Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[DeltaSceptile]

This wait sucks, but I have a feeling we will get new info next month, most likely in a general direct. Another Smash direct would surprise me if it happened so soon.

 

[DOTBHDD]

I thinm we're forgetting something huge.

If James was under NDA, why would he make it sound like she was in Smasg during the interview? The interview referenced indies in Smash yet he never puts Shantae and Smash in the same sentence.

Unlike Twitter, you can't just NOT TALK during an interview.

"So... Shantae in Smash?"
"..."
"James?"
"..."

So I take it from two perspectives.

1. Under NDA and couldn't be explicit about it.
2. He just didn't know.

Of course
3. She's not in because they never got contacted
is possible too. But I think he would've straight up said "Shantae isn't in Smash and you guys shouldn't expect her to be."

But he didn't. Dude was vague which has me to believe it's option 1 or 2.

 

[EarlTamm]

Anyway, I am surprised this video evaded our attention for so long. Is there any other sort of video or article we are missing?

Btw, what do you guys think the chances are that Sakurai has played a Shantae game? With what I learned about Sakurai in the video, I would not be surprised if he has, especially after the ballot.

 

[Teeb147]

Also, two notes. James Montagna has been vocal all along, even mentioning Smash all the time. Maybe he's confident in his control and so doesn't worry about mentioning shantae and smash at the same time. While the others at WF are extra careful.
My second note is that last week or so I did msg James about Shantae being in smash, and he saw the msg but didn't reply. Not saying he would, since I'm just a random person, but just thought I'd mention it since we're on the subject.

I think that maybe it doesn't matter too much because he's known to be a big smash fan, and for him to be quiet would be too big of a change. If you look at it that way, he kind of has to keep talking about smash lol.
He even went for an Ultimate Tourney:
https://twitter.com/jamespopstar/status/1008205744238256128

 

[Jazzy Jinx]

He never mentions Shantae and Smash in the same sentence as far as I heard

He mentions Shantae and Smash Bros around the 20 minute mark. It's very roundabout and kinda feels like a cop-out but he basically says Nintendo could use the polling data to give Shantae a trophy. Personally, whether she's a playable character or an AT (or hell, even actually a trophy) I would say that breaks the NDA. If she's playable, she would have a trophy. If she's an AT, she would have a trophy. If she's a trophy... =P

He also can't claim ignorance here because throughout the interview, it's very clear that he has extensive knowledge of the Smash series. Although I will say, he does sound very anxious at this point like he knew he said too much so... I don't know. I never really called into question Shantae's chances of being an AT. In fact... his follow-up basically confirms she's an AT.

He mentioned literally every other form of representation in the game: playable characters, trophies, Mii costumes and stages. He never once mentioned ATs, something I found to be very suspect. In his wrap-up statements he basically, covertly says, "Try to be satisfied with the outcome even if something is disappointing. Keep supporting the character and maybe she could be playable one day." That screams AT to me.

And as said in the interview, when you get your character in Smash, it is in the hands of Sakurai and the team, so how many people at Wayforward really have to know about this, at least before Smash Ultimate was formally announced?

Being the co-director of the series, he's definitely high up enough to be required to sign an NDA and his speech patterns are unnatural when the subject is Shantae. As an example, when PushDustin mentions adding a Western character like Lara Croft he immediately changes tone and is all like, "Yeah! Yeah! Lara Croft for Smash!" It's unnatural.

Why wouldn't you push the IP you're more directly involved with? There's nothing wrong with harmless enthusiasm for your own material. Especially if Shantae isn't in the game in any form since he obviously wouldn't be under NDA.

To be frank, I think we cracked this. I hate to say it but I think she's an AT.

 

[Teeb147]

He mentions Shantae and Smash Bros around the 20 minute mark. It's very roundabout and kinda feels like a cop-out but he basically says Nintendo could use the polling data to give Shantae a trophy. Personally, whether she's a playable character or an AT (or hell, even actually a trophy) I would say that breaks the NDA. If she's playable, she would have a trophy. If she's an AT, she would have a trophy. If she's a trophy... =P

He also can't claim ignorance here because throughout the interview, it's very clear that he has extensive knowledge of the Smash series. Although I will say, he does sound very anxious at this point like he knew he said too much so... I don't know. I never really called into question Shantae's chances of being an AT. In fact... his follow-up basically confirms she's an AT.

He mentioned literally every other form of representation in the game: playable characters, trophies, Mii costumes and stages. He never once mentioned ATs, something I found to be very suspect. In his wrap-up statements he basically, covertly says, "Try to be satisfied with the outcome even if something is disappointing. Keep supporting the character and maybe she could be playable one day." That screams AT to me.



Being the co-director of the series, he's definitely high up enough to be required to sign an NDA and his speech patterns are unnatural when the subject is Shantae. As an example, when PushDustin mentions adding a Western character like Lara Croft he immediately changes tone and is all like, "Yeah! Yeah! Lara Croft for Smash!" It's unnatural.

Why wouldn't you push the IP you're more directly involved with? There's nothing wrong with harmless enthusiasm for your own material. Especially if Shantae isn't in the game in any form since he obviously wouldn't be under NDA.

To be frank, I think we cracked this. I hate to say it but I think she's an AT.

To me that's pessimistic. I'm not saying it's not possible, and you're free to think this if you prefer to lower your expectations, and I think it's possible he either didn't know at the time, or played it down so as to not break the NDA. Which by the way wouldn't be broken if she's a playable character. Saying someone could be a trophy in a game is barely going anywhere.

anyway, just countering your direction.

 

[EarlTamm]

He mentions Shantae and Smash Bros around the 20 minute mark. It's very roundabout and kinda feels like a cop-out but he basically says Nintendo could use the polling data to give Shantae a trophy. Personally, whether she's a playable character or an AT (or hell, even actually a trophy) I would say that breaks the NDA. If she's playable, she would have a trophy. If she's an AT, she would have a trophy. If she's a trophy... =P

He also can't claim ignorance here because throughout the interview, it's very clear that he has extensive knowledge of the Smash series. Although I will say, he does sound very anxious at this point like he knew he said too much so... I don't know. I never really called into question Shantae's chances of being an AT. In fact... his follow-up basically confirms she's an AT.

He mentioned literally every other form of representation in the game: playable characters, trophies, Mii costumes and stages. He never once mentioned ATs, something I found to be very suspect. In his wrap-up statements he basically, covertly says, "Try to be satisfied with the outcome even if something is disappointing. Keep supporting the character and maybe she could be playable one day." That screams AT to me.



Being the co-director of the series, he's definitely high up enough to be required to sign an NDA and his speech patterns are unnatural when the subject is Shantae. As an example, when PushDustin mentions adding a Western character like Lara Croft he immediately changes tone and is all like, "Yeah! Yeah! Lara Croft for Smash!" It's unnatural.

Why wouldn't you push the IP you're more directly involved with? There's nothing wrong with harmless enthusiasm for your own material. Especially if Shantae isn't in the game in any form since he obviously wouldn't be under NDA.

To be frank, I think we cracked this. I hate to say it but I think she's an AT.

Nothing is definitive, and I kinda agree that it's just a lot of pessimism talking. Plus, saying an indie could become an assist trophy would kinda be unprecedented and that could easily be the reason. Let's not forget that Commander Video is a trophy in Smash 4.

 

[DOTBHDD]

He mentions Shantae and Smash Bros around the 20 minute mark. It's very roundabout and kinda feels like a cop-out but he basically says Nintendo could use the polling data to give Shantae a trophy. Personally, whether she's a playable character or an AT (or hell, even actually a trophy) I would say that breaks the NDA. If she's playable, she would have a trophy. If she's an AT, she would have a trophy. If she's a trophy... =P

He also can't claim ignorance here because throughout the interview, it's very clear that he has extensive knowledge of the Smash series. Although I will say, he does sound very anxious at this point like he knew he said too much so... I don't know. I never really called into question Shantae's chances of being an AT. In fact... his follow-up basically confirms she's an AT.

He mentioned literally every other form of representation in the game: playable characters, trophies, Mii costumes and stages. He never once mentioned ATs, something I found to be very suspect. In his wrap-up statements he basically, covertly says, "Try to be satisfied with the outcome even if something is disappointing. Keep supporting the character and maybe she could be playable one day." That screams AT to me.



Being the co-director of the series, he's definitely high up enough to be required to sign an NDA and his speech patterns are unnatural when the subject is Shantae. As an example, when PushDustin mentions adding a Western character like Lara Croft he immediately changes tone and is all like, "Yeah! Yeah! Lara Croft for Smash!" It's unnatural.

Why wouldn't you push the IP you're more directly involved with? There's nothing wrong with harmless enthusiasm for your own material. Especially if Shantae isn't in the game in any form since he obviously wouldn't be under NDA.

To be frank, I think we cracked this. I hate to say it but I think she's an AT.

"Try to be satisfied with the outcome even if something is disappointing. Keep supporting the character and maybe she could be playable one day."
Direct quote or paraphrase?

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

He mentions Shantae and Smash Bros around the 20 minute mark. It's very roundabout and kinda feels like a cop-out but he basically says Nintendo could use the polling data to give Shantae a trophy. Personally, whether she's a playable character or an AT (or hell, even actually a trophy) I would say that breaks the NDA. If she's playable, she would have a trophy. If she's an AT, she would have a trophy. If she's a trophy... =P

As far as I'm hearing, he only talked in hypotheticals and how the ballot could effect things in the future. He mentioned not even knowing if a Smash game was coming to Switch. We can't really take anything from this as evidence.

To be frank, I think we cracked this. I hate to say it but I think she's an AT.

You're definitely jumping the gun. Not saying this couldn't be the case, but you can't deduce that from this alone.

"Try to be satisfied with the outcome even if something is disappointing. Keep supporting the character and maybe she could be playable one day."
Direct quote or paraphrase?

Paraphrase.

 

[Teeb147]

Here's another phrase he said (at 22:34):
https://youtu.be/3CA9WDHGilM?t=1354

"..you never know what could happen. Maybe oo'll all be surprised by some announcement one day, of a character appearing in a game.."

'a character appearing in a game'.. hmm.. hmmm.

 

[Deleted member]

Found this.
https://twitter.com/MrBozon/status/971988893879840768
Complete with bonus Matt.

 

[EarlTamm]

Here's another phrase he said (at 22:34):
https://youtu.be/3CA9WDHGilM?t=1354

"..you never know what could happen. Maybe oo'll all be surprised by some announcement one day, of a character appearing in a game.."

'a character appearing in a game'.. hmm.. hmmm.

I swear I heard a nervous voice crack after he said that.

 

[DOTBHDD]

Can someone give me the actual quote please?

Okay. Two things are really bothering me because it's contradicting itself.

1. Why would anyone at WayForward agree to do an interview about indies in Smash if they knew they couldn't say anything about it in the first place if Shantae were in Smash? Not just playable but in ANY capacity. The interview itself wouldn't make sense to do if she were in. And why would James giveaway her being an assist trophy when Yacht Club Games kept it a secret. This interview is so... wierd. Why did it even happen in the first place?

2. If Shantae isn't in Smash then why is eveyone involved with WayForward being so quiet about it? If she's not in and they know she's not in then they should just be upfront. They would have by now. The support for Shanate in Smash is so blatant and so obvious that there's no way they can ignore it.

 

[Teeb147]

This is my last note on the interview for now, I listened a bit after the last mark, and it's clear that he just wants to say it'd be cool if someone like Shantae would be in smash but he's all over the place, and starts talking about how it'd be if an indie representative could make it over the known popular characters, and veers subject in there to talking about how cool their characters are. and then comes back to it later.

It just seems a little odd. May be nothing, but I will say that to me it seems like James is in a different play arena than the rest of WF.

 

[Jazzy Jinx]

"Try to be satisfied with the outcome even if something is disappointing. Keep supporting the character and maybe she could be playable one day."
Direct quote or paraphrase?

Paraphrase.

Direct quote: "Regardless of what happens it's best to be outcome independent and be excited about what they make but always continue to let your voice be heard. There's certainly many characters that I personally would like to see represented and um... *he pauses for a moment* ... I think it's important to be realistic but definitely continue to show your enthusiasm because you never know what could happen. Maybe we'll all be surprised one day by a character appearing in the game, I certainly hope so ya know."

And then he just mentions to keep being enthusiastic because "they're listening, they really are".

The entire time he's speaking, there's very little energy to his speech. It's only when they're off the subject of Shantae that he perks up and says goofy stuff like, "Oh yeah! I'd main Lara Croft. Oh yeah, I'd main Ribbon Girl!" To be frank, as I mentioned, it's unnatural the way he's speaking and you can't honestly tell me the subtext of the direct quote I provided isn't referring to Shantae.

He also mentioned how if an Indie got in they would have to beat out Japanese characters, Nintendo 1st parties and popular 3rd parties. It's all very pessimistic in tone. Almost as if Shantae had already been announced as an AT and he's trying to encourage fans to look on the bright side and understand why she might be an AT rather than playable. And given the comment of, "They're listening, they really are", I don't believe he could say that in confidence unless they themselves were contacted and it was because of the ballot results.

As I mentioned before, WayForward loves Shantae. They make games for other companies so they can make money so they can make Shantae games. They constantly re-tweet fanart of the series and pop up in Youtube comments. There's no way they would hold themselves back when it comes to Shantae and Smash. Not unless there was an NDA.

So yeah... given the unnatural speech patterns and the constant reassurance, I would have to conclude two things: 1) he IS under an NDA and 2) Shantae is an AT.

As I mentioned before, his Smash Bros knowledge is too extensive. He literally mentions every other form of representation, including playable fighter, other than AT. If the NDA is specifically drafted to prevent talk about her status as an AT, then he wouldn't be able to mention Shantae and ATs in the same sentence. He literally mentions everything else but AT.

 

[DOTBHDD]

Found this.
https://twitter.com/MrBozon/status/971988893879840768
Complete with bonus Matt.

This is actually good!

Okay so... this is basically proof that James didn't even know Smash Switch was a thing or that it was coming.

Basically. James knew nothing of Smash so he wouldn't know anything of Shantae being in Smash.
Which explains why James is being so outward about Smash Bros and WayForward is being vague as hell. Guessing that means Sakurai told Matt Bozon to keep it hush hush and maybe James didn't get the memo until later.

Okay. Puzzle pieces are starting to fit togther.

 

[EarlTamm]

Can someone give me the actual quote please?

Okay. Two things are really bothering me because it's contradicting itself.

1. Why would anyone at WayForward agree to do an interview about indies in Smash if they knew they couldn't say anything about it in the first place if Shantae were in Smash? Not just playable but in ANY capacity. The interview itself wouldn't make sense to do if she were in. And why would James giveaway her being an assist trophy when Yacht Club Games kept it a secret. This interview is so... wierd. Why did it even happen in the first place?

2. If Shantae isn't in Smash then why is eveyone involved with WayForward being so quiet about it? If she's not in and they know she's not in then they should just be upfront. They would have by now. The support for Shantae in Smash is so blatant and so obvious that there's no way they can ignore it.

Good points. Well, either he does not know or himself and Wayforward just have that much confidence in him. Also, maybe he was the best option for Source Gaming when trying to find a famous indie dev to comment on Smash Bros. He does seem to be a known fan, and turning it down would be suspicious.

This is actually good!

Okay so... this is basically proof that James didn't even know Smash Switch was a thing or that it was coming.

Basically. James knew nothing of Smash so he wouldn't know anything of Shantae being in Smash.
Which explains why James is being so outward about Smash Bros and WayForward is being vague as hell. Guessing that means Sakurai told Matt Bozon to keep it hush hush and maybe James didn't get the memo until later.

Okay. Puzzle pieces are starting to fit togther.

This would explain some things. Btw, I love that there is a single Smash Shantae post in the comment section and that is being completely ignored. It sums up so much in contrast to the tweets above.

 

[Teeb147]

Paraphrase.

Direct quote: "Regardless of what happens it's best to be outcome independent and be excited about what they make but always continue to let your voice be heard. There's certainly many characters that I personally would like to see represented and um... *he pauses for a moment* ... I think it's important to be realistic but definitely continue to show your enthusiasm because you never know what could happen. Maybe we'll all be surprised one day by a character appearing in the game, I certainly hope so ya know."

And then he just mentions to keep being enthusiastic because "they're listening, they really are".

The entire time he's speaking, there's very little energy to his speech. It's only when they're off the subject of Shantae that he perks up and says goofy stuff like, "Oh yeah! I'd main Lara Croft. Oh yeah, I'd main Ribbon Girl!" To be frank, as I mentioned, it's unnatural the way he's speaking and you can't honestly tell me the subtext of the direct quote I provided isn't referring to Shantae.

He also mentioned how if an Indie got in they would have to beat out Japanese characters, Nintendo 1st parties and popular 3rd parties. It's all very pessimistic in tone. Almost as if Shantae had already been announced as an AT and he's trying to encourage fans to look on the bright side and understand why she might be an AT rather than playable. And given the comment of, "They're listening, they really are", I don't believe he could say that in confidence unless they themselves were contacted and it was because of the ballot results.

As I mentioned before, WayForward loves Shantae. They make games for other companies so they can make money so they can make Shantae games. They constantly re-tweet fanart of the series and pop up in Youtube comments. There's no way they would hold themselves back when it comes to Shantae and Smash. Not unless there was an NDA.

So yeah... given the unnatural speech patterns and the constant reassurance, I would have to conclude two things: 1) he IS under an NDA and 2) Shantae is an AT.

As I mentioned before, his Smash Bros knowledge is too extensive. He literally mentions every other form of representation, including playable fighter, other than AT. If the NDA is specifically drafted to prevent talk about her status as an AT, then he wouldn't be able to mention Shantae and ATs in the same sentence. He literally mentions everything else but AT.

Oh wow, that's funny that you got that out of that area.

Interpretation is one hell of a drug.

I'm not demeaning you at all. I've seen emotional interpretations like these before.
Not saying I don't do it too in some ways. Just saying, there's different ways to see this stuff, by a lot.

 

[AngrySun88]

If she's an AT, then why wasn't she shown with Shovel Knight and the others? Why go through this whole routine just for an AT?

We know that with SK Sakurai is thinking about indies, and Shantae is the Queen of indies. We know by the polls that she's doing well, and her games are popular enough in Japan. She's an expressive character with tons of potential. She ticks a lot of boxes.

I'm also trying to keep my expectations low after Ashley, but to be honest I think you could come up with just about any conclusion from that interview.

 

[TheRandomCities4]

So when keeping all options on the table, we're somewhat torn between AT and playable character. I would say that given what we have come to know, these two options carry more weight than Shantae simply not being in Smash Ultimate at all.

EDIT: The longer we go on without seeing Shantae as an AT, the higher the likelihood of her being a playable character given the SK AT (IMO). However, by the same right, so would the 3rd option's likelihood increase (bad news if true).

 

[EarlTamm]

Paraphrase.

Direct quote: "Regardless of what happens it's best to be outcome independent and be excited about what they make but always continue to let your voice be heard. There's certainly many characters that I personally would like to see represented and um... *he pauses for a moment* ... I think it's important to be realistic but definitely continue to show your enthusiasm because you never know what could happen. Maybe we'll all be surprised one day by a character appearing in the game, I certainly hope so ya know."

And then he just mentions to keep being enthusiastic because "they're listening, they really are".

The entire time he's speaking, there's very little energy to his speech. It's only when they're off the subject of Shantae that he perks up and says goofy stuff like, "Oh yeah! I'd main Lara Croft. Oh yeah, I'd main Ribbon Girl!" To be frank, as I mentioned, it's unnatural the way he's speaking and you can't honestly tell me the subtext of the direct quote I provided isn't referring to Shantae.

He also mentioned how if an Indie got in they would have to beat out Japanese characters, Nintendo 1st parties and popular 3rd parties. It's all very pessimistic in tone. Almost as if Shantae had already been announced as an AT and he's trying to encourage fans to look on the bright side and understand why she might be an AT rather than playable. And given the comment of, "They're listening, they really are", I don't believe he could say that in confidence unless they themselves were contacted and it was because of the ballot results.

As I mentioned before, WayForward loves Shantae. They make games for other companies so they can make money so they can make Shantae games. They constantly re-tweet fanart of the series and pop up in Youtube comments. There's no way they would hold themselves back when it comes to Shantae and Smash. Not unless there was an NDA.

So yeah... given the unnatural speech patterns and the constant reassurance, I would have to conclude two things: 1) he IS under an NDA and 2) Shantae is an AT.

As I mentioned before, his Smash Bros knowledge is too extensive. He literally mentions every other form of representation, including playable fighter, other than AT. If the NDA is specifically drafted to prevent talk about her status as an AT, then he wouldn't be able to mention Shantae and ATs in the same sentence. He literally mentions everything else but AT.

Oh wow, that's funny that you got that out of that area.

Interpretation is one hell of a drug.

I'm not demeaning you at all. I've seen emotional interpretations like these before.
Not saying I don't do it too in some ways. Just saying, there's different ways to see this stuff, by a lot.

I mean, none of this is really concrete and just sorta based on interpretation. Plus, as seen above, I think there's a distinct possibility that he did not know about Smash Ultimate.

 

[Teeb147]

I'm taking off from here for a while or even for the night, but before I do I just want to stress that there are vastly different ways to interpret all of this.
Making fast conclusions doesn't work well. We can take the time to talk things through, and see things from bigger perspectives too.
Relax, and allow the dust to settle a bit, things are still open, and we can see more about it with a bit of time.

ciao. <3

 

[DOTBHDD]

Paraphrase.

Direct quote: "Regardless of what happens it's best to be outcome independent and be excited about what they make but always continue to let your voice be heard. There's certainly many characters that I personally would like to see represented and um... *he pauses for a moment* ... I think it's important to be realistic but definitely continue to show your enthusiasm because you never know what could happen. Maybe we'll all be surprised one day by a character appearing in the game, I certainly hope so ya know."

And then he just mentions to keep being enthusiastic because "they're listening, they really are".

The entire time he's speaking, there's very little energy to his speech. It's only when they're off the subject of Shantae that he perks up and says goofy stuff like, "Oh yeah! I'd main Lara Croft. Oh yeah, I'd main Ribbon Girl!" To be frank, as I mentioned, it's unnatural the way he's speaking and you can't honestly tell me the subtext of the direct quote I provided isn't referring to Shantae.

He also mentioned how if an Indie got in they would have to beat out Japanese characters, Nintendo 1st parties and popular 3rd parties. It's all very pessimistic in tone. Almost as if Shantae had already been announced as an AT and he's trying to encourage fans to look on the bright side and understand why she might be an AT rather than playable. And given the comment of, "They're listening, they really are", I don't believe he could say that in confidence unless they themselves were contacted and it was because of the ballot results.

As I mentioned before, WayForward loves Shantae. They make games for other companies so they can make money so they can make Shantae games. They constantly re-tweet fanart of the series and pop up in Youtube comments. There's no way they would hold themselves back when it comes to Shantae and Smash. Not unless there was an NDA.

So yeah... given the unnatural speech patterns and the constant reassurance, I would have to conclude two things: 1) he IS under an NDA and 2) Shantae is an AT.

As I mentioned before, his Smash Bros knowledge is too extensive. He literally mentions every other form of representation, including playable fighter, other than AT. If the NDA is specifically drafted to prevent talk about her status as an AT, then he wouldn't be able to mention Shantae and ATs in the same sentence. He literally mentions everything else but AT.

Okay. That direct quote helps a lot. And this is quite is cherry on the whip. He knows nothing. James is a Smash fan that loves Shantae just as much as we do. Think about it. Actually don't. It's simple. Why would he tell us to support something ("Shantae for Smash") if he knew the outcome? Easy. He doesn't.

He didn't know about Smash and he doesn't know about Shantae's current position in Smash. He's just a big fan that didn't know anything other than his excitement. I think he sounded nervous because he didn't want to outright say if she was in or out just in case. My honest hunch is that he's just an awkward kinda guy.

So, I guess that interview means nothing other than James wasn't in on the Shantae thing. Or maybe he knew and his confidence was getting shaky. Because wasn't there a picture of him and Sakurai floating around stating he didn't know the current position of Shantae but he loved Sakurai?

Anyway, it doens't matter because right now the most important question Shantae fans need to be asking is... Why are they so quiet?

 

[Jazzy Jinx]

Oh wow, that's funny that you got that out of that area.

Interpretation is one hell of a drug.

I'm not demeaning you at all. I've seen emotional interpretations like these before.
Not saying I don't do it too in some ways. Just saying, there's different ways to see this stuff, by a lot.

No disrespect, you're more likely to be clouded by your emotions if you're being overly optimistic. His voice cracks during that monologue and the subtext is undoubtedly Shantae. It doesn't sound enthusiastic at all.

If she's an AT, then why wasn't she shown with Shovel Knight and the others? Why go through this whole routine just for an AT?

Come on man, we both went through Ashley's deconfirmation. >_>

We know for a fact we don't have all of the ATs yet. Why not save a few bigger ones to "please" the fans?

---

For a more optimistic interpretation, perhaps he was under a catch-all NDA. Like Nintendo just rolled up to them and said, "Hey. We're going to do something with this character but we're not telling you what it is. Sign this NDA." Maybe only Matt Bozon is required to be part of the design process.

I would feel a lot more comfortable with all this if he would have ever mentioned ATs, but he didn't.

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

We've over-analyzed things before, but I think now we're getting to the territory of over-over-analyzing. This is an interview from the beginning of last year that uses very vague language when talking about Shantae and Smash. It's mostly just about the hurdles of indies getting into Smash, but not saying it's impossible, and I think that hurdle has pretty much already been crossed with Shovel Knight's AT.

Only time will tell.

 

[Deleted member]

OK. So I got my stalker on (don't call the police) and I tracked down 8 more WF employees twitters, Put them all though twitter advanced search.
Non of them have tweeted the words Shantae and Smash in the same tweet, ever.
Then I looked at each time they all said Smash or Shantae,

All the Shantae Tweets were mostly standard "support our kickstarter" and "proud of this team"
And all the Smash related tweets were mostly memes.

Although I did find this useless gem.
https://twitter.com/JamesPopStar/status/628751909785075712
I believe that was the same talk the Pacman trailer was first shown. James was lucky enough to be in the room for that. So thats cool

 

[DOTBHDD]

We've over-analyzed things before, but I think now we're getting to the territory of over-over-analyzing. This is an interview from the beginning of last year that uses very vague language when talking about Shantae and Smash. It's mostly just about the hurdles of indies getting into Smash, but not saying it's impossible, and I think that hurdle has pretty much already been crossed with Shovel Knight's AT.

Only time will tell.

I agree. James didn't know anything mostly because of that Tweet. Or he knew but was taking a risk which I highly doubt.

WayForward has to know something. Because they aren't talking. At all...

 

[EarlTamm]

OK. So I got my stalker on (don't call the police) and I tracked down 8 more WF employees twitters, Put them all though twitter advanced search.
Non of them have tweeted the words Shantae and Smash in the same tweet, ever.
Then I looked at each time they all said Smash or Shantae,

All the Shantae Tweets were mostly standard "support our kickstarter" and "proud of this team"
And all the Smash related tweets were mostly memes.

Although I did find this useless gem.
https://twitter.com/JamesPopStar/status/628751909785075712
I believe that was the same talk the Pacman trailer was first shown. James was lucky enough to be in the room for that. So thats cool

So, even during the ballot they did not say a peep? I mean, if it's just random developers it's probably nothing, but it is interesting. As for the gem, you can just tell he snuck that in there for a quick humble brag.

 

[Jazzy Jinx]

We've over-analyzed things before, but I think now we're getting to the territory of over-over-analyzing. This is an interview from the beginning of last year that uses very vague language when talking about Shantae and Smash. It's mostly just about the hurdles of indies getting into Smash, but not saying it's impossible, and I think that hurdle has pretty much already been crossed with Shovel Knight's AT.

Only time will tell.

I don't think you're being fair.

WayForward loves to shout Shantae from the mountains. James, in particular, is a huge Smash Bros fan as well. And in the very same interview he openly talks about other candidates, candidates he would know nothing about.

It's not a logical stretch to assume he was being very careful with his word choice regarding Shantae specifically.

So when keeping all options on the table, we're somewhat torn between AT and playable character. I would say that given what we have come to know, these two options carry more weight than Shantae simply not being in Smash Ultimate at all.

EDIT: The longer we go on without seeing Shantae as an AT, the higher the likelihood of her being a playable character given the SK AT (IMO). However, by the same right, so would the 3rd option's likelihood increase (bad news if true).

Frankly, I think those are the only two options.

It's going to be hell if we have to wait until the game is a few days from release to know what her fate is.

 

[DOTBHDD]

Alright, detectives. Let's pick up this case tomorrow. Time to hit the sack.

 

[EarlTamm]

Alright, detectives. Let's pick up this case tomorrow. Time to hit the sack.

Yeah, this seems like the sort of thing we all need to sleep on before we can say anything for certain. Plus, I need an excuse to go to bed.

 

[Louisacommie]

Shantae will 100 percent happen. Been right for e3 and the direct so obviously I'm a profit

 

[Captain Hazama]

Alright, detectives. Let's pick up this case tomorrow. Time to hit the sack.

Me:

 

[A1Again]

 

[Shinuto]

James most likely isn't under NDA has his position at WF might not require him to know about the dealing with Shantae getting in Smash.

 

[Xevious 1]

I could see a Shantae trailer being similar to the Inklings, in that you think this is for Splatoon but it actually turns out to be for Smash. So it would start out looking like gameplay for half genie hero without the smash intro making you think this DLC or a new Shantae game, but then eventually find out that this is for Smash Bros and we get a CGI cut scene then actual gameplay of her. I wont get my hopes up, but a Nindies direct would be the perfect time to reveal her and we only have 3 months left till the game launches.

 

[MajestyIndigo]

I personally think that actions speak louder than words ( the interview) ; She is not included in any fighting games but she is in other games, we had plenty of obvious hints in jammies mode here and there, the whole company behaves very silent whenever smash's topic is brought up to them ect
I may be deluded, but to me that interviews does not weight nearly as much as these FACTS.

 

[Deleted member]

All this talk of NDA and wither or not James knew, made me question who would know such information.
So I did some digging and I checked the trademark on Shantae, to see if Wayforward even owns a part of her.

Spoiler: Trademark Info

So Wayforward doesn't own Shantae, Only Matt and Erin, So technically Nintendo would only need to do business with the Bozons, and only they would need to be under a theoretical NDA.

Now one thing is Matt is also a WF founder, so its unclear how much legal stake he has in the company, and by extension if this theoretical NDA would apply.


Also I think I'm gonna need a tinfoil had and some red string soon lol.

 

[Shinuto]

All this talk of NDA and wither or not James knew, made me question who would know such information.
So I did some digging and I checked the trademark on Shantae, to see if Wayforward even owns a part of her.

Spoiler: Trademark Info

View attachment 159486

So Wayforward doesn't own Shantae, Only Matt and Erin, So technically Nintendo would only need to do business with the Bozons, and only they would need to be under a theoretical NDA.

Now one thing is Matt is also a WF founder, so its unclear how much legal stake he has in the company, and by extension if this theoretical NDA would apply.


Also I think I'm gonna need a tinfoil had and some red string soon lol.

Well it would need to extend to the WF twitter handler(s)

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Going in a bit of a different direction

If Jammies Mode is a hint, then that means they've promoted a Nintendo game across all platforms, including PS4.

The same console from the company that taints your Fortnite accounts because they hate their competitors that much.

I'm just imagining the fist shaking rage they must be having if/when it all goes down.