Rivals of Aether - Official Thread

[arcticfox8]

YOOOOOOOOO KRAGG
YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[joshl94]

Wow,Kragg and Wrastor look great.
Hope I get into this playtester build.
Didn't get the first one, unfortunately

 

[Xanthus]

Kragg looks amazing, on a scale from excited to my heart's going to explode, I might be 1-2 notches behind heart explosion!

Also I wonder if you could Luigi-ladder with his pillar in a Kragg mirror match Pillar, jump, pillar, jump, pillar... from the bottom of the kill zone :D

 

[arcticfox8]

Could you add a stage list to the site?

 

[AbsoluteBlack]

Kragg's pillar better have some limitations. That immediately screams 'busted' to me; is upb->upsmash a kill at 0, if he's up near the top blastline? Is stage control against Kragg 'never be directly below him'?

 

[arcticfox8]

Kragg's pillar better have some limitations. That immediately screams 'busted' to me; is upb->upsmash a kill at 0, if he's up near the top blastline? Is stage control against Kragg 'never be directly below him'?

The thing about Rivals is that everyone's kinda busted.
It's like Super Smahvel Brothers

 

[CaptainCrisb]

I'm impressed with Kragg! He looks awesome to play as, and reminds me of the "trappy" type of character like Orcane

 

[arcticfox8]

Kragg gives me a very Bowser feel

 

[4nace]

Playtester build email going out now! Hope to see some discussion starting soon

Thanks,
Dan Fornace

 

[Pikmin1211]

Brooooo Wrastor looks like the most swank character with those goggles, and Kragg looks super epic, is it 2015 yet?

 

[CaptainCrisb]

Okay, I just received the playtester build, and I noticed just a few things:
-The "single player" bug is still present (but I'm pretty sure it'd be an easy fix)
-And this little graphical bug where both backgrounds get cut off when moving too far to the right or left. I've tested this on all 3 stages, and it only seems to appear on the Fire Capitol stage (ignore the white, that's just from my snipping tool)
And while not bugs...
-No music?! D: D: D: D:
-Of course, I know this is still in development, but the sound effects don't sound "powerful" if that makes sense. They sound more like slaps and claps rather than full, head on, power punches.

 

[Zauron]

I just came here to check real quick and confirm before delving more deeply into the gameplay, is this build not supposed to have music any more like the last one did?

Also, every time I quit the game, I get an unhandled exception. Last one was Unhandled exception at 0x4fe68c21 in RivalsofAether.exe: 0xC0000005: Access violation reading location 0x00000011, my debugger reported it came from d3d9.dll. Previous build (August) did not cause an exception on quitting.

 

[4nace]

I just came here to check real quick and confirm, is this build not supposed to have music any more like the last one did?

Also, every time I quit the game, I get an unhandled exception. Last one was Unhandled exception at 0x4fe68c21 in RivalsofAether.exe: 0xC0000005: Access violation reading location 0x00000011, my debugger reported it came from d3d9.dll. Previous build (August) did not cause an exception on quitting.

Hmm no music this time. Keeping that out until we have music across the board. Also the quitting bug is new hmmm. Not sure what could be causing that. Could be updates to Game Maker? I'll google that one to see if other developers are seeing it.

 

[TheDiamondPiggy]

Heyo, Wanted to give my tier list now. I feel like i'm the competitive guy. I will give individual deductions later.

Anywayssss

ROA Tier List V0.2

4. Orcane
3. Kragg
2. Zetterburn
1. Wrastor

 

[Xanthus]

http://www.twitch.tv/xanthus1 Streaming!!! Should have people coming over soon for a "Smashfest" which is now going to be an RoA fest . Let me know if you want to see anything.

I don't even know where to start yet. There so much amazing stuff. Kragg's foxtrot, comboing with his upB, his uptilt, and his SUPER LOW cooldown down-b, charging wrastors dive kick (and the perfect nerfs to his aerial game), sliding out of dash into smashes (Orcane, puddle, dash then reverse forward smash = great spacing and a dangerous safe hitbox), walljumping.....

I'm about to just completely quit smash man.

 

[Streetwize]

Just made a video showing how easy wavedashing is. Waiting for my 3rd party Wii U controller so I was forced to use my PS3 controller. It still feels really good though.

 

[ChaosBreaker]

unless i can wavedash. im not playing it Kappa

 

[ItsRainingGravy]

Just sent my playtester application. This game looks amazing, and I really want it to succeed. I will be wishing you and your team the best, 4nace.

 

[Ticker]

After playing for a half hour or so, I think you did a pretty good job of allowing the options and movement for competitive play, without making the tech skill required high. Will get back soon with other thoughts.

 

[JCOnyx]

I got my email this morning and immediately downloaded it as soon as I could. The only issue I have so far is the stock controls for GC controllers. At least with the GCC Adapter. L and R are treated as the Z axis and Z rotation which seems to be the smash attacks in RoE, so I have to light press less than halfway to get the UpSmash with L or Left FSmash with R. The C-Stick is the parry/dodge button but only when pressing right or down lol.

It's been awkward, but I decided to just tough it out for a couple hours today with strong button turned on. This game is nuts with bad DI lol, you guys weren't lying when you said the CPU were a work in progress. 0-Deaths everywhere.

I wouldn't be too worried about Kragg's UpSpecial. It doesn't seem to have enough hitstun to guarentee a follow up without setting up a Rock Block first underneath it. I'm also wondering what Kragg's Bair is supposed to be used for, seems particularly useless atm along with his SideSpecial but I need to experiment with that a bit more. His Nair, Fair, UpAir, and UpTilt seem really good though.

I'll look into setting up another controller or possibly seeing if I can use Joy2Key to fix my control problems sometime tomorrow. But I will say I'm sad I don't get to listen in to the amazing Flashygoodness music in this demo

 

[UltimaNylocke]

Guess who's maining Wrastor!!!!!!!!!!

 

[dquarius]

Just applied

 

[Xanthus]

Just played it for 4 hours while streaming (27 viewers, new followers, woohoo!), btw thanks for hanging out in the stream and answering questions Dan! I was too busy having fun and messing around to see what the crowd was up to . But I think I have a few things for feedback, but first I need to at get something to eat/sleep and probably wait until tomorrow.

Initial Accolades (I'll write more tomorrow :D )
First of all, its amazing, great earth character design, loving the dash dancing and wrastor nerfs, and cancelling a dash to charge smashes, and the walljumping, and the everything :D

Kragg Side-B: Potential issue, reasoning, and ideas
I think the main thing I'd like to think / talk about is Kragg's side-B, which feels less like a move and more like an entire shift in how the game has to be played. But it doesn't take as big of a commitment as a move of that type feels like it should take. True, you can stay out of its range and punish it upon the opponent ending it (although it's pretty tight and difficult compared to the ease of hitting side-B). But you have to completely learn how to play around it, which is perfectly fine for people who are good at the game and master spacing, but even then it comes out so quick and is almost like a counter-move that keeps going and you're invulnerable. Then it ends so quickly (whenever you want it to) and a little harder to punish. Also an effect of its vertical momentum cancelling is stalling off-stage or giving another aspect to his already strong recovery. I'm fine dealing with it, and I've learned, and I think you need to have overpowered fun moves first before you dial them back and figure out what they need to be. But I think lesser skilled players can abuse it much too easily, and I feel it needs a trade-off of some kind without killing it's purpose/effectiveness. So maybe it can be beastly while it's active ( I want this to be a great, fun, powerful semi-slow move!! Not everything slow has to be useless like in smash bros), but more easily punished after ending (little longer delay; or forced to keep it certain amount of time unless you go off-ground). Also I think the guy I was playing with had the idea of making hits to it slow it down more. So maybe you could space proper moves against it to hit it without getting hit (I know the hitbox on it is smaller than Kragg's hurtbox); unless that's already possible and I haven't done the right moves yet so I can avoid getting hit after (that aren't projectiles). But again that's a higher-skilled player solution, unless hits completely destroyed it's momentum, but that wouldn't be fun.

Edit: I was so tired and hungry I forgot to talk about parrying: Yes you can parry, but you still take a hit... and aren't guaranteed a punish (I don't think). You can be hit away and he can recover from parry stun after releasing his side-b before you get back.

Kragg Up-B: Spammable easy spacing? Or do players need to be better about letting him re-touch a platform?
Something might need to change about the height of Kraggs up-B as well, or the commitement it requires. I think big strong moves that change the game are fantastic and should be effective, but it felt too easy to keep Kraggs away from the ground by creating his own high in the sky, and to constantly spam it / do it. Maybe the downside is supposed to be its hard for him to get back down with his downair / nair, so you're supposed to juggle him and hit him with better hitboxes beneath (i.e. something that's not immediately punishable, but puts him in an unfavorable position later if you follow up correctly). It also slowed the game down a bit creating such vertical spacing (it's easy to touch a top platform to regain the ability, and stay above with a threatening instant hitbox that will bring you to his level).

What if you could punish it by breaking it, and anybody who is standing falls into a helpless state? So if you're using it offensively and are out-spaced with dash dancing or something, they could punish you if you don't jump off quick enough. Might not be something good because in teams / FFA it would probably get broken quickly and make it feel like the game is punishing you for using something. I don't know, just trying to think of something, or what aspect of gameplay it could affect as a trade-off. It needs to be quick, it needs to hit, and have a low delay, it wouldn't be nearly as fun without it... but I think it would be better with something making it not as spammable or able to keep such huge distance without much downside. Think if a move did this horizontally, it'd be like an instant scorpions GET OVER HERE, except create a breakable wall to keep the space. Then you just have to run 1/4th back onto the stage (top platform) to use it again. And maybe it wouldn't make sense immediately to the player, but having to touch the main ground of the stage (versus platforms) to regain the ability, would work wonders as well.

Closing : It's great! Nothing is too broken and everything seems to be able to be dealt with in a kinda fun way
I'm tired, hope this made sense and I'll play more and think more about it. Everything is able to be countered, these game changing moves and strategy aren't super overpowered or anything of that nature (as far as I can immediately tell). I'm just trying to brainstorm and think if they unify and go with the rest of rivals of aether gameplay or do something to take away from it. I love what they do and love the different thinking, but might be better with a little tweaking.

Keep on making this amazing game! And 2ndary Kudos for actually releasing this tonight, I know how Indie game development works and how easy it is to want to wait and fix a few things right before getting it out there and then cue: "Wait that's funny i just changed a tiny variable I wanted to set before releasing and now Zetterburn's sounds aren't working? Surely I can fix this in the next 45 mins... "then it's the next day before you get it out lol.

 

[norris3942]

Just learned about this game today thanks to Xanthus' stream, it looks like a whole lot of fun and I really like how movement options are as accessible as possible. Can't wait to see what else comes out of this :3

 

[akf09]

brought this to a smash fest and only a few people poked at it at first and then went back to playing PM and i sat and played computers until som1 would ask what it was and play, however later in the night 2 of my buddies who are very good at PM got hooked on it and we played for a few hours, wow is kragg fun! probly my new main.

a few pieces of feedback to offer

Kragg:
wow is he a fun character to play with, his rock move has endless possiblities its truely genius. I feel that his down tilt should hit enemies upward and it should knock the rocks upward diagnally. currently traggs down tilt hits rocks outward just like his forward titl and i feel like its a bit strange that his down smash launches rocks diagnally upward while his down tilt does not.

another change to tragg i would suggest is regaurding his side special which is currently rediculas haha. the extreme armor on it makes your opponent avoid you so much because they are very limited in how to defend. it also doesnt benniit tragg all that much. i think it would be more useful if the move had only light armor, was a bit faster, jump cancelable and popped enemies upward for follow up attacks i will give more feed back soon its bed time great build

 

[likiji123]

So i have been playing for a bit and there was some things i wanted to address

- The silence (no music) makes the game feel odd and makes everything just hearing the hit sounds
- Kraggs U Tilt can be used multiple times and can even make an opponent go from 0% to around 80%
- Wrastor N B Seems a little unfair and kinda reminds me of brawl meta knight's N B
- Wrastor seems a little too good compared to the other characters
- Kraggs U B is great for getting away from opponents during combos (though maybe it should be nerfed a little as it leaves you open when your hit by it and left for combos)
- Every time i go to Practice AI the screen goes back to windowed while im in fullscreen
- When ever a player is burnt there is so sound indicating that your burnt.
- can you add some sort of guide for each character inside the game to help newcommers with how to play and what each character does and what is unique about them

Personal questions
- Will taunts be added ( As for me, when i beat someone i usually taunt and it feels satisfying and i would love to see what the characters do during their taunts)
- Will you be adding ledge grabbing?
- Will you be adding Time and stock battles so we can play by melee rules (4 stock, 8 Mins)
- Will people be able to make mods (chars and stages)
- Will Name tags be in the game
- Is there going to be a way to change the opponents colour (CPU)

Question
- Will there be some kind of crossover character like a character from microsoft or something else (banjo and Kazooie) kinda like what soul calubur and Mortal Kombat 9 has done?

But other than that everything else seems great

 

[Thores]

Thanks so much for adding me to the beta! Even at this early stage I am having a lot of fun with RoA. It feels familiar but also incredibly different. I love how creative all these characters are, and what they bring to the table.

I played with my roommate for about an hour, and we both had a blast. I played some Wrastor and a loooot of Orcane; my roomie called dibs on Kragg and played him pretty much the entire time, minus like two matches as Zetterburn so we covered our bases. Even when he lost he couldn't stop saying how much he loved how Kragg felt.

Anyway, here's some notes:

General
* We were wondering if the characters would eventually get taunts. No rush on that, obviously. There's clearly higher priority aspects of game design you're probably working on.

Stages
* I love the Aether/Basic system and I wish retaining the general layouts in Basic was something that Sakurai had thought of.
* The Aether version of the Air Armada is our favorite so far. That spring is great, and the platform places are cool.
* Our least favorite is the Aether version of the Rock Wall. Falling through the stage the moment the wall breaks was more frustrating than fun. I did like how much horizontal space the stage covered though, and wish that stayed intact for the Basic version.

Orcane
* I love him. It's great how eventually his meta turns into your opponent trying so hard to avoid Orcane's puddles that you can just close in and smack him in the face. And then he wises up to that, and starts forgetting to look out for puddles... it's the best!

Wrastor
* He really is almost too good. He's fast, he's slippery, his Down-B practically feels like pressing a Free Combo button. And that's coming from a guy that barely has the skill and patience to do combos in Smash-style games!
* Actually, a side note to that: my roommate and I were able to find fun combos in RoA with every character within our hour of play. I think that's a testament to how accessible and easy to control the game is, so kudos for that. But if a simple Orcane combo is as easy as making grilled cheese, doing strings from Wrastor's Down-B was like buttering the bread. I'll admit it felt really satisfying, though, and I get that combos is sort of his design theme. I'm not sure how I would balance that while keeping the theme intact.
* Air Smashes is a really cool concept and I think you did a great job with him here.

Kragg
* First off, just thank you for making such an awesome and unique addition to the roster. We have never seen a bruiser character with a kit like this, and I think he might be one of my roommate's favorite fighting game characters ever now.
* It's funny that someone earlier was talking about how broken his Side-B was... Roommate actually thought it was kind of useless. Slow, easy to maneuver around and punish, and sure it has armor, but... he said the move was "high risk, low reward".

Glitches
* The game crashed once. We think it was when Kragg broke a rock with Orcane's puddle on it. Or maybe Orcane's puddle broke the rock, causing the crash? The latter theory occurred to me just now.. we tried recreating the crash by repeating the former theory, with no luck. Here's the crash report:
FATAL ERROR in
action number 1
of Step Event0
for object oPlayer:

Unable to find any instance for object index '113629'
at gml_Script_orca_spec_attack

stack frame is
gml_Script_orca_spec_attack (line 0)
gml_Script_attack_update
gml_Script_state_update
gml_Object_oPlayer_Step_0

* If a wall in the Rock Wall is broken, and Kragg throws a rock into the space the wall used to be while it's respawning... Kragg's rock gets stuck in the wall until it gets broken again. Let me know if that's confusing and/or unclear, and I can try to describe it better.


That's all for now! It feels like I forgot something, and I'll be sure to post about it if I remember. I'm also sure that this won't be the last time we play this week, and next time I'll be writing down stuff as it comes to me. Thanks again for letting me in on the playtest!

 

[Yurya]

Played through SmashLand awhile back. have followed Rivals a little since the first announcement. The latest announcement two days ago got me interested. I read through this thread (and the site) after I submitted my application Really pumped and excited to see how it feels and make comments.

 

[likiji123]

Sorry for all the questions but i have two more
- Will any swordplay characters be in the game
- does this playtester version work on xbox 360?

Thanks so much for adding me to the beta! Even at this early stage I am having a lot of fun with RoA. It feels familiar but also incredibly different. I love how creative all these characters are, and what they bring to the table.

Agreed :D

 

[likiji123]

Oops accidentally did a second post

 

[akf09]

i think a sword character would be cool

 

[Boss N]

I'm gonna apply for the beta once I'm done with classes today, but for now I have some questions from the outset:

So first, Really digging the new characters, Wrastor looks like combination of captain Falcon & Falco. AWSOME.

But my big question:
Is this game going to be accessible to players who aren't as proficient at tech skills, will techs even be a central focus of gameplay? (please no ;_; ) I saw what looked like wavedashing in one of Kragg's showcases, is it gonna be easy to performe or is that the dodge animation?

(Edit: i checked out the website and the characters are actually alot more varied & unique than the trailer made them out to be, well done Fornace I'm even more hyped about the game now!)

 

[Xanthus]

Is this game going to be accessible to players who aren't as proficient at tech skills, will techs even be a central focus of gameplay? (please no ;_; ) I saw what looked like wavedashing in one of Kragg's showcases, is it gonna be easy to performe or is that the dodge animation?

Game is very easy to pick up, you're very much in control of your character without tech skill. Tech skill is just a cherry on top, if you don't have fast fingers its still the best cupcake you've ever had! The combos come from deciding which move to throw out and moving/spacing accordingly. If you're used to fast combos and short hopping aerials, you'll have an easier time, but even that is really easy to pick up (natural low ending lag, no L cancelling or other goofy techniques required!). You'll start doing combos within 5 minutes if you've played any video game before

 

[RoA_Zam]

Playtester bones (Clay Redmon) signing in. Before anything, I appreciate the opportunity that I've been given to test the game as I've been following news of it frequently and had fun with it before I was actually accepted as a playtester. Last night I played with Xanthus (When he says "the guy I was playing with," that would be me) for about 4 hours or so and I sure have a lot to say! If I don't critique something then it means I don't have any majorly positive or negative opinion about it.

Character-Specific stuff

Tier List (IMO)

1. Orcane (I didn't play him once that night but Xanthus destroyed me every time with him)
2. Kragg (Has some busted options, but not too hard to parry)
3. Zetterburn (Great speed and momentum, predictable recovery at times)
4. Wrastor (dash attack is useless unless you SideB, NeutralB is not okay at all)

Every character has their own major strengths and weaknesses, so making a clear tier list is a difficult thing to do right now. Each character has something about them that seems more or less cheap and busted, but every time you think that you've found a way to break the game there is always a way to combat that.

Orcane
I have no clue how Xanthus is so good with Orcane already. Orcane can abuse dash-cancelled Side Smash (dcss) overtop of a puddle to do retreating Smash attacks with crazy good range and little time to react to them. When Orcane is able to do this under a platform, approaching seems very difficult. I jump above the platform and Orcane does his DownB bubbles. He has a pretty valid recovery with air-dodge > SideB if you don't feel like using the puddle. I still have a big problem with his aerial attacks though. Dair is so hard to DI and Even if you do DI out of it correctly, it's easy to read DI and constantly Dairplane any opponent. Still not sure what you're going for with his forward air and the weird momentum shift backwards.

Summarized Ideas:
- Nerf dair
- Nerf bubbles
- (Maybe?) Shorten range on Side Smash slightly while on top of puddle to make retreating dcss less abusable

Zetterburn
Wolf 2.0 I honestly have few problems with Zetterburn because no matter how easy it is to combo aerial attacks together with him, they're not that hard to air-dodge out of. Catching the opponent on fire almost seems necessary for being able to play him, which isn't hard to do. The entire time me and Xanthus played, spiking with Dair never happened once so it's not like that's something that people can abuse. I like that his sideB and his downB have the end-lag that they do so that they can't be used much for combo's or spam. His recovery seems a bit lacking to be honest. His smash attacks also seem a bit ridiculous to me when incorporated as combo finishers. Especially if there is no possible way to DI from them.

Summarized Ideas:
- Make nair slightly easier to DI out of (nair > nair > nair bothers me so much how easy it can be to pull off)
- Reduce knockback of Side Smash and/or Down Smash 2nd hit slightly
- Make Up Smash rise at an arc angle like Wolf's dash attack in Project: M does (to cover a slightly better range)
- Possibly make his DownB go at a parabolic downward angle (Shulk SideB in Smash4) rather than directly down at a set angle so that it could be used as a possible recovery move
- Make UpB startup time faster (Free for Kragg NeutralB or Wrastor Dair hit to land)

Wrastor
With as broken as he was in the August Playtest, he needed the nerfs he got in this version. His dash attack is pretty much pointless and difficult to combo with unless you use SideB near the ground or platform. SideB > Dash Attack > Dash Attack > Dash Attack > Dash attack is way too easy to pull off if you add dash dances in between attacks to space them. His Bair reminds me of a mixture of Falco and Jigglypuff in Melee. With a SideB set at the right height, it seems entirely possible to pull off a wall of Bairs on a character, but spacing isn't anywhere as easy as Puff in Melee which I like so much. I hate Neutral B. Needs to have something that can trade with it. Needs to be easier to DI out of. Needs more endlag if not either of the other two things. It's pretty easy to avoid but me and Xanthus were constantly avoiding using it because we both dislike how it functions in this version of the game. I like how you can cancel out of his dair with a jump or a air-dodge into another dair or anything else. Reminds me of Melee Shine Jump-Cancel Backair. Wrastor UpB seems like a really easy kill move due to it's hitbox ranges. It's essentially now a Marth UpB which I'm not entirely fond of. Little thing we both noticed, but Nair is almost always needed if you want to try to get Kragg or Zetterburn off stage. I love Wrastor's Character design so far and his nerfs were necessary from the last version. Though I consider him the worst in this version, He's still my favorite.

Summarized Ideas:
- NeutralB nerf
- Something about Dash attack during SideB just doesn't sit well with me. On a stage with no platforms, this would be so broken. Maybe less hitstun?
- Slightly more end-lag on using SideB so that you can't dash attack immediately after it
- Less knockback from UpB

Kragg
Where do I even begin with all the praise for this character? Kragg is one of the most original designs I've seen in this game so far and I absolutely love it. His moveset fits together well and despite his slow speed, he has so many options to make up for it. His fair is amazing, his bair is solid, his dair needs to have a longer lasting hitbox, his uair is a based kill move. utilt is not as annoying as people say it is. Against CPU's it's cheap to use since they don't have AI DI implemented well yet. His UpB into upsmash is a fun little combo that's not hard to get out of, and it can be used against him by any faster characters, so it's not a broken thing. It's still a bread-and-butter combo that I can see him needing to use often as long as it's something that isn't overly predictable by the opponent. SideB is my only major problem with him so far because the only things you can do about it are avoid it and punish when it ends, or parry it. For entry level players, this can be something ridiculously unfair to use against them. I do like it's stall ability in air as a use for recovery. I just think it definitely needs a nerf in the aspect that it needs to have moves that trade with it. His DownB needs WAY more endlag than it already has, and less knockback on the third hit of it because that seems so unfair if you have good spacing on it. retreating dcss makes pretty good use with Kragg just like Orcane. NeutralB is a neat mechanic but I'd like it a little better if it was implemented to slide a bit once it hits the ground if you throw it forward. At one point I threw the rock forward and it hit Orcane, went through orcane, Orcane hit the other side of it since the rock traveled faster than Orcane's knockback, and I got off a Side Smash which hit Orcane into the rock again and allowed for a free fair. In this aspect it dawned on me that when you hit an opponent, their bodies need to have a hitbox with a little knockback when they're sent flying so that they don't just bounce off of any obstacles that would normally stop all of their momentum. Maybe making the rock harder for opponents to break but easier for the Kragg that pulled the rock would also make it better since I found myself getting hit with my own rock more often than I should have IMO.

Summarized Ideas:
- SideB needs to trade with other moves
- DownB Needs more endlag and/or less knockback on 3rd hit
- NeutralB needs some changes, which I listed above
- Dair needs to have a longer lasting hitbox
- Don't make it so that he can attack any faster out of an UpB or else UpB > Up Smash would be guaranteed.
- Uptilt doesn't need change unless you just make it ever so slightly easier to DI left/right out of

Other Things about the game

• Walljumping is very useful at certain points. Orcane can do what Melee Captain Falcon does by running off the side and immediately walljumping. It's saved me many times in a match from death and it's easy to pull off.
• You already know about this, but of course there are just a few bugs with knockback from trades where the game doesn't know how to handle calculating the trade I assume.
• CPU's are at a pretty solid difficulty, but they need to learn how to DI so that playing Kragg against them isn't super easy.
• Me and Xanthus had some fun playing what we call "Ice Climber Mode" by having one controller control two players at once and do a Doubles Team match. Maybe you could incorporate that into the game as an actual thing somehow?
• It runs really smoothly on Xanthus's machine and mine as always, but I'm not sure about how it would run on an average subpar processor.
• I actually really love Basic mode as an option. It makes the Air stage my favorite when there isn't the spring in the middle to jump on.
• Dinput and Xinput work both fine from what I can tell. Need to work on getting 4 Dinput controllers working at once!
• Might just be that I suck at it right now, but Parry's don't seem to work well when I try to time them.
• No character seems to have any great advantage over another right now since every character can combo every other, which I really love about this game. Balance needs to be watched carefully.

That's my current Input. I may have more to say once I get my extra controllers that I've added and after I take this demo to tournaments and have more people try it for themselves. But for now, this what I've come up with after 5 hours of play with 3 different people.

 

[Xanthus]

Balance: Zetterburns Charged Neutral B
This charges very quickly, and becomes a move that's so large and so little ending lag I literally don't think you can punish it / beat it unless you use a projectile. And on top of that: Killing power. I abused it a bit the other day, jumping in while charging it. If he stayed away, I would jump out of it and become safe before trying it again. You have to try to get in range eventually to fight, but it's an instant potential large killing hitbox that also you can jump out of. It might just have a little too much of everything and excels too well: at least as far as range and speed are concerned.

Bug? : Misaligned Green Hurt Boxes
Played around with hitboxes and I'm not sure if these are something separate you made visually (therefor sometimes might get missed updating attacks) or if they always represent the current hitboxes. But I've found the following:

• Zetterburns Down B's greenbox is faster than the animation. I remember you increasing the recovery frames on stream for that move from my suggestion, and guess that didn't get updated.
• Orcane's side B - walljump, after he walljumps he still has side-B greenbox
• When Kragg uses downsmash on top of his neutral b , he retains down smash greenbox.

 

[Streetwize]

Bug? : Misaligned Green Hurt Boxes
Played around with hitboxes and I'm not sure if these are something separate you made visually (therefor sometimes might get missed updating attacks) or if they always represent the current hitboxes. But I've found the following:

• Zetterburns Down B's greenbox is faster than the animation. I remember you increasing the recovery frames on stream for that move from my suggestion, and guess that didn't get updated.
• Orcane's side B - walljump, after he walljumps he still has side-B greenbox
• When Kragg uses downsmash on top of his neutral b , he retains down smash greenbox.

Noticed that myself. I was going to make a video showing Wrastor's down-smash, but I might as well report it here and make a video for something else. It looks like he's supposed to bounce off the opponent when he lands.

Also, why does Z only have momentum carry over for his Up-smash? His other smashes stop him in place.

 

[Puppyfaic]

I'm just going to ask something real quick:
Why does this build run even WORSE than the other one? I'm getting more slowdown from this one than the August build. In fact, I'm getting almost unplayable slowdown when there's two or more human players. CPU players don't do anything, but humans make this pretty much unplayable.

That said, I'm absolutely in LOVE with Kragg. Everything about him just feels right. However, I do have a couple suggestions for Kragg, because as-is I feel he has a little bit of trouble standing up to the rest of the Rivals of Aether cast:

-lessen the amount of damage it takes for Kragg break his square boulder thing. I feel like it currently takes too much effort to try and break it with moves like Side Special, Neutral Air, or Jab. However, this should only apply to Kragg. Enemies should, IMO, have to actually work HARDER to break Kragg's boulder. OR, if you don't want to do this, have a smaller number of pebbles fly out of it each time it takes damage. This would give Kragg a cool projectile game.

-Allow Kragg to pick up the square boulder and toss it again by pressing Neutral Special when next to it.

-Maybe allow the square boulder to be affected by the environment? If it hits the spring on Air Armada, make it fly upwards along with whatever horizontal momentum it was carrying before. If it gets launched by Kragg's giant pillar, have it break and its pebbles fly upwards, setting up for a combo. Things like this.

-Make the giant rock pillar send the combatant into helpless state if it is broken from underneath them. Currently there is no drawback to just constantly summoning pillar after pillar, and having your opponent on your pillar doesn't give any sort of advantage to you. I feel that it's an incredibly pivotal move that should have more power than it does. The ability to break the pillar above a pit and have your opponent fall to their death would be amazing. Imagine the shenanigans: You have your pillar still up. Your opponent is launched in its direction your opponent tries to use it to recover. When they land on it, you toss a boulder at it and it crumbles, forcing them to fall and die. Speaking of which, that's another thing. Currently, Kragg's own projectiles(boulder, pebbles) don't actually damage the pillar. Make that so, please?

-As for his Down Special... Currently, the Down Special stops if there's no ground left to use. What if, when on a platform above ground, the Down Special will act as normal, but when it reaches an edge where it can no longer continue, it instead continues on the ground BELOW the platform! Here's a picture to demonstrate my idea: http://i.imgur.com/IqUlDm0.png The areas highlighted by a green square indicate what I'm getting at.

I'm playing with a PS2 Controller that uses DInput. The controls are kind of weird(Triangle is Jump, Circle is Attack, X is Special. L1 is parry/dodge, and L3(!) is Start. Z Axis and Z Rotation are reversed(Up and Down do Side Strongs, and Left and Right do Up and Down Strongs respectively). However, I'm assuming that you plan on having a way of changing controls in later builds, since you had that feature in Smash Land.

I'm also going to continue pushing the original "%-bar-filling" idea thing. I currently feel like I'm not really doing any actual damage when I hit my enemy. Yeah, I feel like I landed a good blow that I hit them, but I don't feel like I'm actually doing any DAMAGE. Just that I'm HITTING them. Some sort of actual indicator of damage being dealt would be nice. Maybe have the player HUD outline flash? Go with my original bar idea? Both? I don't know.

 

[Puppyfaic]

OK, now something weird has happened. After I tried putting a second controller in (It was a SNES-lookalike LOL), all of a sudden, the game ran flawlessly. Menus didn't lag. I was able to play with more than 1 player. I have no idea what the hell this game is doing. This is very weird.

EDIT: Now it's running badly at all times. Getting around 30% speed.

 

[Streetwize]

My collected feedback will be put in later. I've become a little busy just when I finished this video for you all. Until then...

 

[akf09]

yes kragg should def be able to pick his block bak up with nuetral special!