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Regarding European commentary

♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡

Anti-Illuminati
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
1,863
I've had some thoughts about this topic for a while and decided to write them out.
I've noticed few people making negative remarks about the quality of the commentary on European Smash streams, namely on Twitch chat (I know, I know). While it's true that at the moment the Europe does not have great commentators (e.g. Prog, D1, Wobbles, HMW...) and the commentary is not on par with the American commentary please note the following things:

1. On most European streams commentators are not speaking English as their first language. This may hinder the commentators ability to fluidly express his/her thoughts, occasionally people also make mistakes such as mispronouncing words or misusing terms etc. We might have accents too.

2. Until recently we have NOT had quality streamers such as Salty Playground, therefore we have not had a chance to practice and do commentary in English. I think that producing a good quality commentary requires practice and experience, which both only come with time. Not many people consider it but even Prog & D1 didn't start out as they top class commentators they are today. If you watch some of the older tournaments from few years back (such as Apex 2012) you can see much development, not only in the quality, but also in the phraseology of commentary. Smash commentary has developed as a whole during the past few years into more professional direction.

3. Producing good commentary is something that often seems easier than it actually is. Personally, I find it extremely challenging since you have to keep on talking, analyze the game, try to be funny while being genuinely excited about match. Also Melee is freaking fast, sometimes it's hard to keep up what to keep up with >_<

tl;dr European commentary is still in it's baby shoes, please give it a bit of time and we'll be right with you ^_^

Personally, I'd hope that European commentators would not try to copy or mimic American commentary but rather just try to be themselves and use their own expressions & personality. Copying someone else sounds simply lame and fake. I believe the best commentators use their own personality as a tool of self-expression. It's true that commentating requires dedication and hard work, but it should be also fun. I want to encourage everyone who's aspiring to become a commentator to try it out, perhaps practice it bit by yourself at home if you feel like it. Take a chance and try it out because you might enjoy it! And that's what produces good and genuine commentary, enjoyment that comes out of the passion.

I hope to see more and more versatility in Smash commentary in the future ^_^
 

Captain Jenny

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
30
Location
Berlin, Germany
I've been commentating some German nationals, as well as like every local tournament in my area which provided a stream & I've done it mostly in German, but sometimes (like nationals or larger tournaments in General) I've been commentating in English & even though I don't feel as comfortable with it, as I do commentating in German (which seems about natural, being German), I think I'm pretty okay for the mark everyone else in Europe has set so far.

If you guys wish to become a little more organized regarding commentary or just want more competent people to enlarge the spectrum of different commentators you might wanna make a list of possible commentators & try to hit them up BEFORE a tournament, to actually structure this whole thing a little more.

Benny, Tero & Benne from Salty Playground don't know every single person in a 100+ ppl. event, so a little more planning on our (the communities) part should help to improve the quality of future streams.

We might be able to get a list from every EU-Community with the names / nicknames of their favorite national commentators.

For Germany we've got:
-ZetTroxX
-Jon_ass
-Ice
-Luma
-Kiw1
-pheX
-Usleon
-Nick (from Norway, whose English is excellent)
& myself (MISTRRLOVE is my nickname)
 

Gardex

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 29, 2007
Messages
1,521
Location
Gjøvik/Trondheim, Norway
NNID
Gardex
3DS FC
2707-1617-4394
Try getting somebody who's able to actually stay neutral or objective throughout a set.
Watching people play vs Leffen at beast was ****ing painful because of the clear bias
 

prog

Priest of the Temple of Syrinx
Joined
Mar 11, 2008
Messages
2,155
Location
Brooklyn, NY
Definitely understand. Commentating in your first language is difficult enough, especially with the pace of the game, things you may or may not want to highlight, bringing in history, etc. I give a metric ton of credit to Toph for commentating APEX2014 in Japanese.

As for practice and taking time to build, I think everyone forgets that like players, we have to grind it out as well in order to improve. I've been doing commentary since 2009, starting with locals, attempting to find my voice. I'd say the pieces started coming together in 2011 with Pound V and I'm still making strides or trying to with every event I go to.

None of us are classically trained, none of us went to school for this. We're all amateurs doing the best we can. However, keep it up, I like what you guys bring to the table over there and really hope that the scene rallies around Salty Playground the way we did around CT and VGBC. Best of luck, gang.
 

jjlinyard

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Messages
653
Location
London, UK
We'll get there guys people just gotta practice.

I mean I have my notepad ready for my next event and I think every one is getting there slowly, building up partnerships and be coming more comfortable.

I'm just upset I can't make Republic of fighters to commentate now :( (exams are a day away)
 
Last edited:

Captain Jenny

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
30
Location
Berlin, Germany
Oh yeah by the way, I could definitely commentate at Republic of Fighters & my flight is already booked. In the German boards we dicussed certain rules we wanna have for commentating. Something like:

-2 people minimum
-taking notes for figuring out good synergy between commentators (like 1 for the hype, 1 for the in-depth-knowledge)
-a set number of sets a person should / could commentate in a row (I for example have to smoke every once in a while & usually don't stay longer than 3-4 sets in a row, also it can't get REALLY warm depending on the venue)
-TOs should consider commentary & streaming in general, to provide beverages (& maybe even some snacks) for the streaming team (so maybe they could put that on top of the entry fee - like 50 ct. or something like that)

I think stuff like that should be discussed to figure out how to improve our streaming-quality.
 

Arzak

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 22, 2013
Messages
38
Location
New Orleans
The only problem I've ever had with European commentary is that some commentators seem stuck in 2009 with the gay/******/**** talk. Everything else is pretty much up to personal taste, and it's cool to see that y'all are reaching out and making efforts to improve, but that stuff needs to go.
 

jjlinyard

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Messages
653
Location
London, UK
The only problem I've ever had with European commentary is that some commentators seem stuck in 2009 with the gay/******/**** talk.
After finally travelling around Europe I realised this also, but I think that is more of a result of the community being less developed commercially speaking in Europe as apposed to the expansion commercially in the US atm.

As the scene grows over here and streaming becomes stronger thrn it will probably also br fazed out.
 

TreK

Is "that guy"
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Messages
2,960
Location
France
The french Melee commentators are good, if a bit shouty.
Thing is, we had to use foreign attendees to provide a secondary stream with english commentary.

The language barrier sure is a ***** to deal with.
 

*UÇK

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
13
Location
Osnabrueck - Germany
I' going to quote myself from facebook:

"As the founder of Salty Playground I would like to say a few words.

We are trying to establish a service that targets the european smash scene and its smash audience. Being exposed to the american viewers is a nice and welcome side effect. ... well, to be quite frank, overall the most viewers for our YT-videos come from America.
Nevertheless, our main goal is to showcase as much european talents as possible to a european crowd. We barely know the good players in other countries, SYPG will change this.

The US have a much more supportive infrastructure overall towards professional gaming plus they are all just one big bunch whereas europe has many smash-communities.
I think the main reason that keeps us from being one big european scene is the language barrier.

We have 9 active countries/communities in regards of smash: Finland, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Germany, Netherlands, France, UK and Spain. Make that 10 if you count Italy. Italy with their (former?) powerhouse Andrea Aldwyn Legato has been quiet for some time in the european scope of things.
UK consisting of England, Scotland and Ireland (sorry if I forgot something); "Germany" being the german speaking community consisting of Germany, Austria, Luxemburg and Switzerland. I don't know why but the scandinavians - excluding finland - seem to understand eachother.
Apart from that we speak different languages.

To overcome the language barrier that is keeping us from being one unit and to find a common ground we have to speak english.

One might say commentating in english instead of their own native language hinders the commentators to speak their minds fluently and eloquently. I concur. Yet it is the only way to expose their thinking to a continental, even global, audience. It is only way to actually help the european smash scene. Providing that common ground through streaming and commentary in a common language is supposed to help us growing closer together. That is what we are loooking for.

Much love to the big smash-casters VGBootCamp, CLASH Tournaments, Smash Studios who all want to aid their community. So do we. We are dealing with difficult, uncharted terrain in europe.
Give us some time grow and learn and we will grace you with quality content from europe, the home of many very awesome smasher, known and unknown. Yet.

- UCK

P.S.: Follow & Subscribe

P.P.S.: We are lacking highlight- and hype-videos -> We need video editors. PM me if you have the skillset to help us/the european smash scene and feel like becoming a salty overlord."
 

Bones0

Smash Legend
Joined
Aug 31, 2005
Messages
11,153
Location
Jarrettsville, MD
The handful of European tournaments I've watched had noticeably better commentary than the average US tourney, so idk what you're apologizing for... By all means, keep improving though.
 

♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡

Anti-Illuminati
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
1,863
As of late I've been reconsidering whether European scenes should commentate in their native language or in English. Short list of arguments for each. Obviously these things are matter of opinion also:

Native language:
+ More lingual diversity (expressions etc.)
+ Commentators in general are able to express emotion (such as excitement/'hype') as they're using their mother-tongue
- Non-native speakers are unable the understand the contents
- Less professionalism from the global standpoint?

The following match is a perfect example how well commentators perform using their own mothertongue.
Even though I understood literally nothing of the actual verbal 'information' transferred the excitement
of the commentators made watching extremely enjoyable. I enjoyed hearing how commentators
expressed Smash terms (e.g. stickywalking) while speaking French, among other things.


English

+ Globally understood
+ More professional?
+ Better future for the growth of the Smash scene as whole?
- Lacks lingual diversity in a sense by being the only language used

Perhaps some mid-balance between the two would be optimal?
 

Bones0

Smash Legend
Joined
Aug 31, 2005
Messages
11,153
Location
Jarrettsville, MD
Perhaps some mid-balance between the two would be optimal?
I think it'd be fine if the commentators spoke English by default and switched to the native tongue for hype moments. I don't really need to be able to understand a Wombo Combo reenactment. Idk how easy that is for bilingual people to do though.
 
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