Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[IanTheGamer]

Also, R.O.B. didn't properly debut on a video game system.

Also, he never actually said that either.

He more said he wouldn't add Manga characters.

Which still disqualifies Goku. Besides having manga characters kinda defeats the point of Smash being a celebration of Nintendo's past

 

[LancerStaff]

He also said at one point that Animal Crossing was too nonviolent to have a rep.

Things change, after all...

I feel like that’s because Brawl was supposed to be gritty and tough and ****. Which is why Jiggs and TL were late characters.

I don’t see them backing down on the video game origin thing.

 

[christyalmeth]

updated the roster flame picture with who I think is in. No surprise mostly vets besides 2 figures I can’t make out

 

[IanTheGamer]

I feel like that’s because Brawl was supposed to be gritty and tough and ****. Which is why Jiggs and TL were late characters.

I don’t see them backing down on the video game origin thing.

Good because Smash was always meant to be a celebration of Nintendo's past, and putting in Goku, Darth Vader, Shrek, or even The Undertaker (yes the wrestler) would kind of detract from that

 

[TheLastJinjo]

updated the roster flame picture with who I think is in. No surprise mostly vets besides 2 figures I can’t make out

Are you sure that's not Marth to the right of Samus?

 

[S_B]

Which still disqualifies Goku. Besides having manga characters kinda defeats the point of Smash being a celebration of Nintendo's past

Because Final Fantasy's poster child for the PlayStation totally celebrates Nintendo's past, right?

All I'm saying is these "rules" are created by Sakurai and can be broken by him on a whim.

 

[IanTheGamer]

Because Final Fantasy's poster child for the PlayStation totally celebrates Nintendo's past, right?

All I'm saying is these "rules" are created by Sakurai and can be broken by him on a whim.

I don't see Sakurai breaking the video game only rule though

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Which still disqualifies Goku. Besides having manga characters kinda defeats the point of Smash being a celebration of Nintendo's past

Which wasn't even the point I was making. Just that "debuting on a video game system" isn't an official requirement when it comes to Smash. It's just a requirement for 3rd parties on the Forums to have a support thread.

Obviously Goku is impossible(though many really forget the main reason why at this point. It's due to licensing issues moreso. Not everything is pure Nintendo history. He clearly wants history with gaming as well, as shown by both Cloud and Sonic. 3rd parties already prove that it's not just about being a celebration of Nintendo's past).

 

[Arcadenik]

He also said at one point that Animal Crossing was too nonviolent to have a rep.

Things change, after all, and the old "rules" are only as binding as Sakurai wants them to be.

And I am so thankful for Sakurai changing his mind on nonviolent characters.

When two of the first three newcomers for Smash 4 were nonviolent characters, I knew in my heart that my dog would get in Smash eventually.

 

[IanTheGamer]

Which wasn't even the point I was making. Just that "debuting on a video game system" isn't an official requirement when it comes to Smash. It's just a requirement for 3rd parties on the Forums to have a support thread.

Obviously Goku is impossible(though many really forget the main reason why at this point. It's due to licensing issues moreso. Not everything is pure Nintendo history. He clearly wants history with gaming as well, as shown by both Cloud and Sonic. 3rd parties already prove that it's not just about being a celebration of Nintendo's past).

I still do think that Sakurai will never add anime/manga, comic book, movie characters, or real people to Smash ever. I can see your point. And ROB is still closely tied to video games

 

[S_B]

I don't see Sakurai breaking the video game only rule though

I hope he won't, but the man has been so trollishly inconsistent in the past that I put nothing past him.

 

[Pakky]

KING K ROOL OR BUST!

 

[IanTheGamer]

I hope he won't, but the man has been so trollishly inconsistent in the past that I put nothing past him.

That would cause so much backlash, that I think Sakurai won't even think about it

(Besides if the video game only rule was to be broken, it would be for Darth Vader, a much more well known character than Goku)

 

[FunAtParties]

Ok

Based on the outline, Captain Falcon

OK I can see it now. Ty

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I still do think that Sakurai will never add anime/manga, comic book, movie characters, or real people to Smash ever. I can see your point

Right. "Video game only" is not a rule that we know of, but honestly I think it is one he intends to employ for most characters bar special 1st party exceptions like R.O.B., or to make OC variants(Mr. Game & Watch is self-created for Smash based upon the various nameless characters in the appropriate series, and Giga Bowser is pretty much just a remake of Bowser as a demonic variation, but still specific to Smash only. He has his own other OC's that have nothing to do with other characters, besides using some moves from games he created, but that's normal for developers to reuse assets/ideas to help make gameplay work).

 

[IanTheGamer]

Right. "Video game only" is not a rule that we know of, but honestly I think it is one he intends to employ for most characters bar special 1st party exceptions like R.O.B., or to make OC variants(Mr. Game & Watch is self-created for Smash based upon the various nameless characters in the appropriate series, and Giga Bowser is pretty much just a remake of Bowser as a demonic variation, but still specific to Smash only. He has his own other OC's that have nothing to do with other characters, besides using some moves from games he created, but that's normal for developers to reuse assets/ideas to help make gameplay work).

Smash specific characters were specifically creates for a video game, they don't count. But ROB is still relevant to Nintendo history, so he gets a pass as far as "bending" the so called "video game only" rule

 

[christyalmeth]

Are you sure that's not Marth to the right of Samus?

I have Marth next to Mario. I can’t tell who it is next to Samus. Before I thought it was Ike but it’s too small. Then I thought Platuena, but i’m not sure how tall she is considering Samus in the suit is very tall

 

[S_B]

That would cause so much backlash, that I think Sakurai won't even think about it

(Besides if the video game only rule was to be broken, it would be for Darth Vader)

He's never been known to care about backlash (like how he knew tripping would cause backlash), and the only reason I suggest Goku is because Banco is the developer behind the DBZ games.

If they did venture outside of videogame-born characters, I suspect it'd be him.

 

[IanTheGamer]

He's never been known to care about backlash (like how he knew tripping would cause backlash), and the only reason I suggest Goku is because Banco is the developer behind the DBZ games.

If they did venture outside of videogame-born characters, I suspect it'd be him.

But that's extremely doubtful, and he would probably piss off the fanbase to the point where nobody would buy it

Most people don't really know who Goku is. But practically everyone knows who Darth Vader is

 

[SorenT]

Ice climbers, Ice climber, Ice coimbers


Seriously is nobody else seeing this

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Smash specific characters were specifically creates for a video game, they don't count. But ROB is still relevant to Nintendo history, so he gets a pass as far as "bending" the so called "video game only" rule

That's my point. Exceptions exist if they make sense.

It's just unlikely to happen for 3rd parties. But that's more due to licensing anyway. James Bond would be extremely hard to license due to things like being an Actor, possibly dealing with Rareware if it's using assets explicitly from the games, and of course there's the original copyrights and trademark holders of the Goldeneye series. It's a legal nightmare. This is the problem with 3rd parties not originating from video games. They often have multiple people to go through.

The "video game only" rule is something people came up with for ease of mind. But it's not anywhere near official. I still don't think we'll get any Comic Book or Movie characters, mostly for the reason stated above, and it wouldn't surprise me if it's now a rule(it's implied by the way the Ballot told us to only vote for Video Game Characters, but that's still dubious as a claim overall).

 

[IanTheGamer]

That's my point. Exceptions exist if they make sense.

It's just unlikely to happen for 3rd parties. But that's more due to licensing anyway. James Bond would be extremely hard to license due to things like being an Actor, possibly dealing with Rareware if it's using assets explicitly from the games, and of course there's the original copyrights and trademark holders of the Goldeneye series. It's a legal nightmare. This is the problem with 3rd parties not originating from video games. They often have multiple people to go through.

The "video game only" rule is something people came up with for ease of mind. But it's not anywhere near official. I still don't think we'll get any Comic Book or Movie characters, mostly for the reason stated above, and it wouldn't surprise me if it's now a rule(it's implied by the way the Ballot told us to only vote for Video Game Characters, but that's still dubious as a claim overall).

Now there are some of non video game born characters that I think would be cool in Smash (Darth Vader, Iron Man, Undertaker (the wrestler not the one from Black Butler), The Terminator), but the6yare never gonna happen, so I don't even waste my time with them

 

[Pakky]

Wait... Crash?

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

What's the largest realistic size you guys could see the roster getting?

I see it between the 70-75 range.

 

[S_B]

But that's extremely doubtful,

Sakurai has a history of adding things to these games just because we would've found their inclusion "extremely doubtful".

After Cloud, all bets are off. Cloud represents the beginning of one of the darkest periods in Nintendo history, when Square and many other devs jumped ship to sign on with Sony, leaving the N64 devoid of many classic franchises that had been staples of the SNES.

Cloud and FF7 are the REASON the PlayStation took off and went on to trounce Nintendo's consoles for decades after.

We try to say, "But Sakurai would never include ______!" yet history has shown us that accurately predicting Sakurai is like trying to nail jello to a wall.

 

[IanTheGamer]

What's the largest realistic size you guys could see the roster getting?

I see it between the 70-75 range.

65, maybe

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Now there are some of non video game born characters that I think would be cool in Smash (Darth Vader, Iron Man, Undertaker (the wrestler not the one from Black Butler), The Terminator), but the6yare never gonna happen, so I don't even waste my time with them

It's funny, because Raven from Teen Titans is one of my top (secret) requests. Probably the only non video game character I ever wanted in Super Smash Bros.

 

[Arcadenik]

Right. "Video game only" is not a rule that we know of, but honestly I think it is one he intends to employ for most characters bar special 1st party exceptions like R.O.B., or to make OC variants(Mr. Game & Watch is self-created for Smash based upon the various nameless characters in the appropriate series, and Giga Bowser is pretty much just a remake of Bowser as a demonic variation, but still specific to Smash only. He has his own other OC's that have nothing to do with other characters, besides using some moves from games he created, but that's normal for developers to reuse assets/ideas to help make gameplay work).

Captain N for Smash!

 

[IanTheGamer]

It's funny, because Raven from Teen Titans is one of my top (secret) requests.

Heck, I have even seen John Madden suggested, because of the importance of the Madden series, though we know NFL licensing will be a pain

 

[Phaazoid]

This will probably be the Smash Bros. installment where I'm keeping my newcomer thoughts to a mere minimum, especially if (nearly) every fighter from Smash 3DS / Wii U happens to return.

Look I'm a simple man. Homestarrunner for smash or the game just isn't worth buying.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Now there are some of non video game born characters that I think would be cool in Smash (Darth Vader, Iron Man, Undertaker (the wrestler not the one from Black Butler), The Terminator), but the6yare never gonna happen, so I don't even waste my time with them

You really shouldn't speak in absolutes. I don't disagree with the idea they have a near impossible chance of happening, but it doesn't serve any purpose to outright declare things like that.

There's good reason two of them are beyond unlikely(Iron Man is a Comic Book character. Comic Books are basically the equivalent to Manga. Note that Sakurai dismissed Spongebob, a Cartoon character. It implies that Anime, like Cartoons, are not eligible. Undertaker is basically a real person with a persona that might make him undesirable as an option).

Captain N for Smash!

No video game appearances, mang. ...Though I'd love to see him. At least the NES Zapper is a custom equipment, heh.

 

[A Distant Demon]

I'm going to assume the fact that the roster thread was just merged with the alternate costume thread was an error?

(First post of alt thread)
https://smashboards.com/threads/potential-alternative-character-slots-palette-swaps-clones.446443/

(First post of the now merged roster thread)
https://smashboards.com/threads/pot...ette-swaps-clones.446443/page-2#post-21878625

Would normally report, but for all I know this was intentional.

 

[IanTheGamer]

You really shouldn't speak in absolutes. I don't disagree with the idea they have a near impossible chance of happening, but it doesn't serve any purpose to outright declare things like that.

There's good reason two of them are beyond unlikely(Iron Man is a Comic Book character. Comic Books are basically the equivalent to Manga. Note that Sakurai dismissed Spongebob, a Cartoon character. It implies that Anime, like Cartoons, are not eligible. Undertaker is basically a real person with a persona that might make him undesirable as an option).

Yeah maybe not I see what you are saying. But we do have Ganondorf who is basically just as dark as Undertaker though

 

[S_B]

You really shouldn't speak in absolutes. I don't disagree with the idea they have a near impossible chance of happening, but it doesn't serve any purpose to outright declare things like that.

There's good reason two of them are beyond unlikely(Iron Man is a Comic Book character. Comic Books are basically the equivalent to Manga. Note that Sakurai dismissed Spongebob, a Cartoon character. It implies that Anime, like Cartoons, are not eligible. Undertaker is basically a real person with a persona that might make him undesirable as an option).


No video game appearances, mang. ...Though I'd love to see him. At least the NES Zapper is a custom equipment, heh.

The only thing I'd lean toward for guidance is whether or not a character is popular in Japan.

If a character isn't at least mildly popular in Japan, I'd say their chances are nil.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I'm going to assume the fact that the roster thread was just merged with the alternate costume thread was an error?

(First post of alt thread)
https://smashboards.com/threads/potential-alternative-character-slots-palette-swaps-clones.446443/

(First post of the now merged roster thread)
https://smashboards.com/threads/pot...ette-swaps-clones.446443/page-2#post-21878625

Would normally report, but for all I know this was intentional.

I might've input the wrong thread title when merging. I think I'll let an Admin handle this one. Sorry about that. >.<

 

[Inawordyes]

Alright, so Smash trailer with new news at E3 is a given, new Smash-related news in basically any and every Direct from now until release is (or should be) a given. It comes out this year, so we have, at most, 9 months before release.

How long do you think it'll take before we get anything new on the website now that it's updated for SSBSwitch? Will we get info separate from the Directs?

 

[Krysco]

I'm gonna play it relatively safe this time around and only hope Wolf, Carbos-infused Mewtwo and Ice Climbers make it back. Don't have enough confidence in my most wanted newcomers to put much faith into their inclusion.

 

[Spazzy_D]

updated the roster flame picture with who I think is in. No surprise mostly vets besides 2 figures I can’t make out

Could mayeb be Wii Fit to the right of Samus? Same height in game, I believe, and she could be giving the thumbs up. Or a middle finger considering the tone of the trailer, haha. Palutena is my next best guess.

 

[LancerStaff]

I hope he won't, but the man has been so trollishly inconsistent in the past that I put nothing past him.

This I feel is greatly exaggerated by the Smash fanbase.

Simple things have simple answers. Like with Villager... Sakurai is a lot more consistent than people give him credit for. It’s more that people like to make up rules and pretend he follows them. Like how there’s people who were upset at Cloud’s inclusion because he’s not a Nintendo character, yet mourn Snake’s exclusion.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Man I just realized with smash hype coming up, I really need to start breaking through my backlog. I need to at least be done with Zelda, Xenoblade, and Odyssey before I inevitably get spoiled by something or another.

Curse you Sakurai!