Say "Fuzzy Pickles." Ness Video/Critique Thread

[The_NZA]

throw me your twitch id again. I subscribe to some people but I never fel like that helps me keep in contact.

 

[Bryonato]

www.twitch.tv/bryonato

 

[Calabrel]

I have a lot of 2.6 Ness videos, I'll post two for now, and if you guys want more, I'll post them:

Oksas (Falcon) vs Calabrel (Ness)
Oksas (Wolf) vs Calabrel (Ness)
Bonus: 0-death combo on Peach

 

[Nido]

That's insane O_o

 

[GMaster171]

Alright, I watched the Pit set. Inspiring play. Definitely picked up some cool dtilt/standing jab resets that I didn't know Ness had. Helps his read game a lot (which I think in general is pretty weak). There are two thing in this matchup I would have liked to see more of from you.

1. Psi Magnet. If you know that magnet absorbs him and Pit can't really do that much from a distance that punishes you, just use it. It'll put him on tilt, piss him off, and make him rely on the arrows less.

2. The swinging DJC bair. I noticed you did a lot of instant DJC, and DJC out of magnet, but I think one of the most powerful aspects of DJC comes from the "swinging" aspect you get from jumping away from an opponent and then at your apex jumping towards with a Bair (maybe try with other aerials as well). This sort of swinging motion is hard for opponents to punish and it can land some bairs as kill moves that you wouldn't expect. I think you didn't exploit the full range of the DJC and you should try it out in practice.

Other than that, like I said––inspiring play. My only question for you, do you think nair has applicability in this matchup? Is it worth going for sometimes, and if so, why didn't you?


Edit: Results thread:
http://smashboards.com/threads/demo-2-6-tournament-results-archive-created-7-26-2013.339178/

I cant say why I didn't absorb with magnet, or DJC like that, I'm still learning so I don't notice what I'm doing wrong during the match (yesterday I usmashed with Wolf 4 times in a row without noticing, someone pointed it out to me and it felt stupid that I'd even try that)

With the magnet, Iv never got used to absorbing with it, Iv always used it for offence. I was trying to focus on PS (or at least safely shielding) them, or beating them with safe aerials. Ill def try to use the absorbing part of magnet more as I can.

My worst weakness is tourny nerves atm. I either think too much and mess up simple things, or I don't think enough and run into obvious traps :/, I felt much better this weekend compared to last weekend, it was the pressure of that being my first legit regional that got to me really bad.

I got more videos from this weekend's tourny, 3rd (tho I should have got 4th, a Falco player SD'd twice on last match and still brought me to last stock) this time with more videos.

 

[The_NZA]

My dear friends! I went to a Brawl tourney with a PM side tourney today (my first PM "competitive" experience), but not enough people showed up to have a tournament. Still, I got a lot of friendlies done, and I even got some on stream for you all. (The_NZA v. Hot Dog Turtle)

http://www.twitch.tv/gameunderground/b/447318425
@3:02:00 is the match start.

I was on a tear earlier but I got hungry and tired by the time we got on stream. Still, I would love to hear your criticisms and comments. Feel free to add the video if possible to the OP.

So excited to have this skype group and a place for all of us to talk and push the metagame for Ness.

 

[Nguz95]

Your Ness is dope, fresh, whatever you want to call it; it's awesome! Honestely your matches were really good. I need serious work on spacing with Ness, and watching you gave me a few really good ideas.

I small suggestion from the journeyman Ness player: you might want to use PK Flash to finish those back throws that don't kill. When you didn't do it against Wario I thought it might have been since Wario has so much air maneuverability, but when I saw you didn't do it against Bowser I figured I would make that my critique of the night. Great matches! You make my Ness look so dumpy...

 

[The_NZA]

Your Ness is dope, fresh, whatever you want to call it; it's awesome! Honestely your matches were really good. I need serious work on spacing with Ness, and watching you gave me a few really good ideas.

I small suggestion from the journeyman Ness player: you might want to use PK Flash to finish those back throws that don't kill. When you didn't do it against Wario I thought it might have been since Wario has so much air maneuverability, but when I saw you didn't do it against Bowser I figured I would make that my critique of the night. Great matches! You make my Ness look so dumpy...

Aww shucks your a sweetheart! I definitely should have opted for PK flash against bowser since he has no way around it. I played for 8 hours today, and I wish I recorded some of it. Hopefully i'll go to tourneys in the future.

 

[The_NZA]

I have a lot of 2.6 Ness videos, I'll post two for now, and if you guys want more, I'll post them:

Oksas (Falcon) vs Calabrel (Ness)
Oksas (Wolf) vs Calabrel (Ness)
Bonus: 0-death combo on Peach

You need to join us in the skype group. Give us your skype name.

 

[Red(SP)]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_3XEjneMDI

Leaving this here for critique. I have a long way to go in the world.
Enjoy.

 

[The_NZA]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_3XEjneMDI

Leaving this here for critique. I have a long way to go in the world.
Enjoy.

The segment at 3:22 is fresh as ****!

EDIT:

It's hard to give advice during a combo vid (cause im not analyzing your general play) but you should definitely play magnet DJC attacks. They are pretty good and open up Ness's aerial combo game (alhtough your doing well with utilizing Ness's ground game, which is saying something).

 

[Red(SP)]

The segment at 3:22 is fresh as ****!

EDIT:

It's hard to give advice during a combo vid (cause im not analyzing your general play) but you should definitely play magnet DJC attacks. They are pretty good and open up Ness's aerial combo game (alhtough your doing well with utilizing Ness's ground game, which is saying something).

I played a guy recently who gave me a really tough time. The power shield buff did break my habit of casually approaching with f-air from time to time, and I'm trying to iron out some habits that are stuck on me. I did learn how to fully utilize his magnet not too long ago, but I'm trying to find some stylish use for it. It's been overall helping my momentum shifting game a ton. I really need to get wavebouncing/b-sticking down for momentous usages. You'll never really know how applicable it'll be until the time comes, so I wanna have this stuff down on pat.

 

[The_NZA]

I have a lot of 2.6 Ness videos, I'll post two for now, and if you guys want more, I'll post them:

Oksas (Falcon) vs Calabrel (Ness)
Oksas (Wolf) vs Calabrel (Ness)
Bonus: 0-death combo on Peach

I came across this vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhfNF5EBcUA

I love your speed/movement at 1:20. Also, excellent usage of yoyo at 3:11. How often do you use yoyo as edgeguard? Do you prefer it to bat?

Also, you should join us in the Ness skype group we have going on. Every major ness player who posts is in it.

 

[Calabrel]

I have a rather special treat for you guys: Axe (Pikachu) vs Calabrel (Ness)

And The_NZA, I'm flattered about the Skype group, but I'm rarely on it, please feel free to add me, my UN on there, or at least what I use to log in with is Calabrel1.

 

[Kayo]

I guess it's about time I post my videos here although a lot of them are quite old (the last 4 especially), I'll let you guys pick at them.
First up, a fairly recent set with a friend of mine.
Then, (I have) (a couple) (of friendly) (matches.)

They're nothing too special. I play slightly more read heavy in a tournament setting but this is pretty much my playstyle. I know Calabrel saw the saw the first set on reddit and critiqued it and I'd like to think him and I've been working to improvement. Looking forward to the feedback positive or negative.

 

[GMaster171]

Added to the OP, Everything should be up to date now.

Keep em coming guys, good to see other's videos :D

Edit: Where's the mods, I never got my sticky

 

[Calabrel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7x4d7y04Yms

Pay special attention to 21:05

 

[The_NZA]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7x4d7y04Yms

Pay special attention to 21:05

The big thing I learned from this video is that I need to use my air/combo magnets closer to the ground. It makes wavedashing out of it if you have to, way easier.

Also, can you comment on your occasional usage of a grounded magnet for keepaway, instead of jump grab. Did you jump cancel db out of shield to do it?

Also, can you please log on skype and accept my ****ing invitation so I can put you and your beautiful brain in the ness chat?

 

[The_NZA]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqlanspjdew

Solar's peach took me out of this tourney, but we played some friendlies afterwards. Thanks to Kid Koopa for recording.

EDIT:

Here's the first tourney game with me v. Fatal. Honestly, I didn't feel to good about it but looking back, it wasn't all that bad (except for the SDs).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdivMV717bE

 

[GMaster171]

Added to OP

 

[The_NZA]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksjOqXmdBjA
Oh, and here's a ditto between me and Kidkoopa. You can put it up under both our names.

 

[Bryonato]

Man i wish sinister and I could have recorded our ness dittos. We played so so many

 

[Kayo]

I got a couple more videos for you guys from Mass Madness. I think rest are Friendlies.

The_NZA:
vs EMG (DK)
vs hotdogturle (Bowser)
vs hotdogturtle (Wario)

KiddKoopa (Me!):
vs EMG (Ganondorf)

Both Me and NZA (Ness teams):
vs EMG (Mario) and hotdogturtle (Bowser)

The rest of our videos from Mass Madness are in NZA's posts.

Man i wish sinister and I could have recorded our ness dittos. We played so so many

I would have LOVED to see that man!

 

[The_NZA]

I'm going to actually do some video critiquing since thats what this thread is for and no one seems to be doing it.
I'll look at two vids: Kid Koopa v. EMG (Ganondorf) and Kid Koopa v. The NZA (me). Just to let you guys know, my analysis can be pretty critical cause it's usually more useful for me to point out what's wrong than what's good. But i'll try to make a nod for what's working as well.

KiddKoopa v. EMG (Ganon): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87ciW-6w9oc
:30-1:00
I don't know if that DJC uair was in reaction to ganon's fb. If it was: that was an amazing decision as it has good followups. If it was a guess, I'd call it a bad decision (even if it worked) because its risky, a coinflip, and most of what ganon has will probably beat it out.

I like the choices out of dthrow. DJC uair (although you missed the lcancel––if you landed it you might have been able to DJC uair again). The yoyo gives you good coverage, and responds to his out of jump options.

I don't know why you dash attack out of the next dthrow. I don't know if there's any DI that would make that work. I would have probably full hopped nair'd (sourspot) or faired. Dthrow followups are one thing Ness really needs to have down crisp in PM. He's so momentum based that you need to convert on all of those.

Your DJC bair here is the right strategic decision, and you are getting a good amount of swing out of it, but it could be executed better. Namely: You should fast fall it (your getting stuck in the air during the DJC part for too long).

I know you are probably cringing at this death because you had another jump. But one thing with Ness that I try and keep in mind is all of my entry ways on stage available to me. You had the smashville platform to the left and I know you have some impeccable PKT2 aiming. I think you should have gone to it, just to be safe. You would have made it with a DJ and Airdodge, but even if you forgot about your DJ, your PKT2 could have definitely gotten you there.

1:00-1:30:
I just realized: You don't fast fall your DJC aerials that often. You've got little potholes in your play that are slowing you down that, if smoothed out, will make you into a faster Ness. I'd call the following potholes: DJC fast falled aerials, at 1:34 I see you hesitate for a second before you decide to dtilt, I see you standing still all the time before committing to an action, I see you rolling a lot. These potholes are taking away a ton of options from your Ness.

To me, Ness is all about being a moving target, always dash dancing, foxtrotting, short hopping, DJCing. He can't really afford to try and play the stand still and react game like other characters because he's so mcuh worse than them on fundamentals (bad range, bad grab range, limited projectile space control, slow jumps, etc.). That doesn't mean you need to know how to wavedash consistently. I think more important than wavedashing is having a really strong idea of Ness's dash game. Knowing how to foxtrot, pivot, dash dance, these are all more fundamental and important to Ness than wavedashing.

Because your movement (both aerial and ground) have hesitations and some bumps, you really have taken away your ability to approach with Ness in neutral, and this is hurting your game more than anything out there. If you want to see an example, look at your last stock. You don't have any safe approaches. You DJC bair once, but its not fast enough, not fast falled, and you don't lcancel and dash away from it. You throw a pkfire to try and get control in neutral (good choice btw), but he jumps. You start charging a random bat because it looks like you don't really know what else to do.

Main thing you should focus on: Smoothing out potholes. Next time you play, I think you should tell yourself you wont roll and you wont stand still. Master the dash. How early can you interrupt it into a dash in the opposite direction, how late can you interrupt it without committing. Practice fast falling all of your DJC aerials (especially your backair). If you are doing it right, you should be able to DJC fast fall bair an opponents shield and dash away from them before they can shield grab you. Don't allow yourself to make coinflippy decisions out of neutral (like charging a bat). Practice doing aerials on peoples shields and landing behind them.

Get these things done and I think your play will improve drastically.

 

[The_NZA]

I'm gonna now look at our Ditto to see if there's any unique advice there I can give you, Kid K.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksjOqXmdBjA

0-0:30
Already, i see your approaches are MUCH more refined here. I don't know if its because of confidence, but your short hopping back, DJC fairing with a fastfall and l cancel.

0:30-1:00
I already told you I don't like pkt in neutral. I also really like your movement much better in this vid.

Overall:
In this whole First match, I think you play MUCH better than you did against EMG. You move better, commit better, play out of neutral better. There's still the occasional standing pkfire, charging smash stuff but its better. However, I think I edge you out on every engagement because of a superior understanding of Ness's DJC. Try this out: watch that first match once exclusively looking at yourself. Then rewatch it exclusively looking at me. I'm doing more "bait" before my punishes, with slightly better angles on all my DJCs.

In match two, I see some of the same potholes as you had with EMG. Standing still too much, using bat in neutral because your not sure what to do. In the end, you start doing some cool DJC and magnet stuff in neutral but by and large before that, its a bumpy road on smashville.

PS: I don't know how, but your PKT1 to bat edgeguard seems to work all the time. I need to learn how you are doing it because its SOOOOO cool.

 

[onionchowder]

Hey guys! After the Big House, I decided I want to take P:M more seriously and try to get good. I've got some vids of my Ness and I'm looking for advice. Advice and criticism would be appreciated.

OnionChild vs. VanZ (Shiek, ZSS)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reUX3AaNBAU

OnionChild vs. SWEET (Ivy, Shiek)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_9ait2gPZo

OnionChild vs. MattDotZeb (Falco) -- Game 2 is pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01kxiVHUgTE


I didn't even know Magnet had a hitbox until the day of the tourney (hadn't played P:M since May). That's why I never use it in those vids.

 

[Strong Badam]

LMFAO that ragequit ahahahaa

 

[Bryonato]

Hey guys! After the Big House, I decided I want to take P:M more seriously and try to get good. I've got some vids of my Ness and I'm looking for advice. Advice and criticism would be appreciated.

OnionChild vs. VanZ (Shiek, ZSS)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reUX3AaNBAU

OnionChild vs. SWEET (Ivy, Shiek)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_9ait2gPZo

OnionChild vs. MattDotZeb (Falco) -- Game 2 is pretty absurd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01kxiVHUgTE


I didn't even know Magnet had a hitbox until the day of the tourney (hadn't played P:M since May). That's why I never use it in those vids.

What's your Skype? We'd love to have you in our group

 

[onionchowder]

It's like MDZ's never been chaingrabbed before. Just DIs straight off the stage.

Skype group? For discussing strats or whatever? Sounds good, though I probably won't be online much. sn: onionchowder

 

[Kayo]

Note to self: Chain grab Matt more.

I really do like your playstyle. It just screams classic Melee Ness.

 

[Bryonato]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5DEyyYrE68

so much footage up in there. some good some bad. pretty proud of some little tidbits after i get warmed up.

 

[twinx]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBoTHOX2fjA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSK2zDhkSaU
critique plox

 

[Eltrion]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGSTv35TywU&list=PLLBfn_Mp9t5iR8bn7EDVRrbX2N2WyECjL

Here's Me versus WeonX if anyone wants to take a look.

Also, Here's Hammertime playing the same matchup:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=...eature=player_detailpage&v=j2sdv1NOzMg#t=1068

 

[Bryonato]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBoTHOX2fjA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSK2zDhkSaU
critique plox

First vid.
-definitely like your use of utilt. The move generally gets a lot of hate but I find it useful; glad someone else does.

-Don't like pkt2 in neutral like that. If you're just blatantly throwing it out like that and hitting with it it's because your opponent is bad... or something idk. IMO that should never work unless you play some serious mindgames with it.

-Not sure how I feel about your use of dair in the middle of aerial combos (for example at 0:35). Were you trying to set up a tech chase? I just feel like any other aerial would put you in a more advantageous position.

-Nice DJC bair at 2:13. Glad you have a good comprehension of DJC and it's uses. I would like to see more DJC aerials as opposed to the fullhop bairs/fairs that you're throwing out as they're some of Ness' strongest tools.

-Again with dair in the middle of combos. Had you nair'd instead after that fullhop fair at 4:55 you would have put yourself in an edgeguard opportunity.

-I would like to see you be a little more aggressive offstage since Ness can get away with some really dirty edgeguards and gimps using rising nair, fair, dair, etc, although i understand showing restraint vs. a character like DDD.

-YOOOO! props for going for that (what I think was a dair) at 7:56. That would have been so sick!

Second vid.
-You 0-death'd a guy. Good ****. All that needs to be said.

-If anything I would like to see you nair more as a combo extender/starter. Spend some time in training or in friendlies and mess around with what you can get out of strong/weakspot nair. Weakspot nair is pretty godlike for things like dthrow -> aerial chains.

Don't really have a whole lot else to say. All in all it's pretty solid play. What I recommend is just working on what your best options are out of certain moves (aka dair less in combos unless you know what you can immediately follow up with) and stop using pkt2 so much in neutral. Hope this helps!

 

[twinx]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGSTv35TywU&list=PLLBfn_Mp9t5iR8bn7EDVRrbX2N2WyECjL

Here's Me versus WeonX if anyone wants to take a look.

Also, Here's Hammertime playing the same matchup:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=...eature=player_detailpage&v=j2sdv1NOzMg#t=1068

back airs and air thrown pk fires are good against space animals

 

[Bryonato]

As is uthrow. You can cg spacies with uthrow till pretty damn high %s

 

[twinx]

ness can up throw chain grab space animals?
hype

 

[CardiganBoy]

2:55 - Amazing combo:

 

[The_NZA]

Apex Video Dump. Remember, its not just mine, but some of Bryonato and Kayo's as well.

The NZA (Ness) vs Sethlon (Roy) $5
http://youtu.be/YE7DcfpSxJ8
Bryonato (Ness) vs Kayo (Ness) $10:
http://youtu.be/o1NJrcEOdt8
GHNeko (Sonic) vs The NZA (Ness, Ike) $1:
http://youtu.be/2cPXyeoCC7E
Toast (Marth) vs Bryonato (Ness, MK) $3:
http://youtu.be/CycoxCrL_Rk
Apex 2014 Pools The NZA (Ness) vs. Andrewajt62 (Marth):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRMJ-_P1o98

Apex 2014 Pools The NZA (Ness) vs. Flikk Flakk (Mewtwo, Ivysaur, Fox):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIuPW879t1g

Apex 2014 Pools The NZA (Ness) vs. CT Salem (Zelda):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNlfGzZJNT0&list=UUh4KJOemR5sg5-NxWZw76QA

Apex 2014 Pools The NZA (Ness) vs. Eli (Ness):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znJJX1DQZ_g&list=UUh4KJOemR5sg5-NxWZw76QA

ALSO Kayo is the player formerly known as Kid Koopa.

EDIT: I have no idea how to unhyperlink that block of text.

 

[Kayo]

I need more videos of me playing.