Sexy Marth Dittos (videos)

[Shai Hulud]

Shai Hulud (black Marth) vs. 3GOD (blue Marth) - Pokemon Stadium

Shai Hulud (black Marth) vs. 3GOD (blue Marth) - Final Destination

Criticism welcome.

 

[~Endless]

Great Matches

Both of you are pretty text book and certainly above average I say, Black Marth had a little better spacing then Blue Marth and was a bit more on w/ the mind games I think though Blue Marth made some nice moves to keep up and was creative, good stuff.

btw if Blue Marth had tech'd that first kill during match 2 on FD that would have been sick XD

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Sexy marth dittos?...lol...I suppose you get points for trying..

Final destination match.

At the beginning you showed decent spacing but you really need to mix things up instead of focusing on fairing. You leaping off after you tippered him so far off wasn't a very good idea, if he teched that up-b hit, you'd have been edgeguarded...stick to more reliable methods in cases like that.

The airdodge up so high and safe at around 30 seconds?...no reason to be doing that.

Now you're starting to jump high, getting above a fellow marth isn't a good idea unless hes got no stage under him.

You really need to be wary of the range of marth's f-smash, you are falling prey to it quite abit.

D-tilt edgeguarding is good but at lower damages, as you seen, he made it back..you need to be him further out with an f-smash.

The dair sucide wasn't too good..and the random f-smashes can be punished badly. But speaking of the dair, you're trying to spike him far too much and trying it at the wrong times.

Your wavedashing wasn't used much unless he was respawning..and when you did, you went right into attacks for the most part.

You came down with the d-air abit too much as well on your last stock for no real reason.

Your edgeguarding needs work in dittos and you need to stop being sloppy as the match goes on..learn the spacing of marth's attacks as you seemed to not realize the range of most things, learn his ranges so you can tell when you are safe and when you are not. You need to be baiting marth more with your dashes as he seemed smash and grab happy..sort of like he did at around 3 minutes..he could have punished you badly. Your dash dancing wasn't used much close range..you mostly did it well away from your foe. Also..if you tried shieldgrabbin his sloppy spacing during the f-air battles, you'd have made your life much easier.

you seem to be just learning marth as you haven't got down the spacing and you are, as the above poster said, textbook..spamming fairs without thinking about better things to do at the time. You will surely improve but be more open about your game, you were too predictable.

 

[Schweppes]

Looks pretty good for the most part, but you guys didn't grab nearly enough(your approach was kinda predictable...), and random FSmashes shouldn't work quite as well as they did. >_>

My post feels so small compared to blue's.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

I'm sorry schweppes..I tend to really be picky when I critque someone..how about you handle the other match and I take a breather?

 

[Schweppes]

Uhhh... I guess I could do that. >_> I'll edit this post when I'm done. Stay tuned!

 

[Emblem Lord]

Spacing is almost meaningless in Marth dittos.

Does anyone know why?

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Spacing isn't meanless in marth dittos emblem lord.

I go by everything you say usually but I disagree massively in this part due to the fact you need to be wary of what your range and his range is.

If you're getting at marth's grab range being so great to interrupt combos regardless of spacing, or being the fact marth can do the same to you and his range is your range...meh, thats a give-me

But spacing is important in every matchup..In my marth ditto experiences and watching many many pro marth dittos, spacing is very important..I don't know what you are trying to get at by saying its useless, you may not think its important as some other aspect of the marth ditto but by no means is it useless.

 

[thereaperX]

Spacing is almost meaningless in Marth dittos.

rofl you have no clue what you're talking about. nice try.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

lol thereaperX, Emblem lord is a marth board member that is held very high up, at least to me.

I'm Extremely curious to why he said that though..he wouldn't say it for no reason.

 

[thereaperX]

I know who he is. he's not some amazing "pro" marth but, as you said, he's not rubbish either. I never said anything about his skill.

all i said was...to say "spacing is meaningless in marth dittos" is total garbage.

 

[Omni]

More wavedashing out of shield to grab after missed f-smashes rather then trying to get the SH d-air.

F-throw to dash attack when Marth DI's away. F-throw to f-smash/f-air when he doesn't.

Lots of SHFFLC'ed f-airs being thrown out on both sides. Don't be afraid to take a hit and CC grab one. Better payoff.

Stop DI'ing inward toward the stage. That's the reason for the massive d-air spikes and f-air juggling.

Blue Marth looked extremely ******** on FD match near the end. Forces me to believe that both of your Marth's are just really fast and flashy, and lack really good mindgames, despite the fact the Black Marth was more smarter/aggressive.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Xthereaper, you responded like he knew nothing is all, you've got to realize hes bound to have a good reason to make such an odd statement..

starting to get good crits in here, haven't seen omni in quite some time.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Equal range is why spacing doesn't matter as much in Marth dittos.

I say almost meaning less because in every other match spacing is probably the most important aspect of his game. In Marth dittos it doesn't matter as much.

thereaperx: Correction. First you said I have no idea what I'm talking about. Which implies that I know nothing about Marth. Then you said that my particular comment is incorrect after bluedeath said something.

My guess is you realized how silly your statement was about me not knowing what I'm talking about so you switched around what you meant. Which is good, because in all honesty, only about a handful of people know more about Marth then me.

You aren't one of them.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

lol @ emblem lord's ownage...

And I guessed right..as you can see..but you said meaningless so I was about skepitcal if you had another reason that was greater than that.

Check out my guideline thread by the way emblem, you'll like it.

 

[Emblem Lord]

I think Cactuar is rubbing off on me. >_>

 

[thereaperX]

honestly...what he said is incorrect, simple as that. just because he's emblem lord doesn't mean he's going to be right all the time.

if people just think about the basicis of marth vs....anybody, it should be ridiculously obvious that in any of his matchups, at least one of his moves is going to require perfect, "tipper" spacing to have great results.

let's see...marth ditto, right away I can think of the need to keep your opponent (marth) in the air with tippered up airs if you choose to juggle that way.

let's say you land a forward air...you're going to want to tipper a forward (or reverse) up tilt in order to achieve optimal "combo-contiuning" status. if you do a horribly spaced "hilt" up tilt, you're just going to send your opponent flying away, destroying the combo (unless of course you wanted to use hilt utilts horizontal power to kill).

I really could go on but I think people get the point....spacing is critically important in marth's game vs anyone.

spacing is probably the biggest thing that separates the "pro" marths from everyone else.

 

[Randizzle]

I think that spacing matters in the sense that it means the difference between a rewarding tipper and combo setups as opposed to a whiffed attack that can be punished. But other than that, there are more important aspects of marth's playing that are more important in the dittos such as good mindgames, good DI, a strong grab game, and a few other things.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Randizzle gets what I was saying earlier...anyway.

lol, emblem is getting angry....well its only natural, after you get so much noob questions and dealing with lesser players all the time, its a wonder you don't turn green and start smashing..or you could be like me and magically get all the noob players to hate you..

Its a talent of mine...anyway.

Reaper, please don't turn this thread into a flame fight, I don't want it closed.

 

[Emblem Lord]

I honestly don't see that as spacing so much as knowing how to combo. When I say spacing I mean in terms of knowing your distance, and being far enough to punish a whiffed move while staying just outside someone's "zone".

Also knowing how to make slight adjustements to your spacing such as SH backwards shuffeld Nair or d-tilt then slight wavedash back. Basically using attacks to mask your intention to adjust your position and such to force your opponent to get past your blade and look for openings. Ultimately you want to make your opponent think they can rush you when in reality when they try they will just get grabbed or comboed due to your spacing and Marth's ability to control space really thanks to his speed and range.

Your definition of spacing is very basic. I was thinking of it on a higher level.

I suppose that's the difference between you and me.

 

[Heart Break Kid]

Your definition of spacing is very basic. I was thinking of it on a higher level.

I suppose that's the difference between you and me.

Lets not get cocky emblem lord. lmao

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Emblem is still getting with the pwning of teh words...

Anyway, lets not get too heated.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Am I wrong?

That was why I think spacing in Marth dittos doesn't matter as much. If you read what spacing is all about in my post you can understand my point.

The range is equal so the zone of control is equal. Spacing has it's place in combos, but there are other more important things in Marth dittos.

 

[thereaperX]

Emblem is still getting with the pwning of teh words...

Anyway, lets not get too heated.

Honestly what on earth are you talking about. Clearly emblem lord's definition of "spacing" and mine differ, leading to the dispute. Nobody "owned" anything.

lol, emblem is getting angry....well its only natural, after you get so much noob questions and dealing with lesser players all the time, its a wonder you don't turn green and start smashing..or you could be like me and magically get all the noob players to hate you..

Its a talent of mine...anyway.

Are you implying that I'm some "noob" player?


Emblem lord - even with your new definition of "spacing," it's still critical to control that "zone" well enough to land the fairs, the grabs, etc. Spacing is still important in your case.

Maybe you meant to say that in a Marth ditto, the opportunity to achieve optimal "zone control" is equal.

 

[Emblem Lord]

My definition of spacing isn't new.

And yes, that last part you said is true. Another reason why spacing overall has less importance IMO.

 

[Shai Hulud]

Thanks for the comments guys...those of you who said it seemed I was playing more fast/flashy than good are essentially correct. Marth is not my main by any means and I do try to go for spikes at times when I surely have better options (like the attempted suicide spike on FD).

How specifically should I edgeguard Marth differently?

Oh and the random fulljumps are mostly me ****ing up my wavedashing because I was playing Ice Climbers in the matches before.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

I said pwned, not owned. Theres a difference!

And it was all in good fun, just poking at you and emblem.

but really its nothing to agrue about when the topic creator doesn't really need it, he needs to improve his spacing in general so its needed here.

 

[Brightside6382]

Spacing is garbage in general, why space when you can just throw out as many F-smashes as possible?

Remember, time spent not f-smashing is better spent F-smashing.

 

[Cactuar]

Behold. For I am Cactus.

Moving around all pretty and stuff > good spacing in Marth dittos.

That is all.

*cactus dance*

(postscript: Swing your sword.)

 

[TedBoosley]

God I hate Marth dittos

 

[thereaperX]

Behold. For I am Cactus.

Moving around all pretty and stuff > good spacing in Marth dittos.

That is all.

lol i'm gonna have to say "no" to that.

 

[Randizzle]

I miss getting the chance to play good marth dittos. Not enough good marths around here... haven't had a good marth ditto since FC =(

 

[Cactuar]

lol i'm gonna have to say "no" to that.

Uh oh. Looks like "thereaperX" knows more about Marth dittos than me.

 

[Ryan-K]

Yeah he plays with Mew2king everyday unlike you do Cactuar !!!

 

[pockyD]

lol @ all the asskissing on marth boards o_o

 

[thereaperX]

Yeah he plays with Mew2king everyday unlike you do Cactuar !!!

First, get off this ******** notion that Cactuar is the only one who gets access to really good players. I may not play mew2king everyday, but I get to play caveman and xelic everyday. They are no mew2kings, but they aren't too shabby either.

Second off, while on the subject of Mew2king, since you two seem to respect him so much, I went ahead and asked for his opinion.

That's a screenshot of what he told me.


Even though he says he does both, he was quick to say that what Cactuar said was "obviously false."

In conclusion, superryan get off Cactuar's nuts. Cactuar quit using your "semi-pro status" to spew nonsensical junk about what's good and what's not in marth dittos.

Even when you're "moving around all pretty," you're inherently spacing yourself the entire time. You want me to believe that you just move around all pretty with no regard to spacing at all, which is precisely what you're statement "
Moving around all pretty and stuff > good spacing in Marth dittos" implies? Sorry, no, wrong.

Does this mean I think you're bad at Marth dittos? No, you're good at Marth dittos. You've beaten forward before, great. You're better than me.

All this means is that you like to use exploit your status to convince random noobs that you're right when you say stuff like moving around "all pretty and stuff" is > spacing.

Moving around intelligently in Marth dittos and spacing are not mutually exclusive, and I'm giving you due credit when I say that you certainly must have the ability to move around intelligently in Marth dittos since you are good at them.

 

[Keitaro]

Edit: Nevermind, I don't care.

Either way, shouldn't you ask M2K the general question instead of that little thing Cactuar posted which sounded kinda like a joke?

 

[Emblem Lord]

People still don't understand that Cactuar doesn't give a **** and just says things randomly?

 

[Winston]

Man "cactus dance" still has me lolling...

 

[fugito348]

uh oh ur not watchign porn are you reaper x? suspicious taskbar ya got there nah im jus playin