Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Deleted member]

Just a question, but did anybody else think Spring Man wouldn’t be a fighter?
My main reasoning for thinking this is because it would be hard to stay true to Arms and not make every single move Simon’s Up Ariel x2

I wasn’t sure about him either.

 

[Jetsurge]

K.Rool has good alts too.

Yeah K. Rool's alts are pretty cool, it's like all the colours of the Kremlings. I think Incineroar has the best alts in the game. He's got his shiny form and Big the Cat.

 

[osby]

And it's the person's own fault for pre-purchasing the DLC and ending up dissatisfied with the contents.

That being said, we're talking about a character that only one small part of the world would recognize. Why on earth would Sakurai think it's a good time to experiment with an obscure, not highly requested character when people are spending actual money on the content? That's just not fair at all to the Western audiences.

Honestly, he probably would've been better off saving Piranha Plant as one of the five DLC fighters instead of Katalina. It wasn't highly requested either, but at least it's iconic enough to be instantly recognized.

Eh, I'll wait until confirming if it's true or not.

One possible scenario is that DLC also includes a character that only western audiences would be familiar with, but that would a pretty weird strategy for post-release content. I guess we'll see.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

On another note, Smash Spain has a video with all of the alternate colors for every fighter. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz44BlBVhdQ

Hey, Shulk's got a Rex alt.
And Incineroar's got a Big the Cat alt

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

Hey, Shulk's got a Rex alt.
And Incineroar's got a Big the Cat alt

I’m just happy we finally got a Shiny alt. I don’t know why Sakurai didn’t already think about this.

 

[Iridium]

Does anyone else think 's 7th alt looks like his Chronicles design? The hair...and the armor...

NonSpecificGuy What do you think?

Uh, osby ? Anything?

 

[osby]

Hey, Shulk's got a Rex alt.

Which one? Aren't black haired ones for Sharla and Dunbar?

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

I have gone an entire lifetime curled up in a ball.

Do you want help with that? I have some experience in psychotherapy with adolescents. I'm assuming you're probably not over the age of 30.

 

[hazza5557]

So like is Snake not getting an amiibo? Unless I’m dumb he was the only one not shown during the direct.

They didn’t show Richter or Incineroar either I don’t think so he’s probably in a wave with them

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Which one? Aren't black haired ones for Sharla and Dunbar?

Oh wait... they are... darn it...

 

[Deleted member]

I don’t know anything about Granblue Fantasy.

 

[osby]

I’m just happy we finally got a Shiny alt. I don’t know why Sakurai didn’t already think about this.

It's probably because Pokemon aren't only owned by Nintendo and other shareholders has a say in their alts, like third parties or pretty much any fighter.

Oh wait... they are... darn it...

At least he has different hair/skin colors now.

 

[Jetsurge]

Big the Cat is definitely a battle in World of Light

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Isn't that his old Brawl victory pose?

yeah it is but our little boy looks a bit more cocky now. Hes so proud of himself

 

[osby]

Big the Cat is definitely a battle in World of Light

I think a lot of Sonic characters will be. Rosalina (with bunny ears) and Luma can be Cream and Cheese. That mode has so much potential, I loved it.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

yeah it is but our little boy looks a bit more cocky now. Hes so proud of himself

I just wanna see Young Link’s victory animations.

 

[drag0nscythe]

I don’t know anything about Granblue Fantasy.

It is a mobile ios rpg that is japan only and had its only sequel coming out on the playstation 4.

It looks and sounds like old school final fantasy, but with ios design.

Ps4 looks great.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I have gone an entire lifetime curled up in a ball.

Smash Sonic, get out of Dyllybirdy's account.

 

[skylanders fan]

really like the new meta knight costumes glad to see that they are referencing characters like that. Sucks still that sonic and pac man don't get alt colors and just slight variations of there gloves. Also would have been awesome for mewtwo to have his armor but besides that I think the alts are great

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

I think a lot of Sonic characters will be. Rosalina (with bunny ears) and Luma can be Cream and Cheese. That mode has so much potential, I loved it.

Same here! I love event matches, so this will be fun.
I just wanna see a match where you fight Isabelle! And another Isabelle with the Digby alt

 

[Knight Dude]

Alright. Now that I have the time to make a case for a character, I feel that with the Fighters Pass and DLC OFFICIALLY CONFIRMED, we can truly now begin speculating for what and who should be in. I think that when we take DLC into consideration, it should be an absolute banger. We're not in the realm of Smash 4 anymore where all the rules were broken, we're in the realm of "Every rule has been broken before. Go all out." Which is why now, especially with series like Street Fighter and Virtua Fighter getting some love, I wanna make the case for Bandai Namco's very own Tekken. And a specific character.

People of the board, I present to you...

The Case of Tekken's Heihachi Mishima Joining the Smash Ultimate Roster

View attachment 175210

Here are a few points I like to present to show why Heihachi would be fit for Super Smash Bros. Ultimate.

Tekken's Legacy and Current Status

Spoiler: Explanation

Over time, Tekken has become one of the "giants", when it comes to the fighting game genre. Yes, you have your 2D-fighters like Street Fighter and King of Fighters, and then you have your 3D ones, like Soul Calibur and Virtua Fighter. But Tekken stands on it's own two feet amongst these greats by making a compelling campaign that the fans love, with characters that have become a staple for not just the FGC, but gaming in general. There was a reason why Street Fighter X Tekken was made, after all. ...Even if it was a bit "meh", but STILL. For the most iconic fighting game franchise to collaborate with Tekken is a sight to behold.

What makes Tekken have the leg up, also, is that you may not know, but they have some pretty big Nintendo relevance, too. Firstly, Tekken Tag Tournament 2 was the franchises' first big jump onto a Nintendo platform. It was not bad and a pretty good game, definitely attracted some Tekken fans. Then came the big one - Pokken Tournament. Easily this has been a beloved game, a game that mixes Pokemon's fan favorite characters and Tekken's core gameplay? Who could pass that up? So far, it has been stated in Nintendo's reports that even the Switch release of Pokken Tournament, "Pokken Tournament DX" is in the top 20 most-sold Switch games, making it both sold a million on Switch and Wii U.

But what about now? Does it stand up still against these colossal fighters like Soul Calibur and Street Fighter? The answer is abso-****ing-lutely. The reactions to The Walking Dead's Negan and Final Fantasy XV's Noctis joining the battle should leave you with little explanation. Tekken 7 has become a blockbuster hit, and was released back in 2015. Easily enough time for Sakurai to fit him in as a DLC before the project plans have finalized. It even shows with the Mii Costume that he got, and especially with the short little video with him and Ryu back in Smash For. Whether it'd be because the Mishima Saga came to a bittersweet end or even the create-a-character, it's simple to see that Tekken has grown year-by-year, and definitely won't be leaving anytime soon.

Heihachi's Legacy as a Character

Spoiler: Explanation

Whether you like it or not, especially when we have the likes of Jin Kazama in the mix, with the setting and build up over the years, Heihachi has been probably the most iconic character in Tekken, and it shows too, when they chosen him for who would be a Mii Costume to represent Tekken. He's most notably known as a bit of a "villainous"-type of character, which fits Smash Ultimate's motif of "Heroes VS. Rivals". To give a bit of his backstory:




Due to how well-written and impactful Heihachi has become as a character in the Tekken franchise, he has always been met with praise from fans and journalists, whether it be his moves or characterization. His popularity has led to him often to even be one of Sony's mascots, "as well as one of the best characters in fighting games". It's definitely shown in that regard when he was chosen into the roster for PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale. When you think of an iconic fighting game character, back then, you would only really say "Ryu", but now? Heihachi definitely is one of them.

Some Love for Bandai

Spoiler: Explanation

This point is a bit of a simple one, but I think makes the sense, in the long term. Bandai Namco helped Sakurai and Nintendo to develop not only just Smash for 3DS and Wii U, but they also helped them develop Smash Ultimate. The roster currently has an ample amount of 3rd parties, but let's compare Bandai Namco to the rest and see why they should get another character.

Konami - 3 (Snake, Simon & Richter Belmont)​

Sega - 2 (Sonic and Bayonetta)​

Capcom - 3 (Mega Man, Ryu and Ken)​

Square Enix - 2 (Cloud and a rumored character)​

Bandai Namco - 1 (PAC-MAN)​

​

As you can see, there are generally, if you don't count echo fighters, 2 characters for each character across the board for all the third parties, but yet only Namco has one. It'd make sense to round out all the companies and give Namco one more fighter. And who else would do fit better for Namco than Tekken?

Status in Smash

Spoiler: Explanation

For Heihachi, Tekken so far represented in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate so far has been unconfirmed. We haven't seen him or Tekken in Spirits and World of Light, but as we've collectively confirmed where we have pretty much all the characters in the roster have different variations of Spirits, AND the Mewtwo + Lucas 3DS Trophy Situation, Spirits doesn't deconfirm a character, so we'll put that to the side. But when it comes to adding a new character, there seems to be two big patterns when it comes to either a past franchise or fighter getting in or not, and that's from being a Mii Costume or an Assist Trophy. While there have been a few ATs promoted to playable fighter status, like Isabelle and Little Mac, Mii Costumes seem to be the one people look towards the most, and with good reason. They're actually a part of the roster, but as a part of the Mii Fighters, to make you feel like you're playing as them. So first, let's take a look at the current Mii Costume status and see where Heihachi and some characters are at.

View attachment 175223

As you can see, for Heihachi being the sole rep for his franchise, no costume has been shown to be in Smash Ultimate, as of now. And if, by the off chance it does happen, it wouldn't necessarily deconfirm him, as we have Captain Falcon and Link outfits in Ultimate. But, with Smash Ultimate, there's a clear pattern of a BIG amount of costumes getting promoted to either a fighter or an AT. But what adds possible credence to Heihachi is that he is also not a part of the Assist Trophy roster, which you can see here with a full list of the 59 usable ATs.

Spoiler: AT List

• Akira - Virtua Fighter
• Alucard - Castlevania
• Andross - Star Fox
• Arcade Bunny - Nintendo Arcade
• Ashley - WarioWare
• Black Knight - Fire Emblem
• Bomberman - Bomberman
• Burrowing Snagret - Pikmin
• Chain Chomp - Super Mario
• Chef Kawasaki - Kirby
• Color TV-Game 15 - It's literally ****ing Pong.
• Devil - Devil World
• Dillon - Dillon's Rolling Western
• Dr. Kawashima - Brain Age (A.K.A. WII U TOP CHARTER BAYBEE!!)
• Dr. Wright - SimCity
• Flies & Hand - Mario Paint
• Ghirahim - The Legend of Zelda
• Ghosts - PAC-MAN
• Gray Fox - Metal Gear Solid
• Guile - Street Fighter
• Hammer Bro - Super Mario
• Isaac - Golden Sun (****ing R.I.P.)
• Jeff - EarthBound
• Kapp'n - Animal Crossing
• Klaptrap - Donkey Kong
• Knuckle Joe - Kirby
• Knuckles - Sonic
• Krystal - Star Fox
• Lyn - Fire Emblem
• Metroid - Metroid
• Midna - The Legend of Zelda
• The Moon - The Legend of Zelda
• Mother Brain - Metroid
• Nightmare - Kirby
• Nikki - Swapnote (Actually R.I.P.)
• nintendog - nintendogs
• Phosphora - Kid Icarus
• Rathalos - Monster Hunter
• Riki - Xenoblade Chronicles
• Rodin - Bayonetta
• Sablé Prince - From Whom The Frog Bell Tolls
• Samurai Goroh - F-Zero
• Shadow - Sonic (R.I.P.)
• Sheriff - What even is his game. "Sheriff"? Yeah, real original.
• Shovel Knight - Shovel Knight
• Skull Kid - The Legend of Zelda
• Spring Man - ARMS
• Squid Sisters (Callie & Marie) - Splatoon
• Starfy - The Legendary Starfy
• Starman - EarthBound
• Sukapon - Sukapon
• Takamaru - The Mysterious Murasame Castle
• Tiki - Fire Emblem
• Thwomp - Super Mario
• Vince - Art Academy
• Waluigi - Super Mario (Where he belongs.)
• Dr. Wily - Mega Man
• Yuri Kozukata - Fatal Frame
• Zero - Mega Man

Yep. Heihachi is nowhere to be seen. With Akira's Virtua Fighter getting some love and a HUGE boost in representation for Street Fighter in Smash Ultimate - when we're talking about games that are a part of the fighting game genre - it seems as if Tekken has been conspicuously absent. No doubt that after the Mii Costume reveal, he had to have gotten a level of support for him to be in Smash, especially after Ryu. But how would he work, moveset-wise? Well, after being shown what Akira would look like if he was a playable character, I don't think him fitting on a 2D plane would be a problem, especially after Street Fighter X Tekken. I feel as if if you can look at some of Incineroar's and Ryu's moveset and combine that with the feeling of how Akira looks and plays and look at how Tekken plays as it's own respective game, I feel that a moveset for him wouldn't be THAT hard to make. Hell, look at Ken - he's was able to wiggle out some more creativity out of Ryu's moveset.

If I were to draw any conclusions is that with the timing of Tekken 7's release, the project plan for Smash Ultimate AND DLC project plans for Smash For and Ultimate, and with the points presented, it feels as if Tekken will not get the treatment that Virtua Fighter will get, but rather, I feel that Heihachi from Tekken will become a playable fighter.

Tekken was on the GBA and the 3DS before getting on the Wii-U. Both Heihachi and his grandson Jin have shown up in both of the Project X Zone games as well. So the two of them have the most presence on Nintendo systems. Honestly, Tekken's had more of an impact on Nintendo than Soul Calibur for that alone, and that was without Link as a guest. But that isn't too surprising since Tekken's one of the more successful fighting games financially.

Still, I'm glad someone's talking about Tekken again. Being a fan of the series since as long as I could remember, it'd be really sick to see one of the Mishimas in the game. The Mishima moveset is pretty easy to translate some of their more iconic moves into specials as well. Hellsweeps, Electric Wind God Fist, Demon Scissor Kick, Dragon Uppercut and the like make for solid choices. And that's not getting into Heihachi specific moves, like Hell Axle Kick, Demon's Breath and Twin Pistons(I don't think Kazuya has Twin Pistons anymore, but I might be wrong.)

Throws aren't too much of an issue either, as Tekken characters usually have at least 5 throws to work with. And each Mishima has some unique command grabs, like Heihachi's headlock, or his Power Bomb. Since Tekken's got a lot of combo strings, there's plenty to pick from for normals. Air moves shouldn't be too hard either, since the Jumping attacks in Tekken should do the trick.

Similar to Ryu, there's also echo potential since either Jin or Kazuya could be added along side him, though we're not getting any echoes as DLC, more so an idea for a future title waaaaaay down the line.

Basically, other than a 2nd Mega Man character, particularly Mega Man X. But another Mega Man like EXE or Geo Stelar would be sick too. A Tekken character is my most wanted choice for Smash. I got damn near everything else I wanted so I'm pretty content, even if I don't get those last few crazy choices. Ryu Hayabusa's right under the 2nd Mega Man character and Tekken character, but I think in concept he's less of an "out there" choice.

EDIT: This dumb post was longer than I meant for it to be.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Did anyone notice that Rabbid Peach was a Spirit?
This means it's probably very well possible that some unrepresented third party companies could just get some Spirits

 

[Curious Villager]

yeah it is but our little boy looks a bit more cocky now. Hes so proud of himself

Hah yeah. Well I'll be looking forward to have another run through with Toon Link in Smash Ultimate. He's probably going to remain my primary main again unless by some miracle we get Professor Layton as one of the five DLC characters down the road...

Also will be looking forward to a Tri Force Heroes team ups too.

 

[osby]

Same here! I love event matches, so this will be fun.
I just wanna see a match where you fight Isabelle! And another Isabelle with the Digby alt

That's a great idea. If you guys can't tell I really liked this mode even though it has no platforming or (as far as I know) cutscenes. It was a great way to work around the budget and time limitations without being Classic Mode 2: Electric Boogaloo.

Did anyone notice that Rabbid Peach was a Spirit?
This means it's probably very well possible that some unrepresented third party companies could just get some Spirits

Heck, even Shantae is one. Just how many Spirits they have?

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

Did anyone notice that Rabbid Peach was a Spirit?
This means it's probably very well possible that some unrepresented third party companies could just get some Spirits

Yeah I noticed that too. I just didn’t think too much about it. But now that you mention it...

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Heck, even Shantae is one. Just how many Spirits they have?

I mean, since Shantae is a spirit, I'm hoping Rottytops is one too...

 

[Knight Dude]

Dark Samus has an alt that's like her concept art. The white and red one.

There's the brown one that's similar to Spire and a Pink one similar to Grendraya(I forget how you spell her name) chick from Prime 3. Her Yellow one seems like it references those statues from Super Metroid just like Ridley's yellow alt.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

I mean, since Shantae is a spirit, I'm hoping Rottytops is one too...

I’m just confused why every single Shantae character is female. Just gonna put that out there...xD

That's a great idea. If you guys can't tell I really liked this mode even though it has no platforming or (as far as I know) cutscenes. It was a great way to work around the budget and time limitations without being Classic Mode 2: Electric Boogaloo.



Heck, even Shantae is one. Just how many Spirits they have?

Probably could’ve came up with something more creative if I tried...Oh! I got an idea!

You have to kill a Green Inciniroar. Labeled “The Grinch” yet try not to kill A Mini in a Geno costume, Isaac Assist Trophy, (only AT who spawns) and Ken! I kid, of course.

 

[Zinith]

Before I go to bed, I'm just gonna leave this here...

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

Does anyone else think 's 7th alt looks like his Chronicles design? The hair...and the armor...

NonSpecificGuy What do you think?

Uh, osby ? Anything?

Meta Ridley has a second palette swap!

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Do you want help with that? I have some experience in psychotherapy with adolescents. I'm assuming you're probably not over the age of 30.

I'll be fine...

I’m just confused why every single Shantae character is female. Just gonna put that out there...xD

Like Bolo.

But um, yeah, the majority are. But, it's definitely nothing to complain about. It's great! :D

 

[osby]

Before I go to bed, I'm just gonna leave this here...

View attachment 175299

I feel like Boshi and Dark Pit would get along well after seeing the last one...

 

[GoeGoe]

I think this is the most beautiful thing that came out of the Direct

 

[DJ3DS]

In terms of recolours, I like King K Rool's the most out of the newcomers - each recolour is a different Kremling.

For returning characters, Pichu probably wins thanks to the Aqua bandana but I also particularly like how the new plastic look makes ROBs more muted colours (particularly the Famicom and the Light Blue) appear.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

I'll be fine...

Like Bolo.

But um, yeah, the majority are. But, it's definitely nothing to complain about. It's great! :D

Oh wow! A boy! xD

But yeah, I wasn’t complaining, just found it a bit funny and weird. I could care less tbh

I think this is the most beautiful thing that came out of the Direct

Your darn tootin’ right!

 

[monadoboyy]

It is a mobile ios rpg that is japan only and had its only sequel coming out on the playstation 4.

It looks and sounds like old school final fantasy, but with ios design.

Ps4 looks great.

You can play the game on Chrome based browsers and it's not Japan only, though registering an account might require you to use google translate

 

[KingBroly]

Nia has a Mii costume.

Apparently Morag does as well.

And yet Rex's is DLC.

Anyone want to explain to me why Rex won't be DLC when Sakurai said he couldn't have been in the base game because of timing?

 

[Iridium]

Lucario stuff.

Seeing the changes to Lucario make me glad he's one of my mains. So, aura seems to have been toned down a bit, while his base power seems to have gone up a bit.

Extreme Speed seems to have less landing lag, and the "headbonk" appears to be less annoying. He can still perform similar combos like in Smash 4, and those visuals...

Not the only changes, but I have to go to the pre-release build forum to report these changes.

 

[Deleted member]

Shulk’s hair color changing to match each character is neat. I use white/Fiora, so I’ll still be blonde most of the time, but they all look really cool now.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Because Shantae made it in as a spirit, I was hoping that maybe some other indies may have as well.

Cave Story, Touhou, Skullgirls, more characters from Shovel Knight, Fate, etc.