > and grab, twice in a row.

this is wrong rocksmash interrupts this at the up air don't believe me ask kirrrby

 

[Zephramrill]

oh ****, totally forgot about that. ****. my zeal for kirby is wavering.

 

[Bestiarius]

Wait, was that combo the gonzo? 'Cause that was what the gonzo looked like. RS breaks the gonzo?

Also, about the Ivy matchup, I play Ivy a lot, so maybe I can help.

Yeah, Ivy is gimpable, but thatt's Kirby's job anyways, regardless of who his opponent is. If the Kirby is good, a WoP is probably gonna happen anyways, killing someone with better recovery. So the gimpability of Ivysaur is not the main concern.
Ivysaur outrnges Kirby. Here is where any compensation for recovery can be found. Jab combo, ftilt, and the always useful Razor Leaf are your best friends here. Kirby will have to approach as his only projectile is the shockwave from Final Cutter. Use the aforementioned to set up a pseudo-wall to keep Kirby at bay. If he tries to go over you, Vine Whip or Bullet Seed. Just don't let him suck you up, as we wouldn't want Bullet Seed to end up in the enemies hands. I think, with smart play, this matchup should be close to even, maybe even slightly in Ivy's favor, though that's probably a stretch.

 

[Zephramrill]

Well you can SDI out of the gonzo if you SDI the throw... with everybody. lol

 

[Bestiarius]

Then why'd you say the gonzo was a GUARANTEED 60%?
Edit: you said it's, and i quote, "basically inescapable." In other words, escapable, but not likely?
Btw, glad to see your zeal for the Pink Orb o' Death is waning !

 

[Zephramrill]

Well I doubt anyone discussing this in this thread knew you could SDI it, and its still tough to do on reflex I guess.

 

[PkTrainerCris]

Kirby has an easy time gimping ivy... but an onstage aerial combat ivy has his stuff... her long ranged aerials can keep kirby at bay pretty well, and kirbys slow air speed doesnt help him... onstage, ivy outranges and stops kirbys approaches ( which is a big deal because kirby has to approach because of his lack of proyectiles) , kirby has his own stuff, he can use bulletseed (although ivys range will save him from being swallowed frequently), has nice ko options, and is a good juggler
I would say its 55-45 either side or neutral

 

[Bestiarius]

I would think that Kirby would **** Ivy in the air. Btw, Captain Nimrod has a question: what's the "S" in "SDI" stand for?

 

[Zephramrill]

Smash, its because you are using the cstick.

 

[Ryusuta]

I would think that Kirby would **** Ivy in the air.

No, Ivy's back air and Razor Leaf do a pretty good job keeping Kirby in check, actually.

 

[Bestiarius]

That's true. I didn't think about that.

 

[Zephramrill]

fullhopped fair is pretty decent too actually..

 

[PkTrainerCris]

Yup, ivy has a good against kirby on the air, IF it is onstage, offstage is too dangerous....
I have a question, how does kirbys dair works against ivys uair... if i recall well, its ranged enough to keep kirby safe, but idk.. or shall kirby better use down B against ivys uair??

 

[Zephramrill]

Well ivys uair is usually painfully obvious, airdodge-punish is what works best, or just airdodge, fastfall, and then attack from the ground.