LAK’s 50 starts off the game. I like it. The questions themselves don’t seem too useful, but the fact that he actually went through the trouble to write down all those questions to get out of RVS shows positive intent to me. +.25.
Soup’s 51 is awkwardly worded. What’s “interesting” about LAK starting out with questions? -.25
JTB’s 57 is null. That said, I find it odd how he immediately questioned LAK on his question to him, which seemed pretty simple and straightforward to me.
Gheb’s 58 and 59 kinda looks scummy. but actually in a sort of WIFOM way too dumb for scum. Would scum just blatantly make a move that could be interpreted as scummy like that? I’m thinking not. More likely that he genuinely doesn’t have faith in LAK. +.25.
Soup’s 69 strikes me as off, even more so than his 51. No one was piling on LAK, besides from maybe two people he expressed general dislike for his slot. Like, why even make this post Soup? -.5
JTB’s 73 is a dumb assumption. Like, too dumb. -.25.
@Gorf 79: The problem that I saw earlier is in my notes above.
@84-87: Don’t know where these questions are going. Need to see though if anyone is answering them. That said, questions for the sake of questions is meh. -.25.
KevinM’s 89 and 90 as well as Rockin’s 92 don’t seem to care to progress the game much. Rockin’s
“If you feel I'm scum, then be sure to add more steam this time Calling me out and not doing anything doesn't mean you were right :B
Also, I was pretty unmotivated that game. A lot of vets in the game and none of them I was buddies with? Lame.
This game is different cause it's SKIES OF ARCADIA! w000000t!
I see a bit of unfamiliars in this game.”
Still feels awkward to me. Like, who even talks like this? -.25 to KevinM. Could just be laziness, but I don’t feel like I should excuse him for that. -.5 for Rockin. He doesn’t really do anything with his 92 and the wording still feels awkward.
J’s 94 is pretty meh. Don’t think he was serious but if he was I would like to know.
@Gorf 100: What gave you the impression that Rake was town in his post? I mean, we know it now, but honestly, looking back at Rake’s 81, I don’t really see anything besides an explanation on his past experiences which could be interpreted as being “overly friendly.” Is it because of how “open” he was, so to speak? As that’s really the only explanation I could think of.
@102: Gorf, same question as above. What lead you to believe that LAK was pro-town at that point in time?
In any case, I like Gorf identifying players as pro-town. It feels very relaxed, and consistent with how I’ll image Gorf’s town mindset works. +.5.
Soup’s defense over his mafia skills and “advice dog” nature in his 104 also feels consistent with Soup’s personality . +.25.
Read Orb’s 106 again. While I can see where other people are coming from with suspicion on him, I think I’m going to just have to defend it with the simple fact that that could be either newbie town or scum. Null.
Soup’s push on Orboknown in his 107 and 109 for the reasons he is pushing him is also something that seems consistent with his personality. The whole “lecturing” of Orboknown to give “more meat” to his reads is something that I’ll expect out of Soup. +.25.
@119: Gheb you’re kidding me. Was it really not obvious why a LAK lynch wouldn’t of went through? -.25.
Gheb’s push on Orboknown as something that’s “textbook newbie scum” also reads as genuine to me. A bad push, but still genuine. +.25.
Null on Marshy’s jump, something he’ll do as either alignment. Going to admit stupidity and point out though that I’m not sure why Marshy choose to joke answer Soup’s question in his 126. Also null.
Like Orbokown’s 128. I know I said this before, but his reasoning for disliking my slot is pretty much what I’ll expect out of a newbie town. +.25.
132 still consistent with Soup’s personality but damn kid learn to read intent not outcome. +.25
134 is indeed a careful retraction. Okay, so there is one thing from Orboknown that I don’t like. -.5.
135 is a blatant wagon jump on JTB‘s part. Didn’t do anything else around this time besides simply wagon hop. Don’t like that. -.25.
@143: Okay I actually didn’t even realize that Gorf wasn’t on a wagon at the time. I thought he was already on a wagon when he said “I’m on the Orb wagon in spirit.”
Gorf, WHY not just join the Orb wagon? -.25 for Gorf and +.25 for Gheb for being right. Sorry I missed that Gheb.
@146: Soup I understand where you are coming from and I think that you genuinely thought things out, but I just think that you’re overestimating some people. ‘
Rockin’s 147 is giving me mixed vibes. His “silly” responses to Marshy are kinda dumb, but looking back on it now it “feels” genuine. It feels “relaxed,” not tense like I would expect scum to be. It also goes along with Gheb who said that Rockin is just naturally “scattered brain. However, what I don’t like is his crictisms of Soup and Orb. They just feel so useless, as does this post as a whole. Like, why even make that post Rockin? Overall going to have to -.25.
@Rockin: I know I already asked you this, but I missed it and don’t feel like going back.
“FOS: Ragnarock
Not liking how you feel I'm scummy, but going after Orbo instead.
JTB - Any reason why you're voting for Orbo?”
This is from your 148. Where did this come from? Why was Soup’s suspicion of you bad? Why didn’t you back up your Orb hate with a vote?
-.25. Don’t like it when people state dislike towards someone but then doesn’t back it up with a vote.
AM’s case on Soup is null to me. It’s in Ryker’s nature as either alignment to pick someone who he feels is scummy/wants to frame as scum and go with it. The case itself though is not really good. It observed outcome, and not intent. Could totally still be scum even with this case.
@AM: What was Soup’s scum intent? Does his posts not show a consistency with Soup’s personality, as well as his play itself?
It’s annoying to admit, but rereading over J’s 174 with a clear mind leaves a bit of a different impression. I understand now better why J was suspicious of Gorf for his “lack of a vote.” However, it still feels like he’s picking on us for simply “not explaining things.” For one, I did explain why I disliked Rockin in the post that you quoted, I just didn’t go into much detail. Two, if you felt like we didn’t explain things, then why not simply ask us to explain things? Why does scum have to be attached to it? Like the town lean on Soup. Overall read good intent in it because I KNOW what J looks for when it comes to reading me, and 174 is pretty much it. Just think it’s a weak case. +.25.
180 is a generic thought process and I’m little bit bugged by Gheb’s 181. Gheb, what made you confident that I was town at the time with so little to go off of? -.25.
@182: Hmmmm, mixed vibes off of this one knowing that we’ve got a pseudo guilty on Ryker now. Gheb has the right idea, but he doesn’t take it anywhere. Null.
“I apologize for going to a friends house instead of playing mafia.
/sarcasm”
This is from Orb’s 191, and I like the sass of it. Don’t thin Orb newb scum would do that. +.25.
That said, Orb needs to pick up his game and give reads. His inactivity and lack of scum hunting is disturbing.
@Orb: Can you give me reads on the following people: Soup, Gorf, me, and AM?
@Gheb: What’s “fishy” exactly about Orb butchering the quote (195)? I mean, he didn’t exactly seem like he was trying to frame you with it, so it’s much more likely that it was simply a mistake.
Again, don’t really see scum soup pulling the gambit he did in his 204. +.5.
@Gheb’s 206: At the time, why did you agree on more pressure on J?
Rockin’s 211 is baffling. For one, I have no idea why Rockin votes us in that post. Is it just because we didn’t go after J for something we went after him for? Weak reasoning. Also, the rest of the post feels “empty,” so to speak. More or less just confirming earlier suspicions about Rockin here. His explanations on why Soup/Orb are “bad” players, and his explanations on what “white knighting” is feel unneeded. His commentary on the Orb wagon and Rake aren’t much better. If you don’t like the Orb wagon or JTB, then why not jump on them? Seems like that would be much more legit jump then us. Also, why did you even make that comment on Rake? “I hope he posts more but it’s only been a couple days so I’m not sweating it.” Like, you went back on your concern in the same sentence. Seems useless and, more importantly, careful. -.75
Like Orb not being a total pushover in his 222. However, this came after people were calling him out on it, so I can’t really count it towards his townie points. Null.
@Soup’s 200-240: Read intent mother****er, INTENT!
@Rockin’s 236: Yeah great job with that pressure.
241 is a bad/useless wagon hop. -.25.
244 is meh. I understand LAK’s case and the jump of Gheb is gutsy considering that it’s Gheb but the rest of that post just feels like him throwing out one liners to seem like he’s “doing” stuff. Null, just wish that LAK would make his thought process clearer, as I KNOW that RR can do.
@Ryker’s 247:
“It isn't that your read switched. I would be a ******* to try to insinuate that. It's that, in your first post, you immediately label him as a dangerous player and highlighted him specifically for LAK, and then turned around and started agreeing with him with absolutely no argument, no attempt to flesh out your read, and no attempt to follow up on your "Gheb's dangerous" statement. That's shady.”
Why is this shady? Soup simply said to be cautious of Gheb, not that he’s scum. I don’t see why someone can’t acknowledge someone else as a good player and then agree with a statement of theirs.
“Hey scrub, I hate cases based around people being "fake." I don't blame you for misunderstanding us though--no one seems to have figured out our math puns yet. So you're not alone!
But it's the fact that you floated a vote out there and then put something on it. Orbo's initial post was not bad. I don't see the flaw in it, it just read typical Orbo to me. He's not a player that posts a lot, he's a scrub, and what he says isn't the weightiest. I have no ****ing clue why you and Gheb are putting him on a higher standard. He hasn't played better than essentially a newer player and so he hasn't earned that standard. Because of that, it sounds like you two are angling for a lynch for reasons that aren't because of a person's scumminess--you're just shooting for a lynch because you know you can get it.
As a result, this has nothing to do with Orbo's actions except how they relate to you. Spotlight's on you, babe, time to put on the big boy pants and dance.”
I agree with this assessment of Orb. That said, don’t you think that it’s entirely possible that Soup could of simply not have known? Like, I could totally see why Soup town would of thought Orb was playing “textbook newbie scum.” Gheb kinda, but not as much.
Btw, just curious, why go after Soup and not Gheb when he did the exact same thing, but arguably should of known better?
@AM’s 249: Again, don’t see why it’s bad to say to be cautious of “player X” but then agree with something player X states. The way Soup has been treating Orb is something I would expect Soup to do, and it’s the same with thinking Rockin’s question is bad.
If you’re going to apply “context” to Orb and then accuse Soup of not doing so, then you should probably also include “context” on Soup when it comes to reading him.
251: Ew, but it’s a bad case. D=
@252, 255, 261: Thank you Rockin for being incredibly useful as always. -.25.
@261:
“I rather try and lynch scum/suspicious people so we can learn about their flip and then see the connections. Lynching Orbo would just rid of a nucience and not get us closer to lynching scum (imo)” -Rockin
Like?
253 onwards is where Soup gets caught up in his Orb read, which is what kinda got me earlier. It’s bad play on Soup to get caught up in such a read, but it’s nothing that couldn’t of been the result of a frustrated townie. Null.
LAK is wrong in his 266 but for the right reasons. I like the fact that he picked up on Orb’s “attempts” to read people like I have, which show that he’s genuinely paying attention to the game. +.25.
@270: Again great pressure Rockin keep it up. -.25.
I will say though that Rockin’s posting form 240-280 feels “relaxed” as a whole which I like. +.25
@281: How so?
@284: You see Marshy, this is something that never was really explained on your part. Why didn’t you like Gorf? I know why other players didn’t like him, but not you. Was it just because you agreed with J’s case on him? Also, what led you to have por-town feelings towards Gheb?
Like Soup, I can see where Gord is coming from wrt his 288. Definitely agree with Rockin suspicion. Will only give him +.25 though for general inactivity up to that point though, giving a scum Gorf enough time to think out his response.
290 missed the point.
295 is again a thought process that I’ll expect out of town Gorf, especially w.r.t. me. Needs to clean up those nulls though. +.25.
@296: Actually in my defense I hade done a fair bit of the posting up until that point.
299 takes an unpopular stance. Like that. +.25.
@301: Could you go into more detail J as to why Soup’s responses weren’t the best J? How is clinging onto the Orb read scummy and not just anti-town? -.25.
@302: Hopefully my reread will help you answer your question.
@305: Could you J (not trying to be sarcastic here)? Because honestly I’m not really seeing it.
You see J, 307 kinda sums up the problem I have with you. In this reread, you can see who I think is town and why, and so far you haven’t really attacked anyone who I consider to be scum. That’s a problem, because I recognize your reads to generally be pretty good, and the fact that you’re attacking people who I consider to be town is a problem. The only person I like that J is attacking is my slot, because again, I know what J looks for in Swords scum and I think that J thinks he has found it. Still no correct reads, so -.25.
@311 and 313: I don’t see why you’re so antagonistic towards Gorf wanting a scum read explained for him. Like, if someone called you scum, but you didn’t understand why, then wouldn’t you want them to explain?
@316: Did you take into consideration Gorf’s recent posts? Is Gorf “now showing his work” really that scummy?
321 is good. Soup also recognizing a pro-town Gorf is consistent with his play this game. +.25.
@332: KevinM buttriding Marshy’s read that weren’t even explained well.
“Lynching dumb town/scum who’s buddying with other people.” - KevinM
This keeps KevinMs options for being wrong and is a weak justification for a wagon hop. “Lazy town” or not, I do not sense legit effort to scum hunt here. -.25.
341 is a weird wagon hop as 342 points out. -.25 for Gorf.
@343: “@bolded: What exactly are the right wagons? The ones that are the most popular? I understand where your assessment of Gorfs playstyle comes from but I can't agree that it's good for town.” - JTB
I think the answer to this is pretty obvious. The “right” wagons are the ones that Soup thinks is scum.
@344: No, it’s pretty much just because I think Orb is bad at this game and that his wagon wouldn’t of been fruitful to catching scum. No other reasons.
Currently lean town on him as of this point on my reread.
346 is interesting. I agree with it, but I want you to expend on it if you’ll please.
@349: The right conclusion for the wrong reasons. Agree with Gheb reaching. +.25.
@351: Yeah but why now? What not back then? What changed?
@355: Meh, appolizes. I always had you as town, and my reread which is clearing my mind up is just reinforcing it. In any case, blame Xonar, he’s doesn’t know how to read people.
@361: At this point I would have to say one of Rockin or Gheb. Rockin because his posts read useless and careful. Gheb because his reads seem very out of wack. I can’t understand how he can logically be defending some of the people that he is while attacking others. LAK and Orb are very “meh” pushes. Defending Rockin despite how blatantly careful he’s being while attacking Gorf who’s been less careful makes it seem like he had a preset mindset. Like, I don’t understand how someone could logically defend Rockin, even with meta. All that said, if I had to pick one then it would probably have to be Rockin.
366 and 381 both feel very genuine in the sense that I wasn’t exactly making strong pushes at the time. Marshy attacking me for that and being “confused” about my inconsistencies and “**** blocking wagons” show to me this genunity plus the fact that he’s actually been paying attention to the game, which is something that I’ve kinda been questioning up until this point. +.5.
@378: @The first point: While it’s true that he didn’t vote immediately, he voted soon afterwards. So is it really still so “non-committal? @second point: Yes Gorf has improved. Could you argue otherwise? He posted a read list, which while having too many nulls in it for my liking, is pretty committal.
Marshy what do you mean by “a disturbing lack of math this game” in your 381?
388 is a good question that I’ve been wondering. +.25 for Marshy.
@390: Very relevant post there, KevinM. You attack Nabe for that generic reasoning.
@391-394:
KevinM makes a good point on Orb, which I hadn’t considered. Him not attacking anyone at that point does feel safe, even by his “bad player” standards. -.25 for Orb.
KevinM your attack on LAK makes it out to be that LAK isn’t doing anything but defending Orb, where that’s not actually the case. He’s defending Orb in order to attack Gheb.
KevinM being bugged by J “subtly directing Night actions” is something that’s consistent with how KevinM thinks. It’s not actually a scummy thing that KevinM pointed out but it’s cool.
KevinM why is J “asking questions without a lot of weight to them” scummy and not just useless?
J did elaborate on me and Gorf earlier, he just didn’t elaborate on Soup yet.
I understand your null reads. I also understand your Rockin and Orb reads. I think I understand where you’re coming from with LAK, but you simply missed the part where LAK attacked which I think would change your read (would it not?). I have no idera why J’s on there and that needs to be explained more.
@401: No, I voted you because 1. I didn’t realize there were better picks than you that Day and 2. I didn’t like any of your pushes. Also don’t play Heavy Rain that game is silly and has one of the most pretentious plots I have ever seen in Video Games.
@402: You didn’t really clarify what was or wasn’t scummy to be fair.
@410: What gave you a town read on KevinM? Don’t you have anything else to say besides just this? -.25.
@419, 421-423: Can someone help me out with reading LAK? I can’t tell if LAK is genuinely scum hunting or just dropping by every now and then to let us know that he’s “there.”
Hmmm, don’t like Soup’s sudden jump to J in his 424. It’s sloppy and it needs to be explained. -.25.
Good point about Orb ignoring the thread in your 430 Soup. -.25 for Orb. Still need to explain why you voted J. Is it just because you didn’t like his questions?
Marshy’s outburst from 439-442 is something he’ll do as either alignment so null.
@443: Yeah you’ve just been incredibly helpful. Great defense there mate.
@449: Ehh, why not go for the “information” lynch? Seems kinda cop outish. -.25.
@451: “I’ll rather lynch other players, so I’ll vote the person you guys are telling to vote.”
-25.
Mmmmm kind of getting lazy so I’m going to skim the rest of post 440-480. It’s basically just LAK and Soup scrabbling and none of it really is effecting my read of either of those two.
483 is good, shows me that LAK does have his head in this game a little bit. +.25.
Gorf is still kinda lurking as of 484 and needs to stop. -.25.
@488: Wow, will get to later. First I’m finishing Day 1. Obviously I hit a nerve here. Also
For future reference J, never use that first gif again. It’s very obnoxious.
490 is bad. Comes off as Gheb playing “the town critic.” -.25.
493 and 496-497 are very frank which do actually come off in a positive light for him, just because it feels genuine. +.25.
Don’t like Gorf’s hammer. No comment from Gorf as to why he wanted Nabe dead, and as scum Gorf could just of been expending his life span. -.25.
@J and Marshy: Yeah but I really don’t think Rockin is town. D=
