So 3 Pikmin confirmed, ordered Plucking, and Pink for recovery...

[DaDavid]

Yes, yes, and yes!

Admittedly the first point is only awesome because of his new recovery, but still. It's looking like he'll be much less difficult to recover with, and the predictability in plucking is much appreciated.

What are some other reactions to it though? Maybe I'm too hyped to see some potential problem with these changes...

 

[Junahu]

Having the recovery weighed down by any Pikmin you have, seems to gimp the recovery significantly.

Either keep your pikmin and have a slow recovery. Or sacrifice your pikmin to get back to the stage more reliably... where you have no pikmin to defend yourself with.

 

[DaDavid]

Yeah I'd have to go back and look but it seemed like he was even able to drop Pikmin while being carried. Which I think is interesting just in terms of it even being such a last-second decision that you have to make. Definitely better than his rope thing.

 

[Thor]

It looks like he just used side+b to throw the Pikmin until he was down to one, and then used up+B with no extra Pikmin for full height. Not sure how useful/problematic that will be in practice though.

If Pikmin are like in Brawl, I forsee some serious Pikmin homicides after KOing an opponent to maximize the number of Purples (or a red or two for more range and slightly less power/knockback) one has, since you can predict EXACTLY what you pull. Even if they change effects, if they do different things, expect to see a lot of Pikmin flying off the edges during star KOs if you can order your Pikmin (via the whistle probably) to cycle certain Pikmin to the back so that you can get rid of the others.

 

[Takehiko]

I think it comes down to finding out how many pikmin will impact his his flight, If I remember correctly, he had the purple pikmin when he was trying to recover, so that could have loaded him down. Once people perfect this then he shouldn't have any problem recovering with at least 1-2 pikmin, or if it can't happen then there will be techs made to get him to safety, so that he has the ability to resume fighting.

 

[DaDavid]

Makes me wonder if Purples weigh more than the others as a way to keep people from just hording them. Seems like it'd kinda be a pain against a competent opponent anyway, doubt they'd leave you alone long enough to get your ideal set up.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Only three pikmin = each must be more powerful = less pluck time

 

[Sovereign]

Having the recovery weighed down by any Pikmin you have, seems to gimp the recovery significantly.

Either keep your pikmin and have a slow recovery. Or sacrifice your pikmin to get back to the stage more reliably... where you have no pikmin to defend yourself with.

I also see it as a nerf to his offense, as well as his recovery. This also makes me believe he's a lot more vulnerable with this floaty-type of recovery, compared to the snappy tether-styled recovery. Not gonna lie... I'm happy. I'll see you soon, Hilt. <3

 

[Z1GMA]

THANK GOD !!

 

[Mysteltainn]

I always imagined the Winged Pikmin would get in there somehow, but the idea of Olimar having to choose whether he wants to get back to the stage or get back to the stage unarmed seems interesting.

Also, has anyone else noticed this?

Has Yoshi always been able to do this? If not, the notion that Pikmin are seemingly more affected by their surroundings is something to consider.

 

[DaDavid]

I also see it as a nerf to his offense, as well as his recovery. This also makes me believe he's a lot more vulnerable with this floaty-type of recovery, compared to the snappy tether-styled recovery. Not gonna lie... I'm happy. I'll see you soon, Hilt. <3

He does appear more vulnerable, which is something of a worry, but in general it's pretty quick so who knows.

I don't recall if Yoshi could eat them before or not, but I wanna say yes. It'd suck if the Pikmin were easier to pick off now.

 

[Accf124]

I'm just wondering if Rock Pikmin will be involved somehow.

 

[DaDavid]

It seems weird to me that they wouldn't be, since Flower Pikmin are in. But honestly they just don't seem different enough from Purples to generate any sort of creative thinking.

 

[Sausage Zeldas]

Having the recovery weighed down by any Pikmin you have, seems to gimp the recovery significantly.

Either keep your pikmin and have a slow recovery. Or sacrifice your pikmin to get back to the stage more reliably... where you have no pikmin to defend yourself with.

You could just nair and/or jab them away to get yourself some breathing room.
All in all, I don't think the line size drop will hurt too much, especially since it'll be easier to plan your attacks with perfectly predictable Pikmin plucking.

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

So Olimar throws his pikmins away in order to save himself...Is Sakurai promoting murder??

"Parents, whenever your lives are in danger, remember to sacrifice your kids before you run away."

 

[egaddmario]

Improved recovery is a godsend. The problem is that you now how to get rid of your pikmin to recover. Isn't that the EXACT OPPOSITE of what Sakurai was promoting in Brawl and what Pikmin is ACTUALLY about? Oh well. The only 3 is such a power nerf, but hopefully the pikmin can endure more. Only time will tell. Hopefully they'll keep my little buddy strong enough for me to main him again. Hell, i probably will anyways, i love him too much.

 

[DaDavid]

Well I guess you have to decide if the recovery length is even worth it if you're getting back, vulnerable, with no Pikmin to defend yourself with.

 

[greenluigiman2]

Improved recovery is a godsend. The problem is that you now how to get rid of your pikmin to recover. Isn't that the EXACT OPPOSITE of what Sakurai was promoting in Brawl and what Pikmin is ACTUALLY about? Oh well. The only 3 is such a power nerf, but hopefully the pikmin can endure more. Only time will tell. Hopefully they'll keep my little buddy strong enough for me to main him again. Hell, i probably will anyways, i love him too much.

You don't have to get rid of your Pikmin to recover. It just becomes a lot easier.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

He does appear more vulnerable, which is something of a worry, but in general it's pretty quick so who knows.

I don't recall if Yoshi could eat them before or not, but I wanna say yes. It'd suck if the Pikmin were easier to pick off now.

No, Pikmin could not be eaten by any characters. They could only be damaged if they exited a certain radius around Olimar and left their "safe zone". If they lowered that zone, or if they're always vulnerable... oh god.

I also see it as a nerf to his offense, as well as his recovery. This also makes me believe he's a lot more vulnerable with this floaty-type of recovery, compared to the snappy tether-styled recovery. Not gonna lie... I'm happy. I'll see you soon, Hilt. <3

yep... yep :/

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

Well, Olimar was considered kinda broken in Brawl thanks to his Pikmin mechanic. Sure, bad recovery but he was difficult to reach and send off the platform. Let's just wait more to see how he turns out.

 

[DaDavid]

Well if they've made the Pikmin more vulnerable it would certainly be understandable given his Smashes are basically projectiles. Still, hopefully it doesn't hurt him too much.

Hopefully it's early summer we'll be able to try him out.

 

[Master Morrison]

Guys yoshi isn't really eating the Pikmin for those that don't know that
Yoshi has never been able to eat any item in smash
It's just cleaver posing by sakurai
Olimar just landed and the yellow is still landing and while he is landing yoshi is using is b special
But the thing is that olimar is supposed to have a lot of Pikmin it's in his game too
He is supposed to swarm his opponent to distract his opponent and then go in for the kill move like in his game but in the end it's sakurai's call in the end
I'm just guessing its limitations because he did cut thing like tethers and gliding
So I'm guessing 24 Pikmin plus 4 captains was too much

 

[DaDavid]

I don't know know, Olimar is mid-walk in that pic and with the other Pikmin being mid-walk as well, I kinda doubt that the Yellow is lagging behind THAT much.

The fact that he hasn't been able to eat items in the past is kinda irrelevant for 2 reasons. First, Pikmin aren't items, and second, Yoshi could've been changed to be able to now. We can't be sure, but I think it being tricky photography is sort of a less sound assumption than that Pikmin are more vulnerable.

 

[Sky Pirate]

Using clever posing to make a funny scene in a miiverse picture isn't exactly a new thing, is it?
I don't see why it would be difficult to assume that it's the same thing in this case.
For all we know, he could've tossed the pikmin onto that platform to create distance between the yellow and the rest of the squad.

Also, I like the fact that ANY change happened to Olimar, even if it was a horrible nerf.
Now we actually get some things to work on.

If your pikmin aren't counted in your recovery, you actually BENEFIT this time around? Awesome, I'm on board.
It lacks the speed of his old UpB and instant return is out of the picture, though. :<

They also announced custom specials, no? I do wonder how they'll let you customize his specials.
Only things I can think of that'd be customizable would be whistle and UpB.

 

[himemiya]

Having the recovery weighed down by any Pikmin you have, seems to gimp the recovery significantly.

Either keep your pikmin and have a slow recovery. Or sacrifice your pikmin to get back to the stage more reliably... where you have no pikmin to defend yourself with.

Yeah theres that, but its still better then his brawl one. Keep in mind its still subject to change so lets hope they buff it a bit more.

 

[FirstBlade]

The recovery seems like more of nerf than buff....and this is saddening considering he was nerfed in pretty much every other category as far as we can tell. It is better than his Brawl recovery but it still is completely terrible from a technical standpoint. You have to get rid of his Pikmin for it to even be of any use which leaves him as a sitting duck if he gets back to the stage. A good player could easily be edge-guarding and smash you out of the screen while you are vulnerable. This also is connected to his 3 Pikmin thing. In a match, you would have to be plucking like crazy if the Pikmin are still as weak as before. The recovery also looks like it can't even be used as an attack which I guess is okay...but once again makes him very vulnerable during recovery especially considering how slow he moves.

The ordered Pikmin could be better for management...but that is in no way shape or form going to keep players from camping and trying to get the Pikmin they want. Not to mention, it takes away from his unpredictable random nature which I think was one of his best features. Oh well, don't know if I'll main him again but I'll at least try him out. Considering is placement on the Brawl tier list I guess a nerf was needed somewhere but I feel this was a little overboard (especially considering other top tiers like Diddy Kong and Pikachu have been getting buffs as far as we can tell. Sakurai....I am disappointed )

 

[DaDavid]

Just me personally maybe, but I don't see how being unpredictable to everyone, including the player, is a good feature for any character. It's great that you can know what to expect now, though the nerf to 3 could still hurt worse than the buff to predictability. But I mean my man basically has projectile Smashes in all directions, so once you get your three Purples, your kind of a huge threat.

I don't think it does us any good to look at the Brawl tier list, since we don't know what the new mechanics/physics changes have done in terms of making characters more or less practical. For example, if glide tossing is out and/or Diddy only has 1 banana, he would be pretty garbage compared to Brawl without some buffs. Maybe something similar is happening here and without nerfs Olimar would've been too good.

 

[FirstBlade]

Just me personally maybe, but I don't see how being unpredictable to everyone, including the player, is a good feature for any character. It's great that you can know what to expect now, though the nerf to 3 could still hurt worse than the buff to predictability. But I mean my man basically has projectile Smashes in all directions, so once you get your three Purples, your kind of a huge threat.

I don't think it does us any good to look at the Brawl tier list, since we don't know what the new mechanics/physics changes have done in terms of making characters more or less practical. For example, if glide tossing is out and/or Diddy only has 1 banana, he would be pretty garbage compared to Brawl without some buffs. Maybe something similar is happening here and without nerfs Olimar would've been too good.

I never said he shouldn't have gotten any nerfs, that would be ridiculous. Being unpredictable to an opponent in terms of Pikmin though was actually quite good against opponents because they didn't know what to expect half the time (unless of course you were trying to get a certain Pikmin which in fact could be very bad for the player). With the random thing it certainly wasn't guaranteed you could get 3 Purples easily but I don't see how this new thing helps quite much considering you will still have to cycle through to even get those 3 Purples, in a 1 on 1 match no one in their right mind would give you time to do that.

You bring up a fine point about the tier list though.

 

[DaDavid]

I never said he shouldn't have gotten any nerfs, that would be ridiculous. Being unpredictable to an opponent in terms of Pikmin though was actually quite good against opponents because they didn't know what to expect half the time (unless of course you were trying to get a certain Pikmin which in fact could be very bad for the player). With the random thing it certainly wasn't guaranteed you could get 3 Purples easily but I don't see how this new thing helps quite much considering you will still have to cycle through to even get those 3 Purples, in a 1 on 1 match no one in their right mind would give you time to do that.

You bring up a fine point about the tier list though.

Well I'm sure getting 3 Purples easily won't be that easy in practice because people will obviously be on you, on it'll certainly be more reliable than having to rely on the RNG to give you one. I guess personally I am always trying to have certain Pikmin on me, so the randomness was definitely not a benefit to me. Even as a matter of keeping opponents on their toes, being unpredictable didn't matter because to them it's just "kill the Pikmin" no matter what color it happens to be you know?

 

[FirstBlade]

Well I'm sure getting 3 Purples easily won't be that easy in practice because people will obviously be on you, on it'll certainly be more reliable than having to rely on the RNG to give you one. I guess personally I am always trying to have certain Pikmin on me, so the randomness was definitely not a benefit to me. Even as a matter of keeping opponents on their toes, being unpredictable didn't matter because to them it's just "kill the Pikmin" no matter what color it happens to be you know?

True. On another note, I am saddened though I won't be able to put as many Pikmin on opponents, hopefully Olimar really wasn't nerfed as bad as I think he was.

 

[DaDavid]

True. On another note, I am saddened though I won't be able to put as many Pikmin on opponents, hopefully Olimar really wasn't nerfed as bad as I think he was.

yeah I noticed when he was throwing the Pikmin on Mario that it's just not as satisfying.

 

[DakotaBonez]

Even while carrying Pikmin, his up b covers as much distance as Mario's up b. (I think)
Although it doesn't seem like it functions as an attack, does it?

 

[DaDavid]

Even while carrying Pikmin, his up b covers as much distance as Mario's up b. (I think)
Although it doesn't seem like it functions as an attack, does it?

Plus we've only seen it with no Pikmin and 3 Pikmin. 1 or 2 would probably be a totally useful recovery. And no,it doesn't seem to have a hitbox sadly.

 

[BeatNinja]

The things they're doing to Olimar were the only downside of the entire Direct for me. I feel like they're dumbing him down. Yes, he was amazing in Brawl, but nobody has been beaten with the nerf-stick quite as much as him.

Three Pikmin at a time isn't total blasphemy, but I don't think it was necessary. If they gave him four or five at a time, that would be a nice middle-ground. Not as many Pikmin, but you can still pressure people with his side-B and defend yourself with that lovely c-stick. Sakurai said that this makes Pikmin management more easy, but that's why I said I think they're dumbing him down. You're always on the move with Olimar, and you can always see what kind of Pikmin is next in line.

His new up-B looks alright, but I think his up-B in Brawl is disturbingly underrated. Not only does it track ledges (AKA if I do his up-B above a ledge, he'd still latch onto it, making for some ambiguous situations that've gotten me a lot of ledge-guarding opportunities and satisfying spikes) but when you have a full party of Pikmin it has pretty nice range as well. It's not a bad tool when you short hop and tag someone in the air with it, it has decent knockback at higher percentages.

 

[allison]

I suspect the Pikmin limit was lowered for 3DS performance reasons.

 

[DaDavid]

I suspect the Pikmin limit was lowered for 3DS performance reasons.

If it was at all a problem, I imagine it was still marginal. Several things seem to have been done for the sake of balance, so when we have him straight up tell us why he's doing those things, I don't see the point of getting pessimistic and assuming it was for another reason.

 

[BlitznBurst]

So winged Pikmin just come out of nowhere, pick him up and then **** off again

This is exactly what I didn't want out of Olimar in this game. At least the other Pikmin weighing him down does still tie into the Pikmin management aspect instead of just being completely generic, but I'm still pretty disappointed, especially when Rock Pikmin are still nowhere to be seen.

 

[extremechiton]

all i want to know is if lucario gets stronger the more damaged he is, why cant pikmin be stronger if theyre flowered up?

 

[Skyfox2000]

The things they're doing to Olimar were the only downside of the entire Direct for me. I feel like they're dumbing him down. Yes, he was amazing in Brawl, but nobody has been beaten with the nerf-stick quite as much as him.

Three Pikmin at a time isn't total blasphemy, but I don't think it was necessary. If they gave him four or five at a time, that would be a nice middle-ground. Not as many Pikmin, but you can still pressure people with his side-B and defend yourself with that lovely c-stick. Sakurai said that this makes Pikmin management more easy, but that's why I said I think they're dumbing him down. You're always on the move with Olimar, and you can always see what kind of Pikmin is next in line.

His new up-B looks alright, but I think his up-B in Brawl is disturbingly underrated. Not only does it track ledges (AKA if I do his up-B above a ledge, he'd still latch onto it, making for some ambiguous situations that've gotten me a lot of ledge-guarding opportunities and satisfying spikes) but when you have a full party of Pikmin it has pretty nice range as well. It's not a bad tool when you short hop and tag someone in the air with it, it has decent knockback at higher percentages.

You have to take into Consideration the Technical Limitaions on the 3DS

 

[BeatNinja]

You have to take into Consideration the Technical Limitaions on the 3DS

This is absolutely true, but at the same time, why hurt a character just so they can be played on the version of the game that people won't be playing the most.

I find that both versions of the game should've had a handful of exclusive characters, Olimar being a Wii U exclusive of course.