Rate Their Chances - Smash Ultimate Edition! Day 672: Five Most Likely First and Third Parties for Smash 6, and Final Goodbyes

[TCT~Phantom]

Good. Now count how many of those are Nintendo games.

You said fighting games blatantly in your first post. No need to move the goalpost.

Expect my ratings tonight around 9.

 

[shocktarts17]

Sephiroth
Chance: 10%

Spoiler: SSBU DLC 'Leaks'

Supposedly Cloud made it into Smash to represent the Final Fantasy series as a whole, functioning as the face of the series despite also being the face of the series' transition from Nintendo to Playstation. While I have no major issues with this logic (I don't love it but I understand and can accept it) the idea that Nintendo would not only ignore all the other Square Enix series in favor of Final Fantasy again, but that they would ignore all of the other Final Fantasy games again to pull another character from FF7 seems like a pretty large stretch no matter how iconic he is. Even if there wasn't talks and rumors about Square Enix getting a rep I think Sephiroth's chances would be low, and with the conversation leaning away from more Final Fantasy representation I'd say Sephiroth's chances are looking pretty bleak. Add to this the nature of trying to balance a 9ft sword (and yes the "too big" thing can come back here because there isn't a version of Sephiroth that does have a short sword unlike a certain large reptile) just seems like the final nail in the coffin. Despite all this his name has shown up on the SE leak list and he is majorly iconic so it's not like he has no chance.

Want: 0%
Honestly I have no interest in Sephiroth. I've played FF7 but I just never really connected with the cast in the same way others did so my interest in them has always been fairly low. Add in the idea that Sephiroth would be pushing out other SE reps, or even other more interesting FF reps like Black Mage or Chocobo Knight just makes him feel really blah for me. And the icing on the blah cake is that he can't even enjoy the "face of Final Fantasy" logic Cloud uses to get into Smash, so he'd be just another 3rd party character with no Nintendo history. And then the cherry on the blah cake is the ridiculous sword would either look goofy with how he uses it to not be OP, or be super OP. I think if I was making a worst case scenario Fighter's Pass he would be one of my 5.

Prediction: SNK Rep 6%
Nominations: Ravio x5
Well we did it Ravio fans (all two of you), tomorrow Ravio will be first place in the 7 to get added to the schedule. It is truly a testament to what one guy with too much time on his hands can do.

I will now be accepting bribes for my future nominations.

 

[TheSeelGoesMeow]

Sephiroth​

Chance 20 %: cloud is enough. I think if they add another square rep it is sora.

Want Abstain I don't know anything about ff7

nominations assist trophies

 

[GoodGrief741]

there isn't a version of Sephiroth that does have a short sword

This is Sephiroth ingame. As you can see, that is a very reasonable size for a blade. It’s artwork and later appearances that give Masamune its ridiculous length, but it’s not like it can’t be made to work.

Edit: site isn’t doing images, huh? Link is this http://www.ricedigital.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/omnislash.jpg

 

[shocktarts17]

This is Sephiroth ingame. As you can see, that is a very reasonable size for a blade. It’s artwork and later appearances that give Masamune its ridiculous length, but it’s not like it can’t be made to work.

Edit: site isn’t doing images, huh? Link is this http://www.ricedigital.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/omnislash.jpg

idk man that doesn't look like a very good angle, its coming straight at us.

(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/RadiantPettyEmperorshrimp-max-1mb.gif)

(https://i.imgur.com/nHLBhuy.jpg)

Here are other views and it looks massive.

 

[GoodGrief741]

idk man that doesn't look like a very good angle, its coming straight at us.

(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/RadiantPettyEmperorshrimp-max-1mb.gif)

(https://i.imgur.com/nHLBhuy.jpg)

Here are other views and it looks massive.

Those aren’t real though. Sephiroth isn’t a party member.

I maintain that it wouldn’t be hard or out of character to have Masamune be a reasonable length.

 

[shocktarts17]

Those aren’t real though. Sephiroth isn’t a party member.

I maintain that it wouldn’t be hard or out of character to have Masamune be a reasonable length.

(https://snackedup.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/final-fantasy-7-sephiroth-chosen-one.png)

Here is one where it's almost as tall as him and goes off the top of the screen, I mean it's not like it's ever a short sword.

And while you could just shorten it, it's not a scaling thing where you scale the whole character down, this is reducing the size of one aspect of a character. It would be like suggesting since Ridley's tail is so long that you could just make it short and stubby and then he'd fit.

Obviously they probably could find some clever way around it, but I hold that it would either be a disservice to Sephiroth fans or be OP.

 

[alguidrag]

Sephiroth
Chance 5%
I can see another SE character happening, maybe even a FF character but somehow I think Sephiroth needed to be a boss not playable
Want 0%
As I said I don't think he will be playable, if they can add bosses in DLC I think he got a shot of being a boss

nomations Agnès or another Bravely series character

 

[Sudz]

Sephiroth
Chance: 0%
Based on the total cluster**** that Cloud and all FF content allegedly was, I'm gonna say it's impossible for Sephiroth to get in. I am not sure how to further elaborate on this. I don't see cooperation happening here lol
Want: 5%
As far as anime swordsmen go, he'd be interesting, but I also think there are a million other more interesting characters to consider for DLC. So it's a no from me. He would be pretty sick as a boss, though.

Noms: Shy Guy x5

 

[Ornl]

Sephiroth
Chance : 0%
- Only the original 8 have playable villains.
- No third license is represented by 2 different non-Echo fighters.
- Sephiroth would be one of the worst choices for Square Enix, limiting the représentation of their editions to 1 unique game.
Want : next.

 

[shocktarts17]

Only the original 8 have playable villains.

what about ?

 

[Ornl]

what about ?

Echo. And Dark Pit is a false villain who is finaly an ally, like Meta Knight.
Bowser, K.Rool, Dedede, Ganondorf, Ridley and Sephiroth are real antagonists.

 

[RealPokeFan11]

Echo. And Dark Pit is a false villain who is finaly an ally, like Meta Knight.
Bowser, K.Rool, Dedede, Ganondorf, Ridley and Sephiroth are real antagonists.

Still a dumb argument. Dedede is also one of those villains who later became an ally.

 

[shocktarts17]

Echo. And Dark Pit is a false villain who is finaly an ally, like Meta Knight.
Bowser, K.Rool, Dedede, Ganondorf, Ridley and Sephiroth are real antagonists.

But you didn't specify that, you just said a playable villain, which Dark Pit is. If you really want it to be some rule you would have to clarify that only the original 8 get unique villains.

And if Dark Pit isn't a villain then Dedede isn't either. Dedede hasn't been a villain in a really long time and in his latest appearance he was only a villain for the first chapter while brainwashed, compared to Dark Pit spending at least half of the game as an antagonist. And honestly Bowser has been an ally in several games too, Nintendo has a weird thing with bad guys not being bad all the time.

And finally, if you look at the roster you'll realize that the original 8 characters' series make up most of the fighters to begin with, with only Kid Icarus and Fire Emblem having more than two characters outside of the original 8. So it makes sense that there wouldn't be any villains outside of those series either when most fighters only have one or two characters from their series.

 

[Ornl]

Still a dumb argument. Dedede is also one of those villains who later became an ally.

Not in all games. In Kid Icarus, Dark Pit is thought to become an ally in the course of adventure (like Shadows for example). What has nothing to do with the origins of Dedede.

 

[shocktarts17]

Not in all games. In Kid Icarus, Dark Pit is thought to become an ally in the course of adventure (like Shadows for example). What has nothing to do with the origins of Dedede.

Dark Pit has only been in one game compared to Dedede's 20+ games. If you did a percentage of game time to villain time Dark Pit would be way more villainous.

 

[Ornl]

Dark Pit has only been in one game compared to Dedede's 20+ games. If you did a percentage of game time to villain time Dark Pit would be way more villainous.

Bowser, K.Rool, Dedede, Ganondorf, Ridley and Sephiroth are real antagonists (2), and
they were final bosses. Not Dark Pit. Only the original 8 have playable true villains (2), even Porky is absent
despite his great potential.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I would give Sephiroth a 30% percent chance just because outside of any Dragon Quest character, Geno, or Sora, he is very likely the next option for a SE rep if it isn't any of them.

even Porky is absent
despite his great potential.

Porky isn't as iconic as the original 8's antagonists, but he is a real villain. If you haven't played the Mother games, than you would assume Porky is just a brat whether than a real threat which, you're wrong if you think that.

 

[RealPokeFan11]

Bowser, K.Rool, Dedede, Ganondorf, Ridley and Sephiroth are real antagonists (2), and
they were final bosses. Not Dark Pit. Only the original 8 have playable true villains (2), even Porky is absent
despite his great potential.

At the end of the day, what the hell does this have to do with anything? Dark Pit technically is still a villain, even if his role was much smaller than most villains. We're simply proving your dumb arguments wrong.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I don't see why we're using Dedede as an example when he's either Kirby's friend/rival or possessed most of the time.

Even in Kirby's Adventure, he just tried to keep Kirby from letting Nightmare go free, even if Dreamland couldn't dream 'cause of it. He was only really a true antagonist in Kirby's Dream Land and Superstar's Spring Breeze/Revenge of the King. As for Meta Knight...in Adventure, he also helped Kirby, even after he fought him, so you could say he was just testing Kirby.

Anyway, if we're gonna have more arguments like we can't have another plant-like character because we already have a literal plant, or we can't have more reptiles...I may as well say we can't have more human characters...these fan-rules are getting weirder and weirder.


-well, guess I'll rate Sephiroth:

How do you even hold that thing what the heck:

Chance: 70% - Ignoring datamines and leaks and whatnot, Sephiroth has a good chance at being one of the DLC characters, as long as Square doesn't mind Nintendo and Sakurai wanting more from FF7. However, since they could also represent other series such as Dragon Quest, Tomb Raider, etc., they might just go for those instead. Since this is still Final Fantasy, however, they may as well let them promote that.

Want: Abstain - I'm interested in Final Fantasy, but I have no interest in Sephiroth himself, personally. I'm not gonna rate this, though, because I don't care either way, and haven't played FF7 (or really any FF except the one on the SNES Classic, which I still need to finish and haven't played much of yet).

Nominations:

Creeper x3
Ninten x2

 

[Ornl]

At the end of the day, what the hell does this have to do with anything?

- Sephiroth is a final boss. In Smash, the final bosses who are fighters are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who does not become an ally. In Smash, enemies that do not become allies are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who wouldn't be an Echo Fighter. In Smash, the non-Echo enemies are from the original 8.
The comparison between Sephiroth and Dark Pit isnt' valid.

 

[TheCJBrine]

- Sephiroth is a final boss. In Smash, the final bosses who are fighters are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who does not become an ally. In Smash, enemies that do not become allies are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who wouldn't be an Echo Fighter. In Smash, the non-Echo enemies are from the original 8.
The comparison between Sephiroth and Dark Pit isnt' valid.

Ridley isn't a final boss until Samus Returns as far as I'm aware, unless you count Robo Ridley.

This is also another case of circumstance instead of silly fan-rules being true. Sakurai has also implied there aren't any rules (other than the three or so he mentioned in the past) in one of his interviews. I really doubt he cares about any of this, especially with the Plant.

 

[shocktarts17]

- Sephiroth is a final boss. In Smash, the final bosses who are fighters are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who does not become an ally. In Smash, enemies that do not become allies are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who wouldn't be an Echo Fighter. In Smash, the non-Echo enemies are from the original 8.
The comparison between Sephiroth and Dark Pit isnt' valid.

I think you're putting a lot of causation into your correlation.

Sephiroth isn't not getting in because only the original 8 can get villains who aren't echoes, he isn't getting in because most series only have 1 or 2 fighters who aren't one of Nintendo's core series (who just so happen to mostly be represented in the original 8). However if Sakurai truly cared about some rule concerning the original 8 and who can be a fighter Fire Emblem/Kid Icarus wouldn't have more than Kirby/Yoshi/DK/Metroid.

It's fine to feel like Sephiroth shouldn't be in because only the original 8 deserve non-echo villains, but that's something that should be kept to your want score.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I think you're putting a lot of causation into your correlation.

Sephiroth isn't not getting in because only the original 8 can get villains who aren't echoes, he isn't getting in because most series only have 1 or 2 fighters who aren't one of Nintendo's core series (who just so happen to mostly be represented in the original 8). However if Sakurai truly cared about some rule concerning the original 8 and who can be a fighter Fire Emblem/Kid Icarus wouldn't have more than Kirby/Yoshi/DK/Metroid.

It's fine to feel like Sephiroth shouldn't be in because only the original 8 deserve non-echo villains, but that's something that should be kept to your want score.

There is no rule that says ''Only the original 8 can have unique villains in the roster.'' That is fan rule ********. Sakurai can add whoever he want's when it comes to Nintendo characters.

 

[shocktarts17]

There is no rule that says ''Only the original 8 can have unique villains in the roster.'' That is fan rule ********. Sakurai can add whoever he want's when it comes to Nintendo characters.

I know that's what I was saying, did you mean to reply to me?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I know that's what I was saying, did you mean to reply to me?

What you mean? If you mean reply to your comment than, yes. I thought you were saying only the original 8's villains can be unique in Smash.

 

[shocktarts17]

What you mean?

You replied to me like I was suggesting that there was a rule that only the original 8 can have a villain, when my whole post was to say there is no such rule. So I wondered if you meant to reply to someone else instead.

 

[GoodGrief741]

- Sephiroth is a final boss. In Smash, the final bosses who are fighters are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who does not become an ally. In Smash, enemies that do not become allies are from the original 8.
- Sephiroth is an enemy who wouldn't be an Echo Fighter. In Smash, the non-Echo enemies are from the original 8.
The comparison between Sephiroth and Dark Pit isnt' valid.

-Sephiroth has silver/white hair. There are several silver/white haired characters not from the original 8.
-Sephiroth is playable in a fighting game. Many characters outside of the original 8 franchises have appeared in one as well.
-Out of the playable fighters, 0/75 killed Aerith, so he’d be unique in that regard.
-Sephiroth’s name starts with an S. There are several characters from non-original 8 franchises whose names start with an S. In fact, third party alone, we have Sonic, Simon, Solid Snake, Cloud Strife, and Bayonetta, whose real name is Cereza, with a starting letter similar phonetically to S. That makes Sephiroth super likely.

See? I can do it too.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

You replied to me like I was suggesting that there was a rule that only the original 8 can have a villain, when my whole post was to say there is no such rule. So I wondered if you meant to reply to someone else instead.

I was replying to you. Sorry, I thought I read your whole comment.

 

[shocktarts17]

I was replying to you. Sorry, I thought I read your whole comment.

No worries!

 

[RealPokeFan11]

Can we move on to the next day? It's been Sephiroth's day for about 3-4 days now.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Who you guys think should be rated next? I would like to see Urbosa rated if she hasn't already.

 

[shocktarts17]

Wait GoodGrief741 is it Ravio's day next?

 

[GoodGrief741]

Who you guys think should be rated next? I would like to see Urbosa rated if she hasn't already.

She hasn’t been rated yet, but you can nominate her.

Wait GoodGrief741 is it Ravio's day next?

Next day is SNK rep. After that it’s the new top 7 (so probably Ravio).

 

[shocktarts17]

Next day is SNK rep. After that it’s the new top 7 (so probably Ravio).

Oh yeah I even did prediction for SNK rep lol my bad

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Tbh I let today go longer to watch stuff go down.

My rating will be later.


And now SNK Rep time

 

[shocktarts17]

Tbh I let today go longer to watch stuff go down.

(https://media0.giphy.com/media/U0OtAFNYX47S/giphy.gif)
^ TCT~Phantom in this thread

SNK Rep
I'm going to start this by saying my knowledge on the subject of SNK is very small, so if I get something wrong or mess up someone let me know and I'll just switch to an abstain here, but I figured I'd try to at least give it a shot.

Chance: 10%
The two most popular SNK series appear to be King of Fighters and Metal Slug, with its most recent appearance being the Nintendo game SNK Heroines: Tag Team Frenzy. While supposedly King of Fighters was one of Sakurai's inspirations for the Smash Brothers series, the series itself is not nearly as popular as other fighters such as Tekken or Street Fighter or Mortal Kombat. While I could see a scenario where KoF gets a rep out of respect for it's legacy and Sakurai being a fan, I don't see it as a very likely pick in Nintendo selected DLC.

Want: 5%
I don't particularly like traditional fighters and never really got into them, only really venturing in if a crossover tempted me (like DC vs Mortal Kombat or Injustice). Because of this I don't really have any interest in a more obscure rep from a traditional fighter when we already have Ryu and Ken, who I already don't really ever play as.

And for the last time,
Nomination: Ravio x5
Nominations: Monster Hunter x5
Nominations: Splashy boi (Magikarp) x5 at the request of RealPokeFan11

 

[DaUsername]

Oh hey, you're back. I was starting to get worried.
SNKharacter
Chance: 10%
While SNK has been around for a very long time, they don't have much to work with when it comes to characters. The only series with a real shot is King of Fighters, but the series isn't that big and there isn't any real fan demand for anyone so it doesn't seem likely.
Want: N/A

Ravio prediction: 3%
Noms: Erdrick x5

 

[Ornl]

-Sephiroth has silver/white hair. There are several silver/white haired characters not from the original 8.
-Sephiroth is playable in a fighting game. Many characters outside of the original 8 franchises have appeared in one as well.
-Out of the playable fighters, 0/75 killed Aerith, so he’d be unique in that regard.
-Sephiroth’s name starts with an S. There are several characters from non-original 8 franchises whose names start with an S. In fact, third party alone, we have Sonic, Simon, Solid Snake, Cloud Strife, and Bayonetta, whose real name is Cereza, with a starting letter similar phonetically to S. That makes Sephiroth super likely.

See? I can do it too.

There is nothing to be proud : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

 

[shocktarts17]

There is nothing to be proud : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Hey in the RTC thread once the day is over and we move on to the next character all discussion on the previous character is over. If you would like to continue discussions please move it to private messages. From the rules on the first page,

3. Please do not discuss a character after their day has ended. If you wish to discuss a character again start nominating them for a rerate, however please wait at least two weeks before renominating a character.