Sakurai's Retirment -- Your Stance

[Mr. Mumbles]

I want a new director, but not because I think they'd do a better job. I, like Kimblee, just want to see how the world would change if the homunculi win if there were a new director.

 

[Pyra]

I want a new director, but not because I think they'd do a better job. I, like Kimblee, just want to see how the world would change if the homunculi win if there were a new director.

It would certainly be interesting.

I wouldn't mind it personally, because as I've said in a previous post, I think they'd probably turn to Sakurai for tips on keeping the Smash feel. I doubt anyone that would be chosen as the new director would ruin the series.

 

[The Slayer]

Voted yes. Sakurai only knows how to make easy games for little kids. (IE Kirby) Smash 64 and melee where a happy accident, and if we want the next next competitive smash game we need him gone.

As much as I like Melee and didn't had a lot of fun with Brawl, that's a pretty selfish reason to consider. Yeah, maybe Sakurai keeps this weird field between competitiveness and causal play when it comes to Smash Bros, but he knows how to get the game right for most people. And even though Kirby seems to appeal for little kid, they sure get pretty intense in later levels for most of those games.

 

[Renji64]

I am thankful for his work and he did amazing job in the best and a okay job currently. I would love for someelse to take over hopefully that person can make a game to please everyone. Sakurai only cares about $ and casual consumers so yeah. I don't like sakurai's subtractive game design being able to less each installment isn't fun.

 

[EdgeTheLucas]

I don't want Sakurai to retire so much as I just want his games to have balance patches. Sakurai says he balances his games personally but that hasn't always proven successful.

In 64 Pikachu was clearly the best, Melee it was a slew of characters but notably Fox and Falco, and don't get me started on Meta Knight in Brawl.

Nonetheless he is the person who made characters like Ness, Captain Falcon, the Ice Climbers, Mr. Game & Watch, Pit, R.O.B. and many more characters that we've grown to know and love, so I can't imagine him gone. At the same time it sucks that at least half of those creative characters I named just can't keep up when I play with no items on stages with no hazards or wonky layouts.

I have hope for the newest games though, because you can REALLY tell that he's including a fail-safe for competitive play, what with customize-able movesets, the possibility of post-release patching, and the fact that Bandai-Namco is helping balance the game, meaning more people than ever before are possibly helping Sakurai balance the roster.

Sooooooooooooooooo what I'm trying to say is that, after all this time, no, he shouldn't retire, just maybe buff Zelda cuz damn she needs it lol

 

[BKupa666]

I'm glad you made this thread, @ UltimateWario , since on most sites, users treat any mere mention that Sakurai is a flawed developer as sacrilege, let alone an entire thread claiming he should retire partly for that reason.

A few bulletpointed thoughts of mine:

--"No one can give us what Sakurai gave us" is crap. Anyone can make movesets. Anyone can be dedicated. Anyone can tack token shock and retro characters onto a roster and be hailed as "unique." No one can claim these are impossible for other developers to replicate, because no other developer has been given the chance (and if given a chance, might not succeed right away due to not being handed five games on a silver platter to develop over fifteen years).
--"Having fun/enjoying Smash/respecting Sakurai" and "calling out his poor decisions when they are made" are not mutually exclusive. If he puts tripping in a game or leaves out multiple iconic newcomer requests, there's no shame in criticizing that, "he can do whatever he wants" mentality be damned.
--These touchy-feely defenses of Sakurai's every decision and emotional outbursts about how anyone who disagrees is "an entitled brat" (or some variation thereof) are silly. Judge the game on its merit, not the "feelings" of the developer or the misguided notion that literally everything he does is perfect.
--Recognize that Sakurai alone, as much as he tooted his own horn about "deciding what goes in the game" pre-Brawl and as much as the gaming media and fanbase glorifies him as a "hardworking genius," is just one guy. Not every decision, good or bad, falls on his shoulders, but the shoulders of multiple individuals, with him potentially unfairly taking all of the credit or blame either way.

I may add to this later. Bring on constructive criticism, bring off obsessive "like warrior" drivel.

 

[Shiliski]

At 43, Sakurai has about 20-30 years of work left in him, so I don't expect him to retire anytime soon. Eventually he'll retire. Eventually.

When that happens, or possibly at some point before then, Nintendo will face a choice: To continue Smash under another director, or to discontinue the series.

If it continues, it probably wont be as good. If we're super lucky it may actually be better, but even a big company like Nintendo would be lucky to get another guy like him. Remember when Steve Jobs left Apple, and the company went down the toilet? That's an extreme case, but it really shows that talented people are as rare as they are necessary. The only real question to me is: Even if it isn't as good, would it still be good enough? I hope so.

The alternative is no more Smash forever. Then again, all things end and there will be a time when that happens too, regardless of whether or not Sakurai is the last person to direct a Smash game. That may sound sad, but when it happens it will have happened because very few cared enough to be sad about Smash going away.

That said, I don't expect either of these will happen anytime soon. If a child were conceived today, I bet he'd reach adulthood, get through college, and get a start on his carreer before Sakurai retires, so I think the topic is jumping the gun a bit.

 

[The Real Gamer]

I voted "yes." There's no doubt in my mind that there are developers out there who could fill in for Sakurai if need be.

Sakurai has done a good job overall but like BKupa just stated, he has made some questionable choices overtime and isn't above criticism. I personally feel that the Smash series still has a lot of untapped potential especially when it comes to the game's core mechanics. In terms of taking the series in a new direction I don't think Sakurai is the man for that job. He laid the foundation, but I'd be ecstatic to see someone new step in and perfect it.

With that being said I'm willing to bet that even if Sakurai isn't the lead developer for the next game I'm sure he'll still be involved in some way or another.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I would argue Zelda, Sonic, Olimar, Ness, Lucas, and Mewtwo aren't very satisfying or intuitive to a beginner either. And Brawl Jigglypuff is just plain unsatisfying. I say this because when I first played Brawl, I wasn't competitive at all and none of these characters made sense to me. So while PM Pit might be a bit off-putting to newer players, I don't think that's something exclusive to PM.

I have respect for Sakurai and other visionaries like him, but he also frustrates me. I've never been a fan of developers telling their fan base: "You're playing the game wrong." Which is effectively what he said to competitive Melee players, and the reason why Brawl is the way it is. Alas, I'm still excited for Smash 4, and very curious how another developer would handle the Smash series.

I believe there is much more internal logic to the characters you mentioned then there is to some of the characters in Project M. You hit a button, you do a move, and it is fairly easy to figure out what that move is supposed to do. Now, actually using those attacks correctly is a different matter.... but that is part of the charm of Smash. Easy, intuitive design with a surprising amount of depth.

Another example: I honestly am not sure how I am supposed to hover as Mewtwo in Project M. Now, am I not the technically most proficient Smash player out there and I've only really tried to play as Mewtwo once or twice. Still, I was able to figure out the basics to wave dashing (with out knowing the term, mind you) back in 2003 after watching break the target videos and realizing people were moving way faster then I thought possible. Even a casual hack such as myself should be able to see a video of a basic technique and easily replicate it.

Now, I don't want this to seem like an attack on Project M. It is an exceptional mod; by far the best console mod I have ever seen. The thing is that a lot of the competitive crowd likes to think of it as perfect, when I think there are a lot of design choices made in the game that I would not like to see in a main stream Smash Bros. I would also love to see more competitive techniques in future Smash Bros, I just think a balance should still be maintained.

Eh, agree to disagree I suppose, as I don't think I'm going to change anyone's mind.

 

[Shiliski]

Check this out! Replace Sakurai's name with Kanye West and now he suddenly sounds like a big butt!

The difference is results. Sakurai produces them. Kanye West does no- Holy **** it's Kanye West!

Kanye West: I'm real happy for you Shiliski, and I'mma let you finish, but 64 was the best Smash of all time! OF ALL TIME!

... FFFFFFFFFUU-

 

[Baskerville]

I don't see him retireing entirely, he'll probably step down as Director after this game and let a fresh face and new ideas take his place. Of course, he is going to play some kind of role when there is another game.

 

[Kevandre]

I wouldn't be upset if he retired post-SSB4. He deserves it, he's made three awesome Smash games and it looks like 2 more on the way.

I'm all for new blood as long as they don't ruin it.

 

[nessokman]

Stop acting like his calcific tendonitis is going to stop him from going on. He has years to recover, and there are numerous treatments, including a surgery that has proven 90% effective (10% had to have another surgery).

Do some reading, it's fascinating.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcific_tendinitis

Sakurai is nowhere near stepping down, he has years left. I would sooner see the series end with sakurai. By the time he leaves, there will be two or three more smash games at least. That is plenty, the series will get stale if it runs too long.

Not to mention that I wouldn't trust a new director to not **** it up.

 

[Weeman]

I'd be ok with him going since, like Kupa said, it would be close minded to think that no one can take his spot and do a good job at it, now of course i also respect him greatly as game developer i recognize he has done mistakes, however i still think that blaming him for reasons like "My newcomer didn't make it in" are rather stupid.

Now with that said i also think that the competitive mindset of most people is rather closed, since apparently if this game doesn't have the same feel as melee, it will not be competitive, but that is not true, as far we know this game could have it's own metagame different from both Melee and Brawl where both offensive and defensive aproaches are possible, and honestly i'd rather have it that way. I mean look at Project M and how a character like Olimar who got the short end of the stick because his playstle didn't fit with the mechanics.

My point is that just because the competitive side of this game might not involve super fast short hop approaches where only the fastest characters reign doesn't mean it cannot be competitive and fun.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Now with that said i also think that the competitive mindset of most people is rather closed, since apparently if this game doesn't have the same feel as melee, it will not be competitive, but that is not true, as far we know this game could have it's own metagame different from both Melee and Brawl where both offensive and defensive aproaches are possible, and honestly i'd rather have it that way. I mean look at Project M and how a character like Olimar who got the short end of the stick because his playstle didn't fit with the mechanics.

I kind of agree with that.... a lot of Street Fighter fans disliked 4 when it came out, as it promoted a more defensive style of play and got rid or certain techniques such as parrying. They adjusted and it has proven itself to be a great competitive game, and SF III is still out there for people that prefer that style of play. That doesn't mean that Smash 4 won't have problems, and it may not end up being as competitive as Melee, but the potential for it or another Smash game to be as competitive as melee with completely different techs and physics is very possible.

 

[Weeman]

I kind of agree with that.... a lot of Street Fighter fans disliked 4 when it came out, as it promoted a more defensive style of play and got rid or certain techniques such as parrying. They adjusted and it has proven itself to be a great competitive game, and SF III is still out there for people that prefer that style of play. That doesn't mean that Smash 4 won't have problems, and it may not end up being as competitive as Melee, but the potential for it or another Smash game to be as competitive as melee with completely different techs and physics is very possible.

Indeed, i do think some things in the Smash 4 demo need to be fixed because they are fundamental problems that affect the flow of the game overall, like blast zones being too far in some stages, and the knockback being rather messed up. But i do think that people shouldn't just say that the game is doomed to be casual just because the competitive play might be different than what we are used to.

 

[SKM_NeoN]

Sakurai, from what I understand, is far too controlling with his projects. Instead of letting a team who specializes in character balance do their thing, he's gotta step in, take control, and ruin it with his ridiculous ideas on balancing. I'm sure that's not the only aspect he does this with, either.

Thanks for your hard work Sakurai, but unfortunately we need to let you go.

 

[StarshipGroove]

Sakurai doesn't make or break the series, in fact both his current newcomer choices and gameplay ideas have been weal. If he quits then that's that.

 

[BKupa666]

Anyhow, just figured I didn't really answer the actual question above, so here goes round two.

I'm conflicted with whether or not I actually want Sakurai to retire from Smash, because as great an idea as it might seem in the short term ("we're totally getting better gameplay and more fan favorite newcomers without him!!"), there's always the possibility that someone with a worse ratio of agreeable to disagreeable ideas replaces him. I suppose if Sakurai made some absolutist statement about something I'm passionate over, for example "K. Rool and Ridley don't belong in Smash and I will never add them," I'd take my chances with someone new. Otherwise, I might just settle for the devil I know vs. the devil I don't.

If we got a new developer, my primary hope would be that they approach new titles differently. Not every new Smash game requires "a line to be drawn in the sand" and a "different direction to be taken." That sort of mindset has left us with countless hours of development time thrown away on the Subspace Emissary and on needless moveset customization (that, in all likelihood, almost no one will use after the first few weeks), rather than enduring gameplay or a higher number of quality characters. Personally, it'd be great to see a few simple, yet quality new modes thrown in (Smash Run is a great example, others have mentioned stuff like "King of the Hill," "1 vs. 3 Boss Characters" or "Capture the Flag" modes), but with the majority of focus placed on adding and refining as much content as possible.

As much as Sakurai claims a new Smash game necessitates more than such an expansion, I'm skeptical.

 

[nessokman]

Anyhow, just figured I didn't really answer the actual question above, so here goes round two.

I'm conflicted with whether or not I actually want Sakurai to retire from Smash, because as great an idea as it might seem in the short term ("we're totally getting better gameplay and more fan favorite newcomers without him!!"), there's always the possibility that someone with a worse ratio of agreeable to disagreeable ideas replaces him. I suppose if Sakurai made some absolutist statement about something I'm passionate over, for example "K. Rool and Ridley don't belong in Smash and I will never add them," I'd take my chances with someone new. Otherwise, I might just settle for the devil I know vs. the devil I don't.

If we got a new developer, my primary hope would be that they approach new titles differently. Not every new Smash game requires "a line to be drawn in the sand" and a "different direction to be taken." That sort of mindset has left us with countless hours of development time thrown away on the Subspace Emissary and on needless moveset customization (that, in all likelihood, almost no one will use after the first few weeks), rather than enduring gameplay or a higher number of quality characters. Personally, it'd be great to see a few simple, yet quality new modes thrown in (Smash Run is a great example, others have mentioned stuff like "King of the Hill," "1 vs. 3 Boss Characters" or "Capture the Flag" modes), but with the majority of focus placed on adding and refining as much content as possible.

As much as Sakurai claims a new Smash game necessitates more than such an expansion, I'm skeptical.

This, as long as sakurai doesn't entirely rule out what we want, he should stay. Smash is his baby, and I doubt he'd leave until he physically had to.

 

[praline]

I'll be fine with it in like 25 years when its more likely to happen.

 

[SwagzillaForilla]

If Sakurai ever did retire, I'd hope that whoever took his place would show the veterans more love. I feel like there are more characters than Bowser or Pit that need reworking.

 

[MechaWave]

After reading this thread, I can see why Sakurai tries to avoid the competitive players.

I, personally, do see Smash 4 as his last Smash game, if he ever decided to retire or something. So I'm not putting myself up for false hopes. If Smash 5 is to come and has a different director, then I wouldn't be surprised, all I'm saying.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

I'm glad you made this thread, @ UltimateWario , since on most sites, users treat any mere mention that Sakurai is a flawed developer as sacrilege, let alone an entire thread claiming he should retire partly for that reason.

This is such over exaggerated nonsense. Nobody in this thread at all has referred to Sakurai as some sort of flawless god-given gift to game development. The very fact you need to generalize people in such a way just goes to show how inoperable your perspective is on these matters, and how blatantly misguided your thoughts are on those who oppose your viewpoint, and their viewpoints especially.

A few bulletpointed thoughts of mine:

--"No one can give us what Sakurai gave us" is crap. Anyone can make movesets. Anyone can be dedicated. Anyone can tack token shock and retro characters onto a roster and be hailed as "unique." No one can claim these are impossible for other developers to replicate, because no other developer has been given the chance (and if given a chance, might not succeed right away due to not being handed five games on a silver platter to develop over fifteen years).

I don't think anybody denies the possibility that a Smash game could be developed by a different director/company/development team. They just would rather not given they had the choice because we trust Sakurai, the man who's given us all that we currently have, to pull through. Major corporations don't just pass off their brand name product to other CEO's just to see how it will work out simply because "it could". I'm sure a whole litany of people could do what Mark Zuckerberg does every day being the CEO of Facebook, but he is the one that created it. It's his idea, and it's his idea that continues to bring in gajillions of dollars every day due to the ridiculously insurmountable user-base. Steve Jobs had to die before they would let anyone else take a wack at leading Apple.

The point is, Sakurai is analogous to those examples. He created Smash. He invented Smash, the ideas behind it, he made it what it is. Just because someone else can do it, doesn't mean it's so easily passed off. He earned the right 50x over to do with the franchise what he sees fit. Just like in Apple, Facebook, and whatever else, there are misteps, but these companies and in my analogy, Sakurai, have earned a sympathetic patience from consumers. There's absolute nothing wrong in having faith in such a brilliant developer.

--"Having fun/enjoying Smash/respecting Sakurai" and "calling out his poor decisions when they are made" are not mutually exclusive. If he puts tripping in a game or leaves out multiple iconic newcomer requests, there's no shame in criticizing that, "he can do whatever he wants" mentality be damned.

Well first of all I don't agree with criticism on leaving your newcomer request out. That's simply entitlement, because he can put whoever he wants in the game, he's not obligated to abide by fan request when it comes to the roster.

As far as his poor decisions (which is subjective btw)? Sure...criticize away, as long as it's constructive. Telling him to quit so the company can find new blood to create new iterations of Smash, or have him step down? That's not constructive criticism at all, that's a cop out. Instead of actually using your brain you'd rather just shift the responsibility to someone else in hopes that they will mold the game to your vision of what's acceptable. It's pathetic.

--These touchy-feely defenses of Sakurai's every decision and emotional outbursts about how anyone who disagrees is "an entitled brat" (or some variation thereof) are silly. Judge the game on its merit, not the "feelings" of the developer or the misguided notion that literally everything he does is perfect.

It's not touchy-feely. It's not in regards to Sakurai. It's a very real type of pity I have for people who really think their voice carries as much power as they think it does. In reality, you need to do things to be noticed. You need to do things to be trusted. Sakurai has done so, mostly in regards to Smash. What about you? What have you done? You don't have to be jealous that the man you wish would step down has commanded about a zillion times more respect and trust in what he does than your opinion on what he does.

--Recognize that Sakurai alone, as much as he tooted his own horn about "deciding what goes in the game" pre-Brawl and as much as the gaming media and fanbase glorifies him as a "hardworking genius," is just one guy. Not every decision, good or bad, falls on his shoulders, but the shoulders of multiple individuals, with him potentially unfairly taking all of the credit or blame either way.

I may add to this later. Bring on constructive criticism, bring off obsessive "like warrior" drivel.

It's quite simple, friend. Give respect where it's deserved. Mistakes or not, give credit where it's due. Asking him to step-down because the following game doesn't look like it's your cup of tea is the opposite of that. It's entitlement. It's sad. It means you need better things to do.

 

[NoiseHERO]

No.

If he can't do it, he shouldn't die/get sick over it. And while Nintendo is full of some geniuses imagination and passion wise I wouldn't want someone to replace him or his vision.

Unless he has a son with like-interests/ideas as him.

After playing a lot of games, you can kind of feel different vibes when another company or director has had their hands on a different games in the same series, compared to the original creator/director/company. I could make some examples but whatever. Sakurai being out might change some of that magic feel, which could be a good OR bad thing or neither. But I prefer to stick with him.

THEN NORTH KOREA STYLE ON BRAWL 5/6

Of course I'd buy the game's either way, if they're still good games, I mean it's fukken smash brothers, c'mon now.

 

[SwagzillaForilla]

This is such over exaggerated nonsense. Nobody in this thread at all has referred to Sakurai as some sort of flawless god-given gift to game development. The very fact you need to generalize people in such a way just goes to show how inoperable your perspective is on these matters, and how blatantly misguided your thoughts are on those who oppose your viewpoint, and their viewpoints especially.

What room do you have to speak? You're the worst offender.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

What room do you have to speak? You're the worst offender.

Please elaborate, are you saying I've misjudged you? If so, how have I done so?

 

[Young Marth]

I feel like when Sakurai leaves smash it's gonna be like when Jon left grumps. It may debatably better or worse than it's predecessor, but when it first happens everyone will be screaming apocalypse and saying it's the death of the series, but it will live on and still have a HUGE fan base. That being said, i think Sakurai still has one last smash game in him. And when he's done, he will pass the torch to someone who knows what they're doing. (Like what happened with Aonuma & Miyamoto.)

 

[NoiseHERO]

I feel like when Sakurai leaves smash it's gonna be like when Jon left grumps. It may debatably better or worse than it's predecessor, but when it first happens everyone will be screaming apocalypse and saying it's the death of the series, but it will live on and still have a HUGE fan base. That being said, i think Sakurai still has one last smash game in him. And when he's done, he will pass the torch to someone who knows what they're doing. (Like what happened with Aonuma & Miyamoto.)

I still miss jon, but I was kind of getting annoyed of his grump role and a chunk of the games they were stuck on at the time of him leaving. So laid-back Danny was a breath of fresh air. But now I wish I could see all 3(6) of em doing a game.

 

[BKupa666]

This is such over exaggerated nonsense. Nobody in this thread at all has referred to Sakurai as some sort of flawless god-given gift to game development. The very fact you need to generalize people in such a way just goes to show how inoperable your perspective is on these matters, and how blatantly misguided your thoughts are on those who oppose your viewpoint, and their viewpoints especially.

I don't think anybody denies the possibility that a Smash game could be developed by a different director/company/development team. They just would rather not given they had the choice because we trust Sakurai, the man who's given us all that we currently have, to pull through. Major corporations don't just pass off their brand name product to other CEO's just to see how it will work out simply because "it could". I'm sure a whole litany of people could do what Mark Zuckerberg does every day being the CEO of Facebook, but he is the one that created it. It's his idea, and it's his idea that continues to bring in gajillions of dollars every day due to the ridiculously insurmountable user-base. Steve Jobs had to die before they would let anyone else take a wack at leading Apple.

The point is, Sakurai is analogous to those examples. He created Smash. He invented Smash, the ideas behind it, he made it what it is. Just because someone else can do it, doesn't mean it's so easily passed off. He earned the right 50x over to do with the franchise what he sees fit. Just like in Apple, Facebook, and whatever else, there are misteps, but these companies and in my analogy, Sakurai, have earned a sympathetic patience from consumers. There's absolute nothing wrong in having faith in such a brilliant developer.

Well first of all I don't agree with criticism on leaving your newcomer request out. That's simply entitlement, because he can put whoever he wants in the game, he's not obligated to abide by fan request when it comes to the roster.

As far as his poor decisions? Sure...criticize away, as long as it's constructive. Telling him to quit so the company can find new blood to create new iterations of Smash, or have him step down? That's not constructive criticism at all, that's a cop out. Instead of actually using your brain you'd rather just shift the responsibility to someone else in hopes that they will mold the game to your vision of what's acceptable. It's pathetic.

It's not touchy-feely. It's not in regards to Sakurai. It's a very real type of pity I have for people who really think their voice carries as much power as they think it does. In reality, you need to do things to be noticed. You need to do things to be trusted. Sakurai has done so, mostly in regards to Smash. What about you? What have you done? You don't have to be jealous that the man you wish would step down has commanded about a zillion times more respect and trust in what he does than your opinion on what he does.

It's quite simple, friend. Give respect where it's deserved. Mistakes or not, give credit where it's due. Asking him to step-down because the following game doesn't look like it's your cup of tea is the opposite of that. It's entitlement. It's sad. It means you need better things to do.

Point by point:

--Indeed, and neither did I. The vibe I have gotten for years has been that, to criticize Sakurai in any way, one must walk on the most fragile of eggshells. I think that's ridiculous. Sakurai is not a sacred cow.
--Then those people should defend that stance on the grounds that it's their preference, rather than asserting that it's literally impossible to do what Sakurai has done, because that is an outright lie, and they're almost always setting up an unfair comparison in the process (comparing a new developer's hypothetical first Smash to Sakurai's third, fourth, or fifth).
--Faith is one thing, but blind faith is a different beast, and the latter runs rampant on Smash forums from my observation. Also, enough with this "he's earned it, he's entitled to XYZ" stuff. Exactly what he's "earned or entitled to" depends on what higher powers believe will benefit their company the most.
--I'll keep this simple: not all newcomers are "made equal." If we agree that the end goal is to create a game that will appeal the most to the widest number of individuals, blatantly shunning multiple massive fan requests is objectively negative. No, "unique" nobodies do not balance out these shunned requests, given that anyone can be made "unique" with enough effort, and, yes, people claiming they prefer "not just getting popular characters" is shaky, given that they've never experienced this alternative.
--Noticing lots of choice words popping up with increasing frequency...first "misguided," then "entitled," then "not using the brain," now "pathetic." Talk about "over exaggerated nonsense." Also, I let your initial strawman slide, but this one merits a calling-out. No one is "demanding" he step down or retire. This thread was set up to ask people whether or not they would prefer this, and why. I have answered.
--I have no idea what relevance this has to anything, but as a general principle, status does not inherently result in the generation of "brilliant" ideas. A veteran game designer could think up an utterly detestable idea, while a Joe Schmoe at the computer (i.e. most of us on SWF) could come up with something revolutionary.
--That "get a life, stop criticizing" conclusion leads me to retroactively assume your entire premise is "If you don't like Sakurai, you can GIT OUT." Mleh. I was hoping for better. Hopefully someone else can supply.

 

[synesthe-sia]

Yeah, I want someone who listens to the audience and doesn't dumb down the game for casuals. When you do that, it (usually) hurts the quality of the game. So if you want an intentionally lowered skill ceiling, then you're pretty stupid. Most people who do want that just want to spite tournament players mainly because they're casuals themselves. I wouldn't necessarily ask for Melee 2.0. I'd just ask for a higher skill ceiling. I also say this as someone who doesn't play in tourneys.

But as far as the roster is concerned, I don't give a ****. Nintendo would likely revive someone like Takamaru anyway. Seems like that's heading our way with or without him being playable Smash Bros. Not every old franchise deserves a reboot.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Point by point:

--Indeed, and neither did I. The vibe I have gotten for years has been that, to criticize Sakurai in any way, one must walk on the most fragile of eggshells. I think that's ridiculous. Sakurai is not a sacred cow.

Yet you just did right here.

--Then those people should defend that stance on the grounds that it's their preference, rather than asserting that it's literally impossible to do what Sakurai has done, because that is an outright lie, and they're almost always setting up an unfair comparison in the process (comparing a new developer's hypothetical first Smash to Sakurai's third, fourth, or fifth).
--Faith is one thing, but blind faith is a different beast, and the latter runs rampant on Smash forums from my observation. Also, enough with this "he's earned it, he's entitled to XYZ" stuff. Exactly what he's "earned or entitled to" depends on what higher powers believe will benefit their company the most.

This is just denying history. He crafted a game that has sold millions and will likely continue to. A game he made 10 years ago (or so?) is still a hyped event at MLG and EVO. He is definitely entitled to a host of things when it comes to Smash.

--I'll keep this simple: not all newcomers are "made equal." If we agree that the end goal is to create a game that will appeal the most to the widest number of individuals, blatantly shunning multiple massive fan requests is objectively negative. No, "unique" nobodies do not balance out these shunned requests, given that anyone can be made "unique" with enough effort, and, yes, people claiming they prefer "not just getting popular characters" is shaky, given that they've never experienced this alternative.

Roster choice is arguably the most subjective topic to attack Sakurai with, so I will honestly not go in-depth anymore on the subject other than say that he makes the choices, and there's no reason to believe he won't make it work when it comes to roster choices, whether you like the choices or not.

--Noticing lots of choice words popping up with increasing frequency...first "misguided," then "entitled," then "not using the brain," now "pathetic." Talk about "over exaggerated nonsense." Also, I let your initial strawman slide, but this one merits a calling-out. No one is "demanding" he step down or retire. This thread was set up to ask people whether or not they would prefer this, and why. I have answered.

Saying that you personally believe he should give way for someone else is hardly much different.

--I have no idea what relevance this has to anything, but as a general principle, status does not inherently result in the generation of "brilliant" ideas. A veteran game designer could think up an utterly detestable idea, while a Joe Schmoe at the computer (i.e. most of us on SWF) could come up with something revolutionary.

How is this comparable? Sakurai has produced actual, tangible results. What you're speaking is just philosophical. Yes, a random internet fool can throw toss out a genius idea, and yes, a veteran game designer can throw out a bad one. Sakurai has actual, observably good results with his work. This isn't something you can philosophize against. The proof is in the pudding.

--That "get a life, stop criticizing" conclusion leads me to retroactively assume your entire premise is "If you don't like Sakurai, you can GIT OUT." Mleh. I was hoping for better. Hopefully someone else can supply.

Well aren't you cheeky.

People think that because it's the internet that they're the boss and they are the all-knowing ones. Sakurai doesn't have to prove himself anymore than he already has, he's done something. It's like if Martin Luther King were alive and you walked up to him and tried to criticize his efforts for racial equality. He did something. What did you do?

It just comes off as a downright disrespect, and that's where the tone comes from.

 

[ScottyWK]

I doubt Sakurai would retire from Smash for the next iteration of the game. He seems like a prideful guy, and I can't imagine someone like him being willing to just hand over the franchise to someone else. In 5+ years when that time comes, I'm sure he'll be ready to do another game.

$ + Pride = too much to pass up.

 

[Jumpman84]

I don't think Sakurai should retire until he feels comfortable with passing on the torch to someone else. In any case, for all the anti Sakurais (and the pro Sakurais as well), there is one important thing that determines how Smash as a series goes forward. We should consider these words from back at E3 2005 as they are what convinced Sakurai to do Brawl (and by extension, 3DS and Wii U). They come from one much wiser than I: Eiji Aonuma. Granted, things may have changed in nine years, but I feel they are still as important to today and for this very topic at hand. In particular, pay attention to the last sentence. (Special thanks go to the Wayback Machine for digging this up in the archives.)


Aonuma: "Sakurai-san! Please make Smash Bros.! You are gonna make it, right?"

Sakurai's response: "Well, uh, I wonder what will happen." (I was a little incoherent because I didn't know how to respond.)

Aonuma: "To be honest, if you aren't involved with it, that will probably mean the end to the Smash Bros. series.

Smash Bros. piles together so many elements from so many games and continues entertaining people without ever growing old. It's your skill, your sense, your thinking that's allowed that to happen. I don't think there's anyone who can replace you.

Creating a Smash Bros. with no soul would be a waste of time."

 

[TeenGirlSquad]

I can only see it happening because of health issues. And I don't see Ninty making another game without him, unless he deliberately passes it on to someone else.

 

[nessokman]

I can only see it happening because of health issues. And I don't see Ninty making another game without him, unless he deliberately passes it on to someone else.

His health isn't that bad, he has tendinitis, but there are MANY treatment options for it, including a surgery that is incredibly effective.

read about it here:http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcific_tendinitis

He didn't have a freaking heart attack people, it isn't that bad.

 

[PCHU]

If Sakurai decides he wants to step down, yeah, it'll be a great loss, but there's always the potential for a great gain.
He did create the games we know and love, but I don't think it's wrong to say that there is someone else who could carry on the series and carry it well.

 

[BKupa666]

Yet you just did right here.

This is just denying history. He crafted a game that has sold millions and will likely continue to. A game he made 10 years ago (or so?) is still a hyped event at MLG and EVO. He is definitely entitled to a host of things when it comes to Smash.

Roster choice is arguably the most subjective topic to attack Sakurai with, so I will honestly not go in-depth anymore on the subject other than say that he makes the choices, and there's no reason to believe he won't make it work when it comes to roster choices, whether you like the choices or not.

Saying that you personally believe he should give way for someone else is hardly much different.

How is this comparable? Sakurai has produced actual, tangible results. What you're speaking is just philosophical. Yes, a random internet fool can throw toss out a genius idea, and yes, a veteran game designer can throw out a bad one. Sakurai has actual, observably good results with his work. This isn't something you can philosophize against. The proof is in the pudding.

Well aren't you cheeky.

People think that because it's the internet that they're the boss and they are the all-knowing ones. Sakurai doesn't have to prove himself anymore than he already has, he's done something. It's like if Martin Luther King were alive and you walked up to him and tried to criticize his efforts for racial equality. He did something. What did you do?

It just comes off as a downright disrespect, and that's where the tone comes from.

--Was referring to the "calling him a god" bit there. With regard to the fanbase at large putting Sakurai on a pedestal, that's a simple general observation of mine based on years on this forum, no different from "Ridley is a controversial character" or "People don't like tripping." Take it or leave it.
--Again, the moment Nintendo decides a different developer is in their best interest, that ostensible "entitlement" vanishes just like that. This would be perfectly fair, because Nintendo would not have reached that hypothetical verdict in a vacuum, but rather based on specific developmental factors that led them to this conclusion.
--Even a horribly, horribly developed Smash game would probably sell millions as well, just based on the premise of "I can make Mario punch Pikachu." Smash games do not sell well because of Sakurai, but rather because of positive contributions he, as well as others, can make to their development.
--Personally, I'd prefer someone to design the roster to "make it the best it can be" for the highest number of fans, rather than just to "make it work."
--Yes, philosophizing is occurring in a thread based on a hypothetical scenario. If put in an influential position (let's say a Freaky Friday body swap occurs), Joe Schmoe could make as ideal a development call as a veteran developer, despite "not having produced results." Joe Schmoe might decide to spend 60% of a game's resources on refining character movesets rather than on a mediocre adventure mode, for example.
--"Having produced results" is a really stupid barometer with which to measure one's "ability" to criticize any given job, not just Smash development. Guess there can be no more movie critics who aren't directors, art critics who aren't artists, political pundits who aren't president, sports analysts who aren't athletes, food critics who aren't master chefs, etc.
--I am guilty of the monstrous crime of possibly preferring one video game developer (depends on who it is) over another video game developer to develop a video game. How downright disrespectful of me.

 

[Senario]

The way I see it, is if you like his game style and game direction you want him to quit for his personal health. If you don't like his game direction because of it's complete anti competitiveness you want him to quit because somebody else might be less stubborn. It is a win win, if he retires he gets rest and we get a shot at somebody who isn't so set in their ways that they actively try to snuff out competition.

 

[NintenRob]

This is the dumbest thread I've ever seen, its like people completely ignore For Glory, Hitstun, Smash Fest, Faster Gameplay, asking the players for feedback, specifically saying the game is still in development, 12 man balancing team.

Yep, Sakurai should definitely leave, people get up him for supposedly making Brawl 2.0 but Melee 2.0 is perfectly ok. Did people ever think he is trying to make something new?