SkillKeeper - TrueSkill™ Rankings Bookkeeper

[fraggle]

from what have seen from other people the program looks good I just cant get any challenge brackets uploaded

 

[Waymas]

Pretty sick and nice job sir.

 

[Fizzi]

from what have seen from other people the program looks good I just cant get any challenge brackets uploaded

Did you try the newest version?

Where are you getting your API key from?

 

[fabri]

thanks, we use it in tournaments in Chile :v

 

[Nine]

So for some reason I keep getting a message that says Invalid API Key. Then I tried it on a version that you posted a while back and it gave me the same error message that says unhandled exception has occurred...if you select continue you will continue if you select quite the program will close.

Have you tried reseting your API Key?

 

[Dapplegonger]

Would it be at all possible to upload challonge brackets that aren't your own? I want to upload brackets to which I do not have the API key.

 

[Fizzi]

Would it be at all possible to upload challonge brackets that aren't your own? I want to upload brackets to which I do not have the API key.

Is the tournament part of a subdomain? If so I believe you can do this. If it's on a random person's account the challonge API has no way to do this.

 

[Dapplegonger]

Is the tournament part of a subdomain? If so I believe you can do this. If it's on a random person's account the challonge API has no way to do this.

Oh, okay, I'll check to see if that works.

EDIT: It did not.

 

[Fizzi]

Oh, okay, I'll check to see if that works.

EDIT: It did not.

Works for me. Do you have the newest version? Put in your API key and whatever subdomain you want to add from. I just started a leaderboard using the michigansmash subdomain and I certainly have no access to that.

 

[Dapplegonger]

Works for me. Do you have the newest version? Put in your API key and whatever subdomain you want to add from. I just started a leaderboard using the michigansmash subdomain and I certainly have no access to that.

Oh, does it still work if I just put in my API code and some random other subdomain? I didn't know what to do, cause I thought it meant the API code of the other account.

 

[Fizzi]

Yeah. You put in your API code and the subdomain from which you want to add tournaments. So basically you have access to all tournaments that are within a subdomain using your API key.

But like I said, if the tournaments are just on a person's account directly, I think the only ways for you to add those tournaments are:

1) Having the tournament organizer as you as an admin for the tournament on challonge
2) Use the tournament organizer's API key

 

[RedEyesWhiteSwaggin]

Has anyone had any problems with the program recently? I used it without issue back in March but now I've been getting random crashes if I leave the program alone or if I try to start a new world. I've tried downloading it multiple times, switching computers, and getting a new API key.

EDIT: I don't get any error message or crash message it just closes.

EDIT 2: I also can no longer copy past API keys :/

@ Zankoku

@ Fizzi

 

[Lafungo]

Stumbled upon this a couple days ago, it's just what I was looking for! Can't believe I didn't find this sooner. Thanks for making this, it's awesome!

What exactly does the decay do? Looking through the source code, it seems that it multiplies each player's sigma by 1.05. Is this correct?
Also, assuming the values in GameInfo.cs are what's used by the program, why is DefaultDrawProbability 0.10? Shouldn't it be 0 for Smash?

I have a few requests for features I'd like to see implemented:
- Parameter value customization, particularly for beta and tau. I'd like to be able to play around with these and figure out what works best for a local Smash scene. For example, I think that the defaults restrict rating fluctuation for players with lots of matches a bit too much, so I'd probably increase tau. Might be useful to allow customization of draw probability as well, for users who would want to use SkillKeeper for other games.
- Head-to-Head. If I'm not mistaken, this was already a feature in GlickoMan. Would be great to have it back.
- Support for two-stage Challonge brackets. Currently, SkillKeeper will only import matches from the Final Stage portion of the Challonge page.
- A way to set the order of tournaments played on the same day. Currently, matches from both (or more) tournaments get mixed up (since Order values only reflect order within a given tournament). This would be particularly useful for tournaments with multiple stages (pools + bracket) that were imported separately. I know you can set the earlier stages to the previous day to bypass this issue, but it's a work-around, not a fix.

As an aside, do you have any idea what a realistic upper bound would be for how big of a match history SkillKeeper can handle? Would it start being laggy and/or stop working if a World file has 10k, 100k, a million matches?

 

[LanceKing2200]

Is there any way to weight brackets? As in, can you import, say, 4 weekly events and a monthly event and have the monthly event apply a bigger impact to player's scores?

 

[metalmonstar]

Is there an option an I have to set in order for skill keeper to import the records from TIO and Challonge. As of now winning the set is it but a 2-1 is certainly different than getting 2-0'd right?

 

[Raziek]

Is there an option an I have to set in order for skill keeper to import the records from TIO and Challonge. As of now winning the set is it but a 2-1 is certainly different than getting 2-0'd right?

Game counts are irrelevant. All that matters is who moved on in bracket.

 

[Delphiki]

Wow, I had no idea this program existed! I've been using GlickoMan for the past year or so to obtain set counts for the Sacramento rankings, but I don't know what all this business is about API keys and subdomains. I'd really like to use this newer program, but it doesn't seem feasible to gather up a bunch of info or admin privileges from the several TOs. Why is this limitation even necessary? Why can't I import just using a challonge URL?

I fear I'm going to have to recreate challonge brackets in tio, but I'd really like to find something less time-consuming.

 

[Fizzi]

Wow, I had no idea this program existed! I've been using GlickoMan for the past year or so to obtain set counts for the Sacramento rankings, but I don't know what all this business is about API keys and subdomains. I'd really like to use this newer program, but it doesn't seem feasible to gather up a bunch of info or admin privileges from the several TOs. Why is this limitation even necessary? Why can't I import just using a challonge URL?

I fear I'm going to have to recreate challonge brackets in tio, but I'd really like to find something less time-consuming.

Challonge has no mechanism for easily extracting bracket information out of another person's tournament. That is, unless that tournament is hosted on a subdomain. Subdomains are called organizations on challonge. So for example, our local tournaments are organized on videogamerescue.challonge.com , in this case the subdomain is videogamerescue. From skillkeeper, anyone can put in their own API key and videogamerescue as the subdomain and import our events. I honestly think everyone should use subdomains, its much better than hosting tournaments on your account.

As far as importing via URL, while this is possible, its a bit more complex. You'd have to fetch the html and parse out all the match results yourself. I believe I have heard of someone working on it.

You can find your API key in your challonge settings.

 

[Delphiki]

Perfect answer, I've got it all going now! I hadn't used challonge before, so I didn't know the terminology, and thankfully it looks like three out of four of our area's challonge-faring TOs are using subdomains, so this will be a snap! Loving the new match history output, and it runs super smooth. This little bird-witch has made a new friend. Thanks a lot, and great work!

 

[KimiNewt]

I'm having an issue (or perhaps this feature does not exist): when importing a challonge tournamnet, it imports the players from the two stages (pools and brackets) but it only records matches from the bracket stage. Is that just something that's missing?

Also, have you considered making a web version of the program? It could be very useful. I can assist with that in September if there's any interest.

 

[Riio]

A decay interval of 12 months gives significantly different scores to a decay interval of one year, and 8 weeks gives significantly different scores compared to 2 months. Am I missing something or is this a bug?

 

[Fizzi]

I'm having an issue (or perhaps this feature does not exist): when importing a challonge tournamnet, it imports the players from the two stages (pools and brackets) but it only records matches from the bracket stage. Is that just something that's missing?

Also, have you considered making a web version of the program? It could be very useful. I can assist with that in September if there's any interest.

From http://api.challonge.com/v1 : "Please note, two-stage tournaments are not yet supported by our public API. We'll follow up with this support soon. Thank you for your patience!"

Hence two-stage tournaments don't import properly :\. It's been a long while and challonge API still doesn't support them.

 

[Floppeh]

I am still in love with this program. Are you guys planning on updating anything anytime soon, or is this version final for the most part?

 

[KimiNewt]

From http://api.challonge.com/v1 : "Please note, two-stage tournaments are not yet supported by our public API. We'll follow up with this support soon. Thank you for your patience!"

Hence two-stage tournaments don't import properly :\. It's been a long while and challonge API still doesn't support them.

Missed that, thanks.

As for the other part of my message, is there any interest in a web-based version of the program? From either the developers or users?
There are the Smashboards rankings system a few other sites but they're not quite the same..

 

[Fizzi]

I am still in love with this program. Are you guys planning on updating anything anytime soon, or is this version final for the most part?

@ Zankoku is the primary developer. I only helped with a couple of features. The source is on github though and afaik anyone is welcome to contribute. Personally I'm not planning on adding anything to it in the near future.

Missed that, thanks.

As for the other part of my message, is there any interest in a web-based version of the program? From either the developers or users?
There are the Smashboards rankings system a few other sites but they're not quite the same..

I'm sure there would be a large amount of interest in that from users. Right now in order to share my local rankings with both the local community and any interested parties I have to put the information on Google sheets ( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ku6rJAhq-L8ZIaUw1ZK9-bQJ17JLruOQxbpRlOyJF7U/pubhtml ). It would be great if this stuff was all automatic and you could even browse other region's PRs. I'd be interested in helping on such a project but probably not anytime soon - I have other things I'm more interested in working on for now.

 

[KimiNewt]

@ Zankoku is the primary developer. I only helped with a couple of features. The source is on github though and afaik anyone is welcome to contribute. Personally I'm not planning on adding anything to it in the near future.


I'm sure there would be a large amount of interest in that from users. Right now in order to share my local rankings with both the local community and any interested parties I have to put the information on Google sheets ( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ku6rJAhq-L8ZIaUw1ZK9-bQJ17JLruOQxbpRlOyJF7U/pubhtml ). It would be great if this stuff was all automatic and you could even browse other region's PRs. I'd be interested in helping on such a project but probably not anytime soon - I have other things I'm more interested in working on for now.

I do the same (google drive thing). I think it will be nice to have everything online, or at the very least being able to display it online (displaying the CSV would be dead easy, though resolving the "bacon" file would be the same as rewriting the whole program).

I might start working on it as soon as exams are over (10/9), assuming I don't have to practice for Dreamhack (and even then, probably..)! I'll post here if I actually start so that interested parties can help.

 

[Zankoku]

I've sometimes considered something like a web-based version of my program keeping everything in an SQL database, but my ability with PHP and SQL isn't nearly at the level I think I'd need to be at.

 

[Electric91]

Will there be a mac port soon?

 

[Zankoku]

I have zero experience coding for Mac, so not until someone else takes up that idea, no.

 

[KimiNewt]

So I found this website: http://garpr.com
It seems fairly similar to SkillKeeper and the ideas i had regarding a web version (though it's severely lacking in features and the execution is not spectacular). Anyone using it?

 

[Zankoku]

That's the site used by NorCal and written up and maintained by Gar.

You can get a hold of him via Twitter: https://twitter.com/garsh0p

 

[Missile]

Great program. Very useful and easy to use!

I have one question. How do I go about importing Challonge brackets from my subdomain? When I input my API key, it only adds tournaments from my account and not the subdomain ones as well. Did I miss something?

 

[Zankoku]

input your subdomain in the second text box that is labeled "Subdomain"

 

[Citricide]

Will we have some sort of MYSQL or sqlite support? I really want to be able to push updates to my website from the program itself

 

[Riio]

Great program. Very useful and easy to use!

I have one question. How do I go about importing Challonge brackets from my subdomain? When I input my API key, it only adds tournaments from my account and not the subdomain ones as well. Did I miss something?

In case you or anyone else is still having trouble, just enter the name of the subdomain, not the whole URL.

 

[Uncle]

First off, I want to say thank you to everyone who played a part in creating this program. It's super efficient and not hard to use in the slightest.

Now, here's a question I have:

Is it possible to combine two worlds together, as in merging the bacon files?

 

[Zankoku]

Unfortunately no, I didn't think of that as a thing that would need to be done.

 

[APESAUCE]

there a way to run this on a mac?

 

[Danimal197]

First off, I want to say thank you to everyone who played a part in creating this program. It's super efficient and not hard to use in the slightest.

Now, here's a question I have:

Is it possible to combine two worlds together, as in merging the bacon files?

You could just copy+paste the contents of one BCN file into another, and then manually delete any duplicate player entries. And then sort through any other remaining problems I haven't thought of.

I have an idea for how we could import data from challonge brackets that are not hosted on subdomains, by using the log of the tournament in question. I don't know how to code, but I do know the basic process of how to get it to work.

1. Essentially you would pull the log data off of a tournament, example

Spoiler: Raw

Aug 27, 03:30 PDT

The organizer created this tournament.
Aug 27, 19:41 PDT

The organizer triggered the bracket prediction phase.
Aug 27, 19:41 PDT

The organizer started this tournament.
Aug 27, 19:41 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for weegee over dskro.
Aug 27, 20:18 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for The Wall over Help.
Aug 27, 20:19 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for tesh over Black TNT.
Aug 27, 20:21 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for cyanide over furbs.
Aug 27, 20:23 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for AvoiD over cryus.
Aug 27, 20:27 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-1) win for weegee over AvoiD.
Aug 27, 20:38 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for runct over arjuna.
Aug 27, 20:38 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for furbs over Help.
Aug 27, 20:38 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-1) win for The Wall over cyanide.
Aug 27, 20:39 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (0-0) win for furbs over AvoiD.
Aug 27, 21:00 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (1-0) win for Dojo | BC over Starbuck.
Aug 27, 21:01 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for Black TNT over Starbuck.
Aug 27, 21:09 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-1) win for dskro over cryus.
Aug 27, 21:10 PDT

A score edit cancelled the cyanide vs. dskro match.
Aug 27, 21:10 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-1) win for cryus over dskro.
Aug 27, 21:13 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for cyanide over cryus.
Aug 27, 21:34 PDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-1) win for Dojo | BC over tesh.
Aug 28, 00:44 EDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-1) win for arjuna over tesh.
Aug 28, 00:56 EDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for cyanide over arjuna.
Aug 28, 01:11 EDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for karna over arjewnah.
Aug 28, 01:13 EDT

Danimal197 reported a (2-0) win for The Wall over Dojo | BC.
Aug 28, 02:01 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-1) win for arjewnah over Black TNT.
Aug 28, 02:02 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-1) win for arjewnah over furbs.
Aug 28, 02:06 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-0) win for weegee over karna.
Aug 28, 02:17 EDT

Krebs reported a (3-2) win for The Wall over weegee.
Aug 28, 02:20 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-1) win for Dojo | BC over arjewnah.
Aug 28, 02:51 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-0) win for karna over cyanide.
Aug 28, 02:56 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-1) win for karna over Dojo | BC.
Aug 28, 02:56 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-0) win for karna over weegee.
Aug 28, 02:57 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-1) win for karna over The Wall.
Aug 28, 03:19 EDT

Krebs reported a (2-0) win for karna over The Wall.
Aug 28, 03:19 EDT

This tournament has ended.

2.Use the challonge API and a specified subdomain to rebuild the tournament from scratch automatically. Again I'm a worthless scrub who doesn't speak code but it looks like http://api.challonge.com/v1/documents/matches/update has everything you'd need.

3. Import the tournament into skillkeeper using subdomain.


Anyone interested in tackling this project? I would be willing to contribute money if someone with the skills is willing to invest the time.


Also, I love love love this program, I'm doing it for the entire texas scene, and let me tell you it is a complete ***** trying to get all the tournament data. Thank goodness for tloc.challonge.com and austinsmash4.challonge.com.


Statistically, can anyone tell me how accurate cross-city elo is? Like assuming matches between cities are fairly rare?

EDIT: Also, I have collected like 8 challonge API keys because lol.

 

[KimiNewt]

I've finally started work on a web version, though this may take forever so don't hold your breath. If anyone wants to help, PM me!

In the meanwhile, I started with a super simple version that just allows to upload SkillKeeper CSVs to be displayed. That should be up later this week.
Preview: http://i.imgur.com/Yig5OSk.png