Smash 4 Social Thread 3.0

[Naoshi]

He did a great job porting Greninja from Melee tho ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Spoiler

Wasnt there some leftover code for Mewtwo in Brawl? Thats how Project M guys managed to get him in from what I understand. These guys make everything look so easy

They didn't use the left over data from what I've heard. It was very unusable so they ended up making Mewtwo from the ground up.

People who complain about grinding on this game should go and play some hardcore JRPG or whatever. That is where you will find serious grinding.

To each their own, grinding isn't for everyone though. Personally I don't mind as long as I don't constantly get the same custom/outfits/equips constantly.

 

[Kenith]

I made a thing:

Melee's roster if the clones were not created.
Did not know that King Dedede was planned in case the rights to Marth could not be secured, and when they were, he decided to continue finishing the clones (even though he had time to finish Dedede)

Anyone else prefer this roster?
I mean, think about it: We could've gotten this roster of 20 unique characters, with Brawl adding so many new ones (including Ganondorf)

What could have been!

 

[Naoshi]

I honestly wouldn't prefer it. Clones are honestly nice alternative versions of their based characters that may play better in their own ways. Falco is one of my favorite characters and I largely prefer him over Fox. It sucks having one unique character left out, but having 6 additional characters (which half of them are actually really fun) isn't a bad thing.

Plus, the final roster works more in long term. We ended up getting Dedede in Brawl and Smash Bros 4 while keeping some of the Melee clones (Dr. Mario, Falco and Ganondorf) and their successors (Toon Link and Lucina).

EDIT: I guess the only benefit is Ganondorf being unique.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

People who complain about grinding on this game should go and play some hardcore JRPG or whatever. That is where you will find serious grinding.

Porn games too.

Also, Quest 64 has some of the hardest grinding ever. Only HP and Defense can be rasied quickly. Everything else, including normal Level ups for some more spells is a serious pain in the ass. >_<

Also, does anybody have an idea why whenever I write a message, it lags severely on my computer? Like, nearly freezing up every time? I don't know if's just the website design or something else. But this should not be happening(and yes, I'm getting really pissed off at this. It was just as bad yesterday and work was horrible because our Distract Manager was being an extreme asshole to everyone and constantly taking away our workers to do some inane **** while we needed them to get out orders and such. It's like, not while we're busy. Not during the Lunch rush. Seriously. Pick a day that isn't busy as hell, or wait till it's not busy as is. -_-

 

[Knuckles the Knuckles]

The fact that you're having doubts about this being bad design is actually pretty funny.
(Not trying to be rude, it just seems like you're very forgiving of Nintendo)

What can I say, they are my favorite company. Though, I still called it bullcrap so I can recognise them screwing some things up

 

[Kenith]

I honestly wouldn't prefer it. Clones are honestly nice alternative versions of their based characters that may play better in their own ways. Falco is one of my favorite characters and I largely prefer him over Fox. It sucks having one unique character left out, but having 6 additional characters (which half of them are actually really fun) isn't a bad thing.

Plus, the final roster works more in long term. We ended up getting Dedede in Brawl and Smash Bros 4 while keeping some of the Melee clones (Dr. Mario, Falco and Ganondorf) and their successors (Toon Link and Lucina).

EDIT: I guess the only benefit is Ganondorf being unique.

What if...I did this:

Now Ganondorf is unique, and ALSO in Melee (Sheik is gone, Zelda is her own woman)
Is this better or worse than no Dorf?

 

[Naoshi]

Not really, there's still less choices of characters I like.

I honestly don't have an issue with clones as long as they are designed well and make tons of sense.

This sort of works though but half of my mains would cease to exist

 

[TJ-Works]

@ TJ-Works

I don't know what the post says. The first line said "Korra and Toph" and I had to stop reading. Haven't watched LoK yet.

Don't spoil me. >:x

 

[FalKoopa]

I made a thing:

View attachment 27214
Melee's roster if the clones were not created.
Did not know that King Dedede was planned in case the rights to Marth could not be secured, and when they were, he decided to continue finishing the clones (even though he had time to finish Dedede)

Anyone else prefer this roster?
I mean, think about it: We could've gotten this roster of 20 unique characters, with Brawl adding so many new ones (including Ganondorf)

What could have been!

Not at all. I liked all the clones in Melee, excluding Pichu. I'm not going to trade them for Dedede, even though Dedede is one of my favourite characters.

"You know what the say, the more the merrier."

 

[Kenith]

Not really, there's still less choices of characters I like.
I honestly don't have an issue with clones as long as they are designed well and make tons of sense.
This sort of works though but half of my mains would cease to exist

Well, Pichu, Roy, and Young Link will be cut in Brawl anyway, so...
Falco would be exactly the same as Brawl...in Brawl.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Truthfully, the only two clones I would've kept if I had to choose among Melee's current cast is Pichu and Ganondorf. They feel the most unique and fun(and I prefer them to the originals). Dr. Mario is definitely the 3rd. Then Falco. Then Young Link. Then Roy. Keep in mind I like them all, but I suck so much with Roy that I do actually prefer Ike's moveset more. I think Roy looked cooler, though. >_>

 

[Naoshi]

Well, Pichu, Roy, and Young Link will be cut in Brawl anyway, so...
Falco would be exactly the same as Brawl...in Brawl.

But at least I still get the option to play them then none at all. Plus, Dr. Mario made a surprise comeback in SSB4. He wouldn't have existed at all if not for the Melee clones decision.

I see why you would want a scenario, but I'm happy with the scenario we got sans the unfortunate cuts. Your ideas are pretty good even though I disagree with them. (Although... cutting Shiek would kill her only chance in the roster. I say Ganondorf should be saved for Brawl if I were to choose between two of your scenarios.)

 

[Kenith]

I must be a backwards thinker. I believe If this was the roster we were presented with in 2001, there's anyone who would've ever, EVER complained.
You get Bowser, you get Ganondorf, you get Mewtwo, Zelda, Peach...
Who else was requested?
The only other thing I would change is removing Ice Climbers for Little Mac, but that's a bit too hypothetical.

EDIT: OR Pit.

 

[Naoshi]

I must be a backwards thinker. I believe If this was the roster we were presented with in 2001, there's anyone who would've ever, EVER complained.
You get Bowser, you get Ganondorf, you get Mewtwo, Zelda, Peach...
Who else was requested?
The only other thing I would change is removing Ice Climbers for Little Mac, but that's a bit too hypothetical.

Little Mac prob wouldn't been a good idea to take IC's spot. Melee was probably IC's only shot at the roster, if not Brawl. Little Mac came in at the perfect time with his franchise revival on Wii. ...Shame IC is gone now lol Hopefully they'll be back next game.

It's fun imagining these scenarios though, so this is a fun discussion.

 

[FalKoopa]

I must be a backwards thinker. I believe If this was the roster we were presented with in 2001, there's anyone who would've ever, EVER complained.
You get Bowser, you get Ganondorf, you get Mewtwo, Zelda, Peach...
Who else was requested?
The only other thing I would change is removing Ice Climbers for Little Mac, but that's a bit too hypothetical.

There were plenty of complainers about the Melee roster too, from what I've heard. Doc and Pichu were completely unexpected. People were going WTF over G&W, Marth and Roy (Hilariously, people then thought it was Roy Koopa, this came a complete circle. )

 

[Kenith]

There were plenty of complainers about the Melee roster too, from what I've heard. Doc and Pichu were completely unexpected. People were going WTF over G&W, Marth and Roy (Hilariously, people then thought it was Roy Koopa, this came a complete circle. )

No, no, I mean there wouldn't have been as many complaints if THIS was Melee's roster.

 

[Naoshi]

Worst case scenario, people would be disappointed at the insignificant jump in the roster. Going from 12 to 20 wouldn't feel like a big enough jump for a big game. I understand why Sakurai went with the 6 clones. 12 -> 25 is much more significant. So you would have a (different) group of people being disappointed in the roster count being 20. Dunno how loud that complaint would be though.

 

[Kenith]

Of course, if we're considering hypothetical rosters...
I would've made it so most of the characters in Smash 64 shared a few basic moves, to squeeze in one or two extra characters.
Either Meowth or Bowser.

 

[Frostwraith]

I'd say people would have always complained.

Crossover titles always have people complaining.

 

[Naoshi]

Of course, if we're considering hypothetical rosters...
I would've made it so most of the characters in Smash 64 shared a few basic moves, to squeeze in one or two extra characters.
Either Meowth or Bowser.

I don't really want to sacrifice gameplay for 2 more characters. I don't reallly think these changes are enough to give extra dev time for one character alone.

 

[Kenith]

I don't really want to sacrifice gameplay for 2 more characters. I don't reallly think these changes are enough to give extra dev time for one character alone.

Well, if Jiggs was removed, they could've added Meowth, who would've had much more longevity considering how consistently prominent he was in the anime (I don't recall him still being in the anime, if so, he deserves a medal)
That alone would make a huge difference.
Of course then people would complain about him not being important by the time Smash 4 comes around...

@ Frostwraith Wow, you just can't win with this fanbase, even if you go back in time and retroactively give them characters they want, huh?

 

[Deleted member]

even if you go back in time and retroactively give them characters they want, huh?

Nobody actually knows what they want.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Meowth is in most Anime episodes as is Team Rocket. Jigglypuff was written out after the 1st Season, I think. Never appeared past Kanto.

The thing is, Mewtwo was too hard to implement in Smash 64. Meowth would have no less the same issues. Jigglypuff, not counting her popularity alone, was a partial clone of Kirby. We were unlikely to get any other Pokemon that couldn't be a partcial clone of someone else. Luigi was clearly a clone of Mario, but was very prominent so obviously got the spot.

 

[Bedoop]

Well allow me to say.







You look nothing like I imagined you to be.



We need to talk more.

Didn't expect him to have orange hair.


Seriously, no where near close to how I pictured him.

What did you imagine me looking like? :3

 

[FlareHabanero]

People who complain about grinding on this game should go and play some hardcore JRPG or whatever. That is where you will find serious grinding.

Shin Megami Tensai comes to mind. The series is infamous for it's teeth grinding difficulty, with bosses that require a lot of preperation and strategy to beat in particular.

 

[Naoshi]

Well, if Jiggs was removed, they could've added Meowth, who would've had much more longevity considering how consistently prominent he was in the anime (I don't recall him still being in the anime, if so, he deserves a medal)
That alone would make a huge difference.
Of course then people would complain about him not being important by the time Smash 4 comes around...

@ Frostwraith Wow, you just can't win with this fanbase, even if you go back in time and retroactively give them characters they want, huh?

Keep Jiggs

She is a very unique character. I don't care that she stopped being relevant in the anime.

Besides, Pokemon isn't all about the anime. Jigglypuff was a popular Pokemon in Japan. She has earned her spot for popularity and thus earned her stay for being a unique fighter.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

What did you imagine me looking like? :3

IDK honestly.

 

[Bedoop]

IDK honestly.

*insert certain catchphrase you use here*

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

I just bought the Reaper trophy.

It made a "Don't Fear the Reaper" reference.

I want to handshake the guy who wrote these. We need more.

 

[Kenith]

Meowth is in most Anime episodes as is Team Rocket. Jigglypuff was written out after the 1st Season, I think. Never appeared past Kanto.
The thing is, Mewtwo was too hard to implement in Smash 64. Meowth would have no less the same issues. Jigglypuff, not counting her popularity alone, was a partial clone of Kirby. We were unlikely to get any other Pokemon that couldn't be a partcial clone of someone else. Luigi was clearly a clone of Mario, but was very prominent so obviously got the spot.

Meowth could be a partial clone of Mario or something.

Nobody actually knows what they want.

Well, I know what I want, goddammit. I just didn't get it (for the most part).
EDIT: Actually, if we're talking ratios the ratio for wanted+got/wanted+didntgot is pretty good.

EDIT: Sorry, meant to edit the previous post.

 

[Knuckles the Knuckles]

Meowth could be a partial clone of Mario or something.

Meh, looks more to me like a Captain Falcon clone.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Meowth could be a partial clone of Mario or something.

Not with those claws. Only their Up and Nuetral B could be similar at most. Maybe a few kicks. Also, what special moves could it have? Pay Day is obvious, but that's it. Jigglypuff had quite a bit better movepool to choose form. Double Slap. Submission. Pound. Sing. Rest.

I don't think anybody really played close enough to Meowth's movepool, really. He has potential, but not so much as a clone.

 

[Naoshi]

Mario seems like a random choice for Meowth to be a clone from lol

 

[Kenith]

Okay, fine.

But I hold that this would have been the best case scenario for Melee.
I don't know. I just really like the look of it.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Okay, fine.

But I hold that this would have been the best case scenario for Melee.
I don't know. I just really like the look of it.

@Cap'nChreest would not approve.

 

[Kenith]

Diddy Kong should've been in Smash 64.
Meowth could be a clone of him.

 

[Bedoop]

IDK honestly.

>Says he Imagined/Pictured me looking a certain way
>Doesn't know anymore
11/10 It's Decent

 

[Themandme]

Here is my 64 roster

 

[Digital Hazard]

I made a thing:

View attachment 27214
Melee's roster if the clones were not created.
Did not know that King Dedede was planned in case the rights to Marth could not be secured, and when they were, he decided to continue finishing the clones (even though he had time to finish Dedede)

Anyone else prefer this roster?
I mean, think about it: We could've gotten this roster of 20 unique characters, with Brawl adding so many new ones (including Ganondorf)

What could have been!

As much as Dedede inclusion in Melee would've been awesome, I actually like the Melee clones.

... Yes, people, that includes Pichu as my personal punchbag.

 

[allison]

Finally started watching Legend of Korra. I feel silly for not doing so before, given how much I liked Avatar: The Last Airbender.

Yes, they can, but they're VERY durable. I would suggest rolling constantly to avoid it if you're going to fight it.

Now I'm wondering if they're weak to freezing!