SmashCAP 1: [CONCEPT ASSESSMENT]

[RuNNing Riot]

Edit: This is proposing ideas, not types and Stats and all the like.

But really, a lot of Pokemon can carry a specific move/item and counter their counters. This isn't something that's extremely exclusive to a few Pokemon or anything like that.

Are we going to be running this like a mirror version of Smogon's CAP? They generally start off submitting concepts to work on, one gets picked, and then a group of people meet together to discuss and decide on the Pokemon's exact stats, etc. And there also has to be loads of polls asking what their movesets are and aren't, etc. etc.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

I agree that we need a separate thread for each project but I don't see the point in having a separate thread for different sections of the project.

Of course. I just believe some sections may need their own attentions called to, which may require a separate thread. But yes, we will be trying to keep the amount of threads for each project as limited as possible.

Are we going to be running this like a mirror version of Smogon's CAP? They generally start off submitting concepts to work on, one gets picked, and then a group of people meet together to discuss and decide on the Pokemon's exact stats, etc. And there also has to be loads of polls asking what their movesets are and aren't, etc. etc.

Well, unless you can think of some better more organized way to do this, we might as well just stick with what Smogon has. We're obviously going to alter the outline whenever need be to fit our ideas and etc. but it will mostly follow that guideline.

-Terywj

 

[Riddle]

so like, concept poll is next?

 

[Wave⁂]

The problem with that is it will make will be alot harder to organize, especially if we keep one thread and mash all the future projects together. This should be the main thread and will eventually branch off to the separate projects (SmashCAP 1, 2, etc.).

Also, Zook, I request this to be stickied since it's like, the main thread about SmashCAP.

-Terywj

We can create a "master" thread when we need one. This should be the CAP 1 thread.

Or we can just accept the fact that as soon as we poll something, BOC will instantly win seeing as the majority of the Pokemon Center likes it.

This.

This is proposing ideas, not types and Stats and all the like.

If your recording has a higher volume, Chatter has a higher chance of inducing confusion.
C WUT I DID THAR

 

[Terywj [태리]]

so like, concept poll is next?

...It will be up when the deadline for submissions is over. (Wednesday night)

We can create a "master" thread when we need one. This should be the CAP 1 thread.This.If your recording has a higher volume, Chatter has a higher chance of inducing confusion.
C WUT I DID THAR

Understood. *Changes title*

-Terywj

 

[Circa]

Or we can just accept the fact that as soon as we poll something, BOC will instantly win seeing as the majority of the Pokemon Center likes it.

Although it does seem as though BOC will win, it's not smart to immediately assume anything like that. It's negative thinking in general, and causes a lot of bandwagoning which would in turn make it harder for other ideas to come in and stand their own ground. I'm betting, for instance, that very few even noticed or cared about Mewter's idea, which could actually be an extremely good and interesting concept to work with if it was changed around a bit.

Edit: This is proposing ideas, not types and Stats and all the like.

Considering the fact that he's giving us an idea he's been working on for quite some time, he probably figured it would be unnecessary to wait to give his ideas on typing, ability, and stats. And although it's not quite 'with' the process, I know I at least don't oppose the inclusion of Pokemon that have been thought through to a more advanced point in design; as long as they were well thought-out before posted of course. It would just make the process of working with them go quicker and let us get down to testing sooner.

My 2c.

EDIT: What are the current plans for posting the final results for each of these? If this gets big enough, would it be reasonable to consider creating a subforum for all of this?

 

[Terywj [태리]]

At the current point, I believe a "Final SmashCAP [Insert #]" thread will be posted at each project's conclusion. Although I would like to have a subforum for this, we'd need a good amount of threads in there in order for it to actually work...we could possibly ask to replace the Strategy PokeDex with a SmashCAP subforum...that would be nice.

Of course we'd have to get this through Zook, Umbreon, etc.

As far as concept submissions are concerned, I'm supportive of the anti-bulky offense one as well as Umbreon's idea.

-Terywj

 

[Riddle]

The thing about Umbreon's idea is that it kind of takes away the group effort of the project. I would rather him post it as "Pokemon that can beat his counters with different sets" or whatever the muk he wants to do with it.

 

[Deleted member]

whatever you guys want to do, you can use the restricted sub-forum for. I was going to ask JV to remove it, but I think finding a different use for it may be a better idea and this fits well.

I have no moderation here and I don't want it back, but I can supply whatever game knowledge or resources you may be looking for (and god I have tons of them).

 

[Terywj [태리]]

whatever you guys want to do, you can use the restricted sub-forum for. I was going to ask JV to remove it, but I think finding a different use for it may be a better idea and this fits well.

I have no moderation here and I don't want it back, but I can supply whatever game knowledge or resources you may be looking for (and god I have tons of them).

Would you be allowed to like, rename the subforum and stuff? If you could that would be greatly appreciated.

-Terywj

 

[Mewter]

The sub-forum, if it keeps all the older threads, probably doesn't need to be renamed (in my opinion).

So, what are we going to do with all of the older Strat Dex entries?
/Deletethemsincewehavesmogonforthat

 

[Spire]

In that case, Zook and I can post poll threads for the various polls you seem to need, Terywj.

Thanks again Umbreon

 

[Terywj [태리]]

If we kept that subforum "The Strategy PokeDex" and posted SmashCAP threads don't you think that's a but misleading obnoxious?

-Terywj

 

[Pink Reaper]

I should point out, if you do an anti-Taunt ability you should make it something along the lines of "Pokemon cannot be mentally altered." Basically make the pokemon resist Taunt/Torment/Confusion/Attraction. This allows it to counter basically any bulky offensive pokemon that uses taunt as well as Machamp and the now oddly common torment users. Attraction added on simply to comply to the idea of what the ability would do.

 

[UltiMario]

I should point out, if you do an anti-Taunt ability you should make it something along the lines of "Pokemon cannot be mentally altered." Basically make the pokemon resist Taunt/Torment/Confusion/Attraction. This allows it to counter basically any bulky offensive pokemon that uses taunt as well as Machamp and the now oddly common torment users. Attraction added on simply to comply to the idea of what the ability would do.

Pink Reaper and I are thought buddies, we can think of the exact same way just because its awesome and all that.

 

[CRASHiC]

I'd like to propose another way about countering Bulky Offense.

Serene Grace

If we make a pokemon fast enough to out run the bulky offense pokemon but not the sweepers, and give it the correct moves and stat base we could stop Bulky Offense pokemon by simply not allowing them to do anything, or hitting them with poison, paralysis, burn, etc.

It would be to some degree less effective, but it wouldn't require the creation of a move that doesn't exist in the pokemon world.

At the very least, it would be an effective choice for a 2nd ability, though to properly work, I believe this pokemon would need its move pool and base stats to revolve completely around the concept. this pokemon would likely carve out a place like Aerodactl, who has a very specific goal that it is good at, but can't do much else. It could be an evolved form of Dunsparce.

 

[Wave⁂]

Serene Grace is, for lack of a better term, gay.

 

[CRASHiC]

All H4X are, but it would still make a good counter to bulky offense pokemon, cutting through their defenses with a critical hit, paralyzing them, making them flinch.

 

[Pink Reaper]

at that point you're just using Jirachi.

 

[Wave⁂]

Things you can do with Serene Grace:
abuse flinch
abuse burn
abuse freeze

Oh wait

 

[Deleted member]

IMO it should override anything that forces you to choose a move other than choice items. which is, iirc, only taunt and torment.

and yeah, I can do whatever you want with it. just give me all the details.

edit: I have a serene grace sacred fire choice scarf flareon. the worst part is is that people only think it's hacked to have sacred fire since flash fire activates so infrequently.

 

[RuNNing Riot]

Well, unless you can think of some better more organized way to do this, we might as well just stick with what Smogon has. We're obviously going to alter the outline whenever need be to fit our ideas and etc. but it will mostly follow that guideline.

-Terywj

Fair enough.

...say, if this is going to become the 'master' thread as annoying puts it, you may as well also list the concepts submitted so far on the first post. Makes it easier to know what the options are instead of having to sift through the entire thread.

 

[CRASHiC]

at that point you're just using Jirachi.

Good point. I always seem to forget that Jirachi exist. No idea why.

 

[Wave⁂]

other than choice items. which is, iirc, only taunt and torment.

Actually, that could be interesting. Below-average offensive stats, but an ability that negates Choice items' move restriction.

 

[UltiMario]

Actually, that could be interesting. Below-average offensive stats, but an ability that negates Choice items' move restriction.

So it'd be like a weaker Huge/Pure Power, except with Item Slot Syndrome?

<.>

 

[Wave⁂]

Or free Quick Feet.

 

[Circa]

Or free Quick Feet.

Not really worth it if it's below average in offenses.

I don't really care what all the ability covers, just as long as one of those things is taunt. Let's not try and discuss right now though. It's not the time. Concepts are what should be talked about right now. And if none of those are popping up, then minor discussion on typing for the current most dominant concept (which I wouldn't normally mention, but this one does admittedly seem to be a landslide victory).

 

[UltiMario]

Or free Quick Feet.

Same, seeing as quick Feeters tend to have Toxic Orb on them to activate it.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

I've reedited the OP with the current submissions.

-Terywj

 

[Wave⁂]

Bulky attackers:

Heatran, Rotom, Gyarados, Latias, Jirachi, Gliscor, Salamence, Scizor, Metagross, Swampert, Starmie, Tyranitar, Suicune, Machamp, Togekiss, and Empoleon.

 

[UltiMario]

Wasn't the Anti-Taunt thing supposed to be an ability for the BOC, not just a SmashCAP concept in itself?

Also, Starmie is bulky? I never really found it bulky, but then again, you hardly see the thing anymore....

 

[Pink Reaper]

Bulky attackers:

Heatran, Rotom, Gyarados, Latias, Jirachi, Gliscor, Salamence, Scizor, Metagross, Swampert, Starmie.

You forgot TTar, Suicune, Machamp, Togekiss and also possibly Empoleon.

 

[Circa]

@UltiMario: It is mainly meant for the BOC, but it's also a kind of concept as well because it hasn't existed before now. Thus, it can be discussed on what exactly the ability does, even though it's not the main concept of the SmashCAP.

I wouldn't say it's bulky per say, but Starmie does have good enough defenses (and typing) to make plenty of easy switch-ins. Trust me I'd know. I see plenty of Starmie.

 

[Wave⁂]

60 / 85 /85 is fairly bulky, especially when you factor in Recover.

 

[Riddle]

Yeah, I believe anti-taunt is a part of BOC since I actually mentioned it in my explanation...

 

[KrazyGlue]

60 / 85 /85 is fairly bulky, especially when you factor in Recover.

Yes but it has 5 weaknesses.

And I'm assuming by "Bulky Attackers" you mean popular bulky attackers with at least decent speed. If not, there's some pokemon to add, such as Feraligatr which is bulky and is an attacker. It's just not one of the top used ones. Even then, it has decent popularity in UU and is faster than some of the pokemon on your list.

Also, if you're including pokemon with a fair amount of weaknesses, doesn't heracross deserve a mention?

 

[Mewter]

I've reedited the OP with the current submissions.

-Terywj

My submission doesn't count as a submission? :O

Unless I read something wrong (by the way, I'm really bad at theorymon, so don't ask me to elaborate).


Edit for a random idea:
An ability called Quickfix, where the Pokemon with the ability is able to cure itself of stat ailments after a certain number of turns?

 

[Terywj [태리]]

@Mewtwer: My bad, what is it called again? Can't see right. <_<

Random ideas are okay, but again, we're working on concepts until tomorrow.

-Terywj

 

[Wave⁂]

An ability called Quickfix, where the Pokemon with the ability is able to cure itself of stat ailments after a certain number of turns?

Shed Skin?

 

[Circa]

@Mewtwer: My bad, what is it called again? Can't see right. <_<

Random ideas are okay, but again, we're working on concepts until tomorrow.

-Terywj

Sorry on making Anti-Taunt sound like a concept in its own, I read Annoying's post wrong. It's only meant to be discussed as an ability option, as it was intended to be for use on the BOC. It is by no means a concept for an entire Pokemon, just an ability.