Smash 4 Advanced Technique: Pivot Cancelling/Turndashing(A New Movement Technique!)

[JamietheAuraUser]

I'm incredibly optimistic over Smash 4 but even then my gut still tells me that it's all a bit superficial..."for show" if you will.

We know Nintendo of America works on the game, or at least works on game balance and translation. The Treehouse team confirmed this at E3. So I'm sure that the feedback will be given some consideration, if only for them to check and see if they've already made these changes on the latest builds. I'm not overly worried even if the game continues to look similar to how it did at E3, however. After all, I've seen multiple characters have aerial attacks with easy auto-cancel windows, including Fox (FAir, DAir, UAir from short hop; also NAir has very little landing lag), Bowser (FAir, maybe BAir?), Samus (NAir, BAir, ZAir; also DAir has very little landing lag), Sonic (FAir), and Link (FAir, ZAir). And many aerial attacks that have crazy landing lag still have very little endlag, such as Marth's NAir that appears to be easily usable on the rise of a short hop. NAir > midair jump > tippered FAir looks to be a beautiful, if short, combo with pretty cool kill power. (That said, we then saw Lucina footage where NAir had more Melee- or Brawl-like endlag, but had very little landing lag.) And given that I'm primarily a Brawl player, all of this is just beautiful compared to Brawl. (As much as I do in fact love that game. Especially once codes are in place to make that stupid gimmick known as "random tripping" disappear.)

Overall, this game looks different than its predecessors, but I am by no means opposed to this. Even Marth doesn't look "nerfed" to me. Only "rebalanced".

 

[Canuckduck]

Wow, a new technique that might impress the hardcore Melee players! :,)


I believe the morning sun
Always gonna shine again and...
I believe a pot of gold
Waits at every rainbow's end, oh
I believe in roses kissed with dew,
Why shouldn't I believe the same in you?

I believe in make believe,Fairy tales and lucky charms and,
I believe in promises,
Spoken as you cross your heart, oh,
I believe in skies forever blue,
Why shouldn't I believe the same in you?

You may say I'm a fool,
Feelin' the way that I do..
You can call me Pollyanna,
Say I'm crazy as a loon,
I believe in silver linings
And that's why I believe in you

 

[Bladeviper]

We know Nintendo of America works on the game, or at least works on game balance and translation. The Treehouse team confirmed this at E3. So I'm sure that the feedback will be given some consideration, if only for them to check and see if they've already made these changes on the latest builds. I'm not overly worried even if the game continues to look similar to how it did at E3, however. After all, I've seen multiple characters have aerial attacks with easy auto-cancel windows, including Fox (FAir, DAir, UAir from short hop; also NAir has very little landing lag), Bowser (FAir, maybe BAir?), Samus (NAir, BAir, ZAir; also DAir has very little landing lag), Sonic (FAir), and Link (FAir, ZAir). And many aerial attacks that have crazy landing lag still have very little endlag, such as Marth's NAir that appears to be easily usable on the rise of a short hop. NAir > midair jump > tippered FAir looks to be a beautiful, if short, combo with pretty cool kill power. (That said, we then saw Lucina footage where NAir had more Melee- or Brawl-like endlag, but had very little landing lag.) And given that I'm primarily a Brawl player, all of this is just beautiful compared to Brawl. (As much as I do in fact love that game. Especially once codes are in place to make that stupid gimmick known as "random tripping" disappear.)

Overall, this game looks different than its predecessors, but I am by no means opposed to this. Even Marth doesn't look "nerfed" to me. Only "rebalanced".

this, he seems much more ground based this time around which is a feeling i get with more characters than the last installments.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

Honestly, when I look at Smash 4 Marth from the moveset vids, I see a lot of ground-to-ground potential and a lot of ground-to-air potential. Also, it seems to me that a focus on technical skill, evasion, and raw damage output makes sense for Marth. After all, male Lord characters in Fire Emblem games tend to focus on Strength and Skill over other stats, with only middling Speed. (See: Eliwood, Chrom.) That said, I've not played any of the games Marth is in as a main character, though I've heard Luck is one of his better stats as well, which would explain a focus on evasion.

 

[JV5Chris]

Complaining about games you haven't played, eh?

People tend to do that. Especially about design decisions they don't like.

Platforms in the "For Glory" mode is a perfectly valid request, not some attack on Smash 4 that warrants these responses.

 

[Bladeviper]

Platforms in the "For Glory" mode is a perfectly valid request, not some attack on Smash 4 that warrants these responses.

it is valid sure but imo fd only on for glory is not a huge deal. I would wager that there are plenty of people on here or reddit or other forums that would jump into a game if you asked so not having platform stages for one mode with randoms shouldnt take away anything

 

[Lozjam]

@Skull_Kid
I think if the creator wants it to be turn cancel... Then it can be it..... But I am not fond of that name and I think if someone was trying to commentate a match it would be a lot harder to say turn cancel then pivot cancel...

 

[LancerStaff]

Platforms in the "For Glory" mode is a perfectly valid request, not some attack on Smash 4 that warrants these responses.

Didn't I just explain how FD only was the best thing they could of done?

 

[Shiliski]

So a topic on a new AT has turned into a topic on whether or not "FD only, no items" was a good choice in For Glory mode. In my opinion it's not our job to take For Glory mode seriously, it's Sakurai's job to create something that we can take seriously. I see it as a good way to train against players who want to play "for real" but it's never going to be a replacement for EVO. Not in a million years.

Back onto the topic: Personally, I enjoy the term "Turn Cancel" more than "Pivot Cancel", since I was under the impression that Pivot Cancelling was already a different thing? Though to be fair they're pretty similar, as far as I can tell.

 

[Canuckduck]

Didn't I just explain how FD only was the best thing they could of done?

FD + Battlefield = Best thing they could've done

 

[TeaTwoTime]

FD + Battlefield = Best thing they could've done

This is true.
But they also could have done nothing, so I'll take what we have and am happy for it.

I think I like Turn Cancel more than Pivot Cancel.

 

[Rich Homie Quan]

Honestly, when I look at Smash 4 Marth from the moveset vids, I see a lot of ground-to-ground potential and a lot of ground-to-air potential. Also, it seems to me that a focus on technical skill, evasion, and raw damage output makes sense for Marth. After all, male Lord characters in Fire Emblem games tend to focus on Strength and Skill over other stats, with only middling Speed. (See: Eliwood, Chrom.) That said, I've not played any of the games Marth is in as a main character, though I've heard Luck is one of his better stats as well, which would explain a focus on evasion.

Ultimately, he's usually a very potent combo of speed, strength, and accuracy with a pretty good luck stat and really only lacking in defense.

I think Melee Marth best represents those characteristics tbh.

Marth in this game seems to be more focused on looking smooth instead of actually being smooth.

 

[Shiliski]

A lot of people here are failing to grasp the fundamentals of this situation. For Glory mode is not an emulation of the hyper-competitive tournament scene, and it shouldn't be.

The thing with For Glory mode is that you have to consider that works in a 1v1 in-person single elimination tournament isn't necessarily good game design for online.

Having "player elimination" (see: stocks) is great if you don't mind watching your friends play after you lose, but many players find it boring to watch three complete strangers for several minutes while they wait for it to be their turn to actually play again. This means that player elimination is bad for online play, so you want Time. It's not what the tournament scene wants, but it's good game design for 99% of the people who will be playing For Glory mode.

No one cares about player elimination in a 1v1 because as soon as one player is eliminated, the match is over. The exact moment when it would become a problem is the exact moment that it becomes completely irrelevant. In four-player FFA play (what I imagine online Smash to be) it's a completely different story. In that kind of situation, a developer who has to choose between "Stock", "Time", and "Coin Battle" is a fool if he chooses anything other than "Time". Sorry to the competitive players who want something more interesting, but Nintendo knows better than to give people what they say they want over what they really want.

What's more: Stage picking. Do you really want to implement the tournament-style stage-picking in online? There's always going to be some d-bag who doesn't want to pick and instead wants to just stall out the game for as long as he can, in the hopes that other players will drop out and he gets a free win on his record. Sure, you could put a timer on it, but still you could end up spending 2-3 rushed minutes taking turns striking out stages for a simple 5 minute match. Not to mention the effort that would go into testing every stage for competitive play. It's far faster and simpler to just say "FD Only".

It would be nice if there was some kind of online tournament mode where TOs could have options like "1v1" or "Doubles", "Stage Bans", Various character and stage counterpicking options, possibly even character bans, so on and so forth... They have something similar for MK8, so it would be a real shame to not include it for Smash, but that's not really the default online multiplayer mode. From the way things look now, I imagine that the default in "For Glory" is going to be something like "4 player FFA, no items, FD only, 5 minute Time" with a lobby that lets you beat up Sandbag, and if that's the case then it's a completely different thing than what most competitive players here really want.

I think your only real hope in this case is some kind of "online tournament" mode like what Mario Kart 8 has.

tl;dr: Online matchmaking is a completely different beast than the tournament scene. Matchmaking has to be constructed in such a way that it entertains the players, while tournaments need to be built in a way that determines which player is better at the game. These require vastly different mindsets and so they result in vastly different choices.

 

[Senario]

A lot of people here are failing to grasp the fundamentals of this situation. For Glory mode is not an emulation of the hyper-competitive tournament scene, and it shouldn't be.

The thing with For Glory mode is that you have to consider that works in a 1v1 in-person single elimination tournament isn't necessarily good game design for online.

Having "player elimination" (see: stocks) is great if you don't mind watching your friends play after you lose, but many players find it boring to watch three complete strangers for several minutes while they wait for it to be their turn to actually play again. This means that player elimination is bad for online play, so you want Time. It's not what the tournament scene wants, but it's good game design for 99% of the people who will be playing For Glory mode.

No one cares about player elimination in a 1v1 because as soon as one player is eliminated, the match is over. The exact moment when it would become a problem is the exact moment that it becomes completely irrelevant. In four-player FFA play (what I imagine online Smash to be) it's a completely different story. In that kind of situation, a developer who has to choose between "Stock", "Time", and "Coin Battle" is a fool if he chooses anything other than "Time". Sorry to the competitive players who want something more interesting, but Nintendo knows better than to give people what they say they want over what they really want.

What's more: Stage picking. Do you really want to implement the tournament-style stage-picking in online? There's always going to be some d-bag who doesn't want to pick and instead wants to just stall out the game for as long as he can, in the hopes that other players will drop out and he gets a free win on his record. Sure, you could put a timer on it, but still you could end up spending 2-3 rushed minutes taking turns striking out stages for a simple 5 minute match. Not to mention the effort that would go into testing every stage for competitive play. It's far faster and simpler to just say "FD Only".

It would be nice if there was some kind of online tournament mode where TOs could have options like "1v1" or "Doubles", "Stage Bans", Various character and stage counterpicking options, possibly even character bans, so on and so forth... They have something similar for MK8, so it would be a real shame to not include it for Smash, but that's not really the default online multiplayer mode. From the way things look now, I imagine that the default in "For Glory" is going to be something like "4 player FFA, no items, FD only, 5 minute Time" with a lobby that lets you beat up Sandbag, and if that's the case then it's a completely different thing than what most competitive players here really want.

I think your only real hope in this case is some kind of "online tournament" mode like what Mario Kart 8 has.

tl;dr: Online matchmaking is a completely different beast than the tournament scene. Matchmaking has to be constructed in such a way that it entertains the players, while tournaments need to be built in a way that determines which player is better at the game. These require vastly different mindsets and so they result in vastly different choices.

So basically what you are saying is...For glory mode isn't a grab at the competitive scene and Sakurai is just the same as ever and doesn't want to support our play. Thanks. I'm so glad that we can't even have a place in a mode that honestly should be closer designed around competitive play.

Nobody gets bored in draft pick in league of legends waiting for somebody to dodge or going through champion bans and that can take upwards of 5 minutes depending on how many people dodge. I don't think it is good game design to design two modes that are supposed to be different and make them exactly the same but one being 1v1. With one being "for fun" and another being "for (fake) glory". It is like if you made normals and ranked in league of legends one queue and said "oh ranked was never meant for competitive play! we want everybody to have fun for good game design so we put everybody together!"

Good game design tries to include as many players as possible into the game's audience, it tries to strike a balance between the regular players who often are more numerous and the extremely passionate who have good ideas and are important to keeping the game alive in the long run.

I will say for glory misses the mark currently as a competitive mode, but that is the fault of Sakurai not doing his homework. Nintendo did it.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

So basically what you are saying is...For glory mode isn't a grab at the competitive scene and Sakurai is just the same as ever and doesn't want to support our play. Thanks. I'm so glad that we can't even have a place in a mode that honestly should be closer designed around competitive play.

Nobody gets bored in draft pick in league of legends waiting for somebody to dodge or going through champion bans and that can take upwards of 5 minutes depending on how many people dodge. I don't think it is good game design to design two modes that are supposed to be different and make them exactly the same but one being 1v1. With one being "for fun" and another being "for (fake) glory". It is like if you made normals and ranked in league of legends one queue and said "oh ranked was never meant for competitive play! we want everybody to have fun for good game design so we put everybody together!"

Good game design tries to include as many players as possible into the game's audience, it tries to strike a balance between the regular players who often are more numerous and the extremely passionate who have good ideas and are important to keeping the game alive in the long run.

I will say for glory misses the mark currently as a competitive mode, but that is the fault of Sakurai not doing his homework. Nintendo did it.

Seriously, get over it.

We got what we got, and it will do just fine for it's intended purpose.

 

[Senario]

Seriously, get over it.

We got what we got, and it will do just fine for it's intended purpose.

You should get over telling people what to do. Seems like you want to think your opinion should be shared by everybody. I seriously don't see why you even needed to respond to me as I wasn't even a dressing you.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

You should get over telling people what to do. Seems like you want to think your opinion should be shared by everybody. I seriously don't see why you even needed to respond to me as I wasn't even a dressing you.

Because it's whining, and whining benefits nobody.

 

[ferioku]

To be honest, the constant whining is getting quite annoying, all I've been hearing is Brawl 2.0 or the next smash brothers a failure and it's getting freaking annoying seeing the same BS every day! How many times do people need to say the same thing everyday to get their points out, it's not like Sakurai is reading through our complaints through smash boards anyway,

 

[TeaTwoTime]

Hasn't For Glory confirmed to be 1v1 without items on FD (or FD variants)? I thought I'd read that somewhere.

 

[Metal B]

Hasn't For Glory confirmed to be 1v1 without items on FD (or FD variants)? I thought I'd read that somewhere.

It will always be without items and on Final Destination variants. One-vs-One is an option, you properly (only speculation) also can play Free-for-Alls and Team-Battles (i guess you can play local with a friend against other teams like in Mario Kart 8).

 

[Deleted member 245254]

It will always be without items and on Final Destination variants. One-vs-One is an option, you properly (only speculation) also can play Free-for-Alls and Team-Battles (i guess you can play local with a friend against other teams like in Mario Kart 8).

Really curious on if friendly fire will be activated or not, but I'm actually really excited for 2v2.

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

Yep the For Glory mode as it is now is really great. I really hope people do not want to go through a 2-3 minute ban stage and then only play a 3-5 minute match. And then there'd be complaints of "Sakurai, this stage should be a counterpick, Sakurai why is this stage a neutral? Sakurai why didn't you do your homework? Sakurai why can't you make a map pool that everyone agrees with and won't ever complain with? Sakurai why don't you just make it a Bo3 so we can spend more time playing instead of banning stages? Sakurai why did you make it a Bo3 I just want a quick Bo1 match with someone and then be able to play someone new."

If you're such a competitive player who can't stand only playing on FD, then why don't you just play with friends and pick the stages you want to and practice.

For Glory is just for a quick matchmaking online that will be very very convenient and fun. Waiting a few minutes for the bus to come? Time for a match! Waiting for class to start? Let's play a couple games! You get some ranking too which will show generally how good you are relative to everyone else. Yea the only stage is FD but really your skill will still be around the same place.

If you want a tournament experience, go host or find a tournament and play an online one. If you want an inperson tournament, go to an inperson tournament. For Glory is an online matchmaking system that Smash has never gotten and this is one of the best things about SSB4 that will really help players find ways to play games and improve against similarly skilled opponents.

 

[D-idara]

A lot of people here are failing to grasp the fundamentals of this situation. For Glory mode is not an emulation of the hyper-competitive tournament scene, and it shouldn't be.

The thing with For Glory mode is that you have to consider that works in a 1v1 in-person single elimination tournament isn't necessarily good game design for online.

Having "player elimination" (see: stocks) is great if you don't mind watching your friends play after you lose, but many players find it boring to watch three complete strangers for several minutes while they wait for it to be their turn to actually play again. This means that player elimination is bad for online play, so you want Time. It's not what the tournament scene wants, but it's good game design for 99% of the people who will be playing For Glory mode.

No one cares about player elimination in a 1v1 because as soon as one player is eliminated, the match is over. The exact moment when it would become a problem is the exact moment that it becomes completely irrelevant. In four-player FFA play (what I imagine online Smash to be) it's a completely different story. In that kind of situation, a developer who has to choose between "Stock", "Time", and "Coin Battle" is a fool if he chooses anything other than "Time". Sorry to the competitive players who want something more interesting, but Nintendo knows better than to give people what they say they want over what they really want.

What's more: Stage picking. Do you really want to implement the tournament-style stage-picking in online? There's always going to be some d-bag who doesn't want to pick and instead wants to just stall out the game for as long as he can, in the hopes that other players will drop out and he gets a free win on his record. Sure, you could put a timer on it, but still you could end up spending 2-3 rushed minutes taking turns striking out stages for a simple 5 minute match. Not to mention the effort that would go into testing every stage for competitive play. It's far faster and simpler to just say "FD Only".

It would be nice if there was some kind of online tournament mode where TOs could have options like "1v1" or "Doubles", "Stage Bans", Various character and stage counterpicking options, possibly even character bans, so on and so forth... They have something similar for MK8, so it would be a real shame to not include it for Smash, but that's not really the default online multiplayer mode. From the way things look now, I imagine that the default in "For Glory" is going to be something like "4 player FFA, no items, FD only, 5 minute Time" with a lobby that lets you beat up Sandbag, and if that's the case then it's a completely different thing than what most competitive players here really want.

I think your only real hope in this case is some kind of "online tournament" mode like what Mario Kart 8 has.

tl;dr: Online matchmaking is a completely different beast than the tournament scene. Matchmaking has to be constructed in such a way that it entertains the players, while tournaments need to be built in a way that determines which player is better at the game. These require vastly different mindsets and so they result in vastly different choices.

Sakurai already said 1vs1 will be another For Glory option. And it's probably gonna be stocks.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Sakurai already said 1vs1 will be another For Glory option. And it's probably gonna be stocks.

unfortunately he pretty much outright stated that for glory will be using time :/

 

[JV5Chris]

Didn't I just explain how FD only was the best thing they could of done?

You're free to your opinions, but I would say the audience this mode targets would largely prefer some platforms over none. Projectiles are far from the only reason why. Platforms create room, allow for different options with recovery, add variety to the gameplay, and help balance out the cast. If they're struggling to re-balance a stage for the mode, I could understand FDing it, but that treatment on every stage is not necessary. It would be a stronger mode if stages were not restricted to the vanilla FD mandate.

 

[Beats]

You're free to your opinions, but I would say the audience this mode targets would largely prefer some platforms over none. Projectiles are far from the only reason why. Platforms create room, allow for different options with recovery, add variety to the gameplay, and help balance out the cast. If they're struggling to re-balance a stage for the mode, I could understand FDing it, but that treatment on every stage is not necessary. It would be a stronger mode if stages were not restricted to the vanilla FD mandate.

I'm not sure where the notion of FD being projectile campy came from or why it's so widespread. Honestly when I think of projectile camping stages I think Pokemon Stadium and Dreamland. To me, thinking of FD just reminds me of chain grabs, and basically any combos that aren't as easily interrupted by teching on platforms.

Details aside, I agree that having more stage options is a good thing. I love me my platforms. However, having FD only on For Glory does not bother me because I wouldn't trust For Glory matchmaking anyway. To me it just seems like a mode for the more casual side that wants a no item rule set. Whether or not there are other stages aside from FD, For Glory wouldn't be the ideal way to play competitive matches. The best way is to do it the way we always do, and find people to play via online smash communities. And for the few occasions where you have nobody else to play and go to For Glory, at least it's a good enough environment to practice tech skill and mind games on a variety of people.

 

[PingPongCop]

Oh god.

Lady Palutena, reflect that ****!

This made me laugh so hard XD

Also shout out to @Mang@Tortle for that Soraka avatar

 

[JV5Chris]

@ Beats

All good points, but think about how convenient it would be if "For Glory" was just a bit more accommodating, Don't know about you, but I'm not always in the mood to open up a browser, hunt for someone looking to play a match, and gamble on if they show or stick around for long. It's also frustrating to deal with friend list limits and waiting for peak hours. Having the option to quickly jump into a random, no-items, match without the platform element to Smash Bros missing would be greatly appreciated. This is all assuming online-play is better btw.

 

[Bladeviper]

@ Beats

All good points, but think about how convenient it would be if "For Glory" was just a bit more accommodating, Don't know about you, but I'm not always in the mood to open up a browser, hunt for someone looking to play a match, and gamble on if they show or stick around for long. It's also frustrating to deal with friend list limits and waiting for peak hours. Having the option to quickly jump into a random, no-items, match without the platform element to Smash Bros missing would be greatly appreciated. This is all assuming online-play is better btw.

it should be better, the netcode for the wii u in general seems to be a lot better then the wii's so there is that at least

 

[Shiliski]

Sakurai already said 1vs1 will be another For Glory option. And it's probably gonna be stocks.

If that's the case I can take some of what I said back, because there's no reason not to have stocks if it's really 1v1. Too bad it seems like Sakurai's going to use time anyways.

Still, I doubt we're going to get the kind of finely-tuned stage-picking process in For Glory that we would easily get in a tournament, even if stocks were somehow an option.

I know people wanted something better, but I just don't see Nintendo giving us that. Not when I see it from a game design point of view.

Also, regarding League of Legends, that game actually has exactly what I'm talking about. First off, yes there's a long pregame in draft/ranked mode. The difference is that LoL is on average a 20-60 minute game, so you can afford spending 2-3 minutes banning characters, then whining over lanes, and then instalocking mid anyways because "I get to pick first so deal with it, noobs". Nintendo would probably cut out the chat functions like they usually do, but if we lived in some bizzare reverse-universe where they didn't you could expect to see as much whining in the Smash lobby as you do in LoL games.

People in LoL complain all the time over that wait, too. They'll accept it for the most part out of necessity, but if someone leaves they get mad about that, and if someone says they're going to dodge there's a loud torrent of "THEN DODGE ALREADY AND QUIT WASTING OUR TIME!" You also see this mentality when a game goes slightly bad and you lose a single teamfight, and one of the guys on your team starts shouting, "SURRENDER SO WE CAN MOVE ON TO THE NEXT GAME. STOP WASTING OUR TIME ON THIS !@#$@# MATCH."

There are plenty of impatient people online. LoL is no exception. In my experience, Ranked LoL has less of this kind of attitude than Normals LoL, but it's not absent.

 

[Leonyx]

To be perfectly honest, I would think that a banning system for stages would be pretty simple to implement. Certainly it increases the amount of time it takes to start a match, but it should only add a minute or so.

The way I picture it, each player would have two or three bans (I forget at the moment how many are in tournaments, but I think this is in the ballpark) and would alternate ban picks for stages. There would also be a timer for maybe 10-15 seconds for each pick; if someone does not pick in that time they lose that ban. Then the game could just pick randomly from the stages left. If there was some kind of rematch system, the loser could pick the stage after bans.

That being said, I think Sakurai implemented it this way because 1. the Japanese scene uses Final Destination solely and he wanted to follow that model, 2. it's extremely simple for a player with a feel for the competitive scene to jump in to a match, and 3. hardcore (keyword here meaning "regularly competes in tournaments") competitive players won't really use this mode at all since they likely have access to people they can play against offline and can adjust the rules more to how tourney matches work. It's also worth noting that by making this mode the way it is, Sakurai has sort of avoided influencing how matches will be played in tournaments, since it's clear by reactions that competitive players feel that more stages should be available to pick and won't follow the For Glory model especially if it's strictly a time match.

My apologies if these points had been brought up earlier in the thread; I was following this thread up until the point where the topic got derailed and had skimmed from then on. I suppose this thought isn't really helping us get back on topic but I felt I had some input that wasn't considered yet.

 

[JV5Chris]

It would be great if players local stage lists factored into the matchmaking by some percent. Seems like the sort of thing that would make everyone's experience better.

 

[Colino]

That said, I've not played any of the games Marth is in as a main character, though I've heard Luck is one of his better stats as well, which would explain a focus on evasion.

Marth is relatively weak in his own games compared to the other Lords you mentioned, but that's mostly due to the games themselves. He kind of bucks the trend as far as stat distribution goes. Luck is one of the better stats of all Lords (and characters with a noble background. It's kind of a play on the fact that they were fortunate to be born with noble blood).

it should be better, the netcode for the wii u in general seems to be a lot better then the wii's so there is that at least

I'm very hopeful for the netcode: MK8's is really great. That being said I have never truly enjoyed playing online fighting games and this will most certainly not be an exception.

 

[Bladeviper]

Marth is relatively weak in his own games compared to the other Lords you mentioned, but that's mostly due to the games themselves. He kind of bucks the trend as far as stat distribution goes. Luck is one of the better stats of all Lords (and characters with a noble background. It's kind of a play on the fact that they were fortunate to be born with noble blood).



I'm very hopeful for the netcode: MK8's is really great. That being said I have never truly enjoyed playing online fighting games and this will most certainly not be an exception.

true i think fighting games suffer more in general than others but i really enjoyed persona 4's online, give me something close to that and it should be fine i think

 

[Second Power]

unfortunately he pretty much outright stated that for glory will be using time :/

Where.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Where.

April direct.

He follows up his bit on For Glory mode talking about how you can have friend matches allowing you to set the rules to your liking, "like stock battle".

Not sure why he would mention that specifically if For Glory was by default, a stock battle.

 

[Second Power]

April direct.

He follows up his bit on For Glory mode talking about how you can have friend matches allowing you to set the rules to your liking, "like stock battle".

Not sure why he would mention that specifically if For Glory was by default, a stock battle.

That doesn't give any indication what the default is. That makes it clear the settings in the two online modes are set in stone. When he went to say what you could change, it's obvious he would go for the second most popular mode to use an example.

He got Final D as the only stage 'correct', and stocks were used in the invitational. I think we're safe, but feel free to quote me on that if I'm wrong.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

That doesn't give any indication what the default is. That makes it clear the settings in the two online modes are set in stone. When he went to say what you could change, it's obvious he would go for the second most popular mode to use an example.

He got Final D as the only stage 'correct', and stocks were used in the invitational. I think we're safe, but feel free to quote me on that if I'm wrong.

Um, it pretty much directly implies that whatever the default will be, it isn't stock. Considering time has been historically the default setting, it's pretty easy to assume what it will be.

You can bet I will quote ya because I'm a vengeful fothermucker and it's actually the most logical assertion that it will be time, along with the fact it was inferred.

For stated reasons, time is easily the most logical due to inclusion techniques being used to benefit random, quick matches.

 

[Lozjam]

Guys, this thread isn't about for glory mode. This is about the new technique that was discovered. Please move said conversations of for glory mode to other threads.

 

[Leonyx]

Has the pivot cancel been shown to be used in the direction the player is running? I'm not sure if it has, and it would likely be a much more effective technique if so.

Also, has it been shown in any of the ComicCon gameplay? The demo is supposed to be more recent there, and if it's still in there it would have better chances to be an intentional addition.