Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Deleted member]

What sucks is that nothing makes sense at all. So it's legit because a guy's name can be tracked to a company Bamco's involved in but Nintendo isn't which means Sakurai trying to keep this under wraps extends to Bamco's marketing team who for DBFZ leaked like 3 of the base game characters, Ginyu, Hit and Black. Then there's also the Grinch stuff which proves legitimacy but then there's the fact that the Grinch and dog images themselves are re-used from trailers meaning it's possible it's been faked and my head just hurts from this mess

At this point, nothing is everything and everything is nothing. I'm still rolling over the fact that Microsoft got their first hands at a ****ing Kingdom Hearts 3 trailer during E3.

Xbox. Kingdom Hearts.

Sky's the limit.

 

[Tyrathius]

I mean, we've got 60+ characters already. I don't think there's much left that appeals to more casual gamers, especially as far as first party characters go.

There's stuff like Incineroar, who may be more well known, but not many people would have a particularly strong reaction to.

 

[Chrono.]

I know a lot of people are saying this is the “roster of dreams” and I’m many respects, it honestly is to a ton of people. I seriously have to ask though, who outside of the hardcore Nintendo’s community cares for Geno, Isaac, Chorus Kids, And Mach Rider? I mean holy crap we’re happy, but for a lot of people these choices will probably be confusing. But then again, the same could be said of tons of smash characters, so who really knows? Perhaps they just wanted to craft the roster of big fans dreams.

I definitely saw a lot of folks on Twitter saying this roster sucked precisely for this reason.

 

[Confirmation]

Afraid I don't have time to search back now, but did this get posted? It shows even more of the E3 art, and we can see the leak is missing pretty much the entire background formation.

iirc it's been mentioned that the E3 mural and the "empty" battlefield already have differences and thus the non-mural stuff can't be compared to the stuff in the leak.

I'm beginning to see old arguments resurface so I'll take that as a reason to nap. This is super hype though and hopefully still stands tomorrow

 

[Johnknight1]

Just dropping in to check on things, and this thread is wild, honestly...

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I'll see you guys on the other side :thinking:

Yeah... take it easy everyone. Don't go super ham and wear yourselves out lmao.

Death.

Taxes.

Skull Kid conspiracy theories.

 

[doomedtacox]

I mean, we've got 60+ characters already. I don't think there's much left that appeals to more casual gamers, especially as far as first party characters go.

There's stuff like Incineroar, who may be more well known, but not many people would have a particularly strong reaction to.

Well I'm sure characters like Waluigi and Toad would in terms of first party.

 

[Idon]

I know a lot of people are saying this is the “roster of dreams” and I’m many respects, it honestly is to a ton of people. I seriously have to ask though, who outside of the hardcore Nintendo’s community cares for Geno, Isaac, Chorus Kids, And Mach Rider? I mean holy crap we’re happy, but for a lot of people these choices will probably be confusing. But then again, the same could be said of tons of smash characters, so who really knows? Perhaps they just wanted to craft the roster of big fans dreams.

Honestly?
Not many.

But ask yourself, what would the general public care about? Madden? Fortnite? Overwatch? Dota 2? Halo? God of War?
None of these things sound like they're especially high on Sakurai's priority list, so appealing to large groups of dedicated fans seems to be the ideal situation right now. (Unless it's Kingdom Hearts, but even the big D is in the way of that)

 

[HyruleHero]

I know a lot of people are saying this is the “roster of dreams” and I’m many respects, it honestly is to a ton of people. I seriously have to ask though, who outside of the hardcore Nintendo’s community cares for Geno, Isaac, Chorus Kids, And Mach Rider? I mean holy crap we’re happy, but for a lot of people these choices will probably be confusing. But then again, the same could be said of tons of smash characters, so who really knows? Perhaps they just wanted to craft the roster of big fans dreams.

I completely agree. However Nintendo always explains a characters history after their reveal trailer so it will be okay. For new generation kids as well they won't know about the beloved bear and bird. Really the only character any 'new' fan of smash would know would be Sora if what people are saying is true.

I'm glad for these characters, happy for Geno fans and beyond over joyed for Banjo to be in the game (if real) but relevancy definitely isn't something for any of these characters.

 

[perfectchaos83]

Yea, this is sort of what I want confirmed. But what I am saying is that, if this is the case, is there any other detail on the poster that was hidden by a character completely that somehow perfectly matches the empty battlefield? Because if there is then that would mean the details that don't match were purposely changed (as opposed to "he was just guessing").

I haven't seen any, but I do find it VERY telling that the major inconsistencies appear exactly where they've been pretty much 100% obscured by the foreground characters.

 

[TheKnight]

Yeah... take it easy everyone. Don't go super ham and wear yourselves out lmao.

I think you mean:

 

[TheSpaceKing12]

So why does Issac has grass under his feet? Can he make grass, I think he has earth powers so idk

Yeah he can make grass. He also hasn’t other powers relating to vines and absorption. But the bulk of his powers are earth related. Some folks on the Isaac thread pointing out he appears to be kneeling to pet a Djinn, which is a magic creature from Golden Sun, and would likely playing a role in his moveset too given that Djinn played the role of super attacks in golden sun.

 

[Chrono.]

I'm expecting this to be fully debunked by the time I wake up.

So good night.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Grinch might’ve made Sakurai go on a Grinch Hunt

 

[CaPtAiNInSaN0]

What sucks is that nothing makes sense at all. So it's legit because a guy's name can be tracked to a company Bamco's involved in but Nintendo isn't which means Sakurai trying to keep this under wraps extends to Bamco's marketing team who for DBFZ leaked like 3 of the base game characters, Ginyu, Hit and Black. Then there's also the Grinch stuff which proves legitimacy but then there's the fact that the Grinch and dog images themselves are re-used from trailers meaning it's possible it's been faked and my head just hurts from this mess

 

[Impa4Smash]

Or he's been a phony this entire time to throw people in a loop.

Who's being phony? Whatchu tacoing about?

 

[CosmicQuark]

I had to deal with this with the Box, so I guess I'd be complaining too much if I take issue with having to deal with it here. But I have to say my peace.

The stage used in game... does not have to correlate that much in the more microscopic minutia for a band going around a circular stand (or wristband, if you want to be wrong) so long as the macroscopic details to the viewer remain unaffected, at whatever distance they will be at. It would be weird that they copied 95% of the detail spot on, but didn't manage to know a whole ****ing island or whatever is missing, if they were faking it. There are many other problems (namely the problem with the leak itself is a zoomed out image of poor quality), but that's the major one.

Now that I said my peace, nitpick away.

(and of course as a disclaimer: while I think this leak is likely, it is not at all certain)

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Grinch might’ve made Sakurai go on a Grinch Hunt

Sakurai: Give me my keys. I have to go for a drive.
Assistant: Oh?
Sakurai: I'm thinking of a new fur coat. Something vibrant. Perhaps green in color.
Assistant: You're going to kill The Grinch aren't you?
Sakurai: I'm going to kill The Grinch, yes.

 

[Johnknight1]

Those are the lights of the bike.

Because, you know, a bike should have lights.

No, Mach Rider is not riding Skull Kid.

Big Leaky Brain: Mach Rider is in Ultimate if this leak is legit.

Galaxy Leaky Brain: Majora's Mask is clearly in front of Mach Rider, therefore Skull Kid is in Ultimate.

Multidimensional Leaky Brain: Mach Rider is in Ultimate and Skull Kid is hiding inside his motorcycle because they are a new duo character.

Time Paradox Leaky Brain: Mach Rider will take off his helmet and reveal he is Big Boss and he is holding Majora's Mask because he had to kill the real Mach Rider and Skull Kid to get there, and he is a part of a Patriots conspiracy to take over Smash and hijack Metal Gear.

La-Li-Lu-Le-Lo.

 

[smashingDoug]

Yeah he can make grass. He also hasn’t other powers relating to vines and absorption. But the bulk of his powers are earth related. Some folks on the Isaac thread pointing out he appears to be kneeling to pet a Djinn, which is a magic creature from Golden Sun, and would likely playing a role in his moveset too given that Djinn played the role of super attacks in golden sun.

Thank you.

 

[doomedtacox]

Who's being phony? Whatchu tacoing about?

There's some thought that Incineroar was a phony to throw leakers off, but nothing too concrete.

 

[Z25]

If the dual Nintendo directs rumor is true then to pretty easy to slot 7 characters in.

Open up the regular Nintendo direct with chorus kids and end it with Geno followed by a “smash direct coming soon!” Like with cloud.

Open up the smash direct with Issac, talk about him and Geno, move onto the echoes.

Have Sakurai discuss the master pieces from past games.

Sakurai: “ but that’s not all! We have another blast from the past!” Cue Mach rider.

End the direct wth an overview trailer that has banjo crashing through the logo and taking his place with the cast.


And there you go. Pretty nearly done. Alternatively sometime before now they could throw one of the characters up in a special video like robin and lucina.

I honestly think if this is real Incenroar was leaker bait and won’t be in sadly. But we’ll get the DLC announcement before release. Not sure if I buy it being at the game awards but if Nintendo finally realized they could make announcements outside of their events and go big for smash, then the awards make perfect sense for dlc.

 

[Impa4Smash]

There's some thought that Incineroar was a phony to throw leakers off, but nothing too concrete.

Oh that. Right, I agree it's a strong possibility at this point

 

[Darkraid]

Or he's been a phony this entire time to throw people in a loop.

Maybe Vergeban got it slightly wrong. Geno as base, Incineroar as DLC.

I am still not beliving that roar is not in the game at all.

 

[Mutsukki]

I had to deal with this with the Box, so I guess I'd be complaining too much if I take issue with having to deal with it here. But I have to say my peace.

The stage used in game... does not have to correlate that much in the more microscopic minutia for a band going around a circular stand (or wristband, if you want to be wrong) so long as the macroscopic details to the viewer remain unaffected, at whatever distance they will be at. It would be weird that they copied 95% of the detail spot on, but didn't manage to know a whole ****ing island or whatever is missing, if they were faking it. There are many other problems (namely the problem with the leak itself is a zoomed out image of poor quality), but that's the major one.

Now that I said my peace, nitpick away.

(and of course as a disclaimer: while I think this leak is likely, it is not at all certain)

The E3 spread is not the stage used in the game. In fact, it's the exact background used on the website, which would be the exact one used in any other material. Much of the discrepancies come only from things entirely hidden by other characters, that's the biggest problem of them all I'd think

 

[Solmatter]

My main concern is actually the character posing. Am I the only one who feels like Isaac's quadracep is too long? Geno's pose seems a little "floppy" and Banjo looks slightly off to me (though Kazooie looks great). Ken also has a weirdly long front leg but again, maybe I'm misinterpreting. What do you guys think?

 

[Iko MattOrr]

This doesn't really make sense as the process to move the characters would require him to get the characters in their own layers. Imagine it as you having paper cutouts of every character. If he knew about the E3 blank battlefield he could have just used that one to paste the characters over it. Yea it would take more time to correctly align most characters, but as we know most characters were shifted anyways (and we expect them to be) so it's not really like he needs to be super precise on placement.

I agree with you on this, though it really depends on how much effort they put into the work (I say they because I believe this is the work of more than just 1 person).
I think it's possible that parts of the sky were moved with the characters; it's a bad thing to do, but who knows, maybe they rushed a bit...
That's the only way I can think of that would explain the leaker knowing the shape of the empty picture, but still being forced to change it.
I did an examples many pages ago, I moved Bayonetta, changed the shape of a cloud and removed Luigi, and I went low effort, so I moved parts of the sky with the characters... this is the result:

It's bad, but I think it's good enough to look credible at the resolution and level of blurriness of the leak.

 

[Das Koopa]

Not sure if late;

 

[doomedtacox]

Maybe Vergeban got it slightly wrong. Geno as base, Incineroar as DLC.

I am still not beliving that roar is not in the game at all.

Yup, he could be a boss in spirits too, who knows.

 

[Impa4Smash]

View attachment 171834
My main concern is actually the character posing. Am I the only one who feels like Isaac's quadracep is too long? Geno's pose seems a little "floppy" and Banjo looks slightly off to me (though Kazooie looks great). Ken also has a weirdly long front leg but again, maybe I'm misinterpreting. What do you guys think?

It's honestly too small. Geno is especially hard to see for me. And if someone didn't highlight and put in big letters "Mach Rider" I wouldn't have ever figured out who it was

 

[MainJPW]

Maybe Vergeban got it slightly wrong. Geno as base, Incineroar as DLC.

I am still not beliving that roar is not in the game at all.

I don’t think he knew who was DLC. SE rep/Geno being DLC was always just speculation on his part, wasn’t it?

 

[doomedtacox]

View attachment 171834
My main concern is actually the character posing. Am I the only one who feels like Isaac's quadracep is too long? Geno's pose seems a little "floppy" and Banjo looks slightly off to me (though Kazooie looks great). Ken also has a weirdly long front leg but again, maybe I'm misinterpreting. What do you guys think?

I think it's way too low quality to tell for sure.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I'm expecting this to be fully debunked by the time I wake up.

So good night.

So did I yet here we are.

 

[HyruleHero]

Not sure if late;

the island thats missing fell off of the waterfall. This may be true if the waterfall has been receding each mural update... might be a thing to look for.

 

[Impa4Smash]

I'm expecting this to be fully debunked by the time I wake up.

So good night.

I don't think we'll get a direct tomorrow

 

[Johnknight1]

Smash: No matter what form it takes, always seems to be obsessed with Clouds.

Clouds, Clouds, Clouds.

Smash 64: You can see Double Dedede in the Dreamland Clouds.

Melee: Randall the Cloud on Yoshi's Story.

Brawl: Ridley and K. Rool are in the Clouds.

Smash 3DS/Wii U: Pac-Man is in the Clouds.

Smash 3DS/Wii U DLC: Cloud Strife.

Smash Ultimate: What do the Clouds behind Bowser Jr. look like in this photo?

 

[MainJPW]

So did I yet here we are.

So did I. Apparently there were over 1,000 guests and still no debunk.

 

[Mutsukki]

Not sure if late;

This is so ****ing weird. It's almost like the leaker had a EARLIER version of the background looking this way. I'm still team fake but I swear to god I don't know what's going on anymore.

 

[Jetsurge]

Pretty cool we could have Cloud and Shadow in Smash though

But who is more edgy?

 

[HyruleHero]

View attachment 171834
My main concern is actually the character posing. Am I the only one who feels like Isaac's quadracep is too long? Geno's pose seems a little "floppy" and Banjo looks slightly off to me (though Kazooie looks great). Ken also has a weirdly long front leg but again, maybe I'm misinterpreting. What do you guys think?

Image seems very similar to the Banjo figure that was released recently. If someone had the figure they could probably get that exact pose. Its a bit of a stretch but its always good to keep expectations a little in check (I'm still team real though ).

 

[doomedtacox]

This is so ****ing weird. It's almost like the leaker had a EARLIER version of the background looking this way. I'm still team fake but I swear to god I don't know what's going on anymore.

You have to also understand one image was meant to be displayed on a huge ass screen and the other is meant for a piece of paper.