Rate Their Chances - Smash Ultimate Edition! Day 672: Five Most Likely First and Third Parties for Smash 6, and Final Goodbyes

[TheAnvil]

Is there even another? At risk of offending someone, no other Mario women are coming to my mind unless you count Birdo.

Toadette?

 

[Fenriraga]

Toadette?

If Captain Toad were to make it, I could see her as an alt. But as her own character... Naw.

Plus, they REALLY want us to believe Toads are genderless for some dumb reason.

 

[DJ3DS]

Nintendo said Run is a main Mario game (check out Mario Portal) so you have to count it. And DK games are main DK games not main Mario games...

I agree with you, and I should have specified that I meant that Dixie had 3 playable appearances in DKC games. Apologies!

Considering that a lot of people who like Daisy gave her a low rated chance level... no it's not bias.

I am suggesting that high chance scores are always accompanied by high want scores, in the sense that people are being biased by their own desire for their character into giving them a higher score than they deserve.

I would like to say one last thing. Daisy is the Princess of Flowers in the Mario series. She has a strong affinity with flowers and plants. It has been demonstrated in many games, even the Mario Party series where characters usually do not have special abilities. It is even in her name and jewellery.

We do not have many plant based fighters in Smash Bros at all. Waluigi does not have that to fall back on. Also, her physical stature and aggressiveness make her more suited to the whole sports rep thing. Please take this in mind when rating Daisy's chances.

You were saying?

 

[Fenriraga]

You were saying?

I didn't know Waluigi could use Hermit Purple!

 

[Llort A. Ton]

- Being in a main, game (before or after Toads doesn't matter) deconfirms the "irrelevant spin-off character" argument

I actually haven't seen much merit in the spin off argument for a while now, at least in the case of the Mario series post Smash 4. Arguably every staple character of the mainline Super Mario series (besides a Toad) is playable. I'd even argue Rosalina was the first character from Mario that wasn't really needed (Fine addition, but nowhere near the importance of the Bros, the damsel, or the family of Koopas).

With all important characters out of the way, it makes sense that the literal millions of Mario fans have their other characters they want. Someone put it perfectly earlier and said that these Mario characters are basically in a "pack", usually Waluigi, Paper Mario, Captain Toad, Geno, Daisy, the all mighty THWOMP etc, who, surprise surprise, are all popularized from spin offs. They're pretty much all thats left for Mario reps.

The spin off argument makes sense for other series; no one is cheering for Kalypso from DK Barrel Blast or Pinkle from Tingles rosy RuppeeLand. Most non-Mario series still have their fair share of staple characters yet to appear. While many would prefer if Mario took a breather to allow these other series to shine, I think Mario is too much of a money maker to not add at least one new character. So at the very least, Daisy has that. Not much else though.

All that said, I still don't realistically see Daisy with all other Mario characters against her. The 3 things I've seen brought up for her move set the most here are the sports, personality, and flower power. Sporty moveset and personality could very well go to the more popular Waluigi, and it may be a stretch, but they could make a flower power/plant based fighter out of Petey Piranha if they wanted to focus on that for a move set. Basically, as I see it, anything she can do can be done by someone else from her games and executed better. Long post, I know, but it seems the Daisy people like to debunk this like it's pre brawl days, while I don't see this as the issue Daisy fans should worry about.

TLDR- The spinoff argument doesn't work for or against her; the fact shes facing fierce competition from other Mario characters on her level is what's really bringing her chances down imo.

Ok so hear me out, We rated:

Captain Toad with Pauline
Paper Mario with Daisy

I suggest we rate Waluigi with another Mario girl

Not really Mario persay, but Ashley or Captain Syrup? Them and Waluigi are both commonly associated with Wario.

I didn't know Waluigi could use Hermit Purple!

 

[Morbi]

I agree with you, and I should have specified that I meant that Dixie had 3 playable appearances in DKC games. Apologies!



I am suggesting that high chance scores are always accompanied by high want scores, in the sense that people are being biased by their own desire for their character into giving them a higher score than they deserve.

You were saying?

The opposite is also true. A lot of people are giving her a zero percent chance (which should technically be impossible unless they were confirmed to not make an appearance) and, well, they do not have particularly high want scores either. There is obviously going to be a correlation; however, it goes both ways. Another odd trend is a lot of people placing her at 4% or 14%, both relatively low scores. They arbitrarily cannot seem to round that up to a 5 despite all of their other scores ending in a 0 or 5. Both parties are biased and that is not a problem in this thread as that is more or less the point.

 

[Dr. Jojo Phantasma]

I didn't know Waluigi could use Hermit Purple!

Yes, we need Waluigi with his stand, Za WAH!

 

[chemo]

Daisy

Chance: 1%
Want: 0%

She isn't relevant, she doesn't have any moveset potential, and she lacks popularity. The only way I could see her getting into Smash is if she's a clone or palette+voice swap for Peach, and even then either is extremely unlikely unless Sakurai is desperate trying to come up with clone characters.

Paper Mario

Chance: 20%
Want: 20%

There's probably other Mario characters that are higher priority and if Paper Mario does get in he's probably going to be a clone, which would be a shame because Paper Mario has the potential to have a completely unique moveset compared to his more "3D" cousin, but it's also a case where I would rather see that kind of work put into a different Mario character.

Nomination:

Doomguy x5

 

[MegaMarioMan9]

Hello, owner of the Paper Mario support thread here. Figured I'd give my two cents here even though I haven't visited the tread before now.

Paper Mario
45% Chance
I don't find Paper Mario to be the most likely Mario rep for the next game, given the fact that Waluigi exists. However, similar to Waluigi, he would represent another significant subset of Mario series, the RPG games. If two Mario reps are chosen for the next Smash, Waluigi and Paper Mario are the ones I imagine making the cut. It's theoretically possible that if Waluigi didn't make the cut, Paper Mario's chances would be a bit greater. The only thing I can see working against him at this point is the current state of the Paper Mario series, but I think that's a topic best left for another day.
100% Want
I grew up with the series and still love the first three games to death to this day. There's tons of moveset potential spanning across five titles. I'd of course prefer it if his moveset were to encompass the series history rather than having a heavy focus on the recent entries, but we'll have to see how things pan out.

Daisy
15% Chance
Daisy's kind of in a tough spot, as she would likely represent the Mario sports games like Waluigi would, but she has less popularity from what I've seen. I certainly wouldn't count her out, but I find Waluigi and Paper Mario to be the more likely Mario reps.
10% Want
I'm not a huge fan of Daisy, but I can see some of her appeal. She could potentially have an interesting moveset, but I'd much prefer to see Paper Mario and Waluigi in action.

Nominations
Professor Layton x3
Phoenix Wright x2

I'm not completely familiar with the nomination stuff, so let me know if I'm doing it wrong.

 

[Aetheri]

Man, it was definitely a missed opportunity for a Waluigi and Daisy day, the war would have been funnnn. Well, who else besides Mario characters can draw strong controversy?

Ever hear of a series called...

...Fire Emblem?

 

[DaisyandRosalina]

I actually haven't seen much merit in the spin off argument for a while now, at least in the case of the Mario series post Smash 4. Arguably every staple character of the mainline Super Mario series (besides a Toad) is playable. I'd even argue Rosalina was the first character from Mario that wasn't really needed (Fine addition, but nowhere near the importance of the Bros, the damsel, or the family of Koopas).

With all important characters out of the way, it makes sense that the literal millions of Mario fans have their other characters they want. Someone put it perfectly earlier and said that these Mario characters are basically in a "pack", usually Waluigi, Paper Mario, Captain Toad, Geno, Daisy, the all mighty THWOMP etc, who, surprise surprise, are all popularized from spin offs. They're pretty much all thats left for Mario reps.

The spin off argument makes sense for other series; no one is cheering for Kalypso from DK Barrel Blast or Pinkle from Tingles rosy RuppeeLand. Most non-Mario series still have their fair share of staple characters yet to appear. While many would prefer if Mario took a breather to allow these other series to shine, I think Mario is too much of a money maker to not add at least one new character. So at the very least, Daisy has that. Not much else though.

All that said, I still don't realistically see Daisy with all other Mario characters against her. The 3 things I've seen brought up for her move set the most here are the sports, personality, and flower power. Sporty moveset and personality could very well go to the more popular Waluigi, and it may be a stretch, but they could make a flower power/plant based fighter out of Petey Piranha if they wanted to focus on that for a move set. Basically, as I see it, anything she can do can be done by someone else from her games and executed better. Long post, I know, but it seems the Daisy people like to debunk this like it's pre brawl days, while I don't see this as the issue Daisy fans should worry about.

TLDR- The spinoff argument doesn't work for or against her; the fact shes facing fierce competition from other Mario characters on her level is what's really bringing her chances down imo.



Not really Mario persay, but Ashley or Captain Syrup? Them and Waluigi are both commonly associated with Wario.

I disagree with the katest oart if the post refered to me, Daisy can pull off the flower based moveset better than Waluigi: glowers are Daisy's symbol in Mario, they are on her jewels, her name, her origins, most if tge powers. Yeah Waluigi had a plant based attack but that's it, I'm not saying he gas not potential on this sector but speaking of flower powers Daisy takes the cake.
Personally, but this is 100% subjective, I think Daisy can pull off a sport moveset better than Waluigi too because not only she has plenty of iconic alternate costumes to choose from but sports perfectly represent her personality.

 

[DaisyandRosalina]

I am suggesting that high chance scores are always accompanied by high want scores, in the sense that people are being biased by their own desire for their character into giving them a higher score than they deserve.

This is true, however the same thing can be applied to people who don't want Daisy, they give her low want and low chance too. This is my only problem with this thread, bias is always here...

 

[SmashChu]

I'll do this quick

Daisy
Chances - 0%
Want - 0%

Paper Mario
Changes - 0%
Want - 0%

For Paper Mario, the problem is Mario characters are going to move towards Toad or Waluigi. These characters are more popular. In the case of Toad, they could go with Captain since he had his own game. Daisy doesn't offer enough to stand out.

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

Daisy
Chance: 8%
I honestly think Pauline is more likely, and I don't think Pauline is likely.

Want: 25%
If she had a fun moveset I'd probably play her, but I don't really care.

Paper Mario
Chance: 20%
Possible, but unlikely.

Want: 10%
Not a fan of the series, nor of having another Mario.

Nominate 2B x5

 

[StarCrystal20]

Daisy
Chances: 45%
Want: 100%

I personally think if we were to get new Mario reps it would either be both Daisy and Waluigi or both of them not in Not one or the other. I could totally imagine them sharing a reveal trailer. Personally though, I only want Daisy, not Waluigi.

If she was to be a semiclone, she could have similar moves to Peach, such as pulling out an entire Thwomp for strong but slow damage instead of Toad, and throwing number-powered Dice Blocks instead of veggies.

Paper Mario
Chances: 30%
Want: 0%

I wouldn't play as him. Plus, we already have Mario and Dr. Mario. New moveset, sure, but it's still Mario and I don't see the appeal. Just my opinion!

 

[PhilosophicAnimal]

Oh my...there certainly are a lot of replies for this round. I'm really quite afraid to touch this one. But here I go...

Day 19--Flower child and paperboy.

Daisy

Chance: 5%

As an original character? Not very likely. Peach clone might work, but that's it, and that could've happened as early as Melee, but hasn't. Despite any possible original moveset potential, she's got one major hurdle: she looks too darn much like Peach. Shallow, I know. But it's a problem, especially when you consider we already have Rosalina, or possibly will, and she already looks too much like Peach. No matter how much she may deserve it, or how original she COULD be, the sad truth is that anyone who isn't a Daisy fan or a fan of Mario spinoffs will look at her on the roster and think "why is yellow Peach a separate character?" Yes, she has a dedicated (sometimes scarily so) fanbase, but they are an extreme minority. You might say the same of Geno fans, but there is one major difference: you will NOT be able to mistake Geno for another character, or an alt of a character. He is unique, both visually and mechanically. Daisy cannot say the same. She lacks a strong, recognizable "identity", if you will.

For an example of a side character gaining "identity," I refer you to Wario. He had tons of moveset potential AND a much larger fanbase, but was left out of Melee, despite even having several starring roles in games. He didn't show up in Smash until he differentiated himself significantly, through--you guessed it--WarioWare. He got a new design that set him apart from being just an evil version of Mario (which, I will point out, is his default costume,) and made himself synonymous with the madcap, hyperactive, and vaguely disturbing identity of WarioWare. This allowed the "Classic" Wario to get in as well, hidden among his alt costumes and a few signature moves. But the first step was to solidify his identity in a more widespread fashion.

This is what will need to happen with Daisy first. She needs her own game, her own gameplay style, and a strong sense of independent identity. Yoshi got this back in the nineties. Wario got it later. Even Captain Toad is starting to form his, which is why I believe he is much more viable. If I couldn't even consider her being different enough to warrant her own series icon, then I couldn't possibly see her as a character.

Want: 0%

For the reasons listed above.

Paper Mario

Chance: 5%

The problem here is that Paper Mario would be FAR too different to be a clone or alt, but is also just a different interpretation of an existing character, leaving him in a weird sort of middle ground. If PM had starred a completely unique character, then most certainly, we'd already see playable representation for this series. But I highly doubt Sakurai is willing to have three (four, if you count Luigi) different versions of the same general character. Mario's big, but not that big.

Want: 30%

I like PM--the REAL ones, BM (before Miyamoto.) Paper Mario could be very unique, but I'd rather have it repped by a different PM character, one that isn't already on the roster in some form. Of course, PM is now devoid of original characters, so...

Predictions

Young Link: 8%

Pichu: 20%

Nominations

Marx x5

 

[CannonStreak]

Daisy and Paper Mario: Chance: 20%

I just don't see them getting in anytime soon. Not that I dislike them, I actually don't mind them, but I just don't believe they have that much of a chance in getting in Smash 5.

Want for both: 50%

Eh, I wouldn't mind these two being in. Probably wouldn't play as them much, but it would be fine, still.

 

[Pennate]

Daisy:

Chance: 5%
Daisy's chances are helped by her status as a "main" Mario character, but there is little else else going for her. As a character that has been relegated to spinoff titles, Daisy lacks the immediate recognition of many characters agreed to be likely choices for potential newcomers. Furthermore, Daisy has the misfortune of hailing from a franchise packed with iconic characters that whose likelihood of earning a slot on the roster is greater than hers, as they possess greater relevancy, popularity, and/or moveset potential. Ultimately, Daisy's best shot at appearing in a Smash Bros. title would probably be as a last-minute clone of Peach, but it's still unlikely that a character's alternate palette would be promoted to clone status after three games.

Want: 0%
Nothing about this character interests me.


Paper Mario:

Chance: 37%
Paper Mario is the lead of a highly acclaimed spinoff series that's produced titles for sixteen years, and the Paper Mario trophies and stage in Smash 4 show that Sakurai recognizes the games' popularity. However, even if multiple Mario characters are added to Smash 5, Paper Mario must compete for inclusion against other high-end Mario representatives, such as Waluigi, (Captain) Toad, and Geno, whose odds are simply better for reasons to be explained on their respective days; thus, while Paper Mario has a fair chance of showing up in Smash 5, he will probably be overlooked once more.

Want: 50%
I don't have a preference here.

Nominations:
Excitebiker x3
Ganon x2

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

Daisy

Chance: 15%

She could be a clone, or unique character. Though she still has loads of Mario competition to deal with. On top of being a character known for spinoffs despite her popularity and her Super Mario Run inclusion came too late. The only way I see her being lucky is if Sakurai loosen up on his stance on spinoff characters (Dr Mario got considered lucky).

Want: 85%

I wouldn't mind her at all. She was always one of my more consistent Mario mains in spinoffs. Not going to let two bad apples ruin one character for me.

Paper Mario

Chance: 35%

Another Mario or not, you have to admit the Paper Mario games are successful and Paper Mario himself will be a unique fighter. Just that the two stains known as Color Splash and Sticker Star exists and less people want him as a result. Plus competition with other Mario character.

Want: 90%

I love the Paper Mario games and I had been rooting for him for a long bloody time. I would care less about him using stickers or color splats, I would take what I can get and be happy.

Pichu prediction: 14%

RIP sweet prince

Young Link Prediction 15%

Toon Link exists, so yeah...

Nominations: Tsubasa Oribe x5

 

[Deleted member]

Daisy

Chance: 3%
She won't get in on her own merits; this is a rating of a Peach alt evolving into a clone a la Lucina.

Want: 0%​

Paper Mario

Chance: 25%
He definitely has a fair chance on longevity alone. But poor sales and fan backlash concerning his recent endeavors don't help.

Want: 50%
This would be 100% if he was based on the first 2 or 3 Paper Mario games, but I had to average it with my 0% want for a Color Splash/Sticker Star Paper Mario.
​

Nominations: x1 Tingle, x4 Midna/Wolf Link

Predictions

Pichu: 6.7%
Young Link: 6.4%​

 

[SethTheMage]

EDIT: Whoops; accidentally hit the post button too early.

Daisy:

Chance: 20% - I dunno if she's even on the minds of Sakurai and his team this time. I feel that characters like Captain Toad and Waluigi are higher priority than Daisy.

Want: 20% - Not super excited about seeing her. I have heard a lot of creative moveset ideas for Daisy that encapsulate her character, such as a Mario sports themed moveset, so I wouldn't be opposed to the idea if she ended up like that. However, I won't be disappointed if she doesn't show up.

Paper Mario:

Chance: 20% - Despite what a lot of people think, I don't see him as likely. Mario has a lot of characters already with the additions of Rosalina and Bowser Jr, so I can see Sakurai passing this up.

Want: 10% - As much as I love the first three games in the series (TTYD is one of my favorite RPGs), this idea doesn't get me hyped. I play the PM games more for the stories, quirky characters, and original settings than Mario himself. Paper Mario being playable wouldn't recapture the magic for me.


Predictions:

Young Link: 15%
Pichu: 5%

Nominations:
Sans x5

 

[Xenigma]

I gotta say, of all the characters I expected to see people get this passionate over, I really, really did not expect Daisy. My quick two cents on the matter: we're not the ones you have to convince. This is a meaningless forum game to keep us Smash fans occupied while we wait for actual news. Nintendo is the only one who actually matters in choosing Smash characters, so please, send in your fan mail, create fan art, record videos, buy Daisy merchandise, and do whatever else you can to show them you want to see more Daisy. It's good that your passionate, but make sure you direct that passion in a constructive manner, because that's how you get actual results.

Anyway, ratings:

Daisy
Chance - 1%
To me this is a pretty simple case: independent of whatever potential she may offer to Smash, she seems too low on the Mario priority list to make it in unless Sakurai explicitly pulls her up. Nearly as I can tell, first is some version of Toad, then Waluigi, then Paper Mario/Geno/some other Mario RPG character, then finally Daisy. That's not an impossible scenario to succeed in (compared to Pauline, for instance, who I gave a straight 0% for being even lower priority than Daisy), but it requires a lot of things to go right for her to make it into the roster, especially if she is a unique character and not some sort of Peach (semi-)clone. I don't see it happening, at least not in this particular Smash.
Want - 0%
I think it would be a waste to develop her at this point when there are still better/more important Mario characters available.

Paper Mario
Chance - 25%
I did just say that Paper Mario was roughly third on the Mario priority list, so 25% is a bit high, but that's for a specific reason: he represents his own unique series that now has five entries (six if you count Paper Jam) releasing as recently as 2016, right in time for Smash for Switch roster considerations. Even if fans don't think the newer games live up to the standard set by the original and Thousand-Year Door, that's a very notable legacy for this specific version of Mario. It also helps that moveset-wise he could be totally different from base Mario, and while Geno theoretically competes against him for a "Mario RPG" spot, he at least doesn't have to worry about potential licensing issues. I don't know that he makes this game, but I think it's very possible he sneaks in, maybe replacing Dr. Mario on the roster since I don't think that particular inclusion went over well in Sm4sh.
Want - 75%
I'm not as excited for the possibility as I used to be back in the Sm4sh days, but he still strikes me as potentially the most interesting Mario character not yet in Smash.

Nominations - Lucina x5

Pichu Predictions - 3.3% Chance, 17.7% Want
Young Link Predictions - 3.1% Chance, 18.8% Want
I'm expecting to see a whole lot of 1%s and 0%s.

 

[NessSaysOkay]

Welp, I missed yesterday, where we rated an RH rep, my most wanted. Oh well. Suprised how likely people find it to be, I'd give it a 40% at best. Would love to be wrong though. Anyway, time to get dizzy(Get it? Because both characters are mainly from a spinoff? I'll leave)

Daisy
Chance:20% I don't know, she has a very vocal minority, but it's just that, a minority. If they make her bigger, maybe in like another Peach game as the Luigi of it, I'd increase it a lot. Her moveset has potential, but I just don't see the chances being very high.

Want:50%. I could care less either way.

Paper Mario
Chance:30%. I don't think it's gonna happen, Color Splash sold pretty bad, even for Wii U standards, and it hasn't been very critically aclaimed since Super, maybe even arguably ttyd(I love super but some of the fanbase doesen't, which is fine, each to there own.) I feel like Brawl would have been the best time for this, honestly. Maybe if due to how different Nintendo has been with the switch, they actually make a RPG again, but I sure doubt it.

Want:65%. If it incorparated elements from the first 3 along with 4 and 5, okay, that's fine I guess. If it's mainly the first 3, YES PLEASE. If it's just 4 and 5... bleh.

Nominations:Concept:New Mother character x5

 

[FrozenRoy]

(Are people seriously bringing up "Captain Toad can't jump" as a thing? It's a fighting game, they will fudge one of the most basic aspects of it to get a character in if they want, Captain Toad jumping is not going to destroy people's belief in Smash, they could just make him a poor jumper, with similiar logic to Link/Snake. Or even give him a Robin-esque mechanic that lets him jump better as he goes through stuff. ANd so on.)

Chance - Daisy: 39%

I don't consider Daisy especially likely, and then again I expected other people would think her more likely, but she's not in the dumps in terms of likeliness. At least some of this, though, comes from the simple fact that Daisy as a clone would not be a surprising option, and therefor bumps her chances of getting in in general up. She's mostly relegated to spinoffs or unknown games, but Mario spinoffs are soooo common that it still gives her a portfolio, and she has been shown more love than Waluigi aside from on the internet. Without clone potential she would be in the 20%-25% range though, I feel. She does have a good ability to rep Mario spinoffs, which does compete against the aforementioned Waluigi, so it does offer her some unique place...buuuut I feel like other Mario characters are higher priority.

Chance - Paper Mario: 25%

The latest Paper Mario games keep getting panned by lots of people. Paper Mario has had a LOT of chances to be in Smash Brothers following SIGNIFICANTLY more successful games. Paper Mario certainly has a better chance than, say, meme Geno, but it doesn't make his chance especially high, as I feel Sakurai is more likely to go for characters he would find more unique. Paper Mario DOES, however, offer his unique paper stylings and his hammer, so I bumped the score up some...it just feels like Paper Mario's time has passed if he didn't get in with games that were simply much more successful over multiple previous Smash Brothers possibilities.

Paper Mario has basically been killed as an RPG and that's ended up sticking a fork in his chances, I feel.

Want - Daisy: 37%

She could do some fun stuff, having a more energetic princess in the game would be good, and I actually think Daisy AND Waluigi representing different spinoff aspects and as kind of "rivals" would be fun even though it would never happen. She's not someone I would be especially enthused about, but I could see her doing some fun stuff at the least and if the moveset was good wouldn't really have much baggage.

Want - Paper Mario: 40%

Augh! If I knew it would be 64/TTYD/SPM based Paper Mario, this would be really high, TTYD is one of my favorite games ever and the RPGs are all great. But we all know it would be Sticker Mario and that is an active 0%, would hate, whiny baby RUINING EVERYTHING comment here, I just really hate what the Paper Mario series has become compared to what I love. I split the difference and went with 40% because, hey, it COULD be old Paper Mario...

Prediction

Pichu: 6%
Young Link: 2%

Nomination

Waluigi x2
Hades x1
Medusa x1
Viridi x1

 

[FrozenRoy]

FYI the only reason Waluigi was not on the initial schedule is just that the Daisy support thread was so huge. I would have put him on over Daisy if it wasn't so big. Either way Waluigi has a ton of noms so he should be rated in the coming weeks.

Also as a housekeeping note, the noms list is starting to get cluttered with nominations under 10, in fact it takes up a strong portion of the noms list. I will wait as it is not too big of a problem yet, but soon, most likley sometime in April, I will give a notice to nominate some of these up by a certain date, and anything under 25 will be taken off for the time being.

25 feels like too high of a cutoff, especially for so soon. 15/20, maybe? I don't mind the list being more cluttered if it means more noms, and sometimes surprising noms make it up. (Then again, I'm nominating people with the goal of more being 2nd wave than first for the most part, so maybe that's part of it). Plus, what happens with new characters getting put on?

 

[WestyStigga]

Paper Mario
Chance: 10%
Want: 5%

Daisy:
Chance: 1%
Want: 0% No just No...

Prediction
Pichu: 1.5%
Young Link: 1.5%

Nomination:

2B x5

 

[Ghirahilda]

After watching everything that happenned here today I think I Will start to suport Waluigi and Daisy as a pair. Both Together representing Mario Spinoffs
Don't like It? Come at me bro

 

[Kirby Dragons]

These Daisy want scores are depressingly low. If only we had more 80-100s to even them out.

 

[andimidna]

On questions about Daisy vs Dixie: I think it’s the amount of fitting Mario Characters vs DK characters and the fact that you don’t need to be in Mario Spinoffs to be a major DK character

Daisy:
I think she’s more important than Waluigi, yet still less likely than him. Iirc she’s been around since 1989 compared to his 2000, and he has yet to do anything but be a bad meme. But, he’s the more popular meme, so he honestly has a shot.
They definitely seem to be trying to get character rosters w more girls in Mario games, which might’ve helped launch Rosa spreading into recent Mario games. While there were more added into Smash 4, none of them really seem like they wouldn’t have got in had the character been male, meaning that was just a coincidence and not an asset. Rosa’s relevance, recent popularity, and puppeeer moveset; Palutena’s importance, relevance, and popularity; Villager, Wii Fit, Robin, Corrin being avatars that are both male and female; Lucina being a last minute alt to clone upgrade that’s known for using the guise of Marth; Bayonetta’s ballot success. Filler characters are much more likely in Mario Spinoffs, such as Sprixie Princess in Mario Tennis.
The character from the Mario series I see happening is (Captain) Toad. I think Pauline is also a great choice honestly, but I’m not as sure about her. Waluigi is probably the most requested pick of the series. Since the spinoffs are represented in the Mario Characters moves already (Mario fair, Peach fsmash), I definitely don’t see why a character built around that is remotely desirable or interesting. From Sakurai’s perspective, I could definitely see why he’d just laugh at the idea.
Well, back to Daisy. She’s totally recognizable and will probably get her day eventually since she has obvious longevity, but I don’t think this is her game.
I think an alt costume like alph would do her right.
Chance: 7%
It wouldn’t be the most shocking thing, but I’d argue the signs weren’t pointing to it.
Want: 85%
I’m rooting more for Cpt Toad and Pauline, but her voice is hilarious and I’d totally play as her all the time just to be annoying lmaoo
I totally get why ppl don’t want this though

Paper Mario:
Cool series ig but it’s in decline and has no news for the Switch, right?
Visually, he’s not interesting. We have both Mario and flat. I’m sure his party members could make for an interesting moveset, but I’d rather just see a move represented on Mario and other content from the series in other positions. That seems far more fitting. I hate the idea of Toon Link, honestly. And I only say Toon Link and Dr. Mario should return because there’s no reason to cut assets if it started as port. It just seems like kind of a shame to put so much work into making an interesting moveset on such a boring character. It’s literally Mario in a different style, which is why I bring up Toon Link ofc. It deserves representation and the earlier games in the series seem to be highly acclaimed from what I’ve heard.
I find Sheik and ZSS far less offensive of this despite coming from literal transformations before bc they’re unique both visually and moveset-wise with Sheik even having her own name. You wouldn’t even have to know they’re the same person anymore. It’s kind of funny, actually.
I don’t think that would necessary hold him back other than in appeal and popularity in terms of Smash requests, which he has a decent amount of.
Chance: 15%
Want: 30%
He could have a decent moveset if it involves his party members. The hammer/mallet isn’t interesting at all since 3 characters already use one. He could swing it in different ways and directions obviously, but I’m talking about being interesting, since this is about want.

Predictions:
Young Link: 8%
Pichu: 3%

X5 Midna

 

[Leafeon523]

There's still some snow outside my house after a rainstorm. I'm going to collect the salt of all the Sticker Star and Color Splash haters to clear it away. I get that the newer games aren't as good, but you treat them like if the Zelda CDI games were canon.

 

[Organization XIII]

I like PM--the REAL ones, BM (before Miyamoto.) Paper Mario could be very unique, but I'd rather have it repped by a different PM character, one that isn't already on the roster in some form. Of course, PM is now devoid of original characters, so...

All Miyamoto said was that Paper Mario didn't need a story, which is incredibly stupid but, there was a survey after Super's release and no one commented on the story so IS decided we didn't need one (the one time Nintendo actually pays attention to the fans) and to use Super Mario World characters. He didn't say cut partners, he didn't say make every character a toad, and he didn't say replace the turn-based battle system with garbage item management that makes fighting enemies completely pointless. No the current state of Paper Mario is all Intelligent System's fault.

 

[Troykv]

All Miyamoto said was that Paper Mario didn't need a story, which is incredibly stupid but, there was a survey after Super's release and no one commented on the story so IS decided we didn't need one (the one time Nintendo actually pays attention to the fans) and to use Super Mario World characters. He didn't say cut partners, he didn't say make every character a toad, and he didn't say replace the turn-based battle system with garbage item management that makes fighting enemies completely pointless. No the current state of Paper Mario is all Intelligent System's fault.

Yeah, Miyamoto would have influenced the simplification of the system... but... that wasn't his intention... He just wanted them to focus in make a fun game.

After all, Miyamoto is a guy that appreciate a game for it's gameplay-value mostly

 

[Deleted member]

I would like to remind everyone not to talk about banned users. Because they are no longer part of the community, they are not available to respond to any comments related to them. Please keep this in mind for future discussions.

Best Regards,

Fuzzy Pickles!

 

[MegaMarioMan9]

Oh, I forgot to mention something in my rating regarding the Paper Mario series' representation in Smash 4. So, in Smash 4 (the 3DS version) we got a new stage featuring a few different locales from the series. Two from Sticker Star, and one from TTYD. Not only that, but in both versions, we saw a bunch of new trophies from all across the series, even some that could be considered really obscure, like the Li'l Oinks and Flint Cragley. This is actually pretty important, as it's the first time the series has gotten any significant representation in Smash. All that we got before this was like, a trophy in Melee and some stickers in Brawl. I don't know if it really has any impact on Paper Mario's chances as a character, but it definitely shows that the series is on Sakurai's mind.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Daisy

30% Chance

Previous Smash games implies that Mario Spin Offs are barely recognized in Smash. We got Waluigi as an assist and a Paper Mario Stage. And Geno Mii, but that is like a super special case. Daisy has not appeared in a mainline Mario game since Super Mario Land *Edit, Super Mario Run is a thing I forgot, I'll bite, but lets wait until New Super Mario Bros Switch . That is it. Daisy has been stuck in the Mario spinoffs for the better part of almost two decades. She is simply put stuck in a role that makes her inherently unlikely. Unless we see a Mario Tennis or Party or whatever stage or more signs that the spinoffs will get any focus from Sakurai, I do not feel as confident in her.

15% Want

This is only for a HI IM DAISY TAUNT. I do not like Daisy. I do not like her voice, it is grating. She is so annoying in literally every single appearance. So yeah, this is not a character I support. Like at all. Like I would honestly feel that if she was not a Peach clone I would be legitimately mad if she got in the game. I may have hated on some characters in the past, but at I can understand why people would want her. Like what is appealing in Daisy? I guess she is ok, but she has nothing on my girl Pauline.

Paper Mario

80% Chance

Similar to Captain Toad, but instead of having few minor obstacles he has the stigma of being a second mario and the fact he is not in smash yet. See my response from that day.

100% Want

I love Paper Mario. I may hate Sticker Star and feel ambivalent to, but the first three are golden. I need to dig up my old moveset I made for him that was super unique that had partners stickers and pixls. I would love this character in so much.

Nominating No Cuts x 5

If you have not gotten your votes in, you have until 11:00 PM EDT. Otherwise...

Day OVER, OH MY THIS IS GONNA TAKE SOME TIME, EXPECT CALCS TOMORROW MORNING

 

[Smasher 101]

Daisy

Chance: 10%

Most of this is for the possibility of her being a probable last minute (semi-)clone, to be honest. While I do think there will be a Mario character I think it's more likely to be Captain Toad this time, and if they really want to represent the spinoffs I think Waluigi is more likely to be picked. It isn't impossible and I could see her getting in eventually, but I don't think this is her game.

Want: 0%

I quite like Daisy, actually. I tend to pick her fairly often when I play the spinoffs. But not every character I like is one that I think should be in Smash, and in her case, I just don't think she would be a very interesting fighter even if they made her unique. She wouldn't be my first choice for a new clone, either. I would like to see her get something more in the game, but as a fighter I'm just not interested.

Paper Mario

Chance: 20%

It's possible, I suppose. I kind of feel like his best chance was around Brawl or so, though. His more recent games have had a much weaker reception than his earlier titles, I'm doubting an RPG representative, and there's other Mario characters out there. The series got a stage in 3ds, though, so Sakurai might have interest in taking it further.

Want: 0%

Another character that I like, but don't personally have any interest in seeing in Smash. The first two Paper Mario games are among my favorite Mario games of all time, but I don't know...I feel like his major things are done better by someone else already, and there's not much else about him that interests me in a Smash fighter. I 100% want a stage that covers parts of the full series, though. That'd be great.

Pichu prediction: 6.27%
Young Link prediction: 4.90%

Nominations: Jibanyan x5

100+ noms, here we come!

edit: had to quickly put this here earlier since the day ended in the middle of me typing the post up, reasons for Paper Mario have been added.

 

[farvin111]

Paper Mario chance: 40%

Out of all possible Mario reps, I suppose Paper Mario is viable. However, Mario RPGs are usually neglected. Also, Paper Mario in recent years has just been disgraced. Whether Sakurai cares or not is unknown, but other than that, Paper Mario has a pretty good legacy and would be extremely interesting. I just hope having three or more Marios isn't a turn off for Sakurai.

Paper Mario want: 90%

Oh I love me some Paper Mario. It was a big part of my childhood and it's sad to see it go to **** in recent years, but I have hope that Smash could bring it justice, like Mega Man.

Daisy chance: 1%

In the Mario universe, I admit that she's a somewhat big deal. I also don't believe she would necessarily have to be a clone, as moveset potential in general is a terrible argument. Despite these, however, I just can't ever see her getting in. Rosalina made for a much better new female princess-y Mario rep, and I just don't think Daisy is remarkable enough to have a slot for herself.

Daisy want: 0%

No.

 

[PhilosophicAnimal]

All Miyamoto said was that Paper Mario didn't need a story, which is incredibly stupid but, there was a survey after Super's release and no one commented on the story so IS decided we didn't need one (the one time Nintendo actually pays attention to the fans) and to use Super Mario World characters. He didn't say cut partners, he didn't say make every character a toad, and he didn't say replace the turn-based battle system with garbage item management that makes fighting enemies completely pointless. No the current state of Paper Mario is all Intelligent System's fault.

Yeah, Miyamoto would have influenced the simplification of the system... but... that wasn't his intention... He just wanted them to focus in make a fun game.

After all, Miyamoto is a guy that appreciate a game for it's gameplay-value mostly

Well, perhaps I was a bit harsh toward Miyamoto...you both make good points. I just remembered the quote and was going from that. In general, I'm just incredibly disappointed with what happened to PM...blaming someone isn't gonna fix the problem. I fear one of my favorite series will never go back to how it was.

Day OVER, OH MY THIS IS GONNA TAKE SOME TIME, EXPECT CALCS TOMORROW MORNING

I know, right??? I'm just about to start on the noms, and it's looking like a marathon...

 

[DaUsername]

Daisy
Chance: 5%
She just doesn't seem that likely to me, I'm not sure how else to say it.
Want: N/A
I need to do more research.
Paper Mario
Chance: 30%
It's possible, I guess.
Want: N/A
There's a lot of ways this character could work, so I'm not really sure how to rate this.

Pichu prediction: 7%
Young Link prediction: 2%
Noms: Mike Jones x10

Edit: Added words.

 

[ZealousGamer]

Daisy

Chances 25%: Toad is far more likely but she isn't impossible. I think of a few ways to make Daisy not a clone but it is up to Sakurai.

Want: 50%: I wouldn't mind if she joined but I'd rather have Toad if we are talking Mario reps.

Paper Mario

Chances 20%: Not very likely. There are better options than another version of Mario.

Want 5%: Rather not. As I pointed out earlier; there are better options.

Nominations:
Jibanyan 2x
Midna 2x
Skull Kid 1x