So is 2 stocks the standard?

[Illuvial]

Have some TO friends that are saying 2 stocks First To 3 is the standard tournament ruleset, but I see nothing here that says otherwise so what gives? Is the meta standard gonna be 2 stocks or 3 stocks?

 

[Thinkaman]

Have some TO friends that are saying 2 stocks First To 3 is the standard tournament ruleset, but I see nothing here that says otherwise so what gives?

2-stocks vs. 3-stocks is a contentious debate. Major tourneys are being run successfully in both.

Nintendo and Overswarm are running 4-stocks successfully as well, trolls that they are.

 

[Illuvial]

Thank you for the reply, I figured as much

 

[ミスティック Speed]

I don't mind either.

 

[RanserSSF4]

it's still debatable atm.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I'm really feeling 2 stocks.

 

[Chileno4Live]

I'd say 2 stocks, because it'll speed up tournaments, but I'm so used to 3 stocks. Dilemma...

 

[Kenith]

I've been playing two stocks whenever I do stock matches and it feels "right".
It doesn't take too long, which is the point.

 

[Chimera]

I think 2 stocks is not sufficient. I think at least 3 is necessary, and four may be appropriate.

 

[Tremendo Dude]

2 stocks does feel like it moves briskly enough. However, time constraints aren't as much of an issue in 3ds tournaments because literally everyone has a setup. Round 1 in a double elimination tournament can be over in as little as 15 minutes. The Wii U version will be a different story.

 

[Raijinken]

I like the 2-stock swiss to 3-stock bracket.

 

[Comeback Kid]

People seem to be enjoying 2 stock matches just fine, where even the campiest set isn't too long for the players or viewers.

Forcing 3 stock out of tradition, when that had serious issues, doesn't seem necessary.

 

[The Real Gamer]

2 stock matches are awesome. Fast paced with little room for error. You really need to make every decision count with 2 stocks, whereas with 3 stocks I feel like I can play a bit more "relaxed" knowing I'll have more opportunities to make a comeback.

Plus it gives Smash 4 its own unique identity.

 

[AvariceX]

I'm in the 2-stock swiss/pool to 3-stock bracket camp. Brawl was lowered from 4 stock to 3 stock because it took too long, but this is already looking to be a much faster more aggressive game than Brawl with the new movement techniques being discovered. I doubt it'll get to Melee/64 speeds but it's only been a week and movement in this game is already being completely redefined by perfect pivot. SD's are always going to be a thing and those will be absolutely tragic in a static 2-stock format. Think of all the amazing 3-stock comebacks we'll never get to see in a 2-stock format too.

 

[popsofctown]

I don't like the idea of using a different ruleset for brackets than was used for seeding in swiss. It changes the game a bit. Lucario shifts power level between the formats. Some people's playstyles are better for different lengths. In spirit you're supposed to use the same type of competition when you use a test for deciding how to seed people into a bracket for that type of competition.

If you want to use 2 stock for swiss, just use 2 stock best of 5 for brackets so you don't alter the format. 2*5 = 10, 3*3 = 9. Should be about the same.

 

[Thinkaman]

I don't like the idea of using a different ruleset for brackets than was used for seeding in swiss. It changes the game a bit. Lucario shifts power level between the formats. Some people's playstyles are better for different lengths. In spirit you're supposed to use the same type of competition when you use a test for deciding how to seed people into a bracket for that type of competition.

I agree fully. A tourney really does need to be the same game throughout. Not Smash one round and Mario party the next, or Smash one round and slightly-different-Smash the next.

If you want to use 2 stock for swiss, just use 2 stock best of 5 for brackets so you don't alter the format. 2*5 = 10, 3*3 = 9. Should be about the same.

The problem is that Bo5 is even more of a radical difference in gameplay than stock differences, due to our counter-pick systems.

 

[popsofctown]

Which is why the counterpick system shouldn't really be the way it is, since inconsistency is already a common thing with Bo3 early brackets and Bo5 Winner's and loser's finals. But that's too big a war for me to win..

It is a pretty bad inconsistency, it's the one I'm just already accustomed to stomaching.

 

[Agiknight]

I've had multiple Sudden Deaths in For Glory 1v1s, which are 2 stocks 5 minutes. It's not common, but it's not rare either. 2 stocks feels pretty well paced because of how far out the blast zones are in this game. More stocks would need a longer time limit for sure, but shouldn't be an issue.

 

[Thinkaman]

Which is why the counterpick system shouldn't really be the way it is, since inconsistency is already a common thing with Bo3 early brackets and Bo5 Winner's and loser's finals. But that's too big a war for me to win..

It is a pretty bad inconsistency, it's the one I'm just already accustomed to stomaching.

I empathize, but is there any possible solution to this criteria other than "play all games on the same stage?"

We can't have any variant of DSR, and still have Bo3 be equivalent gameplay to Bo5. All-random stages are a non-solution. Repeated striking from the same set is the same as playing all games on the same stage.

 

[popsofctown]

I don't mind playing all games on the same stage, the one chosen by FLSS. I don't crave variety the way some do, I suppose.

 

[Aeon Lupin]

After witnessing how long top 8 for Melee of all games can get with 4 stocks, I think its for the best 2 stocks become the standard for tournaments. How long do you guys think the timer should be? I advocate for 4 mins.

 

[SmashWolf]

Not in my book, it's not. The thing that's defeated me most so far are suicides, which pretty much means you're screwed if you're not constantly on edge and carefull. Last thing we need is games taking even longer due to people being even MORE carefull with their lives....put in some risks, damnit.

 

[CupofT]

2 stocks is nice as that's the For Glory standard.
I also prefer 2 stocks based on my current play style of the game. With two stocks I can keep the momentum going but once the third stock is added my momentum burns out and I throw away the match.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Two stock is fast. Really fast and I like it but 3 stock feels competitively stronger. I don't think the Wii u will handle 3 stock but at the same time offense is going to get stronger once we can space better on Wii i

 

[SamuraiPanda]

There are multiple other threads debating this issue. Please give them a read or discuss your thoughts/concerns there.