Social Skyworld Hub - "Soaring through the Skys"

[ReRaze]

Is staling usmash really an issue, I mean..it's a low percent combo, by the time it starts killing it will probably be fresh again. Although I do agree there are better followups.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Is staling usmash really an issue, I mean..it's a low percent combo, by the time it starts killing it will probably be fresh again. Although I do agree there are better followups.

The world may never know

 

[Sensane]

I've ben experimenting with d-throw -> d-air -> n-air and it's a little tricky to connect, but I'll just keep practicing it. D-throw -> u-smash is a low percent combo that is best used on heavies and fast fallers anyway. Also, the staleness logic could also be applied to d-throw -> b-air, especially since the sweetspot is so big. Also, so excited to go to OUTFOXX'D this weekend!

 

[ReRaze]

LancerStaff do you happen to know where I could find footstool falling speeds or how I could calculate them? As in how long it takes for an opponent to reach the ground after a footstool.

 

[Tito Maas]

Is staling usmash really an issue, I mean..it's a low percent combo, by the time it starts killing it will probably be fresh again. Although I do agree there are better followups.

Yeah, this is my stance on that. I mean, Nairo never uses USmash out of DThrow, but Earth defaults to USmash out of DThrow.

But I guess it is all preference. I have to play around with the follow-ups more and see how I can use the mixups to maximize damage output.

I don't ever do DThrow to Nair anymore because it just yields the least amount of damage.

 

[LancerStaff]

LancerStaff do you happen to know where I could find footstool falling speeds or how I could calculate them? As in how long it takes for an opponent to reach the ground after a footstool.

I don't think there's any data like that... It's probably just a character's fall speed. I'd ask around the Greninja boards and see if they've got any good info.

Braixen is definitely my main in Pokken, lol. For having almost no traditional fighting game experience I'm kinda decent at it.

 

[Sensane]

Braixen is definitely my main in Pokken, lol. For having almost no traditional fighting game experience I'm kinda decent at it.

But Pokken isn't a traditional fighter lol. I've heard that it's more like a 3D Smash bros. Wait, is that why Pokken has its own forum section on this website?

 

[ReRaze]

I don't think there's any data like that... It's probably just a character's fall speed. I'd ask around the Greninja boards and see if they've got any good info.

Hmmm I doubt it's fall speed (because I find it much easier to footstool reset Roy than Falco despite them having the same fall speed) but I'll ask the greninja boards.

 

[The Merc]

Hey everyone. I'm back from the dead. The healing factor took a while to kick in.

Don't really feel like reading every post but I will say this....

2. Pit has one of the laggiest FSmashes in the game, to the point where it's unusable outside of a very hard read. Reducing endlag doesn't make it Meta Knight level at all.

Really?

It's endlag is not nearly as bad as it could be. Seriously, just look at Link. Or Robin. Or Bowser.

 

[Tito Maas]

Hey everyone. I'm back from the dead. The healing factor took a while to kick in.

Don't really feel like reading every post but I will say this....



Really?

It's endlag is not nearly as bad as it could be. Seriously, just look at Link. Or Robin. Or Bowser.

Tru

 

[MKchouy]

Link, Bowser and Robin (with levin sword) all have significantly stronger f smashes that kill center stage at like 70% though.

I was never a fan of our f smash, i almost never go for it

 

[ReRaze]

Link, Bowser and Robin (with levin sword) all have significantly stronger f smashes that kill center stage at like 70% though.

I was never a fan of our f smash, i almost never go for it

Yeah I agree, the risk/reward ratio is kinda low compared to others.

 

[The Merc]

Link, Bowser and Robin (with levin sword) all have significantly stronger f smashes that kill center stage at like 70% though.

I was never a fan of our f smash, i almost never go for it

Eh, I like using from time to time. But you are right, Pit's other moves are just better

 

[LancerStaff]

Pit's Fsmash comes out way faster then Robin and the like's. It's much more viable as a punish then any of those moves.

Seems to me it's a "grass is always greener" situation.

 

[ReRaze]

Hmmm it's fast, but more often than not if you're in a situation where fsmash is usable as a punish, the difference in speed between say Robin's fsmash doesn't really matter, like you said, fsmash is generally used as a punish, that means the opponent used a bad (e.g gets his airdodge/roll read) or laggy move, in those situations how fast your fsmash comes out doesn't matter too much, if I'm punishing my opponent i'd rather a hard punish than a fast one.

And also it annoys me that you can't really say it's fast and has very good range at the same time since all the range lies in the second hit and to fully utilise that range you're gonna have to go through the startup of the first hit.

That being said I think it has a niche in outspacing laggy moves, catching spotdodges and rolls, (Link's is probably a better version though, does all this, is cancellable and breaks shields, iirc it has more overall reach too).

Oh just a fun thought, wouldn't it be cool if the second hit of our fsmash shield poked easily, that would give it a really good niche imo.

 

[MKchouy]

Our down smash and up smash are amazing though so I'm not complaining if one of our smashes are mediocre.

All I ever wanted in a buff was orbitar lag and more aerial mobility. (Imagine landing on stage safely with orbitars... omg)

 

[LancerStaff]

Ten frames even on a hard punish move absolutely makes a difference. Hitting with Bowser's Fsmash at all is like, well, hitting with the second hit of Pit's. Second hit of Pit's comes out a frame faster, actually...

 

[ReRaze]

Ehh I guess what really makes me feel that Pit's fsmash is lacklustre is because I play lucina too, hers is frame 10 like Pit's but the frame 10 hit has more range, damage and knockback as well as being able to 2 frame the ledge and having setups among other applications.

Hitting with bowser's is kinda worth the risk though, knocback on that move is bonkers. Although tbh I see that move as more of a shieldbreak punish rather than your usual fsmash.

On another note where is the most common situation you find yourself using Pit's fsmash?

 

[LancerStaff]

Well when I last played I was trying out some jab > Fsmash to mild success, but otherwise it's the usual stuff. Out of pivots and foxtrots, hard reads, whiff and landing punishes, some catching people offstage... IDK, not sure where I use it the most. People tend to not expect foxtrot Fsmash though, since most other options get beat by a spotdodge.

 

[ReRaze]

Hmmm never tried jab to anything besides grab lol, might try jab to fsmash if they try and roll and spotdodge, seems like a good mix on paper.

Is Pit's foxtrot all that useful? last I heard, the time it took for his dash to end made his foxtrot kinda useless.

 

[LancerStaff]

I foxtrot plenty, though typically not right in an opponent's face. Pit's initial dash being long is something of a double-edge sword... Obviously you travel a long ways and fast but you spend more time travelling then you would with a shorter one, but I believe one longer dash has the frame advantage over two shorter ones. Basically they're useful in different situations.

But anyway, I mostly use it with walking to control space in neutral or even as a substitute for a roll in some situations. Being able to use Pit's giant dash attack out of it at a moment's notice is also a pretty big plus.

 

[The Merc]

Well when I last played I was trying out some jab > Fsmash to mild success, but otherwise it's the usual stuff. Out of pivots and foxtrots, hard reads, whiff and landing punishes, some catching people offstage... IDK, not sure where I use it the most. People tend to not expect foxtrot Fsmash though, since most other options get beat by a spotdodge.

Really? I can't ever seem to get anything out of Pit's Jab other then Jab 2. Overtime I try to grab, it just makes me Jab again. I know cause I'm still in the endlag, but that's my point. The endlag is just too much to do much with it.

 

[Sensane]

Must I always bring up how many times I've killed someone with the second hit of f-smash at 75% by the ledge with no rage?

 

[Koiba]

>Reads opponent roll
>Uses fsmash
>Opponent falls out of the first hit
>Gets punished



This is my life story right here

 

[LancerStaff]

Mm, I really ought to figure when and how people fall out of the move. We realistically should be able to substitute other moves when it would fail, probably Pit's Ftilt and Usmash. Electroshock I believe comes out F18 so that's probably too slow in some situations.

Really? I can't ever seem to get anything out of Pit's Jab other then Jab 2. Overtime I try to grab, it just makes me Jab again. I know cause I'm still in the endlag, but that's my point. The endlag is just too much to do much with it.

I mean, it's like that for every jab. You really just need to be more patient with it.

 

[PK Gaming]

Don't people only fall out of Pit's Fsmash when he has high rage?

Anyway, I still think he has a strong forward smash, but smashes in general are fairly situational so it's not something I go out of my way to use. I usually get them when I condition them with Ftilt, use it for hard punishes or at he ledge to cover get ups.

 

[LancerStaff]

It usually only happens with rage on top of an opponent with higher percents already, with me it seems most frequent on heavier characters like Link and Dorf. Not entirely sure if DI makes a big difference or not.

 

[The Merc]

Must I always bring up how many times I've killed someone with the second hit of f-smash at 75% by the ledge with no rage?

Emphasis on by the ledge. A number of other Fsmash can do that from the centre of the stage

I mean, it's like that for every jab. You really just need to be more patient with it.

Not true. I can think of a few jabs that go against this.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Down Smash is still better

 

[Sensane]

Emphasis on by the ledge. A number of other Fsmash can do that from the centre of the stage

Not at 75.

 

[The Merc]

Not at 75.

Roy, Bowser, Link (actually, I was killed once by a Link at 40% near the ledge. Tho he did have rage)

 

[Koiba]

Roy, Bowser, Link (actually, I was killed once by a Link at 40% near the ledge. Tho he did have rage)

Can you remember how much you had?

Link's fsmash is crazy strong so it shouldn't have been too much, right?

Also have take the opponent's weight into account :3

 

[The Merc]

Can you remember how much you had?

Link's fsmash is crazy strong so it shouldn't have been too much, right?

Also have take the opponent's weight into account :3

I was Pit on Omega Palutena Temple and Link was on like 112% I think.

 

[Koiba]

I was Pit on Omega Palutena Temple and Link was on like 112% I think.

oh ****


That's really strong

 

[LancerStaff]

Emphasis on by the ledge. A number of other Fsmash can do that from the centre of the stage

Not true. I can think of a few jabs that go against this.

How many Fsmashes like that are even on good characters? Actually, how many good characters even have good Fsmashes? Not many either way.

The only jabs you can mash grab out of consist of a single attack...

 

[The Merc]

How many Fsmashes like that are even on good characters? Actually, how many good characters even have good Fsmashes? Not many either way.

The only jabs you can mash grab out of consist of a single attack...

Meta Knight and Roy to name a few.

Exactly, I just prove you wrong

 

[Koiba]

Meta Knight and Roy to name a few.

Exactly, I just prove you wrong

Roy's kinda a meh character though, isn't he?
I always thought MK's fsmash was just convenient because it's fast


Someone pls teach meeeeee~

 

[The Merc]

Roy's kinda a meh character though, isn't he?
I always thought MK's fsmash was just convenient because it's fast


Someone pls teach meeeeee~

How on earth is Roy a meh character?

Man, they were right in the Roy thread.

But it's still a good fsmash on a good character.

 

[LancerStaff]

How on earth is Roy a meh character?

Man, they were right in the Roy thread.

But it's still a good fsmash on a good character.

Uh... I don't know who you were talking to but they've steered you wrong. Waaaay wrong. Roy has absolutely no good tournament results and there's not a single decent player who'll vouch for him. Most people agree he's at least a half tier too high on the backroom's tier list.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Leave Roy alone...but love Pit