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I know this post is from a couple weeks ago, but what 50% combo are you talking about?!The startup is fine.
But the lag after wards is pretty hard.
I fell in love with Up and Down Tilt though.
Up Tilt starts a free ~50% combo (often true combo), and Down Tilt is a major range-extended ***** slap.
Srsly?I landed a 40% Dair today. Was it buffed?
All hits connected on Ganondorf.
I did the exact same thing also. It was against an airborne opponent.Srsly?
That sounds creepy!
Hey Remioli, see my post here regarding follow ups from a grounded grab release. I haven't found any guaranteed followups from throws. But I follow up D-Throw with a DJ Uair, and follow up F-Throw with an egg or Fair or both in combination. Most of the time the opponent will be able to react with a dodge unfortunately.Does anyone know anything about grab followups? Anywhere I can look for information? Like "D throw leads to X against Y characters at low percents?"
I was trying to figure some out in training mode, but it's tough to know if the CPU's reactions are any good.
Here's the thing: Yoshi's grab game is lousy. It's slow and doesn't lead to anything reliably or consistently. No true combos, and no real mix-up potential worth mentioning. Stick to f or b-throw. They do the most damage, so after 2 pummels it's a free 11%. I cringe when I see people do d or u-throw like they're getting something out of it...cause they aren't...Does anyone know anything about grab followups? Anywhere I can look for information? Like "D throw leads to X against Y characters at low percents?"
I was trying to figure some out in training mode, but it's tough to know if the CPU's reactions are any good.
Not particularly because he does not slide with it like Charizard does. Doing this puts Yoshi in a bad position because it takes a while for animation to finish. If you're this close to the opponent its better to do a grounded Down B instead. Otherwise, the custom Star Bombs would be of use with this tech.Do you think Jump Cancel Down B( The Charizard Rock Slide) is useful for Yoshi at all?
He does a really low Down B, probably can only hit with stars.
Here's the thing: Your edit is my mind set, and should be that of others, given Yoshi's nature. At low percents, you can actually just throw out a SH d-air or a dash attack at anyone that gets too antsy. At higher percents, you can throw people to the ledge. No real reason to just waste free damage using u or d-throw. Smash IS about positioning, but you gain advantage just by recovering from the move's lag faster than their hit-stun, so you still got pressure. Even better is that they're aligned with you now, so it's easier to aim cross-up aerials and dash attacks.@ C chipndip Depending on percentages, the positional advantage after an uthrow/dthrow is better than that of an fthrow/bthrow. At low percents, fthrow/bthrow just sort of end with a reset to neutral, while uthrow/dthrow at least provide you the advantage of being below your opponent, which can lead to more grabs/uairs/usmashes/whatever, giving you "hidden" value that isn't displayed by percentages.
Smash is a game about positioning. You could possibly describe it as King of the Hill. Percent is good and all, but it only serves to make your objective of keeping the opponent off your hill easier.
Edit: To be fair, I personally tend to go for Fthrow/Bthrow (at least in Brawl), but that's because I have a lot of confidence in my ability to repeatedly win neutral, and I lack confidence in the sort of close quarters set up that Uthrow/Dthrow provide. Now in a game where Yoshi actually has good moves and even stronger neutral, I might be even MORE inclined to go for F/Bthrow, but that's because of how I am as a player. If you're good at those 50/50 baits/reads that U/Dthrow provide, they're even MORE advantageous than the percent that F/Bthrow provide. I'm bad, so I stick with what I know I can get.
But the percent differential favors getting an u/dthrow into a follow up, because fthrow and bthrow don't actually do THAT much more damage. These throws also provide the additional advantage of allowing for juggle conditioning to begin (do I make them think they need to jump away/airdodge every time, etc.), and allows you to learn habits. F/bthrow do what? A few extra percent which probably won't be that significant, and reset to lateral positioning. I'd venture to say that we don't even WANT people to be aligned with us, at least among the currently perceived top tiers. What are you gonna do, challenge Sheik/Diddy Fair?Here's the thing: Your edit is my mind set, and should be that of others, given Yoshi's nature. At low percents, you can actually just throw out a SH d-air or a dash attack at anyone that gets too antsy. At higher percents, you can throw people to the ledge. No real reason to just waste free damage using u or d-throw. Smash IS about positioning, but you gain advantage just by recovering from the move's lag faster than their hit-stun, so you still got pressure. Even better is that they're aligned with you now, so it's easier to aim cross-up aerials and dash attacks.
Yes, but u/d-throw don't give guaranteed follow-ups ever, either? F/b-throw sets people in position to be further pressured when you run in, and that's never a bad thing. You don't necessarily need to challenge any f-airs either since it's very low to the ground. You can aim and position your next move as much as you like with better options than a missed u-air. >_>But the percent differential favors getting an u/dthrow into a follow up, because fthrow and bthrow don't actually do THAT much more damage. These throws also provide the additional advantage of allowing for juggle conditioning to begin (do I make them think they need to jump away/airdodge every time, etc.), and allows you to learn habits. F/bthrow do what? A few extra percent which probably won't be that significant, and reset to lateral positioning. I'd venture to say that we don't even WANT people to be aligned with us, at least among the currently perceived top tiers. What are you gonna do, challenge Sheik/Diddy Fair?
At high percents, I agree that F/bthrow are nearly strictly better. But at low percents, it's not so clear. If you can get them offstage, yes. Otherwise, maybe it's not as good.
How can you say that when u/d-throw also have no guaranteed follow-ups? If anything, it's easier to get back to neutral from those throws than it is f/b-throw, depending on the char, assuming it's at low %s.U/dthrow give guaranteed benefits that aren't displayed, in exchange for a few percent. These throws also set people in a position to be further pressured when you stand below them, which is more powerful than the pressure you get from running in without any guaranteed follow ups.
1) Yoshi's FEET are invincible during u-smash. You can still hit his body and head. Yoshi's invincibility on u-smash is lack-luster in comparison to others.Being in the air is almost a strictly disadvantaged position in Smash, especially when you've been put above someone against your will. Our anti-air game is scary - Invincible Usmash which can be done OOS, fast, powerful Uair, etc. With the extra landing lag that can be suffered in this game due to an airdodge, putting someone above you is generally fantastic, unless their Dair or something is just ridiculous.
By contrast, F/Bthrow give the opponent the opportunity to get onto the ground easily, which gives them full access to ALL of their options, including shield, which beats all our aerials except Egg Lay. When you F/Bthrow, you're essentially going for a 50-50 read/guess. With an U/Dthrow, you're going for a trap, which by definition should have a higher rate of success.
Exactly, at first I thought it wasn't legit as the U-smash hits the egg fairly late. Eventually I went through it frame by frame and noticed the egg being clearly pushed off the platform.It's legit. You're able to pause the gif/video (whatever the hell it is) and go frame by frame. He's on the stage but the ending of Usmash shoved him off just barely.