Smash 4 Advanced Technique: Pivot Cancelling/Turndashing(A New Movement Technique!)

[Bladeviper]

Has the pivot cancel been shown to be used in the direction the player is running? I'm not sure if it has, and it would likely be a much more effective technique if so.

Also, has it been shown in any of the ComicCon gameplay? The demo is supposed to be more recent there, and if it's still in there it would have better chances to be an intentional addition.

its the same demo as e3 so its still there

 

[D-idara]

Um, it pretty much directly implies that whatever the default will be, it isn't stock. Considering time has been historically the default setting, it's pretty easy to assume what it will be.

You can bet I will quote ya because I'm a vengeful fothermucker and it's actually the most logical assertion that it will be time, along with the fact it was inferred.

For stated reasons, time is easily the most logical due to inclusion techniques being used to benefit random, quick matches.

Or not? How do you know For Glory doesn't have two settings? 4vs4 and 1vs1? Nintendo certainly knows that 1vs1 works much better with stocks, and Sakurai certainly knows that too...

 

[Leonyx]

its the same demo as e3 so its still there

Oh, I thought the demos were different since they had different loading times. My mistake. Do you happen to know about the directions pivot cancelling can happen in though?

 

[Bladeviper]

Oh, I thought the demos were different since they had different loading times. My mistake. Do you happen to know about the directions pivot cancelling can happen in though?

no since i have not been able to play the demo myself

 

[.Shìkì]

Invitational at E3 was Stocks + timelimit... so there could be that.

BTT : Sure looks like a nice little trick, and it really does seem to be intentional with the usage in some trailers, so let's see what the finished product might hold for surprises.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

Mostly, that particular advanced technique looks really good for characters like Sonic. His dash is so fast he could probably use that technique to continue combos. I'm not sure about the launch angle of his dash attack (and of course this would be DI-dependent in any case), but I'm imagining something like:
Jab x3 > Dash Attack > dash > pivot-cancel UTilt > dash to reposition > aerial stuff

 

[κomıc]

This made me laugh so hard XD

Also shout out to @ κomıc for that Soraka avatar

With love <3

 

[pizzapie7]

So where does it say that because For Glory mode uses only FD-esque stages that all tournaments moving forward will be forced to play on only FD? I seemed to have missed that part in the direct.

I'm merely saying why people would be disappointed with For Glory, it could easily be a lot more than it actually is. What does that have to do with tournaments or anything else?

 

[LancerStaff]

FD + Battlefield = Best thing they could've done

No, people would be complaining because Smashville isn't there. Or Yoshi's Island. Or Pilotwings. The only reason why people are objecting to FD only is because it wasn't the most neutral stage in the past, but it likely will now with the changes. And it's much easier to balance around one stage instead of balanceing around a make-believe ruleset that varies from person to person.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Anyway, I saw the pivot cancel today in the quarter finals of the stream, being used by Samus in an FFA on Gerudo Valley (who I suspect was HugS). It was pretty dope.

 

[Canuckduck]

No, people would be complaining because Smashville isn't there. Or Yoshi's Island. Or Pilotwings. The only reason why people are objecting to FD only is because it wasn't the most neutral stage in the past, but it likely will now with the changes. And it's much easier to balance around one stage instead of balanceing around a make-believe ruleset that varies from person to person.

In Smashville, there are moving platforms. I think of Final Destination and Battlefield as the "bread and butter" stages in Super Smash Bros.

 

[TheTTimeLives]

Does anyone know if you can do jabs and tilts in the same direction you ran in for the turnabout cancel? I don't see this being something that will speed ga,splay entirely otherwise.

 

[Letterbomb]

What exactly is so advanced about this, by the way? Turning and tilting/smashing seems like an inherent mechanic of the game. And uh... isn't this the exact same thing as the pivot we've had in past iterations?

 

[Bladeviper]

What exactly is so advanced about this, by the way? Turning and tilting/smashing seems like an inherent mechanic of the game. And uh... isn't this the exact same thing as the pivot we've had in past iterations?

you seem to keep some momentum this time around after you cancel a dash with a pivot is why

 

[Lozjam]

What exactly is so advanced about this, by the way? Turning and tilting/smashing seems like an inherent mechanic of the game. And uh... isn't this the exact same thing as the pivot we've had in past iterations?

You keep your momentum after you pivot, so you can be moving, and doing a smash/tilt at the same time.

 

[HeavyLobster]

Very interesting. One of the reasons why aerial approaches have traditionally been preferred to ground ones has been the ability to move freely in the air, and to adjust your spacing in order to ensure your attacks are safe on shield. Being able to attack on the ground while sliding makes it easier to avoid punishment on block, and a basic turnaround cancel will be useful as a spacing tool, especially against the running shield approach that's been effective in the Invitational and SDCC tournaments. Diddy Kong and other item spawners will use these pivots as the new Glide Tossing, hopefully keeping strategic item usage as an element from Brawl. Unfortunately, it seems to be restricted to either running back and performing a pivot cancel to attack while sliding backward, or running up and performing a double pivot to attack while sliding forward. It seems highly useful as a defensive/zoning tool, a way to follow up certain kinds of combos, and a way to utilize items in a manner similar to Glide Tossing, but it seems kind of limited as a tool for approaching. The one lingering concern I have about Smash 4 is whether there will be adequate shield-safe approach options, and I don't think this will solve this issue, even though it seems to hold a lot of potential in terms of adding to the game in other ways.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

Shield-safe approach options? How about the fairly significant variety of auto-cancel/lagless aerials that you can just buffer into a grab? That seems shield-safe to me.

 

[Xiaphas]

It seems like Sakurai is really trying to provide non-glitchy techniques that mimic the functionality of wave-dashing. This change as well as the new mechanic for dashing off of edges seem like they were done deliberately to fill the voids of wavedashing.

It seems like these aren't going to completely provide the same mobility we got with wave-dashing, but at least it's a step in the right direction. Sm4sh is not going to be the new melee, but as long as it feels good and is fun to watch it should still be "competitive." Chess and Pokemon are both competitive, and both do fine without difficult to execute button combinations.

 

[LancerStaff]

It seems like Sakurai is really trying to provide non-glitchy techniques that mimic the functionality of wave-dashing. This change as well as the new mechanic for dashing off of edges seem like they were done deliberately to fill the voids of wavedashing.

It seems like these aren't going to completely provide the same mobility we got with wave-dashing, but at least it's a step in the right direction. Sm4sh is not going to be the new melee, but as long as it feels good and is fun to watch it should still be "competitive." Chess and Pokemon are both competitive, and both do fine without difficult to execute button combinations.

Just a note: Sakurai's solution to platform canceling was to remove platforms. So basically everything Wavedashing could do was replicated in SSB4, albit slower. Small price to pay for accessibility I guess.

 

[Xiaphas]

Just a note: Sakurai's solution to platform canceling was to remove platforms. So basically everything Wavedashing could do was replicated in SSB4, albit slower. Small price to pay for accessibility I guess.

Admiral Akbar is telling me this is a trap.

 

[Phantom High]

Looks like I got to learn how to dash dance more effectively.
This will be fun.

 

[LancerStaff]

Admiral Akbar is telling me this is a trap.

No no, I'm agreeing with you. I just wanted to point out that Sakurai solved the platform canceling problem by removing platforms.

 

[Pazzo.]

If I'm correct, the ground game in SSB4 will be king, with air approaches reserved for combos and edgeguarding..

Very interesting.

 

[Xiaphas]

From what I've seen of the VG Bootcamp moveset videos, it seems like there are going to be some very viable aerials with minimal lag (Mario's come to mind).

 

[MudkipUniverse]

Reminds me of the wavedash, except Luigi is having a bad day

 

[MrPhox]

http://smashboards.com/threads/pivot-tilt-attacks-new-game-mechanic.367974/#post-17571901

 

[.Shìkì]

Does anyone know if it is possible to , then and grab? So, pivot grab in the direction you were initially facing? It would help a great deal with Robins grab range.

 

[Lozjam]

Does anyone know if it is possible to , then and grab? So, pivot grab in the direction you were initially facing? It would help a great deal with Robins grab range.

No it isnt. But pivot grabs still give him a ton of range.

 

[.Shìkì]

No it isnt. But pivot grabs still give him a ton of range.

Doh, yeah ik pivotgrabs help, my problem is that its nigh impossible to dash through people because currently as soon as you dash at someone they expect a dash attack and dodge/jump/attack X)

 

[Lozjam]

Doh, yeah ik pivotgrabs help, my problem is that its nigh impossible to dash through people because currently as soon as you dash at someone they expect a dash attack and dodge/jump/attack X)

It's really great with mindgames. You just got to mindgame them really well