Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[RileyXY1]

In Leak 5, who are Murabito and Kamui?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

In Leak 5, who is Murabito?

Villager, that’s their Japanese name.

*edit* Also Kamui = Corrin and Reflet = Robin.

 

[Mc.Rad]

My only disappointment is that Ganondorf has the same fanfare as the “heroic” LoZ characters. Pleased with Bowser, Jr. and Ridley’s fanfares though, and still holding out hope for Wolf to get a stand out fanfare!

(I also like Meta Knight’s but he’s technically not a villain)

I kind of wish that they didn't do remixes for some characters, but like snippets of their "themes". Like how Rosalina was in Smash 4...

Sadly I'm pretty sure that won't happen since they're still using the Brawl victory themes... even though they're probably a decade old by now

 

[Opossum]

In Leak 5, who are Murabito and Kamui?

Villager and Corrin.

 

[MSmariosonic]

My only disappointment is that Ganondorf has the same fanfare as the “heroic” LoZ characters. Pleased with Bowser, Jr. and Ridley’s fanfares though, and still holding out hope for Wolf to get a stand out fanfare!

(I also like Meta Knight’s but he’s technically not a villain)

Eh, the zelda fanfare fits Ganondorf okay to be honest.

I don't think it's specifically villains who get a different sounding fanfare from the others of the same series, since Rosalina has her own fanfare too.

 

[Omniomega]

I have played the demo and now come equipped with knowledge.

Although not that much knowledge :3

 

[Will]

Eh, the zelda fanfare fits Ganondorf okay to be honest.

I don't think it's specifically villains who get a different sounding fanfare from the others of the same series, since Rosalina has her own fanfare too.

I'd just rather have everyone have their own unique fanfares. I made a list compiling what I thought could work in the past. Check it out maybe possibly

Spoiler

Spoiler: Mario Bros.

- Same as before
- 0:00 - 0:06
- 0:45 to 0:54 (1.5x Speed)
- 0:16 - 0:26 (2x Speed)
- Same as before
- 0:00 - 0:05 (Would love to make it Sunshine but Koopalings exist)
- 0:06 - 0:12
- Same as before

Spoiler: Donkey Kong

- Same as before
- Nonstop Diddy beatboxing babyyyy

Spoiler: Legend of Zelda

- Same as before
- 0:00 to 0:05
- 0:06 to 0:17 (1.5x Speed)
- Gains the previous version
- 0:09 to 0:13
- A sinister version of Link's theme

Spoiler: Metroid

- Same as before
- Save Station theme
- Same as before

Spoiler: Star Fox

- Same as before
- 0:54 to 1:00
- 0:10 to 0:17

Spoiler: Kirby

- Same as before
- 0:00 to 0:03
- Same as before

Spoiler: Pokemon

- 0:24 to 0:30
- 0:00 to 0:06
- 1:00 to 1:10 (2x Speed)
- Same as before
- 0:14 to 0:19 (Actually had no idea what to give him)
- 0:52 to 1:00
- Looping song or if you really want to suffer, nonstop this.

Spoiler: Mother

- Gains the previous version
- Mix of 0:00 to 0:10 and 0:50 to 1:10 (2x Speed)
The only one where I scrap the actual theme, which is from the first game, which would go to Ninten or Giygas if they ever show up. Also wanted to give Lucas something special since **** his childhood is like ruined forever give the kid some ice cream.

Spoiler: Fire Emblem

- Same as before
- 0:00 to 0:06
- 0:06 to 0:13
- 0:08 to 0:15
:ultrobin - 0:08 to 0:24 (2x Speed)
- 0:10 to 0:22 (2x Speed)

Spoiler: Kid Icarus

- Same as before
- Same as before
- 0:02 to 0:08

Some of these are pretty generic choices but I'd like to hear what you'd rather choose for some fighters.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Meta Knight was never a villain, he is just a warrior that wants to be the strongest in the universe, but he is a good dude.
But you forgot to add Porky to the list of villains, he has been doing cameos since melee, was 2 bosses in brawl, and was in both the 3ds and the wii u versions of the games, and his stage is returning, so that means they already had to work on a 3d model of Porky (for the statue of new pork city) and add his theme (since it was one of the musics that could play in his stage)

re: meta knight - meta knight was definitely on a morally grey area. Meta Knight was never clearly an ally up until about Squeak Squad, I'd say? It took until Return to Dreamland for him to be playable in a good context. My memory is a bit hazy. Regardless, he was always up there on morally gray - A better comparison is probably to, say, Knuckles for a while.

re: Porky - Can add to list but I skipped out on him intentionally, similar to the Fire Emblem and Pokemon villains (though those I had more foundation): He's a villain that would take significant time to program (unless they went without his mech - I was hesitant to include any other Mother characters, but at least those are like, a week's worth of programming at most), last I've checked, pretty much no fanbase clamors for him, and the best case I've heard is "he's in 2 of the games" which, is kinda a mute point b/c,

Spoiler

Giygas was already in two and technically meant for all three, and we can see cut shots of Giygas taking over Masked Man, so, Masked Man could at least take moves from Giygas (arguably Porky could too)

Then the whole thing that got brought up correctly during Brawl speculation: Porky doesn't really fight; in Earthbound his boss fight is less than spectacular, though, Mother 3 improves on it. On the contrary hand, they did give his boss in Brawl a moveset. This is more of a taste thing but, as someone that's played Brawl's boss rush enough, me personally: meh.

That said, I know I just made that whole post against that, but I'd gladly run a redux list and include him down on the list of candidates along with a very special set of Pokemon / Fire Emblem characters, especially since someone pointed this out to me...

boy if you dont
View attachment 153986

I obviously know you meant to include both, but that was a bad idea. Separate morally grey from the villains, because they don't mix in the same category.

Sure, but if I were to do this, then I'd probably redux over all of the supporting characters and lift them into four categories. "Mostly good" "Mostly evil" "More good but sometimes morally grey" and "More bad but sometimes morally gray" - I'd gladly do that if a few of you have interest. I love discussing Nintendo's supporting characters and I think it could spark up some discussion that isn't the same 5 characters

Also, while I did mention a set characters, I think a good chunk of them will show up in the game in some fashion. We'll see though.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

My only disappointment is that Ganondorf has the same fanfare as the “heroic” LoZ characters. Pleased with Bowser, Jr. and Ridley’s fanfares though, and still holding out hope for Wolf to get a stand out fanfare!

I'd just rather have everyone have their own unique fanfares.

I like having only some of the characters having their own victory theme, makes them more special
/, , , , , all having their own thing is much better and more simple than everyone having something different (though having their own would be great aswell...just those three)

 

[CaptainAmerica]

My only disappointment is that Ganondorf has the same fanfare as the “heroic” LoZ characters. Pleased with Bowser, Jr. and Ridley’s fanfares though, and still holding out hope for Wolf to get a stand out fanfare!

(I also like Meta Knight’s but he’s technically not a villain)

I know, right?

I do like universes sharing themes - melodies at least. But each character should get their own spin on it. Like Mario/Bowser and Kirby/MK have the same theme but one is a rock-y remix.

Ganondorf sharing a theme with Link is not okay. Especially if even Dark Pit can get his own...

 

[Thirdkoopa]

I'd just rather have everyone have their own unique fanfares. I made a list compiling what I thought could work in the past. Check it out maybe possibly

I love this list! Didn't check all of it out, but your Super Metroid choice is BOMB.

 

[Will]

Sure, but if I were to do this, then I'd probably redux over all of the supporting characters and lift them into four categories. "Mostly good" "Mostly evil" "More good but sometimes morally grey" and "More bad but sometimes morally gray" - I'd gladly do that if a few of you have interest. I love discussing Nintendo's supporting characters and I think it could spark up some discussion that isn't the same 5 characters

Also, while I did mention a set characters, I think a good chunk of them will show up in the game in some fashion. We'll see though.

You could always just use the classic alignment chart, you know?

Lawful Evil
Neutral Evil
Chaotic Evil (Porky, Ridley, and Black Shadow just kinda conquer this one)

That type of stuff.

EDIT: I also forgot, Tragic Villains exist too, but the only ones I can think of right now is Giygas.

 

[Roberk]

I'd just rather have everyone have their own unique fanfares. I made a list compiling what I thought could work in the past. Check it out maybe possibly

For Lucario you could probably find a unique song from his movie.

 

[SmashingXan2]

Roster prediction
I think, counting echoes and already revealed newcomers, there will be 12 new characters, as this game seems to be a celebration of smash, so I think that would be a nice touch.

For new echoes, I'm thinking Chrom and Dark Samus. I dont think Sakurai would try to get a 3rd party character that's a clone. Also, both Chrom's and Dark Samus' palette swaps for Ike and Samus are gone.

For unique newcomers, my guesses are
King K Rool due to fan demand
Bandanna Dee for the same reason
Simon Belmont due to Vergaben
Rayman due to his trophy in Smash 4
Elma due to fan demand and that slip recently
Decidueye as my choice for Pokémon
And someone from FE: Three Houses because they were probably in development at the same time and each game had the most relevant FE characters as a newcomer

Thoughts?

 

[UltimateWario]

I have played the demo and now come equipped with knowledge.

Although not that much knowledge :3

What does the demo smell like?

 

[Thirdkoopa]

You could always just use the classic alignment chart, you know?

Lawful Evil
Neutral Evil
Chaotic Evil (Porky, Ridley, and Black Shadow just kinda conquer this one)

That type of stuff.

EDIT: I also forgot, Tragic Villains exist too, but the only ones I can think of right now is Giygas.

I could, but dumping characters into 9 categories (I'd want to do all of the supporting characters; it could be interesting) would be a bit more difficult.

Do love me some DnD though =P

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Compared to pretty much every other franchises, FE really has been getting the most amount of love in Smash 4.

Come to think of it, do you think there's a chance people will complain about "Xenoblade bias" for this game?

If we get Elma on the base roster and Rex & Pyra as DLC I think it'll happen yeah, people are generally tired of the anime swordfighter archetype, so they'll spout any negative claims against them that they can. I'm not a huge fan of the archetype myself mind you, but I wouldn't really care all that much, I guess Ridley made sure I've got no hate left to dish out .

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Roster prediction
I think, counting echoes and already revealed newcomers, there will be 12 new characters, as this game seems to be a celebration of smash, so I think that would be a nice touch.

For new echoes, I'm thinking Chrom and Dark Samus. I dont think Sakurai would try to get a 3rd party character that's a clone. Also, both Chrom's and Dark Samus' palette swaps for Ike and Samus are gone.

For unique newcomers, my guesses are
King K Rool due to fan demand
Bandanna Dee for the same reason
Simon Belmont due to Vergaben
Rayman due to his trophy in Smash 4
Elma due to fan demand and that slip recently
Decidueye as my choice for Pokémon
And someone from FE: Three Houses because they were probably in development at the same time and each game had the most relevant FE characters as a newcomer

Thoughts?

Seems fair. Sufficient and sensical, yet not too overcrowded to prevent DLC additions.

 

[monadoboy]

I'd just rather have everyone have their own unique fanfares. I made a list compiling what I thought could work in the past. Check it out maybe possibly

Ever since Cloud got his own fanfare I wanted Pokemon to get this after a Pokemon wins:

 

[Will]

Simon Belmont due to Vergaben

and into the trash it goes

Ever since Cloud got his own fanfare I wanted Pokemon to get this after a Pokemon wins:

well i mean thats what i gave jigglypuff, but having all pokemon character have it wouldnt be bad either.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

oh, someone brought up fire emblem, but re: fire emblem and pokemon - it makes sense that they'd get different characters all the time because they're casts that swap out. As much as I love supporting characters, any we see are icing on the cake. For Fire Emblem and Pokemon? There's a risk of someone playing Fire Emblem's newest installment and not seeing their character in the game, or playing Smash and then deciding to pick up the Fire Emblem series, while not seeing any characters from Smash in there.

I used to get annoyed at "insert newest FE/Pokemon character here" but now I can relate and understand it more. It does suck because other supporting characters get shafted, but it's also reasonable. It's also why I'm starting to loosen up to that whole "2nd xenoblade character" thing a bit more.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

There's a risk of someone playing Fire Emblem's newest installment and not seeing their character in the game, or playing Smash and then deciding to pick up the Fire Emblem series, while not seeing any characters from Smash in there.

I mean, that's pretty much what happened with Marth and Roy in Melee for western fans at the time and it didn't exactly have a negative effect on fans.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Roster prediction
I think, counting echoes and already revealed newcomers, there will be 12 new characters, as this game seems to be a celebration of smash, so I think that would be a nice touch.

For new echoes, I'm thinking Chrom and Dark Samus. I dont think Sakurai would try to get a 3rd party character that's a clone. Also, both Chrom's and Dark Samus' palette swaps for Ike and Samus are gone.

For unique newcomers, my guesses are
King K Rool due to fan demand
Bandanna Dee for the same reason
Simon Belmont due to Vergaben
Rayman due to his trophy in Smash 4
Elma due to fan demand and that slip recently
Decidueye as my choice for Pokémon
And someone from FE: Three Houses because they were probably in development at the same time and each game had the most relevant FE characters as a newcomer

Thoughts?

Seems solid enough. I would also like to see Chorus Kid(s) but I have a feeling they may miss base roster again due to implementation problems...they could be DLC if that’s the case.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

I mean, that's pretty much what happened with Marth and Roy in Melee for western fans at the time and it didn't exactly have a negative affect on fans.

it's not about a negative affect: it's about a confusing affect. let's throw some scenarios down (these are just my examples; chose three houses b/c it was on my mind)

scenario A: someone buys fire emblem three houses, they play the new Smash Bros game, they're confused because no Fire Emblem Three Houses characters are in there
scenario B: someone buys smash bros, they play the newest fire emblem game, they're confused because no characters are the same as the ones in Smash Bros

the point i'm making, is even though Marth is the Mario of his series, he's also not. To cover every Mario game you put in Mario and you're close to done. To cover every generation of Pokemon or set of games (at least) of Fire Emblem, you'd need a lot more characters to do that. Obviously they're not going to spend time adding in Sigurd just to cover FE4-5, but, with the many characters, they're trying to cover as much ground as possible.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

If we get Elma on the base roster and Rex & Pyra as DLC I think it'll happen yeah, people are generally tired of the anime swordfighter archetype, so they'll spout any negative claims against them that they can. I'm not a huge fan of the archetype myself mind you, but I wouldn't really care all that much, I guess Ridley made sure I've got no hate left to dish out .

I remember when Shulk was accused of being a "generic anime swordsman" so yeah, the complaints have been around for a while and they'll likely continue to be around. I guess some people just don't care for JRPG pretty people with swords.

 

[Chandeelure]

This is so boring lol.

At least we will get a Smash Blog update today with nothing interesting.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

This is so boring lol.

At least we will get a Smash Blog update today with nothing interesting.

We're getting the return of Luigi's nose.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This is so boring lol.

At least we will get a Smash Blog update today with nothing interesting.

...what time do they usually update (EST)? I wanna uhhhhhhh...test a theory

 

[Roberk]

Roster prediction
I think, counting echoes and already revealed newcomers, there will be 12 new characters, as this game seems to be a celebration of smash, so I think that would be a nice touch.

For new echoes, I'm thinking Chrom and Dark Samus. I dont think Sakurai would try to get a 3rd party character that's a clone. Also, both Chrom's and Dark Samus' palette swaps for Ike and Samus are gone.

For unique newcomers, my guesses are
King K Rool due to fan demand
Bandanna Dee for the same reason
Simon Belmont due to Vergaben
Rayman due to his trophy in Smash 4
Elma due to fan demand and that slip recently
Decidueye as my choice for Pokémon
And someone from FE: Three Houses because they were probably in development at the same time and each game had the most relevant FE characters as a newcomer

Thoughts?

I doubt Three Houses to be honest. Characters added while their games were still in development had specific reasons as to why.

• Roy was added when his game still wasn't released yet, Sakurai needed clones to pad out Melee's roster.
• Greninja was chosen to be added before XY released because they wanted a new Pokemon and the reputation of the series allows for such risks. (Guaranteed to sell well)
• Corrin was added because they wanted to promote a new game, he was the easiest to implement while also proven to be from a successful game/series (in Japan).

With Ultimate, Sakurai doesn't really need a character from Three Houses due to the newcomer limitations. I'd only suspect they'd be DLC, and even then that's uncertain when there are objectively popular FE picks they could pull from the Choose Your Legends polls.


Also, I don't put much weight into Ike losing his Chrom palette for Chrom's chances. Meta Ridley was shown in the trailer but not playable even though Ridley already has a full set of 8 alts, so there can be more alts for characters that just aren't finished yet.

 

[Chandeelure]

...what time do they usually update (EST)? I wanna uhhhhhhh...test a theory

It's kinda random, but in 5 more hours, probably.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

My theory is, while not in a direct, you know how Nintendo announced the BOTW Link MK8D update at the end of Day 2 of SDCC? My theory is they’ll just randomly drop a trailer at the end of SDCC today, around I think 6 or 7 PM PST (9 or 10 EST). The 22nd leak would then be somewhat true, minus it being in a direct (and no Cuphead Switch/FFVII Remake on Switch/etc as a result)

That’s my crazy theory I formulated on a technicality

 

[Zerp]

This is so boring lol.

At least we will get a Smash Blog update today with nothing interesting.

Watch, they're going to upload Bandana Dee's video today because you just said it'd be nothing interesting, they've been waiting for this moment.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey uh, did we get K. Rool and Dixie yet? :V

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Hey uh, did we get K. Rool and Dixie yet? :V

Few more hours, if my theory of Nintendo ending SDCC with a bang (sans Direct) is anything to go by

...I should probably break out a tinfoil hat lel

 

[KMDP]

My theory is, while not in a direct, you know how Nintendo announced the BOTW Link MK8D update at the end of Day 2 of SDCC? My theory is they’ll just randomly drop a trailer at the end of SDCC today, around I think 6 or 7 PM PST (9 or 10 EST). The 22nd leak would then be somewhat true, minus it being in a direct (and no Cuphead Switch/FFVII Remake on Switch/etc as a result)

That’s my crazy theory I formulated on a technicality

So... 2:00 AM BST, for the Brits (like me! I'm just... kind of a night owl/vampire)

 

[SmashingXan2]

I doubt Three Houses to be honest. Characters added while their games were still in development had specific reasons as to why.

• Roy was added when his game still wasn't released yet, Sakurai needed clones to pad out Melee's roster.
• Greninja was chosen to be added before XY released because they wanted a new Pokemon and the reputation of the series allows for such risks. (Guaranteed to sell well)
• Corrin was added because they wanted to promote a new game, he was the easiest to implement while also proven to be from a successful game/series (in Japan).

With Ultimate, Sakurai doesn't really need a character from Three Houses due to the newcomer limitations. I'd only suspect they'd be DLC, and even then that's uncertain when there are objectively popular FE picks they could pull from the Choose Your Legends polls.


Also, I don't put much weight into Ike losing his Chrom palette for Chrom's chances. Meta Ridley was shown in the trailer but not playable even though Ridley already has a full set of 8 alts, so there can be more alts for characters that just aren't finished yet.

Those are good points, I do think there will be at least one new FE character, and those are my guesses. Leif could possibly be in even, we have no idea

 

[KMDP]

Earlier in this thread, I saw someone say "With a name like 'Fire Emblem: Three Houses', it'll probably be a multi-version release like Fates." Which is... faulty logic, to say the least.

To start with; the game's name in Japanese is "Fire Emblem 風花雪月" (Fire Emblem: Fūkasetsugetsu; Fire Emblem: Wind, Flower, Snow, Moon); it's a reference to a Chinese poem and the terms are references to the seasons: Wind = Summer, Flower = Spring, Snow = Winter, Moon = Autumn.

Considering there are four concepts in the Japanese name, does that mean there are going to be four games? Pff, no. Just because the English name is Three Houses doesn't mean there are going to be Three Games; presumably, it's a reference to the families of the three main characters: Hræsvelgr, (Alexandre) Bladud and Regan. However, it's possible there'll be multiple story lines like in Fire Emblem 7 ("Eliwood Mode" and "Hector Mode" tell the same story from different perspectives).

The fact that Fire Emblem Fates (Fire Emblem: if) had mutliple games wasn't apparent in it's name, it was the subtitles that showed the multiple versions: Birthright/White Night Kingdom, Conquest/Dark Night Kingdom and Revelation/Invisible Kingdom). If Fire Emblem: Three Houses has multiple versions, then it'd be something like: "Fire Emblem Three Houses: Soaring Titans/Necromancy Vanguard/Little Kingdom", the three names referring to the what the names of the three houses mean/are referencing). Until then, it's better to think of Three Houses as what it probably will be, a single release.

 

[P.Kat]

On August 9th, Nintendo will be hosting a direct announcing what they are working on for the Switch and 3DS. The direct is 40 minutes long. Here is what is going to be announced:

August 9th? C-could it be? My theory coming true? The stars aligning? Oh! Happy d-

>The direct will contain 3 Smash newcomers, with them being Dixie (who is a semi-clone of Diddy) Funky Kong which is DK's echo, and King K Rool.

WHAT? No Ammy, on the 9th?!

This leak is fake, to the garbage with you!

Lol I just had a thought

Since these leaks seem so adamant on pushing K. Rool and Dixie as the next newcomers... what if both are indeed playable, but they’re NOT the next newcomers announced, and someone else is announced instead?

Who would you expect?

also Diablo 3 and Fallout 4 on Switch...I want to believe

Laboman... I'm serious, I can see Sakurai putting Laboman as the joke character for Ultimate. Either that, or Ashley, would come first then Elma, I just have a feeling.

But that's gross...

Them's fighting words! How dare you insult best Alola Starter?! Put em up! Put em up! XD

 

[KMDP]

Them's fighting words! How dare you insult best Alola Starter?! Put em up! Put em up! XD

Not to mention that Primarina already has a Support Thread anyway.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

We're getting the return of Luigi's nose.

Can I personally ask this to be the new "Luigi's Nose" for Ultimate?