Rate their Chances: the DLC Edition. Day: 192: The final day

[Logo12]

Krystal
Chance: 15%
Want: 0%

Mini Kangaroo
Chance and Want: Double Zeroes

Jirachi prediction: 1%
Offline Tournament Mode: 6%

Nominations: Kamek 5x

Congrats on 10000th post!

Lel

And finally I'm not alone with the 0% want :/

Edit: New chart, now with subheadings cuz I'm an idiot that always misses the main point

 

[Tikivoy]

Mini Kangaroo:
Chance: 0%. (rounded)
I can't imagine this as dlc. Even Diskun at least appeared in a Smash Bros game.
Want: Abstain.

Krystal:
Chance: 20%: I’d imagine her getting in from popularity, which from what I’ve heard and seen, is actually there. She doesn't really have much going for her besides that sadly.

Want: 40% Similar to K-Rool, someone I’ve really wanted in the post-Brawl days; In fact, she was actually my most wanted. By now I’ve lost most interest, though her support has made me slightly more interested again. Not without Wolf tho.

Nomination:
Brash x5.

 

[SpiritofSpeed]

Krystal
Chance: 25%
Want: 70%
Star Fox could use another representative. She could use a more unique moveset from Fox and Falco.

Mini Kangaroo
Chance: 0%
Want: 0%
Didn't even know who she was.

Jirachi prediction: 1%
Offline Tournament Mode: 7%

 

[Chromfirmed]

Hi!

Krystal
Chance: 20%
Want: 5%

Although she doesn't bother me, I prefer to others as DLC character. In addition, she has the disadvantage that may be the next fighter Wolf.

Mini Kangaroo
Chance: 0%
Want: 0%

Simply has no chance.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

. As a female she could use a more unique moveset from Fox and Falco.

Wait...

Her being female automatically makes her more unique?

That's just not right.

She can be unique for entirely different reasons but it has nothing to do with her gender.

 

[Logo12]

So I went on and created a few more stats based on the current votes, not sure why I care so much but here:

Should I put this online btw? :/ dunno if this is even useful when in actual analytics but I'm just doing it for fun as opposed to for glory.

 

[Sir Gengar de Èctoplasma]

So I went on and created a few more stats based on the current votes, not sure why I care so much but here:

Should I put this online btw? :/ dunno if this is even useful when in actual analytics but I'm just doing it for fun as opposed to for glory.

The image is broken. Please nerf.

 

[Delzethin]

@ Logo12 , you have a very interesting approach to this kind of thing. Not many people have tried to bring in hard data; I'll give you that.

But beyond that, I have to question some things.

Spoiler: Very flame-inducing material, read at your risk

Yes, I always have a big problem with the fanbase of Krystal. While I do not like the character to start with, the outside description of Krystal recently just makes me cringe so hard.
Years before this ballot happened, from every popular site/people I know, Adventures is not a good game, (a mediocre Zelda game, I'll add), and Krystal is not exactly a liked character either.

But now, starting on April First of 2015, Krystal's popularity raised up randomly. Everyone is like "I haven't played a Star Fox game so I support Krystal", "Krystal is better than Wolf because staff", "Krystal won't be a clone like Wolf", etc etc etc. Krystal seems like a very severe bandwagon for me. 99.99% of them even went out to bash Wolf, calling him a full clone, JUST for the sake of supporting the character. This is where I started to hate the character.

Then I got here.

Well, to be fair I didn't like most of the popular choices to begin with, especially those indie 3rd parties who got a random popularity from the ballot and stuff. But when I reached here, my opinion went back neutral for most. Being bored one day and I walked in the Krystal thread (and later K Rool thread too for no apparent reason), and just to see how Krystal is portrayed here.

So apparently now:

• People are being like Krystal saved the world of Star Fox or something
• People automatically assume Krystal haters are gay furries, and even further admitting to the point when I tried to justify
• People would favor obtrusive activities on DLC support, as far as telling others who don't want to see it just to go away, as if Miiverse is theirs.

Also that Star Fox Zero case. Up to now I still hear them cry about that ruining the franchise, while out of all related boards in here (Fox Social, Falco Social, Slippy Support, Wolf Support, RTC) are generally positive about the case. Those who hated post-64 and those who didn't like those who hated post-64 are obviously two kind of people, now that I learned.

When someone really counters their point, they will just walk away and say "luckily there's no vote against someone", just purely ignoring those points.

end of rant here

It sounds like you carry a few scars with you. Having your character bashed for undue reasons is incredibly frustrating. As someone who watched a long shot character I've personally pulled for be called "random" and "undeserving" hurt, and not just because it felt like all the work I'd done, all the work my fellow supporters had done, was being disregarded.

That said...those people you ran into were among the worst of Krystal's following. As someone who's been involved in speculation for over a year now--and someone who lurked during Brawl speculation and saw how active Krystal's support base was even back then--most Krystal fans I've seen have little to nothing against Wolf and are more likely to think both characters could make it. Though we ourselves felt a little hurt at first when Star Fox Zero turned out to be yet another retelling of 64, things settled down over time (and it definitely helped when Nintendo confirmed that it wasn't a retcon). Nowadays, most of the concerns I see tend to match up with the same concerns many others have: feeling like another retread, shaky aesthetic quality, questionable voice acting, no online modes, and generally wondering if it was the right direction to take the series in.

I don't know where you saw such a dislike for Krystal, although I could take a few guesses; she's very polarizing in some places. But she's had support for a while now, and even as far back as a year ago, her thread was one of the largest character threads on this site. That upsurge in April was for the same reasons as all of the other characters who also hit the ground running: the Smash Ballot gave them a chance. Though many of us were hoping a new Star Fox game would give Krystal a boost in support, we didn't think she needed to be present any more than K. Rool needed to be present in a new Donkey Kong Country game. We were worried that if she wasn't in the game, her support base would give up and stop trying...which led to some of the reactions you saw at first.

But her support base didn't fall off in the slightest. It turns out there're still a lot of people who think she's worth keeping around and interesting enough to be worthy of being in Smash.

Something to keep in mind...and something I even need to remind myself sometimes: we as a community are more than just our loudest voices.


Beyond that, your data has issues. Just in general, relying so much on hard numbers in a topic that is almost purely speculation is going to have its flaws. I mean, the main reason for this rerate is because a handful of people thought Krystal's previous rating was no longer accurate. But then you started adding in other factors that made little to no sense. Why would her rating need to pass an arbitrary mark for being the second character from their series in addition to combining her original rating and Wolf's? Does the latter not already fulfill the requirements of the former? And what does Slippy's odds have to do with this? Why assume his chances directly harm either of the other two? Considering we have no reason to believe they're limiting characters to one per series (something that should really be proven if it's going to be treated as fact, considering what precedent we have leans toward the opposite), shouldn't their odds be independent of each other? And what's up with those spots where you arbitrarily doubled a total or cut it in half?

To an outside eye, it might make one wonder if the numbers are being skewed.

 

[Logo12]

Beyond that, your data has issues. Just in general, relying so much on hard numbers in a topic that is almost purely speculation is going to have its flaws. I mean, the main reason for this rerate is because a handful of people thought Krystal's previous rating was no longer accurate. But then you started adding in other factors that made little to no sense. Why would her rating need to pass an arbitrary mark for being the second character from their series in addition to combining her original rating and Wolf's? Does the latter not already fulfill the requirements of the former? And what does Slippy's odds have to do with this? Why assume his chances directly harm either of the other two? Considering we have no reason to believe they're limiting characters to one per series (something that should really be proven if it's going to be treated as fact, considering what precedent we have leans toward the opposite), shouldn't their odds be independent of each other? And what's up with those spots where you arbitrarily doubled a total or cut it in half?

Well, as far as I've seen, about most of you took Krystal chance as "Coming with Wolf", so I did the initial calculation of Wolf times two rep per DLC. The latter adjustment didn't really do much effect, but just one point: Even when there's a second DLC, it may not always be her. I didn't say a second rep is impossible, I just took what people thought of in that day of rating the concept, which I suppose includes some of you Krystal fans too, unless you tell me all you just came today. And even if I did, I see most of you deeming Wolf as a lock as well, which of course isn't even true.

I only based fully on data because I know if I actually tried another approach, I'll end up with nothing but bias. Of course this calculation is still biased. And to be fair, I kept out her original rating away from the actual calculation, as you can see. I can only go so far with this approach, since no ways have no flaws to begin with.

I have no exact idea on how Krystal will come without/before Wolf, so I mostly leave those possibilities untouched or at most giving a few arbitrary score on it.

For the halfs and doubles, I stated it way back earlier. With the ballot announcing its closure, I feel hard to see anyone even likely
if there's nothing going for them. As I mentioned Krystal going with Star Fox Zero isn't as sensible as you might think, so along with her, I halved everyone's Chance and Want (1.5x if negative because you-know-what-happens) if they are not those I truly want, or they don't have anything that hints towards their chances.

In short, I know the calculation is flawed. I know the penalty stuff I did is flawed. But I'm only using this approach because I can't find anything better to come up with. That's it. I know this way won't make stuff more fair or stuff, but with a community that has fanbases outnumbering the others with over-optimistic ratings, this cannot be fair anyways.

And for the Wants, don't even bother. Every time I see one of you try to soothe my feelings, one day or two later I will encounter more annoying ones. This is exactly why I don't really like most of the popular choices.

---

The image is broken. Please nerf.

Not entirely sure of the problem, but here's a printscreen link if you want: http://prntscr.com/87jy3x

 

[SpiritofSpeed]

Wait...

Her being female automatically makes her more unique?

That's just not right.

She can be unique for entirely different reasons but it has nothing to do with her gender.

Edited my post. I am deeply sorry if that was considered offending.

 

[Aetheri]

Nominations:
Yoshimitsu x5

 

[IanTheGamer]

Krystal
Chance: 50% (It all depends on if Wolf is DLC or not before the ballot)
Want: 100%
Mini Kangaroo:
Chance: 2% (Not out of possibility to be a troll character like WFT)
Want: 0%
Jirachi
Chance: 20%
Want: 0%
Nominations: Leon Kennedy from Resident Evil x5

 

[Troykv]

Krystal:

Chance: ...

Hahahaha.... This is so strange... I was thinking about Krystal's Chaces to be in Smash based on her most recognized characteristics ... and ended up realizing that I can use arguments with Krystal strangely similar to those that I used before with Micaiah (one of the most unique options left in their franchises and also one the most voted, divisive fandom, both have two compete with a overall most popular character but that both doesn't affect so much their chances because one of them is already confirmed in the game -Roy- and the other is the most likeable option for all the facilities -Wolf-, both are veteran, so overall they are easier to make, etc).... Funny... don't you think?.

So... I will give her a similar chance rate but with some buffs because Krystal has an important advantage: The Post-Brawl interview that mentiones her (and has more popularity), nobody knows the Sakurai's opinion about Micaiah.

Chance: 40%

Want: Abstain

After I realize this... make me unable to hate Krystal so furry/fanservice look.

Mini Kangaroo

Chance: 0.1%

Al least this character has connection with Nintendo... But overall is an idea that could fit better as a character from the Initial Roster for her obscurity.

Want: 50%

Personally I don't care

Predictions:

Jirachi: 1.6%
Offline Tournament mode: 9.5%

Nominations:

Fire Emblem DLC Stage x3
Ballot Runner-up fro Smash 5 x1
Rerate! Shovel Knight x1

 

[XeVioN]

Mini kangaroo
Chance: 1% I haven't heard anybody request this character.
Want: 0% I don't even know who he is.

Jirachi
chance: 3% No doubt an iconic pokemon, But I just don't see Sakurai picking him over some other pokemons.
Want: 5% I'm not a pokemon fan but I've seen better suggestions before such as blaziken or Delphox (I think thats the name)

Krystal
Chance: 45% A month ago I would have said 15% but then I found out shes actually voted quite often in Japan being one of the top most wanted newcomers there Arigato japanese people!
Want 100% I support other characters Issac,Fiora Snake, But she is the only character that I feel like I need I 've been wanting her to join smash since Melee, And I will say I mostly want her because she could be...NO, she is THE ONLY Starfox character that could play different then Fox, and not just that I don't think anybody would fight like her (assuming she fights using her Staff)

Nominations: Mecha Fiora from Xenoblade chronicles( Two freaking blades Canons on her back... wow)

 

[TheRandomCities4]

Krystal
Chance: 38%
Want: 100%

I see Wolf easily getting in before Krystal. Would be nice if they somehow found the inspiration to shake up the Star Fox line-up a bit with Krystal too, but eh... just doesn't seem all too likely.

It's difficult to talk about her potential as a fighter because it doesn't translate that well in conversations. It's just that: potential. It's an unclear topic of discussion.

As long as that is the case, Krystal will remain divisive; lots of the discussion revolving her can be easily and subconsciously misconstrued by predisposition, among other things (and that's not including the whole "fur-bait" logic).

----------------------
Mini Kangaroo:
Full Abstain

 

[Logo12]

You guys literally think Krystal is as likely as Snake...

 

[Troykv]

You guys literally think Krystal is as likely as Snake...

My reasons to put Krystal a high score are based in one of my previous scores... the weird similarities xD

 

[MacDaddyNook]

Mini Kangaroo's Chance: 0%
No offense to anyone, but I think the character suggestions are starting to get out of control, like Shrek/Goku territory.

From what I understand, Mini Kangaroo is the logo that appears on the packaging of old pre-video game Nintendo toys, meaning it's really not a character at all. At least with R.O.B., Nintendo treated it like a persona, even if it was a toy outside of the game, and it had many in-game roles long before Brawl to help solidify it as a character. Mini Kangaroo is nothing more than a static image from an era long ago; it never did anything, even implicitly, and any moveset would be 100% fabricated from nothing. If Nintendo wanted to put in its pre-gaming toys, it'd make more sense for them to be items much like the Super Scope.

Being not a character, let alone one from video games, pretty much kills its chance. Couple that with it being almost being entirely unknown by the people who would be interested in Smash Bros, in which even obscure Japan-only video game characters are better known; thus no demand for it what-so-ever, and it's just not going to happen ever.

Mini Kangaroo's Want: 0%
I love kangaroos, but when it comes to picking characters, I rather actually get a real character. I'd even take Shrek/Goku over this.

----------

Krystal's Chance: 40%
Krystal has a good shot of making it in. She has strong support, is a fairly beloved character (of course she has strong opposition too), is from a well-known series that is getting a new game, and was even considered at one point for Brawl (though to how much is unknown). Her biggest strength is that, due to being to being created independently of the Star Fox series, has the strongest potential to not be a derivative of Fox's Blast/Deflector combo. In beta footage of Dinosaur Planet, she is shown performing the same actions Fox did in Adventures, so it wouldn't be hard to translate that to a unique character.

The only thing going against her is that there are several characters that have a higher demand for her, and there are limited spaces left on the roster. Wolf stands to be the most-likely Star Fox character being both more popular and a veteran, and we may not see two characters from the same series make it in. Despite that, her chances are still better than the vast majority of faces suggested here.

Krystal's Want: 85%
Fox/Falco/Wolf, despite how truly different they are, are too similar for my tastes and I would like to see Star Fox get a character completely different from what we've seen before. Krystal is the only one I can see breaking away from the Blaster/Reflector mold.

 

[FalKoopa]

Edited my post. I am deeply sorry if that was considered offending.

He just said that your point was wrong. I don't think anyone is offended.

 

[The Light Music Club]

You guys literally think Krystal is as likely as Snake...

Personally I don't find either to be likely at all..

Krystal:
Chance: 10% - No way she get's in over Wolf. Getting in with Wolf will hard too though.
Want: 35% - I don't really care for her that much, especially since Wolf isn't in the game yet.

Mini Kangaroo
Chance: 5% - I don't think we will see a character like this even though its an interesting idea and part of Nintendo history
Want: 30% - While interesting, there are many other characters I'd rather see at this point.

Nominations
Fire Emblem Stage x 5
Pokefloats x 5

Predictions:
Jirachi: 2%
Offline Tournament Mode: 10%

 

[Deleted member]

The Directory has been updated.

Krystal
Chance: 5%
Copy and paste, but I didn't really say much.

Krystal
Chance: 5%
Well she has demand at least and some uniqueness going for her. I would rate her higher if it wasn't for Wolf, who is by far one of the most requested characters on the ballot. Her competition is too stiff.

I don't think the Brawl interview thing means much. Sakurai considered Krystal, he knows how unique she could be, but he ultimately chose Wolf due to time constraints. He also happens to be the more requested of the two.
I won't deny the possibility of us getting two Star Fox characters, but the chances are highly unlikely in my eyes. If we have two slots left, then I think they are reserved for the ballot characters or Wolf and a ballot character.

Want: 0%
She can be unique, but I hate Krystal and what she represents.

Mini Kangaroo
Chance and Want: Double Zeroes
Even with some importance in Nintendo history, existing before Mario even, she just faded into history. No one is requesting for her and this would be a random, out there choice to some people.
And no, I don't want her. Not interested.

Jirachi Prediction: 0.67%
Unlikely.
Offline Tournament Mode Prediction: 7.10%
The fact that it's online only will sour some people.

Nominations: Heihachi 5x

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Almost Kut character
Chance: 20%
No way her chances can hit the 50% with the amount of slots left, popularity and competition (Yes, that includes Wolf.
But no it's not just Wolf)

And while I think that Wolf and her Star Fox 0 Absence don't rule her out, they are cons, whether you like it or not.
Yes, they can both be in and yes we know it's not a reboot, but we haven't seen Wolf arrive yet, slots are scarce and pre-ballot is over and 0 is the next big Star Fox game and she's missing it out.

Before you infect me with rabies, saying "MuhDoubleStandards", there are none.

First, whine all you want, but no-one ever said her Star Fox Zero disappearance rules her out.
Just like K. Rool's lack of recent appearances.

It's just less noticable because King K. Rool has massive ballot popularity and other pros that outweigh his one con.

Second, Dixie's popularity is not amazing too with K. Rool around.
Nobody expects her to come along with K. Rool, and if it is it's because she's a bonus.

Just because we viewed her chances as "only" one out of four, that doesn't mean we hate her and we're all muh unfair against her.

Want: 20%
While I just burned her fanbase, I'm actually not opposed.

It's just that I don't have a connection with the character or the series and the playstyle probably won't interest me. (Sure, it's unique but I won't play as her)

Plus, two Star Fox characters out of the slots left? (very possibly only four!)
Not cool.

Mini-Kangaroo gets Double Sub-Titles of the newest Star Fox game Krystal is missing out.

Brash The Bear x5

 

[FunAtParties]

Mini Kangaroo
Chance and Want: Double Zeroes
Even with some importance in Nintendo history, existing before Mario even, she just faded into history. No one is requesting for her and this would be a random, out there choice to some people.
And no, I don't want her. Not interested.

There's literally a dozen of us. A DOZEN!

 

[WeirdChillFever]

There's literally a dozen of us. A DOZEN!

Yes da casuls are votung for mini kanga beqare k, rool!

 

[FunAtParties]

Yes da casuls are votung for mini kanga beqare k, rool!

Was there a point to that comment?

 

[Deleted member]

There's literally a dozen of us. A DOZEN!

I don't think a dozen is enough to convince Sakurai to make her playable.

 

[FunAtParties]

I don't think a dozen is enough to convince Sakurai to make her playable.

'Twas a joke.

 

[Laniv]

Krystal:

Chance: 30%
Not Wolf

Want: 50%


Mini-Kangaroo:

Chance: 1%
A character from the before-times of Nintendo, lost to the sands of time.

Want: Abstain

Predictions for Jirachi: 4% Chance, 17% Want
Predictions for Offline Tournament: 12% Chance, 60% Want

Nominate Captain Syrup x 5

 

[Zerp]

Krystal:
Chance: 20%
Too be honest, I think Wolf decimates her chances, but in the rare event he doesn't show up, she might, but if Wolf shows up, it's GG.
Want: 0% I don't care for the character at all, and I had the very misfortune of my first and only encounter with the character being Command, bleh.

Mini Kangaroo: Abstaining, It would be very hard to accurately rate a character like this.


Predictions:
Jirachi: I was very worried I would have missed this, considering I didn't have internet for forever. I'm ridiculously happy right now that's not the case. Regardless, 4% Chance.

Offline Tournament: 20% Chance

Nominations: Rerate!Magolor x 5 It's now much easier to see his Japanese popularity via article, but it should have been common knowledge earlier honestly.

 

[Logo12]

Score so far:

http://prntscr.com/87oqrx

Hours earlier, when the voters are still saturated with Krystal Fans, the rank LITERALLY went up to 5 and 6 for Chance and Want, and by the time I said this:

You guys literally think Krystal is as likely as Snake...

I actually saw the score both being higher than Snake (but lower than the next contender).

 

[Draxis]

Krystal:
Chance: 50%
I don't need to really explain as @ Delzethin ,@TheCynicalCdr and others who gave 30% and higher already explain her chances but I will say this and is that anyone has a chance to win the ballot ( well to be considered since it more of a suggestion box also characters like Goku doesn't have a chance),but the point is that Krystal definitely has a chance to be a dlc character ( at least an average chance) and it doesn't matter if she is not going to in the next game because being relevant kinda doesn't matter much, just look at K.Rool and Isaac they haven't been relevant and fans still wants them, also Krystal is actually popular so don't think she isn't but I do understand the hate that she has which is fine at first but the hate is kinda getting out of hand sometimes and just feel unnecessary, at least say that you dislike her in her own game but what so bad of her being included in smash when she could possibly bring something new.
Want: 100%
At first I never actually supported her and didn't care who gets added when brawl came ( I was little) but when the ballot was announced I was thinking who should I vote and support, at first it was Wolf because I was really disappointed that he didn't came in the roster at the beginning but then I started playing SF: adventure and I thought why not support Krystal to be a dlc character, yeah she didn't fight and didn't do much in that game but I wanted to see her fight with her staff so I decided to vote for her so she show people what she can really do when she has her staff and since then became my most wanted along with King K.Rool , Isaac, and Wolf. Also since I want Wolf back and want Krystal to join, why not have both so both fans of the characters can be satisfy and isn't it the year of Starfox. I feel like having a Starfox dlc pack for smash would be great so it can have both Wolf and Krystal in it and with a stage included.

Mini Kangaroo: Abstain
Sorry I don't know the character.

 

[Scamper52596]

Krystal
Chance: 7.5%
If we get a Star Fox character, it will probably be Wolf. And he's not even a guarantee anymore. Still the most likely veteran, but there's the chance that veteran DLC might be over. Another problem is that she likely won't make an appearance in Star Fox Zero, so the possibility of Krystal being used as a cross promotion is lessened. Not to mention that we probably won't get more than 1 DLC character per franchise, and Wolf is likely to make it in before Krystal. At this point, it's just really difficult for me to imagine a scenario where both Wolf and Krystal (or even just Krystal) make it in as DLC. I'll give Star Fox's telepathic recruit about 7.5%, which is a 12.5% drop from my original score.
Too many hurdles for me to consider her likely...

Want: 40%
I'm pretty neutral towards Krystal. I played and enjoyed both Adventures and Assault, and don't mind her character. She could make a pretty neat and diverse addition, but I'm not actively supporting her.


Mini Kangaroo
Chance: 0.2%
You know how I'm always saying that a character should be recognizable to the general audience in order to be a good DLC character pick? This is a character that isn't. Doesn't help that there's virtually no support for Mini Kangaroo. I honestly could never see this character as more than anything other than a trophy, and that hasn't even happened yet. I'll give the pre-video game representative a small score of 0.2%.
I wonder who came up with this idea...

Want: 0.3%
I'll stick to video game characters.

 

[LIQUID12A]

Want: 0%
She can be unique, but I hate Krystal and what she represents.

That's some pretty big anger directed towards a fictional character. Almost sounds like you have a vendetta against her or that she ruined your life.

Not that I'm defending Krystal, but I find this interesting.

 

[[Obnoxshush/Dasshizer]]

Krystal

Chance: 15%
She's got popularity, but not as much as Wolf, Krool, Isaac, or Bandanna Dee.

Want: 20%
I'd rather have Wolf get in, but once he's in, I'll give some more support to Krystal.

Mini Kangaroo

Chance: 0%
Diskun has better chances than he.

Want: 1%
OK it is a little intriguing, but I think he work better as a part of Diskun's moveset then a standalone character.

Predictions: Jirachi 2%

Predictions: Online tournament 10%

Nominations: Olaf X5.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Ok, let me just get this out of the way...
Mini-Kangaroo: double zeroes

Really, a mascot from a bunch of Japanese vintage toys from the 70's? I can see that selling to all regions...​

Flamebait

Ok, so Krystal's not one of those characters I can't stand; that slot is pretty well reserved for bandwagoned third-parties. However, Krystal for me is just like Dixie in that she's the main competition from a character I do want from an underrepresented franchise.

Let me start by rehashing last time's arguments.

Sorry Krystal, there's someone people want more from the StarFox universe, and it ain't you. True, there is no rule that we can get multiple characters from the same universe (as I said, I'm still hoping Squirtle decides to return from the dead), but with this particular one...we all know that Smash is made in Japan for a mostly Japanese audience, so a franchise like StarFox (or DK, or Metroid) ends up getting the shaft since Japan doesn't care for it as much. IF we get a DLC character from StarFox, it'll be Wolf - after all, they have to do almost no work to get him in, just port him in from Brawl and done. Krystal would be a rebuild, and if their primary target doesn't like the series that much...that doesn't bode well.
Not that she doesn't have her fans, but Wolf has more.
So while she is popular and has her own fanbase, I don't see the powers that be gracing us with more than one StarFox character, and it's not her.

Now, we need to add the fact that she's unlikely to show in the next game, and therefore won't be used to promote SF0. Japan also loves veterans more than newcomers overall, so that's again another negative for Krystal by way of a plus for Wolf. I highly doubt we'll get more than one character per franchise with the limited DLC slots we have unless it's really called for, and Star Fox just isn't that big or important of a series to warrant it. After all, that was supposed to be the blockbuster game at E3, and everyone was just asking where Zelda was.

Now, I'd like to point out an interesting factoid that also concerns Dixie: the order of importance to a series. If we look at Melee, two RPG franchises bumped up to four characters - Zelda and Mario. Both then consisted of a protagonist (Link/Mario), a semi-clone relative (Young Link/Luigi), the main princess of the game (Zelda/Peach), and the big bad (Ganondorf/Bowser). This seems like a great way to rep most series: A protagonist, his bro, the love interest, and the villain. Now, that's four characters, so if we look at some of the franchises that have been around since the 64 days and have not made it to 4 yet, we can see the big names that are really fitting these archetypes. The biggest examples are the DK and Star Fox franchises: For DK, we have the Kong himself, Diddy as the partner, Dixie as the girl, and K.Rool as the perennial villain. StarFox has Fox, Falco, Krystal and Wolf respectively. Interestingly, both have the main two characters only; that they deserve those four specifically is without question, the issue which arises is that we're probably not getting much DLC, so we'd likely only get one for each. Now, the question is which, and for both franchises the villain is leading the charge. Many people like to complain about a lack of female characters in Smash, but the truth is that we've got quite a number, specifically going up significantly between Brawl's 7 (counting Nana and Jigglypuff as female characters, and counting Shiek/ZSS separately) and SSB4's 8 plus 4 (counting Jigglypuff as female, and then adding the four characters who have one or more female costumes Robin, Wendy, WFT, and Villager). In terms of villains, we've got only two full-time villains in Bowser and Ganondorf; the others are really more 'villains' due to their narcissism (Wario, DDD), are just rivals (DP), or peons (BJ). It's villains that are more absent from the roster, so the fanbase is gravitating towards them more.

In essence, I think @ Logo12 's mathematical analysis is well reasoned.

Want score: Let me just see what I said before...

Want: 0%

First, don't you DARE get in the way of Wolf. We need more villains, and he was one of the few Brawl newcomers I liked. But this isn't about him; I'll save those arguments for another time. Once Wolf is in, then I'll pop that up to about 40.
I know she's got some fans, and everyone is wants more ladies in the game, but I just don't like her design. Everyone else from the universe is realistically colored and flies fighter jets, and she...is a blue psychic vixen with a staff? No offense intended, but she does have a little bit of an "ORIGINAL CHARACTER DO NOT STEAL" air about her, along with the whole "We need to make this character stand out, lets make her look completely different than the rest of the cast so she does!" Mary-Sue-ishness. Not a fan.
So like I said. Wolf first, and then she can go up in Want score. Until then, no.​

​

I still stand by this. I don't get the arguments about her staff giving her fascinating moveset potential - after all, Hyrule Warriors has shown great potential to get an awesome sword-and-magic based bestial moveset for Ganondorf, and he's still stuck as a semi-clone. Just because someone has potential does not mean that anyone will make use of it. Furthermore, even as casual as I am, I notice differences between Fox and Wolf. True, I don't put him down at 'non-clone,' which he is mathematically, but he feels much more different to Fox than, for example, Lucas to Ness.

So, final score:
Chance: 5%
Want: 0%
​

Jirachi prediction: 0.2%
Offline Tourney prediction: 19.1%

Nom: Melee Stadium x5

 

[Delzethin]

Are people really putting this much focus on the cross-promotion argument? The thing that's never happened before in the context of Smash except for one ambiguous case where they were looking for a Marth clone?

That was never Krystal's strongest argument for getting in; it's always been her moveset potential. We were hoping that being in the new Star Fox game would make her support base larger...and also afraid that a game that didn't include her--or worse, a retcon--would make people give up and go home. Then it turned out Star Fox Zero didn't include her but also wasn't a retcon, instead merely taking place before her time...which led to some very mixed reactions.

But then her support base didn't fall apart. Instead, people that were quiet about being fans before started actively pushing for her. Maybe SFZ was a catalyst in some way. Maybe Krystal's absence, combined with the bittersweet taste SFZ's E3 demo left in people's mouths, made some people who were on the fence decide they missed her. Whatever the reason is, her support is still going strong despite something happening that we feared would destroy it.

So, it was never about the cross-promotion.

 

[Cane Seven]

That's some pretty big anger directed towards a fictional character. Almost sounds like you have a vendetta against her or that she ruined your life.

Not that I'm defending Krystal, but I find this interesting.

She's the reason Star Fox failed. I'm gonna blame the character instead of Miyamoto. *sarcasm*

Krystal:
Chance: 45%
Want: 99%

Abstain on everything else.

 

[IanTheGamer]

She's the reason Star Fox failed. I'm gonna blame the character instead of Miyamoto. *sarcasm*

Krystal:
Chance: 45%
Want: 99%

Abstain on everything else.

I gave Krystal slightly higher odds, 50% because of her popularity, moveset, and because of her being considered for Brawl,

 

[Gene]

Krystal

Chance: 25%
Want: 0%
That's all I'll say.

Mini Kangaroo

Chance: 0%
Her chances are rock bottom for Smash 4. But that's actually a good thing. Mini Kangaroo is pretty much the ultimate retro rep so adding her as a ballot DLC character wouldn't do her justice. MK is better suited as either a retro for Smash 5 or save her as the retro rep to end all of them.

Want 100%



Nominate: Slippy Toad x5

 

[Dark_Pit]

That's some pretty big anger directed towards a fictional character. Almost sounds like you have a vendetta against her or that she ruined your life.

Not that I'm defending Krystal, but I find this interesting.

This is LITERALLY the only reason krystal is given a low score around here, it sickens me that whenever she's mentioned there HAS to be a group of hate that follows and makes sure she is hated, and constantly tries to get others to join in. Logo and some others look really stupid to me, pulling out "numbers" out of nowhere.

Anyway.

Krystal

Chance: 60% Look, i'm not saying she's the most likely character out there, but you cant deny the uniqueness, the popularity ESPECIALLY, in Japan. (which has alot of weight), giving SF a breath of fresh air. Look i'm not a wolf hater, he can easily get in too, but to say he's 100% unique is idiotic, (which i've seen from some people). Given the statement from sakurai, yes its old but IT STILL has merit. She will NOT be a clone.

So what do her cons round up to then?
Irrelevant: King K Rool and Isaac say hi.

SHE RUINED TEH STAIRFOX SERIS!!!23: Oh? and writers or the creator get no blame? I suppose sticker star was bad because of Kersti. Have you guys ever realized them um... maybe its the developers? Krystal is just a character, and can be molded and shaped into any way the developers want, there is literally no proof of her "ruining" anything. (in fact, i'd say rare's involvement might have saved starfox from a lonnng hiatus)

Rule 34: Anyone who brings this up should be laughed out of the forum.

There is literally no cons against her other than, She's a western made character sakurai will never make those playable, diddy was a rare honor and should be thankful that it was acknowledged by glorious Nippon. This may prove to be the problem that decides her fate. (same with King K.)

It makes me sad time and again to see the unwarranted hate for something that doesn't even exist, this is what makes the smash community toxic. We are treated as second-class supporters because of this, all of you who hate the character without a valid reason (and there is none), I weep for your irl attitudes. But again no one cares because furbait! It can't be because they grew up with the gamecube, it can't possibly be that!

Sigh.

Want: 100%

Mini Kangaroo:
Chance: I do not know who this is so i am abstaining, I am not just gonna give 0's or a low score because I dont know the character much, like some have been doing.

noms: idk x5 brash the bear.