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Rate Their Chances: GAME OVER! Join the RTC Social Group Today!

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So much 50+ with Krystal

Krystal-
Chance- 10%
Want- 20%
I don't really care for her and she only has a stage going for her. Considering we have most newcomers anyway I think its fair to keep most rather low. Also, Falco nor Wolf has been revealed as of now. Rosalina and Robin were only revealed after all Brawl veterans returned.

Excitebiker

Chance- 0.2%
Want- 45%
He can't really work, constantly being on a bike. And we always get retros since Melee? I thought we always got sword weilding lords since Melee too. We don't need a retro. That said, he'd be pretty unique.

Predictions-
Double 0s

Nominations- x5 Galacta Knight and Dark Meta Knight costumes
EDIT: Anybody want to help nominate this with me? I don't think I'm gonna make it otherwise
 
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Morbi

Scavenger
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Jun 21, 2013
Messages
17,168
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Speculation God, GOML
Krystal Chance: 62.713%

It is fairly overt that Krystal is not the most likely candidate for Smash 4; however, I believe that it is unanimously agreed upon that she is the most likely Star Fox representative. In fact, Krystal is more relevant to the Star Fox franchise than most of Team Star Fox. She also offers diversity to the roster for some of the aforementioned reasons (namely her observable move-set potential, something that every other Star Fox character lacks resulting in their apparent similarities). Another female character that is actually prominent would not be utterly outlandish.

Despite her lower ratings from the community there is no legitimate reason that opposes her inclusion; in other words, there is no objective reason indicating that she is not a possibility. The franchise being dormant was never material in the first place; however, clearly, that is no longer the case. The counter-argument of that is also poor, it insinuates that Nintendo is collectively unprepared for release synergy, there is apt precedent that indicates that Sakurai is aware of planned titles and whatnot, thus refuting that presumption regardless.

It is completely and utterly arbitrary to assert, "Star Fox will not receive four characters because... well, I have no feasible reason to support my argument, but ignore the blatant precedent that contradicts my fallacious sentiment anyways because who wants another Star Fox character, amiright?"

#shotsfired
#supportyourargument
#shotsfiredagain

Krystal Want: 100%

I am rather fond of the series and another representative would be grand. Krystal offers a lot in my subjective opinion and I would love to play as her. Sometimes, that is all that is relevant. I want to play as one of my favorite Nintendo characters.
 
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Glaciacott

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 4, 2013
Messages
1,628
Location
Mintendo Noodle House
Krystal
Chance - 2%
Want - 0%

Vocal hatebase here.
It's near the end of announcements, and we barely have anything about Star Fox. It's more likely that Wolf and Falco are in danger than we are to get an extra Star Fox character. Also, Star Fox Wii U was too late and the most recent, Star Fox 64 on the 3DS, didn't even have Krystal.

As for want, I seriously dislike everything Krystal represents and it'd be a shame to 1) lose Wolf or Falco for her, 2) have Star Fox get four characters when a series like Mother doesn't (yes, this is bias) and 3) not get one of the other dozen characters that are far more interesting, significant and lovable.
Even if she does happen, one in fifty still seems to me like a reasonable approximation of her chances. Now to completely follow up on that I give you forty nine unrevealed characters I think are more likely than Krystal, in no particular order

1) Wario
2 ) Ness
3) Jigglypuff
4) Mr. Game and Watch
5) Lucas
6) R.O.B.
7) Mewtwo
8) Ganondorf
9) Ice Climbers
10) K. Rool
11) Dixie
12) Shulk
13) Chorus Kids
14) Marshal
15) Ghirahim
16) Tetra
17) Impa
18) Paper Mario
19) Bowser Jr.
20) Captain Toad
21) Bandana Dee
22) Snake
23) Hades
24) Dark Pit
25) Medusa
26) Black Shadow
27) Louie
28) Jeff
29) Duster
30) Porky
31) Masked Man
32) Sceptile
33) Blaziken
34) Pachirisu
34) Andy
35) Sami
36) Rhythm Monkey
37) Karate Joe
38) Rhythm Wrestler
39) Rhythm Girl
40) Roy
41) Mach Rider
42) Slippy
43) Cranky Kong
44) Duck Hunt Dog
45) Excitebiker
46) Isaac <--- Sorry, don't know how I forgot him @_@
47) Felix
48) Donbe and Hikari
49) Chibi-Robo
50) Krystal

Heck, I'm pretty sure I forgot a lot of big hitters ... can't notice who ... eh, no big deal.
Still, point is, even though a lot of those characters I don't find likely, I still see them as more likely than Krystal. And thus my score. And yes, I was bored, and I figure we're probably not rating characters we rate now again.

Excitebiker
Chance - 5%
Well, he WAS in that previous list, so I think he's more likely than Krystal at the least. But I'm unsure about his odds and I think the series is best repped by stages/music/ATs. Also, if there was a fighter that was on their bike the whole time, I feel Mach Rider would be more likely.

Want - 50%
Indifference I suppose

Predictions
Thing #1 - 23.4%
Thing #2 - 6.231%

No, I don't remember them, and probably won't have time to edit tomorrow. And too lazy to scroll up and look.

Nominations
x5 Use your own Villager and Robin
 
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NATGamer

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 13, 2014
Messages
258
Location
New York
NNID
NATGamer
3DS FC
3737-9639-8538
Excitebiker:

Chance: 50%

Sakurai said he was going to be in Melee instead of the Ice Climbers, but couldn't think of a realistic way of him jumping. Sakurai could've worked around this though and the Biker could be another retro rep.

Want: 35%

I think other characters deserve a spot much more than him and I wouldn't want to play as him.

Krystal:

Chance: 50%

The only way Krystal has a shot at getting in is if Falco or Wolf is cut. We are NOT getting 4 characters from Star Fox since it's such a small franchise. It all depends on if they are both coming back or not.

Want: 0%

I never understood why people wanted her in. We don't need any more Star Fox characters and I don't think she ever has or ever will deserve a spot.
 

andimidna

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 22, 2013
Messages
3,330
Location
Gusty garden galaxy
Krystal:
Chance: 12.5%
Not impossible. But not likely. Not much to say here. Not not not.
Want: 90%
Don't judge me. I'm no furry.
I actually used to want her a lot more.
I want a lot of characters, OK?
Yeesh...

Excitebiker:
Krystal:

He was ruled out in Melee and nothing's changed for the character.
This is a good point.
Chance: 0.5%
Not only is there that, but he's already been sent to Assist Trophy hell and Mach Rider is more popular/requested/recognizable/kewl.
Want: 55%
He's not Mach Rider but he's aiiight-

Edit noms-
x9 Lana
x4 Cia
(8)

nvm, looks like this was edited too late so I have to stick w/ my x5 Lana w/ (16)

Pre:
Idolmaster: 0%
Magikarp: 0%
Just gonna put 0s and see what happens. Wants will be higher, but I'm goin all in quad 0s for muh prediction. And I'll call out any fool I see giving a freakin' fish nobody likes a 50+ score, k?
 
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TheRandomCities4

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 9, 2014
Messages
702
Location
COGNITIVE PSIENCE, SON!
Krystal:

Chance: 60%
Arguably the next in line for Star Fox representation. A 50/50 chance weighted 10% in her favor due to being influenced by the following speculation (as seen in the quotes):

According to Miyamoto, they've been working on the new Star Fox game for about 7 years now, including the transferred ideas from the Wii to the Wii U.

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2014/06/e3_2014_shigeru_miyamoto_confirms_star_fox_for_wii_u

In light of this, I don't think Star Fox's newcomer issue necessarily hinges on relevancy.
Just another theory of mine:

Perhaps Sakurai and his team are using trailers to promote franchises that Nintendo wants to see sold more. These trailers certainly highlight their franchises, after all---they attract a lot of attention. Hence, they raise the awareness of their franchises. It's marketing. Yes, if this were true (and it certainly looks like it could be), it could be viewed as disappointing to some fans---they'd love to see certain franchises be pillared in the epicness of newcomer trailers. As it goes though, there is a limited amount of resources and time to allot towards these newcomer trailers; not all franchises can receive trailers.

There's nothing that says all franchises can't simultaneously receive newcomers, though---with or without trailers.

So, what would this mean about the rest of these franchises?

Well, many of these franchises, even without Smash Brothers, receive more attention than most of the ones shown in the newcomer trailers (except, in the collective notion, Kid Icarus). Not only that, but many of them don't have games out at this moment that Nintendo is focusing on selling. In this sense, perhaps said franchises will receive hidden newcomers? The need to highlight most of these franchises isn't high enough to warrant newcomer trailers. This theory hinges on the idea of each franchise growing---after all, it's the next Smash (it'd be awkward to cut back on these franchises [referring to the ones in the vid, not Mother]).

The main reason why I brought this up is that every single franchise received at least one newcomer in Brawl. All of them---except for Mario (unless you count Wario, which I do because of his heavy association).

In this sense, who's to say the same thing can't happen this time too?

Again, it looks like Sakurai is focusing on newcomers from either recent games or franchises that haven't sold as well as all of the other, arguably more-renowned ones (collectively speaking, not specifically speaking). This could just be part of the marketing ploy---in the bigger scheme.

And to those who might say "Nintendo wouldn't do that---it's greedy and/or unfair":

Too bad. Nintendo is already working some dirty marketing techniques with Smash. Check out how much they're promoting the 3DS version of Smash compared to the Wii U one---they want the 3DS version to sell. But wait, what about the Wii U one? Oh, don't worry, they'll make you want to buy that one too---just not now.

They're making the 3DS version look attractive so that many people get it, only to make the Wii U one look attractive after the 3DS version releases (this is speaking in terms of content---we currently know much more about the 3DS version than the Wii U one).

All I have to say is that it's potentially inconsiderate of Nintendo. Their marketing in general is quite poor, which contributes to the lack of awareness of many of these lesser franchises---and thus, their lower sales figures. Many of these other, more renowned franchises could be argued that they deserve the newcomer trailer spotlights rather than the ones we've seen. However, that's just not the name of the game this time.

All of this said, and I didn't even mention the Amiibo (even if they do bring something unique to the table, they're still commodities to be sold) and potential DLC...

Anyways, to bring the point to a full circle (and I think you know where I'm going with this), perhaps Krystal will be one of these hidden or DLC characters?

(Relevant picture is relevant)



To me, excluding certain more-renowned franchises from growing over others would be odd, especially in this day and age (and especially after knowing that they'd already done it in Brawl). Why can't we have a newcomer for all of them?
Disclaimer: This final quote is sort of my beef with Miyamoto regarding Star Fox, and it is also sort of directed towards those who say "Krystal ruined the franchise!!11!". However, I do admire Miyamoto for his inventiveness---please don't take this as a direct rant against him, but rather an eye-opening spotlight on the facts that have taken place over the many years of Star Fox's developmental history:

Personally, I blame the recent strange choices for the franchise on the game developers.

I also have a bone to pick with Miyamoto, for he feels "ideas mustn't be in a game, even if they are good ones" (quote from Dylan Cuthbert). Miyamoto is selfish in the sense that he doesn't allow anyone else to implement ideas into Star Fox without his approval (which rarely happens, evidently most ideas are from him), and he also doesn't simply allow other companies to create different Star Fox games, especially without his oversight (instead he is the one who consigns the job of making the Star Fox games he envisions to the different companies). He wants to be the sole person to innovate through Star Fox, and that's why it's taken 7 years just for him to finally figure out something to do with the series; he doesn't want others to use Star Fox to innovate or broaden the Star Fox demographic. I don't understand this. Why does he allow many companies to more-freely make Mario or Zelda games and not Star Fox ones? Is he super tight-fisted about the series, and sees it as his baby? Or is he generally afraid of allowing experimentation on something "less popular"? The latter question is already contradicted, because he himself has been experimenting on the Star Fox franchise for the last 7 years! What a hypocrite he is, if that was true...

Miyamoto decided to cancel Star Fox 2 to "have a clear break between 3D on the SNES and 3D on the 64", even though Star Fox 2 was completed.

Miyamoto decided to incorporate Dinosaur Planet into Star Fox Adventures. He is also the one who butchered the original story, forced Andross into a dumb plot-twist, shoved Krystal into a Crystal (just to give her his favorite female trope: "Damsell in Distress", which he has also given to Peach, Zelda, Daisy, Donkey Kong, and Diddy Kong (DK and Diddy Kong in Donkey Kong Country 2 + 3), and avoided using all other unique characters mainly involved with the original story (except for the dinosaurs), and added the idea of the "dinosaur language" to Star Fox Adventures (that's right, it never existed in Dinosaur Planet, and it was certainly not Rare's idea). Come to think of it, why did he keep Krystal if all other characters were thrown out? Just to give Fox a girl? Or is it for another reason...

As a recommendation to JonTron: You don't say no to Miyamoto. Rare is a company that gladly rebels when needed, but in ways that are usually subtle. For instance, they made fun of Microsoft with Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts with the whole beginning sequence of the game, saying that "all gamers want now-a-days are shooters". That's a blatant form of rebellion in one of their games. Unfortunately, many fans took this as an insult to them, and it wasn't. Rare might say things to cover up their true intention during interviews, but that's just to keep their jobs underneath the clueless company known as Microsoft. Point being, Rare would have said no to Miyamoto with Star Fox Adventures. There is a good reason why they didn't. JonTron is funny, but he can be very clueless sometimes, and that provides an unfortunate influence on many gamers, which alters their perception of the developmental story behind Star Fox Adventures, and thus inadvertently affects their perception of Star Fox as a whole. Psychology 101.

Miyamoto also decided that what the series needs are these gimmicky controls that "take the player roughly 30 minutes to an hour to figure out". Why should a game take that long just to figure out its controls?! Gamers now-a-days prefer games they can pick up and play on the spot with ease-of-control. I predict this type of "innovation" is going to fall flat in Miyamoto's face. How is this going to broaden the demographic for Star Fox and increase it's popularity? How?! All this "innovation" is face-value, and not real innovation that expands the game within itself (for instance, expanding the universe from within the game, or adding elements to the game that might attract demographics otherwise not interested into Star Fox). In fact, these "innovations" take away from a company's ability to incorporate additions to the game's universe or lore, because "all of these peripherals make it more difficult to develop games on major platforms" (a quote, in variation, of many different companies who had to work with motion control in some shape or form).

Besides, according to various interviews, Miyamoto is so obsessed with Star Fox that he keeps responding with "I play as Star Fox" when people ask him "which character do you play as in Smash Brothers?" Every time.

Semi-Point in Case: Miyamoto is the one who essentially calls all of the shots for Star Fox! Give someone else a chance, for God's sake...

Otherwise, I blame the franchise's lack of popularity on Nintendo not capitalizing on "innovation" for Star Fox's marketing. That, and their strange, short-handed sense of marketing in general...

This, again, leads me to why I support Krystal. I support her because I want Star Fox, as well as what has happened in the past with development, to be vindicated for its potential. The way many people bash the Star Fox characters on the Smash roster, based on their semi-clone/quasi-clone specials (and not to mention Final Smashes), is disheartening. I'd like to see Sakurai prove his name-sake again (as one who looks mostly to origins when creating characters in Smash) and implement a Star Fox character that could surprise people (in the sense of that character not having to rely on Fox-variant specials). Also, having Krystal in Smash, in my opinion, could vindicate her from that unfortunate developmental story roughly 15 years ago.

There's nothing we can really do about the Star Fox series itself, though. Smash, however, is a venue where characters receive spotlights that they might not have in their series, and in this sense, I'd like to see Krystal have a chance.
There are other theories that I'll choose to keep under wraps for now---ones that have increased the weight of my rating in Krystal's favor.

Want: 100%
If you read the last part in the previous quote, you'll understand why I want her. They're probably reasons you wouldn't expect. Not a furry, btw.

Here's another post I made when I came up for a moveset idea:

(NOTE: I know this exact moveset won't happen---however, let this quote serve as a reminder for her base potential for those who have forgotten, or haven't noticed in the first place)

First of all, let’s set up a knockback scale for Krystal’s moveset:

(From weakest to strongest)

Ineffective (Very minor hitstun, used only with juggle; 0 KO potential [unless it somehow breaks a shield at the ledge]).
Puny (minor hitstun; might KO around 350+%, depending on the position and stage)
Weak (minor hitstun; might KO around 305+%, depending on the position and stage)
Mild (low hitstun; might KO around 180-200+%, depending on the position and stage)
Moderate (low hitstun; might KO around 150-160+%, depending on the position and stage)
Good (okay hitstun; might KO around 120-130+%, depending on the position and stage)
Great (fair hitstun; might KO around 90-100+%, depending on the position and stage)
Excellent (good hitstun; might KO around 75-85+%, depending on the position and stage)

If any one of Krystal’s moves state an in-between (ex: Mild-moderate) knockback, the KO potential is roughly between both categories.

I will refrain from describing the damage dealt with each move. That’s a bit too technical, as it varies with hitbox priority among other things.

Krystal’s ground movement speed would probably be a little below Fox’s. However, her aerial control + ability would probably a little above Fox’s.

The expected goals of a Krystal main: A quasi-ranger. Keep your opponent at least at the full reach of her longer-ranged staff for best results. Characters like Little Mac—who are able to charge in and get within her staff’s range, or use Super Armor abilities to withstand her ranging tactics—would be more difficult to deal with. One example of a more intuitive, challenging strategy for Krystal would include an adept knowledge of her staff’s concealment (will be explained further in the following paragraph).

A side note: Krystal’s staff is to always appear in her right hand (unless she is performing moves that require bothhands with a weapon/weapons other than her staff, i.e. her down smash, but I’ll get to that later). If she uses her staff with moves that require both hands, the item in her left hand will be held through the attacks (obviously, as Smash already does this with certain weapon-wielding characters). However, when not being used, the staff appears in its shorter form (like how it appears on Fox’s back when not equipped in Star Fox Adventures). This allows Krystal only her left hand to use most items. If she uses an item that requires both hands (i.e. the Hammer), her staff will materialize in a strap on her back, sheathed (for “materialization”, think swapping weapons in Borderlands 2—and don’t argue about “they can’t do that in Star Fox”, because plenty of characters can do things in Smash they can’t in their respective franchises [this is especially evidenced by Sakurai’s potd regarding Robin’s nosferatu attack; also, need I mention that Fox can’t use the Fire Fox or Fox Illusion in any Star Fox title? Yeah, case closed]). The reason for the staff being shorter when not used is a play on her mysterious, proverbially playful/tricky nature—it is to conceal the full range of the staff in its physical form, and thus, the reach of some of her physical attacks, only resorting to the staff’s full range when an opportunity presents itself. This would add up into one of the hidden strategies for Krystal mains (as mentioned above).

Neutral A: Basic combos with the staff. 1-2-3-4 style, with the 3rd hit being the juggler ("juggle", as in swiftly spinning the staff from the right side of her body to her left, then back to the right, to "juggle" the opponent for a short time before using the finishing combo move).

The 1st hit: Weak horizontal knockback.

The 2nd hit: Puny vertical knockback.

The 3rd hit: Ineffective horizontal knockback, leaves opponent in front after juggle for finisher.

The 4th hit is a finisher: Moderate-good horizontal-vertical knockback.

Down Tilt: Krystal performs a deft, low forward swipe with her staff. This move has a long and low horizontal reach. Moderate-good horizontal knockback.

Up Tilt: Krystal loosens a moderately small, offensive telekinetic barrier above with her left hand. The barrier acts like a semi-fast projectile, and disappears after a brief moment (only reaching a maximum height roughly twice Krystal’s). The barrier grows weaker as it travels upward, and so does its knockback. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

Left/Right A Tilt: For the sideways tilts, allow me to propose something interesting: a Tilt Combo. This functions similarly to Marth’s Dancing Blade (in the sense of keeping it in mind, so you have a base to understand how the following will function, not necessarily in the sense that it will be similar in-game, per se), but I will point out key elements that diversify Krystal and Marth. One, Krystal’s staff will be tipped with a specific element depending on the moves you use. Two, Krystal will be able to change direction depending on the how you tilt (left or right) during the combo—not only that, but Krystal’s tilt combo itself actually changes if you change direction. Three, Krystal’s tilt combo can end with an up or down tilt, which won’t change depending on the situation—in other words they will act as her regular up/down tilts, but they could be used in conjunction with her tilt combos to end them. Four, Krystal’s tilt combo can intertwine with her neutral A combo. These tilt combos aren’t supposed to juggle your opponent like most players might suspect, rather to provide the player with different ways to keep the opponent at bay (kind of, again, like the mindset behind Marth’s Dancing Blade). This is why knockback will vary with each move. Also, while the striking speed of her tilt combo might not be as fast as her neutral A combo, they are still considerably fast—viable enough for many different uses.

The 1st strike of the sideways A tilt combo has no element. Mild horizontal knockback.

When the 1st strike is initiated backward, the move slightly changes (what I mean by initiated backward is that you tilt A in the direction opposite Krystal is facing in a timely-enough fashion to achieve a different move in the tilt combo [think of the Falcon turn-a-round Punch from Brawl, but maybe not that precise; there’d be a larger grace period to allow the backward initiation for the player]). Weak-mild horizontal knockback.

The options of variance for the tilt combos become sort of exponential after the first strike. After the 1st strike, elements shroud both tips of the staff in this affixed sequence: Fire (2nd strike), Lightning (3rd strike), Ice (4th strike). Keep in mind that these elements override Krystal’s knockback (with a few exceptions).

Fire causes vertical-horizontal knockback. (Always the second strike of the Tilt Combo)
Lightning causes downward knockback. (Always the third strike of the Tilt Combo)
Ice causes vertical-horizontal knockback. (Always the fourth strike of the Tilt Combo)

The damage dealt may, imaginably, slightly differ depending on the element. As a rule of thumb:

Fire = Ice > Lightning. Although the physical moves dictate most of the damage, elements actually have a very minor influence as well. Elemental damage is additive. Elemental damage is also always applied when they’re active, as none of Krystal’s applicable moves are “overridden” damage-wise—they are only enhanced. Like I mentioned before, the additive bonus is very minor, but there is a difference. The main focus of the elemental tilt combo is not the damage, but the knockback.

Before I explain the different 2nd strikes you could make, allow me to explain what exactly these elements entail. First of all, you’re going to have to be aware of the elemental order to intentionally achieve certain results; it’s not gimmicky though, much like Olimar’s Pikmin order (but Olimar’s Pikmin order has more variants of Pikmin than Krystal does elements). Here’s an example: you could initiate the tilt combo early to strike an opponent with a particular element. For instance, lightning causes the opponent to be knocked downward—if they’re on the ground, it could leave them vulnerable for the ice from the 4th strike. If you time yourself well enough, you could even use one of the longer-ranged physical staff attacks, available to the tilt combo, with lightning to spike your recovering opponents from the ledge without having to jump (this is assuming your staff can reach them, or they’re not above you when recovering). Of course, these lighting spikes wouldn’t become too effective until the opponent is roughly around 40%.

After the 1st strike, you could choose one of the following to further (or end) the combo:

Forward Initiated 2nd Strike (Another Forward A-Tilt in the same direction)
Backward Initiated 2nd Strike (A-Tilt in the direction opposite you are facing)
Down Tilt (This effectively ends the current combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Up Tilt (This effectively ends current the combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Neutral A (The Tilt Combo turns into the 2nd strike of the Neutral A Combo—after which, you will not be able to return to the Tilt Combo [you will have to resume the Neutral A Combo, or you could wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation])
Nothing (Wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation; in this sense, you will have treated the combo as a single Forward/Backward A-Tilt. Quick recovery time.)

The forward initiated 2nd strike has the element of Fire. Mild-moderate vertical-horizontal knockback.

The backward initiated 2nd strike has the element of Fire. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback.

The Down Tilt, in this instance, has the element of Fire. If used, it will end the current tilt combo. Moderate-good horizontal-vertical knockback.

The Up Tilt, in this instance (even though it doesn’t use the staff), has the element of Fire. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

With Neutral A, Krystal chains her tilt combo into the 2nd strike of the neutral A combo with the element of Fire. You will not be able to re-chain back into the tilt combo afterwards. This, however, grants her remaining Neutral Combo the elements. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Puny vertical knockback.

After the 2nd strike, you could choose one of the following to further (or end) the combo:

Forward Initiated 3rd Strike (Another Forward A-Tilt in the same direction)
Backward Initiated 3rd Strike (A-Tilt in the direction opposite you are facing)
Down Tilt (This effectively ends the current combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Up Tilt (This effectively ends current the combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Neutral A (The Tilt Combo turns into the 3rd strike of the Neutral A Combo—after which, you will not be able to return to the Tilt Combo [you will have to resume the Neutral A Combo, or you could wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation])
Nothing (Wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation. Quick recovery time.)

The forward initiated 3rd strike has the element of Lightning. Moderate-good downward knockback.

The backward initiated 3rd strike has the element of Lightning. Moderate-good downward knockback.

The Down Tilt, in this instance, has the element of Lightning. If used, it will end the current tilt combo. Moderate-good downward knockback.

The Up Tilt, in this instance (even though it doesn’t use the staff), has the element of Lightning. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

With Neutral A, Krystal chains her tilt combo into the 3rd strike (juggler) of the neutral A combo with the element of Lightning. You will not be able to re-chain back into the tilt combo afterwards. This, however, grants her remaining Neutral Combo the elements. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Ineffective horizontal knockback, leaves opponent in front after juggle for Neutral A finisher.

After the 3rd strike, you could choose one of the following to finish the combo:

Forward Initiated 4th Strike (Another Forward A-Tilt in the same direction)
Backward Initiated 4th Strike (A-Tilt in the direction opposite you are facing)
Down Tilt
Up Tilt
Neutral A
(The Tilt Combo turns into the 4th strike of the Neutral A Combo)
Nothing (Wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation. Quick recovery time.)

The forward initiated 4th strike has the element of Ice. Good vertical-horizontal knockback.

The backward initiated 4th strike has the element of Ice. Good vertical-horizontal knockback.

The Down Tilt, in this instance, has the element of Ice. Moderate-good vertical-horizontal knockback.

The Up Tilt, in this instance (even though it doesn’t use the staff), has the element of Ice. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

With Neutral A, Krystal chains her tilt combo into the 4th strike (finisher) of the neutral A combo with the element of Ice. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate-good horizontal-vertical knockback.

Dash Attack: One of three moves inspired off of Smash Brothers Crusade. Krystal plunges her staff into the ground and uses her forward momentum to spin around it, effectively kicking any would-be opponent. Unlike other characters’ dash attacks, Krystal doesn’t keep moving forward slightly—her position on the ground is stagnant. Moderate-good horizontal knockback.

Neutral Special: One of the few moves inspired off of Joe D.’s moveset. Krystal uses the Gatling Gun in a short burst. This move is chargeable, but you can’t hold onto a charge after it is complete—it’s charged to release. The amount of charge dictates the range of the bullets, as well as the damage of the move itself. Higher charge = more range + damage. Damage and knockback efficiency are also affected by where the opponent was hit—the closer to Krystal the opponent is, the more damage/knockback the move generates. Be mindful, this move does not grant Krystal Super Armor, and can leave her vulnerable while charging. Puny-to-good knockback potential, depending on how close the opponent is to Krystal.

Side Special: Krystal pounces in the direction provided with the tilt to strike with her staff. This move has a slight arch in the trajectory, and can be used to aid in recovering from the left or right. If Krystal makes contact with an opponent, she will deliver a swift blow with her staff. If Krystal makes no contact, only the pounce is performed. Weak-mild horizontal knockback.

Up Special: The staff’s Rocket Booster ability. It’s a recovery move that is able to damage opponents in the way. The Rocket Booster is chargeable like Diddy’s Jet Pack, but can be controlled similarly to Lucario’s ExtremeSpeed while boosting (however it’s not nearly as fast as Lucario’s ExtremeSpeed itself). Weak-mild knockback whose trajectory depends on the direction that the opponent was hit from.

Down Special: The staff’s Ground Quake ability. This move is at its most powerful when used on the ground. It’s a lengthy move where Krystal performs a short hop and forcefully shoves the staff into the ground, creating a minor shockwave. If used in the air, Krystal thrusts the staff downward—allowing her body to follow suit, similarly to the down air of Link/T. Link. If this move strikes the ground from the air, the considerable recovery time is shorter than when using it on the ground—the move however loses half of its power, as well as knockback potential (the Ground Quake is a move that derives power from the ground, so using it in the air cuts down on its power, but hastens its recovery time). There is an exception to this moves’ power when used in the air—it is when it strikes an opponent underneath her in midair. In this case, the move acts like a meteor smash. However, if this move is successfully used as a meteor smash, Krystal loses any further ability to retaliate, leaving her to fall (just like most characters would after using their recovery move). If Krystal strikes someone who is underneath her while she’s in the air, but the opponent is on the ground, the move is not nearly as powerful. Executed on the ground = Good-great horizontal-vertical knockback. Executed in the air to hit an opponent on the ground = Mild horizontal knockback. Executed in the air to hit an opponent in the air = Great downward knockback. If this move strikes the opponents indirectly with the shockwave, they will become temporarily half-buried in the ground. This can’t happen if Krystal executes this move in the air, as the staff will not create any shockwaves once it contacts the ground.

Neutral Air: Krystal briefly twirls her staff, creating a hitbox that covers her whole body. This move does not juggle. Instead it merely repels the opponent. Moderate-good knockback whose trajectory depends on the direction that the opponent was hit from.

Forward Air: Krystal simply extends her right arm forward and allows the staff to reach its full length. The actual attack stems from the force of the staff itself. Mild-moderate horizontal-vertical knockback.

Back Air: Krystal performs a midair backwards roundhouse kick. When finished, she faces the opposite direction she faced prior to the move’s execution. Moderate-good horizontal knockback.

Up Air: Krystal jabs upward with her staff. Moderate vertical knockback.

Down Air: Krystal kicks downward with her right heel. This is her safer-but-weaker alternative spike move, as opposed to the Ground Quake. Moderate downward knockback.

Side Smash: Krystal swiftly plunges her staff into the ground, and uses it to thrust herself forward into a powerful, semi-aerial Do Mawashi Kaiten Geri (wheel kick). This move has a little more forward movement than Fox’s forward smash, as well as a wider sweep. Moderate-to-great horizontal-vertical knockback. Knockback and damage depends on the charge of the smash.

Up Smash: One of the three moves inspired off of Smash Brothers Crusade. Krystal furiously spins her staff above her, juggling an opponent until the release of the move. This is Krystal’s weakest smash attack. Moderate-to-good vertical-horizontal knockback. Knockback and damage depends on the charge of the smash.

Down Smash: The final move inspired off of Smash Brothers Crusade. This move has inspiration from Star Fox Assault, as well. Krystal reaches for both Assault blasters within the holsters at each of her sides. She kneels half way and points each of the blasters at a downward angle, covering both of her sides. The charging animation is inspired by the Assault blaster’s charge in its respective game. She releases the charged blasters. This is Krystal’s strongest smash attack. Good-to-excellent horizontal knockback. Knockback and damage depends on the charge of the smash.

Grab: Krystal grabs with her left arm. She knees the opponent for her mid-grab attack.

Forward Throw: Krystal throws her opponent forward at an upward angle. She uses the Fire Blaster staff ability (from Star Fox Adventures) 3 times to hit the opponent that has been thrown forward to add a little bonus damage. Weak-mild horizontal-vertical knockback.

Back Throw
: Krystal turns and throws her opponent backwards. Mild horizontal knockback.

Up Throw: Krystal shoves her opponent upward with her staff. During this move, her staff becomes tipped with electricity. There is a short surge of electricity at the end of the throw, and this is where most of the force from the throw comes from. Mild vertical knockback.

Down Throw: Krystal shoves her opponent to the ground and uses the Ice Blaster staff ability from Star Fox Adventures. After a brief period, she kicks the opponent away. Mild horizontal knockback.

Final Smash: The other ability inspired off of Joe D.’s moveset. It’s the “Cloudrunner Assault”. Krystal uses her telepathy to call upon an old friend. When active, the Cloudrunner whisks Krystal away on its back, and a target sight appears on-screen that can be aimed. The Cloudrunner loosens considerably-sized fireballs at the opponents on the stage, each time the A button is pressed. This is a call-back to the very first gameplay with Krystal, wherein lies its significance. When the final smash is finished, the target sight widens—soon the Cloudrunner swoops inward wherever the target sight is placed, dealing massive damage to whoever it hits (if it hits). Either way, this is the point where Krystal jumps off the Cloudrunner to resume smashing.

So, what do you think?
I understand that I used this post as a giant dump of some posts I made on the Krystal thread. However, I thought it better to use quotes to give those the option, if they were interested, to hear me out. This way no one would be forced to arbitrarily see a giant post on this thread---gotta mind my manners, you know?

In terms of support, she's lost a lot of steam after Brawl. That's unfortunate. Perspectives shift and change depending on the norm, I guess.

I will admit that there is only one other character that I currently want more than her. Quote, from Cave Story.

Excite Biker - Abstain.

Nominate: Quote, from Cave Story 5x.
 
Last edited:

Delzethin

Character Concept Creator
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Delzethin
Excitebiker
Chance:
-Main Roster: 3%
-As DLC: 2%

So, Takamaru and Prince Sable are out of the running. A lot of people still believe we're getting a retro newcomer still, in the line of Pit and the Ice Climbers. What I don't get is...why? There's no rule that we have to get a throwback character, it's only happened the past two games because Sakurai thought those characters had a lot to gain from having new life breathed into them, and that they'd offer unique playstyles. And if there's some quote of retro characters, then Mega Man and Pac-Man both draw a ton from 80s games for their movesets.

There's also the fact that Sakurai expressed some interest in Mach Rider years ago. I think if we did get a newcomer on a bike, it'd be him and he'd get an alternate color that resembled the Excitebiker.

Want: 10%

I'm a little intrigued by the idea of a character that rides a vehicle...but not nearly enough to want one shoehorned in the roster when there're so many other, younger characters that could be more interesting.


Krystal

Chance:
-Main Roster: 25%
-As DLC: 50%

Seems wherever Krystal goes, controversy follows...and Smash might not be the exception. Even though a new Star Fox game just got announced, it seems to be far too late to affect the roster. Many feel that with the series having been in the doldrums for so long, with nothing other than a remake since 2006, that it'd be a massive stretch to give it a newcomer. Several others associate the Cerinian vixen with a drop off in the series' quality and scapegoat her for it...or worse yet, want the new game to reboot the series and ignore everything that happened after Star Fox 64.

Krystal gets a bad rep, honestly. How is it her fault that Assault had mixed reviews and Command more so, and to those who dislike her character, what better place to redeem her than a new game? A new game that, reportedly, has been in talk for seven years...raising the question of how much was planned out and shelved for later. If this new game had been planned to come out earlier this year or earlier than that, and then delayed to work on something else, then when SSB4's roster was decided on, it would've seemed that she'd be as relevant as Greninja by the time the games came out.

Furthermore, almost every newcomer revealed so far has fit some niche or character archetype we haven't seen before or been distinct from the rest of the roster...and Lucina, the only exception, wasn't originally planned to be her own character. Moveset potential has become one of the most important factors to making the roster...something Krystal has in spades.

It's still an outside shot, but she has one. She's the frontrunner for Star Fox, at least, and if the new Star Fox game was joined by SSB4 DLC that celebrated the franchise's return to prominence with a character that just became relevant again, giving her no major counterarguments? I could see it.

Want: 75%

Moveset potential's a big deal for me, okay? >_>

Krystal's most obvious draw would be her staff, using the techniques Fox picks up in Star Fox Adventures (which is legit, since Palutena's specials use the powers she grants Pit in Uprising), making her a rare new spellcaster so far in a series that has, depending on who you count, 2-5 out of 45-plus. The space animals' lean toward agility (even series "heavyweight" Wolf isn't exactly slow) could lend to her being Smash's first fast magic user, giving her even more of a niche away from the slower Zelda and Palutena and the likely average-speed Robin.

And that's just with the staff. If her moveset also incorporated some of the weapons from Assault, she'd have a blend of magic and technology. No one else has anything close to that!

She may be a controversial character...but if she was implemented well, she could be welcomed as much as Robin was.


Predictions
Idolm@ster Character: 0.34%

Magikarp: 0.02%

Nominations
Sceptile Rerate x5

Let's see if I can't get him one more look.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Krystal

Hoo boy...this RTC day is gonna get heated for sure later on.

Chance: 25%

I'd say thats good enough for her without calling Krystal a shoe-in (Though I don't expect anyone to agree, in fact I expect the opposite. When I come back, I expect a lot of notifications) even though we have yet to see Falco & Wolf & more info for the Wii U Great Fox stage from Star Fox Assault & the game is near release.
B-b-but Palutena stole the staff gimmick!!!

Palutena's staff is a scepter whereas Krystal's is more of a Bo Staff, it can be different just like how Marth & Link both use swords, yet they're completely different from each other along with King Dedede & Kirby having the ability to inhale enemies & use a hammer, yet they're not semi-clones/clones of each other.

I think most of the negativity she gets here is because of the thought that she'll replace Falco or Wolf...relax, it isn't likely gonna happen.

I'll just post this move set @ TheRandomCities4 TheRandomCities4 came up that I thought would suit her well without having to be a Palutena clone

I finally finished my moveset for Krystal!



An interesting proposition. I'll do my best, but I won't make any guarantees...

First of all, let’s set up a knockback scale for Krystal’s moveset:

(From weakest to strongest)

Ineffective (Very minor hitstun, used only with juggle; 0 KO potential [unless it somehow breaks a shield at the ledge]).
Puny (minor hitstun; might KO around 350+%, depending on the position and stage)
Weak (minor hitstun; might KO around 305+%, depending on the position and stage)
Mild (low hitstun; might KO around 180-200+%, depending on the position and stage)
Moderate (low hitstun; might KO around 150-160+%, depending on the position and stage)
Good (okay hitstun; might KO around 120-130+%, depending on the position and stage)
Great (fair hitstun; might KO around 90-100+%, depending on the position and stage)
Excellent (good hitstun; might KO around 75-85+%, depending on the position and stage)

If any one of Krystal’s moves state an in-between (ex: Mild-moderate) knockback, the KO potential is roughly between both categories.

I will refrain from describing the damage dealt with each move. That’s a bit too technical, as it varies with hitbox priority among other things.

Krystal’s ground movement speed would probably be a little below Fox’s. However, her aerial control + ability would probably a little above Fox’s.

The expected goals of a Krystal main: A quasi-ranger. Keep your opponent at least at the full reach of her longer-ranged staff for best results. Characters like Little Mac—who are able to charge in and get within her staff’s range, or use Super Armor abilities to withstand her ranging tactics—would be more difficult to deal with. One example of a more intuitive, challenging strategy for Krystal would include an adept knowledge of her staff’s concealment (will be explained further in the following paragraph).

A side note: Krystal’s staff is to always appear in her right hand (unless she is performing moves that require bothhands with a weapon/weapons other than her staff, i.e. her down smash, but I’ll get to that later). If she uses her staff with moves that require both hands, the item in her left hand will be held through the attacks (obviously, as Smash already does this with certain weapon-wielding characters). However, when not being used, the staff appears in its shorter form (like how it appears on Fox’s back when not equipped in Star Fox Adventures). This allows Krystal only her left hand to use most items. If she uses an item that requires both hands (i.e. the Hammer), her staff will materialize in a strap on her back, sheathed (for “materialization”, think swapping weapons in Borderlands 2—and don’t argue about “they can’t do that in Star Fox”, because plenty of characters can do things in Smash they can’t in their respective franchises [this is especially evidenced by Sakurai’s potd regarding Robin’s nosferatu attack; also, need I mention that Fox can’t use the Fire Fox or Fox Illusion in any Star Fox title? Yeah, case closed]). The reason for the staff being shorter when not used is a play on her mysterious, proverbially playful/tricky nature—it is to conceal the full range of the staff in its physical form, and thus, the reach of some of her physical attacks, only resorting to the staff’s full range when an opportunity presents itself. This would add up into one of the hidden strategies for Krystal mains (as mentioned above).

Neutral A: Basic combos with the staff. 1-2-3-4 style, with the 3rd hit being the juggler ("juggle", as in swiftly spinning the staff from the right side of her body to her left, then back to the right, to "juggle" the opponent for a short time before using the finishing combo move).

The 1st hit: Weak horizontal knockback.

The 2nd hit: Puny vertical knockback.

The 3rd hit: Ineffective horizontal knockback, leaves opponent in front after juggle for finisher.

The 4th hit is a finisher: Moderate-good horizontal-vertical knockback.

Down Tilt: Krystal performs a deft, low forward swipe with her staff. This move has a long and low horizontal reach. Moderate-good horizontal knockback.

Up Tilt: Krystal loosens a moderately small, offensive telekinetic barrier above with her left hand. The barrier acts like a semi-fast projectile, and disappears after a brief moment (only reaching a maximum height roughly twice Krystal’s). The barrier grows weaker as it travels upward, and so does its knockback. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

Left/Right A Tilt: For the sideways tilts, allow me to propose something interesting: a Tilt Combo. This functions similarly to Marth’s Dancing Blade (in the sense of keeping it in mind, so you have a base to understand how the following will function, not necessarily in the sense that it will be similar in-game, per se), but I will point out key elements that diversify Krystal and Marth. One, Krystal’s staff will be tipped with a specific element depending on the moves you use. Two, Krystal will be able to change direction depending on the how you tilt (left or right) during the combo—not only that, but Krystal’s tilt combo itself actually changes if you change direction. Three, Krystal’s tilt combo can end with an up or down tilt, which won’t change depending on the situation—in other words they will act as her regular up/down tilts, but they could be used in conjunction with her tilt combos to end them. Four, Krystal’s tilt combo can intertwine with her neutral A combo. These tilt combos aren’t supposed to juggle your opponent like most players might suspect, rather to provide the player with different ways to keep the opponent at bay (kind of, again, like the mindset behind Marth’s Dancing Blade). This is why knockback will vary with each move. Also, while the striking speed of her tilt combo might not be as fast as her neutral A combo, they are still considerably fast—viable enough for many different uses.

The 1st strike of the sideways A tilt combo has no element. Mild horizontal knockback.

When the 1st strike is initiated backward, the move slightly changes (what I mean by initiated backward is that you tilt A in the direction opposite Krystal is facing in a timely-enough fashion to achieve a different move in the tilt combo [think of the Falcon turn-a-round Punch from Brawl, but maybe not that precise; there’d be a larger grace period to allow the backward initiation for the player]). Weak-mild horizontal knockback.

The options of variance for the tilt combos become sort of exponential after the first strike. After the 1st strike, elements shroud both tips of the staff in this affixed sequence: Fire (2nd strike), Lightning (3rd strike), Ice (4th strike). Keep in mind that these elements override Krystal’s knockback (with a few exceptions).

Fire causes vertical-horizontal knockback. (Always the second strike of the Tilt Combo)
Lightning causes downward knockback. (Always the third strike of the Tilt Combo)
Ice causes vertical-horizontal knockback. (Always the fourth strike of the Tilt Combo)

The damage dealt may, imaginably, slightly differ depending on the element. As a rule of thumb:

Fire = Ice > Lightning. Although the physical moves dictate most of the damage, elements actually have a very minor influence as well. Elemental damage is additive. Elemental damage is also always applied when they’re active, as none of Krystal’s applicable moves are “overridden” damage-wise—they are only enhanced. Like I mentioned before, the additive bonus is very minor, but there is a difference. The main focus of the elemental tilt combo is not the damage, but the knockback.

Before I explain the different 2nd strikes you could make, allow me to explain what exactly these elements entail. First of all, you’re going to have to be aware of the elemental order to intentionally achieve certain results; it’s not gimmicky though, much like Olimar’s Pikmin order (but Olimar’s Pikmin order has more variants of Pikmin than Krystal does elements). Here’s an example: you could initiate the tilt combo early to strike an opponent with a particular element. For instance, lightning causes the opponent to be knocked downward—if they’re on the ground, it could leave them vulnerable for the ice from the 4th strike. If you time yourself well enough, you could even use one of the longer-ranged physical staff attacks, available to the tilt combo, with lightning to spike your recovering opponents from the ledge without having to jump (this is assuming your staff can reach them, or they’re not above you when recovering). Of course, these lighting spikes wouldn’t become too effective until the opponent is roughly around 40%.

After the 1st strike, you could choose one of the following to further (or end) the combo:

Forward Initiated 2nd Strike (Another Forward A-Tilt in the same direction)
Backward Initiated 2nd Strike (A-Tilt in the direction opposite you are facing)
Down Tilt (This effectively ends the current combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Up Tilt (This effectively ends current the combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Neutral A (The Tilt Combo turns into the 2nd strike of the Neutral A Combo—after which, you will not be able to return to the Tilt Combo [you will have to resume the Neutral A Combo, or you could wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation])
Nothing (Wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation; in this sense, you will have treated the combo as a single Forward/Backward A-Tilt. Quick recovery time.)

The forward initiated 2nd strike has the element of Fire. Mild-moderate vertical-horizontal knockback.

The backward initiated 2nd strike has the element of Fire. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback.

The Down Tilt, in this instance, has the element of Fire. If used, it will end the current tilt combo. Moderate-good horizontal-vertical knockback.

The Up Tilt, in this instance (even though it doesn’t use the staff), has the element of Fire. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

With Neutral A, Krystal chains her tilt combo into the 2nd strike of the neutral A combo with the element of Fire. You will not be able to re-chain back into the tilt combo afterwards. This, however, grants her remaining Neutral Combo the elements. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Puny vertical knockback.

After the 2nd strike, you could choose one of the following to further (or end) the combo:

Forward Initiated 3rd Strike (Another Forward A-Tilt in the same direction)
Backward Initiated 3rd Strike (A-Tilt in the direction opposite you are facing)
Down Tilt (This effectively ends the current combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Up Tilt (This effectively ends current the combo—you will not be able to further combo after this move)
Neutral A (The Tilt Combo turns into the 3rd strike of the Neutral A Combo—after which, you will not be able to return to the Tilt Combo [you will have to resume the Neutral A Combo, or you could wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation])
Nothing (Wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation. Quick recovery time.)

The forward initiated 3rd strike has the element of Lightning. Moderate-good downward knockback.

The backward initiated 3rd strike has the element of Lightning. Moderate-good downward knockback.

The Down Tilt, in this instance, has the element of Lightning. If used, it will end the current tilt combo. Moderate-good downward knockback.

The Up Tilt, in this instance (even though it doesn’t use the staff), has the element of Lightning. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

With Neutral A, Krystal chains her tilt combo into the 3rd strike (juggler) of the neutral A combo with the element of Lightning. You will not be able to re-chain back into the tilt combo afterwards. This, however, grants her remaining Neutral Combo the elements. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Ineffective horizontal knockback, leaves opponent in front after juggle for Neutral A finisher.

After the 3rd strike, you could choose one of the following to finish the combo:

Forward Initiated 4th Strike (Another Forward A-Tilt in the same direction)
Backward Initiated 4th Strike (A-Tilt in the direction opposite you are facing)
Down Tilt
Up Tilt
Neutral A
(The Tilt Combo turns into the 4th strike of the Neutral A Combo)
Nothing (Wait for the combo to end via Krystal returning to idle animation. Quick recovery time.)

The forward initiated 4th strike has the element of Ice. Good vertical-horizontal knockback.

The backward initiated 4th strike has the element of Ice. Good vertical-horizontal knockback.

The Down Tilt, in this instance, has the element of Ice. Moderate-good vertical-horizontal knockback.

The Up Tilt, in this instance (even though it doesn’t use the staff), has the element of Ice. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate vertical-horizontal knockback. The horizontal direction of the knockback depends on the side of the barrier that struck the opponent (left side = left, right side = right).

With Neutral A, Krystal chains her tilt combo into the 4th strike (finisher) of the neutral A combo with the element of Ice. The knockback is not overridden by the element. Moderate-good horizontal-vertical knockback.

Dash Attack: One of three moves inspired off of Smash Brothers Crusade. Krystal plunges her staff into the ground and uses her forward momentum to spin around it, effectively kicking any would-be opponent. Unlike other characters’ dash attacks, Krystal doesn’t keep moving forward slightly—her position on the ground is stagnant. Moderate-good horizontal knockback.

Neutral Special: One of the few moves inspired off of Joe D.’s moveset. Krystal uses the Gatling Gun in a short burst. This move is chargeable, but you can’t hold onto a charge after it is complete—it’s charged to release. The amount of charge dictates the range of the bullets, as well as the damage of the move itself. Higher charge = more range + damage. Damage and knockback efficiency are also affected by where the opponent was hit—the closer to Krystal the opponent is, the more damage/knockback the move generates. Be mindful, this move does not grant Krystal Super Armor, and can leave her vulnerable while charging. Puny-to-good knockback potential, depending on how close the opponent is to Krystal.

Side Special: Krystal pounces in the direction provided with the tilt to strike with her staff. This move has a slight arch in the trajectory, and can be used to aid in recovering from the left or right. If Krystal makes contact with an opponent, she will deliver a swift blow with her staff. If Krystal makes no contact, only the pounce is performed. Weak-mild horizontal knockback.

Up Special: The staff’s Rocket Booster ability. It’s a recovery move that is able to damage opponents in the way. The Rocket Booster is chargeable like Diddy’s Jet Pack, but can be controlled similarly to Lucario’s ExtremeSpeed while boosting (however it’s not nearly as fast as Lucario’s ExtremeSpeed itself). Weak-mild knockback whose trajectory depends on the direction that the opponent was hit from.

Down Special: The staff’s Ground Quake ability. This move is at its most powerful when used on the ground. It’s a lengthy move where Krystal performs a short hop and forcefully shoves the staff into the ground, creating a minor shockwave. If used in the air, Krystal thrusts the staff downward—allowing her body to follow suit, similarly to the down air of Link/T. Link. If this move strikes the ground from the air, the considerable recovery time is shorter than when using it on the ground—the move however loses half of its power, as well as knockback potential (the Ground Quake is a move that derives power from the ground, so using it in the air cuts down on its power, but hastens its recovery time). There is an exception to this moves’ power when used in the air—it is when it strikes an opponent underneath her in midair. In this case, the move acts like a meteor smash. However, if this move is successfully used as a meteor smash, Krystal loses any further ability to retaliate, leaving her to fall (just like most characters would after using their recovery move). If Krystal strikes someone who is underneath her while she’s in the air, but the opponent is on the ground, the move is not nearly as powerful. Executed on the ground = Good-great horizontal-vertical knockback. Executed in the air to hit an opponent on the ground = Mild horizontal knockback. Executed in the air to hit an opponent in the air = Great downward knockback. If this move strikes the opponents indirectly with the shockwave, they will become temporarily half-buried in the ground. This can’t happen if Krystal executes this move in the air, as the staff will not create any shockwaves once it contacts the ground.

Neutral Air: Krystal briefly twirls her staff, creating a hitbox that covers her whole body. This move does not juggle. Instead it merely repels the opponent. Moderate-good knockback whose trajectory depends on the direction that the opponent was hit from.

Forward Air: Krystal simply extends her right arm forward and allows the staff to reach its full length. The actual attack stems from the force of the staff itself. Mild-moderate horizontal-vertical knockback.

Back Air: Krystal performs a midair backwards roundhouse kick. When finished, she faces the opposite direction she faced prior to the move’s execution. Moderate-good horizontal knockback.

Up Air: Krystal jabs upward with her staff. Moderate vertical knockback.

Down Air: Krystal kicks downward with her right heel. This is her safer-but-weaker alternative spike move, as opposed to the Ground Quake. Moderate downward knockback.

Side Smash: Krystal swiftly plunges her staff into the ground, and uses it to thrust herself forward into a powerful, semi-aerial Do Mawashi Kaiten Geri (wheel kick). This move has a little more forward movement than Fox’s forward smash, as well as a wider sweep. Moderate-to-great horizontal-vertical knockback. Knockback and damage depends on the charge of the smash.

Up Smash: One of the three moves inspired off of Smash Brothers Crusade. Krystal furiously spins her staff above her, juggling an opponent until the release of the move. This is Krystal’s weakest smash attack. Moderate-to-good vertical-horizontal knockback. Knockback and damage depends on the charge of the smash.

Down Smash: The final move inspired off of Smash Brothers Crusade. This move has inspiration from Star Fox Assault, as well. Krystal reaches for both Assault blasters within the holsters at each of her sides. She kneels half way and points each of the blasters at a downward angle, covering both of her sides. The charging animation is inspired by the Assault blaster’s charge in its respective game. She releases the charged blasters. This is Krystal’s strongest smash attack. Good-to-excellent horizontal knockback. Knockback and damage depends on the charge of the smash.

Grab: Krystal grabs with her left arm. She knees the opponent for her mid-grab attack.

Forward Throw: Krystal throws her opponent forward at an upward angle. She uses the Fire Blaster staff ability (from Star Fox Adventures) 3 times to hit the opponent that has been thrown forward to add a little bonus damage. Weak-mild horizontal-vertical knockback.

Back Throw
: Krystal turns and throws her opponent backwards. Mild horizontal knockback.

Up Throw: Krystal shoves her opponent upward with her staff. During this move, her staff becomes tipped with electricity. There is a short surge of electricity at the end of the throw, and this is where most of the force from the throw comes from. Mild vertical knockback.

Down Throw: Krystal shoves her opponent to the ground and uses the Ice Blaster staff ability from Star Fox Adventures. After a brief period, she kicks the opponent away. Mild horizontal knockback.

Final Smash: The other ability inspired off of Joe D.’s moveset. It’s the “Cloudrunner Assault”. Krystal uses her telepathy to call upon an old friend. When active, the Cloudrunner whisks Krystal away on its back, and a target sight appears on-screen that can be aimed. The Cloudrunner loosens considerably-sized fireballs at the opponents on the stage, each time the A button is pressed. This is a call-back to the very first gameplay with Krystal, wherein lies its significance. When the final smash is finished, the target sight widens—soon the Cloudrunner swoops inward wherever the target sight is placed, dealing massive damage to whoever it hits (if it hits). Either way, this is the point where Krystal jumps off the Cloudrunner to resume smashing.

So, what do you think?
B-b-but she's too risqué!

And Zero Suit Samus isn't? (Especially with today's POTD)

Theres too much dirty fan art of her!!!

What character these days doesn't get them? Also, we may as well take off many females off the roster if we're resorting to R34.

Also, nobody minds the king of OCs & fan art himself, :4sonic:

She's not important to Star Fox universe!!

I would agree if she didn't come back after Star Fox Adventures but seeing how she has made a prominent appearance in Assault & Command (Command practically revolves around her!), I'd say she's going nowhere. (Using the argument of not making an appearance in Star Fox 64 3D doesn't work as SF 64 was made in 1997, 2-5 years before Krystal was even a thought!)

She came from the worst Star Fox game!!

And yet, Metroid: Other M is getting representation...lots of it.

She killed Star Fox!!!

A character does not kill a franchise, if that was the case then Sonic would've been dead long ago.

Japan hates her!!!

[Citation needed]. Also, they totally reacted very nicely when Little Mac got in. :rolleyes:

Want: 100% - The only newcomer I want left.

Excitebiker

Chance: 5%
Want: 45% - Seems cool, torn between him & Mach Rider though

Nomination

Bandanna Dee x5

 
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a Link to the Forums

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 28, 2014
Messages
342
Location
Australia, Victoria
Krystal:
Chance: 10%
Yeah, no. Sorry Krystal fans but a Star Fox newcomer in general to me seems like it's not going to happen. She is the most notable Star Fox character though and the new stage (can't remember the name) is from a game that features her.
Want: abstain

Excite Biker:
Chance: 15%
The number of spots left is very limited and I think there are other characters who I think will get in before him.
Want: abstain

noms:
5 x 3d world representation

predicitons:
double 0's
 

ShinyRegice

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 27, 2014
Messages
1,631
Location
France
Krystal chances: 14 %
Starfox is a dormant franchise since Brawl, but I still can imagine it gaining a playable newcomer thanks to the new Starfox game that will be released in next year. It's arguably one of the biggest, if not the biggest dormant Nintendo franchise, and they'll try to awake it next year with a new game. I doubt that Starfox will get the Roy treatment, an already existing character is enough to make the franchise garish enough (a total of four reps!). Even though the three already existing Starfox reps are maybe enough for this job, a newcomer is easily the best way to make this promotion work.
This promotion can only work if two conditions are gathered: Starfox Wii U doesn't release too late in 2015, and the Starfox newcomer has an important role in this next game. Krystal seems to be one of the most recognizable Starfox characters asides from the ones already playable in Smash Bros.
Still she would probably be an addition for primarily promotional reasons and I don't think that she's very likely, also I don't expect any content from Starfox Wii U to be featured in SSB4 such as exclusive characters, stages, items or trophies. Also, the new Starfox stage revealed after more than one year without much Starfox content (only a 64 veteran, an item and an Assist Trophy) kinda helps the idea of a Starfox newcomer.
Also I don't believe in "She won't make in unless Wolf or Falco is cut", four Fire Emblem characters prior to July 14 was an insane idea, and it still happened. If Sakurai wants to add a Starfox newcomer there is no way he will cut Falco or Wolf for the sake of not overrepresenting the series.

Krystal want: 55 %
Her staff could probably make her more unique compared to the other Starfox characters, though I have no real connection to her so I can't imagine myself a moveset. Even though Wolf isn't really a clone of Fox and Falco, it's still blatant that his special moves, while not exactly working like the ones the other Starfox characters have, are heavily inspired from them. Also I really want to see a non-Fire Emblem franchise with exactly four playables characters, and adding Krystal in the playable roster is an easy way to fulfil the concept. On the other hand, I can't give a very high want for her because she seems to get somewhat legitimate hate (blah blah blah she comes from the worst Starfox game blah blah blah she's furry bait blah blah blah), I don't have much connection with the Starfox franchise, and I don't want her to have the almost naked design she has in the OP. *looks at pic of the day* oh wait... :teeth:
Anyway adding Krystal to the playable roster to make the Starfox franchise particularly garish in order to inscrease the chances of succes for Starfox Wii U is much more legitimate than adding Spectile for ORAS promotion. I mean, those situations are nothing comparable. One game will be the awakening of Nintendo's biggest dormant franchise and a real gamble. The other one has its commercial succes already pretty much set in stone.

Excitebiker chances: 6 % and want: abstain
He was considered as a retro rep in Melee, but Ice Climbers got over him due to better uniqueness potential. Maybe Sakurai found new moveset potential in him, but I don't think that we will have an actual retro representant for this SSB instalment. With the possible exception of Starfox, I don't imagine any dormant franchise since Brawl to get a new character. He will likely become an Assist Trophy again for SSB4. I don't have any connection with his game and I can't imagine a moveset, so I'll abstain for want.

Predictions:
Magikarp: 0.30 % - Not going to happen unless Sakurai wants to create the ultimate joke character, and we already kinda have a joke character with Wii Fit Trainer (plus she's not a total joke because at least she's pretty much the only way to represent one of Nintendo's most important new franchises).
Idolm@ster character: 0.00 % - I'm expecting pretty much only zeroes for this one. This pic shows Mega Man, Pac-Man and Sonic with the legend "Guest characters join the battle!" (I don't understand Japanese, but I saw the same pic translated, I don't know where to find it again). It pretty much kills the possibility of any third-party newcomer, even though it's not exactly a flat-out disconfirmation, plus it's an obscure arcade game released before Brawl.

Nominating:
Concept: non-Fire Emblem franchise with exactly four playable reps x5
 
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DarkKry4

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 16, 2006
Messages
517
Excitebiker

Chance - 0%
I don't see it happening at all.

Want - 0%
nothing against the character but i don't have any urge to want him in Smash.

Krystal

Chances - 0%
She hasn't been in a game in almost a decade (Star Fox Command in 2006). What reason would there be to add a secondary character hasn't made any recent appearances in games? Star Fox Wii U is being released way ahead of this Smash game and is STILL in development. The comeback hasn't happened yet. Right now, Star Fox isn't in any position to be getting newcomers.

Want - 0%
there are more interesting and more important characters from Nintendo that have yet to be added.
 

WeirdChillFever

Smash Hero
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Messages
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Location
Somewhere Out There
Abstain on Karen/Kristel/Kathleen/That Fox
Abstain on predictions

Bandana Deerailing of the thread x5

Excitebiker
Chance: 33%
I loathe the ratings given here.
On Takamaru's days, we were dead set on a retro and Takamaru was the clear frontrunner, 60%'s were given.
Almost nobody was "crazy" enough to rate the absolute shoe in lower than 5% because we were getting a retro without a question. "muh patterns"

Now that he's deconfirmed, everybody is like: "I dunno maybe Lil Mac is the retro". 0% guyz no chance.
Don't you see that Excitebiker is the actual frontrunner is retro land now, and that it's not farfetched at all we'll get a retro as secret newcomer?
These "muh patterns" still apply and Excitebiker's game is a 3D Classic/In NES Remix/Supposed to be in Nintendo Land/Actually released in the West.

The fact we're short in PoTD is actually good for Excitebiker, because in all these pictures, he hasn't been shown yet!

Tl;dr I **** at making a rant thank you for coming.

Want:
100%
I would love to wheelie you all of the stage.
 
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Jason the Yoshi

Watching Me, Wanting Me
Joined
Feb 26, 2014
Messages
18,791
Location
Waiting for Jesus
Krystal
Chance: 95%
Want: 100%
People doubt Krystal for no reason. They've been working on that StarFox game for 7 years, it was originally planned for the Wii.

ExciteBiker
Chance: 1%
Want: 10%
Mmm, nah
 

Gene

You're a vegetable
Joined
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Messages
1,642
Location
NY
NNID
Fairlight92
3DS FC
3411-0266-8945
EXCITE BIKER

Chance: 50%
There's the possibility that Sakurai could've changed his mind about him and make his move set work without needing to put ramps on every stage. Also Wario made it possible for a guy to fight on a bike and use it as a weapon without being on it.

Want: 20%
I'd prefer Mach Rider with his melee trophy redesign and fight like someone from kamen rider but with his bike mixed in and non realistic shooting machine guns.



KRYSTAL

I have a lot to say here. Inb4 troll or bias.

Chance: 40%
She is the most wanted Star Fox character, but her chances are about has even as the other Star Fox newcomers. Krystal may not even be playable this time and she didn't have a chance over Wolf now or in Brawl because he was planned since Melee. She has move set potential but so does every other character that has been in a Smash game so far, including the clones. Krystal could easily be a Fox clone and it has been proven numerous times and no one wants another Fox clone. If it came down to wanting a SF character that had to be a clone of a veteran character in smash while having an accurate move set referencing their skills then Slippy as a Snake clone would be the best choice (he can still be unique without being a clone).

- They both are mercenaries
- Use weapons to take out their enemies
- Had an actual conversation in Brawl while giving each other advice about fighting.
- Snake wanted him to design a weapon for him
- Slippy's :GCA: attacks and animations would be Dan Hibiki-fied versions of Snakes. This would show if Snake returns or not Sakurai can say that Slippy learned some CQC with Snake.

I've seen people say how the new Star Fox stage makes her likely because Assault but people forget that she's not the only character in that game, it wasn't her debut game, and she didn't do anything over the top or memorable in Assault to use the new stage as a good argument.



Want: 0%
Krystal's everything is unappealing to me. There isn't a single thing that she's done in the series that's prominent or likable to warrant anything more than a trophy, assist trophy or a codec cameo, at least not yet. Even if she had an interesting move set with her staff the entire character behind it is unlikable to a lot of people. There are several Star Fox characters that should get in over her, I mean what makes her more deserving than Peppy (original SF member and father figure to Fox. No he's not too old for smash, stop using this argument), Slippy (Mechanic, best friend of Fox, makes their mercenary job possible. Yes he can fight and annoyance isn't part of Sakurai's criteria for choosing characters), Pigma (closest thing we have to a SF villain, member of Star Wolf), or even Andross himself (if K. Rool and Ridley can be sized down then so can N64 Andross. SNES Andross can't be a counter arguement since he's a non canon character in a non canon game)? Her importance is very over exaggerated by her fans while at the same don't consider the pros and cons.
 
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FalKoopa

Rainbow Waifu
BRoomer
Joined
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Messages
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India/भारत
3DS FC
1650-3685-3998
Switch FC
SW-5545-7990-4793
ExciteBiker: 10%
Not really a likely character... Sakurai shot him down once, and while those restrictions don't really apply now, he doesn't seem to be the forefront retro. (Really, after Takamaru was revealed as an Assist, I have no idea who is likely among the retros anymore.) Also good for him is that the Brawl AT hasn't been seen yet and the series is still alive.

Want: 60%
Mostly nostalgia speaking, I like him, and will be happy to see him. I also like him better than the other motorbiker, Mach Rider.

Krystal: 5%
Don't see her happening at this point. Well, you could make up an idea that Falco and Wolf have been held back to be revealed in Krystal's trailer... but I'm not into the theory.

Want: 0%
Eh. The only StarFox game I've played is 64.
 
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YT123

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 25, 2014
Messages
130
NNID
Olaf551
3DS FC
5069-4175-0996
Krystal
Chance: 22%
Want: 75%
I like Krystal but she just isn't as relevant anymore as she was during the Brawl period.

ExciteBiker
Chance: 5%
Want: 40%
He could work but I would rather have a different retro rep.
 

Pureownege75

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 20, 2014
Messages
229
Location
Gangplank Galleon
Krystal
Chance: 7%
The chances of StarFox getting a 4th rep are incredibly unlikely, and her only real shot is if either Falco or Wolf are cut, which while possible, don't make sense in my eyes, as both are much more important to the series than Krystal. Furthermore, the whole "we need more females" argument is bascially invalid at his point, after all of the new female characters we've gotten. I will concede that she's probably the most likely Starfox newcomer, but that's like saying Bandana Dee is the most likely Kirby newcomer...
Want: 0%
Never liked the character in the slightest. She's prime furry material and I think she's pretty gross. Also Star Fox has all the characters it needs. The main hero, the main sidekick, and the main antagonist, anything else we get is just unnecessary, especially for a series as small as Starfox

Excite Biker
Chance: 5%
With Takamaru dead, the door for the next "retro rep" is open to other characters. Personally, I don't think we are obligated to get one, as both Little Mac and Pac-Man kinda represent that. Excite Biker is probably one of the most likely retro reps, especially with his assist trophy not yet shown.

Want: 10%
Would be an awesome addition if done right, but as I've said countless times, there's simply characters that I want more

Nominations
Balance Patches x5

Tomorrow's gunna be alot of fun....(or just a waste of my time)
 
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Joe D.

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 11, 2014
Messages
673
Location
New York
NNID
NeroSnare
3DS FC
2552-1665-5337
Krystal:

Chance: 60%

Want: 100%

Krystal has a far better chance than most think. Apart from what we know of Smash 4, she has much more going for her than against her. She is demanded by many, has great moveset potential from both the staff and other weapons, is a female, (which has become a favor in this new installment,) and she has a likeable personality that can really be shown off well in Smash.

She has also outlasted a bunch of other notable candidates.

"But Joe, what about Slippy? He has to be in because he's far more important and relevant than Krystal!"

Slippy is an important part of the franchise, no question about it. However, if we're talking about Smash, then Slippy is nowhere near as necessary as Krystal. We already have Falco to fill the role of Fox's friend and partner, but with Krystal, we get her to rep the love interest side. That's a part of SF that's never been seen in Smash, and it would make much more sense to include the main love interest over sidekick #2.

"Ok, but she's way too sexual! Only furries like her, and she's just an icon on Deviant Art."

So what you're going to tell me is that Krystal doesn't deserve a spot because of cringey fan art of her, but Zero Suit Samus and Palutena do?

Seriously, a general consensus of Krystal haters like to assume that because of the one overly graphic dipiction of her in SFA makes her a, "demeaning and stupid," character, yet plenty of other Nintendo females are dipicted in similar ways, but they let that slide. Having fan art that's incredibly adulterated shouldn't make that character any less deserving for Smash.

EDIT: Look at today's POTD. You're seriously going to keep pressing this argument now?

"Joe please, we already have a staff wielder in Palutena. There's no way we'll see Krystal in now."

Absurd.

First off, Palutena wields a scepter, not a Staff. Palutena hardly uses that thing in her moveset except for jabs and a few sweeping moves. Krystal would use her staff in a much more physical way, making use of the staff in far more parts of her moveset. Also, even if Palutena had a full fledged Staff moveset, I fail to see why Krystal couldn't be included for having a Staff of her own, when we have 8+ swordsmen.

"She's not even important to the franchise. She's just eye candy there for furry appeal. She does nothing."

If her only game was Adventures, then I would agree. However, this is not the case. In the two games she appeared in after SFA, her role increased dramatically. In Assault, she is there in every mission fighting at your side, giving tips to you, and assisting you with weaponry on the battlefield. She is the reason that the 6th mission even happens.

Command pretty much made her the focus. Even though I agree that Command's storyline is a mess, we can't deny it's existence. Krystal's role in that game was the most dynamic it's ever been, and that game proved that the Story of Star Fox shifted to her being one of the main focuses, making her all the more relevant choice for Smash Bros. And even in Command, She fights with you, gives direction, and makes her name known. No eye candy character would be that involved in the missions at hand.

"But Star Fox hasn't had a game in years! There's no reason to include another rep for a franchise that was dead for almost a decade."

Star Fox was never, "dead." The franchise was always in the mind of Nintendo, more specifically, Miyamoto. That franchise is his baby, and the only way he'll let the game see a new installment is if he is absolutely sure that he is confident in what will be created. He had juggled the concept of SF on the Wii for the console's life cycle, but could never figure out what to do with the series for Wii. He eventually found a way to make the game work on the Wii U,and now we'll see SF again.

So with that said, Star Fox was always in the picture, but it was just never implemented into a full game. The franchise was always relevant, and is a big enough financial success to warrant a 4th character in Krystal.

"We don't even know if she's in the next SF game, so why include a character who would just be left out of the franchise?"

We don't know if she's not in either, and that shouldn't even be an argument to a roster that was finalized 2 years ago. Yes, I mentioned that Star Fox was thought of and tossed around, but they never made another stroyline, so even back then they never had any plans to remove Krystal from the series.

So that's my standpoint on the matter, but I'm ready for the detractors to take me away.

As for Excitebiker:

Chance: 10%
Want: 60%

I would love to see another retro in Excitebiker. He could certainly be an incredibly unique addition, and he would do a fantastic job of repping Nintendo's 8-bit era.
 
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WeirdChillFever

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
6,592
Location
Somewhere Out There
Takamaru:
"Most likely" retro. In the top ten list, rated between 10% and 60%

Excitebiker:
Arguably "most likely" retro.
Gets zeroes.

Come on.

I think we needs some optimism. :)

I stop with these rants after this post though.
I think I made my point and I don't want a debate in this thread.
 

TCT~Phantom

Smash Master
Writing Team
Joined
Dec 10, 2013
Messages
3,965
NNID
TCT~Phantom
Excitebiker
90% Chance
Generous? Maybe, but with retros dying like Takamaru, Lip, and Sable, and the fact a retro is so likely, he seems like a frontrunner.
For starters, the Excitebike/Excite series has been one of the with Nintendo for ages, since the dawn of the NES. Excite has had games on the N64, and wii with its sucesorrs, and even a game on wiiware. However, one thing that shows how the series is valued by Nintendo to an extent is they chose excitebikes to be free when they released the eshop. Why choose a game many might not have remembered?
Another thing that helps the Excite biker is that he was not deconfirmed in the direct. Now this may be trivial, but most of the brawl assist trophies that were not secret (I think at least 4/5) were deconfirmed then. Not being seen in the demo is also a flag in his favor. The only question is why would the lowly exictebiker be kept hidden?
Finally, Excitebiker was considered by Sakurai for Melee. This is the big one, since in this game in particular, Sakurai is changing old ideas. Villager. Miis, and PacMan were considered but rejected from brawl, and Ridley is all but confirmed. Little Mac and Palutena ascended from their previous roles. Transformation characters were cut, yet the popular ones remain. Character movesets are getting big changes after long times, such as Bowser. Heck even the once rejected Baloon Fighter lives on in Villager's Up B, which shows Sakurai changed his mind on Baloon Fighter being able to jump tremendously. The only reason Sakurai said he did not put Excitebiker in Melee was that he could not make him jump convincingly. But now, I think with all these changes, he can.
100% Want
Sure! A vehicle fighter? That would be hilarious!

Krystal
20% Chance
On one hand, she could be a semi clone (lel) and Star Fox Wii U, and America <3 Krystal. On the other hand, Star Fox was dormant and plenty big enough as is to some.
70% Want
A friend of mine wants her, so why not?

Nominating Ridley X5
(Operation one last try)
 
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Rockaphin

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 13, 2014
Messages
2,490
Location
Rogueport
NNID
Rockaphin
3DS FC
2595-0113-8473
Excitebiker:
Chance: 2%
Want: 65%

Excite Bike was a classic that I actually liked, unlike Ice Climber.

Krystal:
Chance: 15%
Want: 85%

I don't see why she receives so much hatred. I mean, I'm not even a fan of the Star Fox series, but she's a very important character that's done more than Falco in the series as a whole and he's in Smash. Especially after her huge role after she debuted, but once again, I'm not a fan of Star Fox so I don't really know. That's just what I've been told. Four Star Fox characters is ridiculous though.

Also, a friend of mine would really love to see her.

Nominations:
Mario Party Content: x1
M. Bison x4
 
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BluePikmin11

Akko is my dear daughter!
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https://twitter.com/BPikmin11
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blue
These ratings for Krystal are going everywhere. :crazy:

Krystal Chance: 10% She could be a semi-clone for the game, but I think it's more likely that Falco and Wolf will be getting in than her as the 4th Fox clone, and I can't really see Sakurai replacing one of them for her just to add her in the game. Right now, Krystal hasn't been in any of the recent Stafox games since Command which is one of the main flaws of her getting in, the only benefit going for is her popularity (like K. Rool, Isaac, and other popularly requested character). That's honestly all I can say about her chances.

Excitebiker Chance: 5% I'm thinking the only classic character we have left will be a historical one (Duck Hunt Dog for example), and honestly I'm expecting just two retros in the game the more I think about it. The concept of a mounted character is cool, but it's probably way too complicated to put it in as a moveset, which is why I think he could be an AT again.

Magikarp Prediction: 1.23% Filler day once again. :rolleyes:
IdolMaster Prediction: 3.4% Are these guys anime characters?

Nominations:
Dr. Mario x5
 
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D

Deleted member

Guest
Excitebiker
Chance:
1%

Due to the demise of Takamaru and what's recently going on, I have to drop the scores of every retro considerably to 1%.
Keep in mind that a retro rep isn't impossible, but it seems like that Sakurai has been focusing more on recent games; characters like Robin, Greninja, Rosalina, Palutena, Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, and even Little Mac support this. On the subject of Little Mac, he might be our retro rep; his series was recently revived, but he definitely has that retro feel to him.
Retro reps aren't even that demanded. Takamaru was the most requested one, but his requests weren't spoken in volume as let's say Shulk or King K. Rool. Still, this added to Takamaru's case as being seen as the "most likely retro."
Excitebiker does have a chance and was considered for Melee, but it can be safely said that we won't get a retro rep.
Want: 55%
Mostly indifference? Attacking with a bike would be cool, though.

Krystal
Chance:
5%

Her time is still up.
Her fan demand from Brawl is certainly dwarfed and even Japan doesn't really request her.
As for Star Fox itself, I say that a Star Fox cut is more likely than a Star Fox addition. Look at the lack of Star Fox content that we're getting; it's pretty concerning for the fates of Falco or Wolf. As another pointed out, if we were to have Krystal as an announced newcomer, we would have seen Falco or Wolf by now. We have Brawl's Mario 4 before Rosalina and Marth and Ike before Robin and Lucina.
Star Fox isn't that big of a franchise to warrant 4 reps. It's a struggling/dormant franchise that doesn't compare with other Nintendo franchises in terms of sales and popularity. Saying that this dormant franchise should get more reps than a series currently underrepresented (Donkey Kong), one of Nintendo's biggest franchises (Kirby), or even a franchise with a current hit game (Fire Emblem) is pushing it. If Star Fox were to get another rep, bias would have to be involved here.
Star Fox's lack of demand for a newcomer is also the result of the sense of completion of the Star Fox franchise. We have the hero (Fox), the sidekick (Falco), and the rival (Wolf). The love interest isn't that important, especially when the most recent Star Fox game was a remake of the N64 classic that didn't feature her. Newcomers won't be able to experience her either outside of Brawl since she hasn't made a single appearance on the Wii. The Wii U Star Fox game doesn't help at all since this is a brand new, recent title that I doubt Sakurai had knowledge of existing. If he did, then I don't think that he would have considered making Kid Icarus: Uprising a Star Fox game initially.
The only things that she has going for her is that she is easily cloneable and the fact that a Star Fox character manages to get added in every game. Other than that, she doesn't have a big chance.
Want: 0%
I will say this right now: I hate Krystal and that hatred is pretty fair. I don't give a damn about her and Fox's relationship and yet it was one of the center points of Command. That's just horrid fan fiction and it's sort of like Sega making a Sonic game about him and Amy getting married.
I also don't believe that she would use her staff in combat. As I've mentioned, she's easily cloneable and you know what that means? Another Blaster, Reflector, Illusion, Fire, Landmaster moveset and I know everyone loves those. It would be disappointing if she got in over a character with a lot of potential.
Lastly, I hate her design. It just looks horrible.

Whew... sorry for being salty there.

Magikarp Prediction: 0%
Because everyone underestimates the power of a god.
Idolm@ster character Prediction: .32%
Generous ratings.

Nominations: Dr. Mario Day 5x
 

wizardto1

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 1, 2014
Messages
1,026
Location
Lurking
NNID
waddledee3
3DS FC
1676-4166-2291
Krystal
Chance: 7%
The chances of StarFox getting a 4th rep are incredibly likely,
If getting a 4th rep is incredibly likely then you rate her a 7%:psycho:
Anyway....
ExciteBike: 5%
Want: 50%
Krystal: 10%
Want: 0%
Predictions: Double Zeros
Nintendo Land Stage x 5
 

Rie Sonomura

fly octo fly
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Messages
19,720
NNID
RieSonomura
Switch FC
SW-4976-7649-4666
Krystal
Chance: 0% - Assuming Wolf stays, and even if he doesn't, I honestly don't think Krystal will get in.
Want - 20% I wouldn't mind, though. I'm kinda indifferent to her as a character but if she gets in, I'd be curious as to how she plays.

Excitebiker: double 0s - better as an AT IMO.

Predictions:
Magikarp - 0%
Idolm@ster character - 3%

Nominations:
Fiora x 2
"Captain Falcon's theme" x 2
2nd Smash direct x 1
 
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TheDarkKnightNoivern

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 24, 2014
Messages
3,641
Location
Croft Manor
Krystal
Chance 50% - I'm kinda split on krystal but she has a lot going for her, she's unique, female and fairly popular, things sakurai clearly wants in a character.
Plus I'm pretty sure the great fox reveal was a hint (Seriously sakurai saying I wonder what missions it will conduct while it's leaving fichinia on it's way to sauria can't be a coincidence)
Also with a new star fox game in development a new star fox character is a must and krystal is the only good choice. (Well not really but I think it'd be great promotion)
I don't see Falco or Wolf getting cut for her but I don't think it'll matter much, falco and wolf would probably be fairly easy to make due to them being a clone and semi clone.

Want 100% - I've always liked krystal as a character, design wise, personality wise. Plus the staff would be a really fun weapon to use in smash, she's by far my most wanted newcomer alongside impa
 
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Joe D.

Smash Ace
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Krystal
Chance - 2%
Want - 0%

Vocal hatebase here.
It's near the end of announcements, and we barely have anything about Star Fox. It's more likely that Wolf and Falco are in danger than we are to get an extra Star Fox character. Also, Star Fox Wii U was too late and the most recent, Star Fox 64 on the 3DS, didn't even have Krystal.

As for want, I seriously dislike everything Krystal represents and it'd be a shame to 1) lose Wolf or Falco for her, 2) have Star Fox get four characters when a series like Mother doesn't (yes, this is bias) and 3) not get one of the other dozen characters that are far more interesting, significant and lovable.
Even if she does happen, one in fifty still seems to me like a reasonable approximation of her chances. Now to completely follow up on that I give you forty nine unrevealed characters I think are more likely than Krystal, in no particular order

1) Wario
2 ) Ness
3) Jigglypuff
4) Mr. Game and Watch
5) Lucas
6) R.O.B.
7) Mewtwo
8) Ganondorf
9) Ice Climbers
10) K. Rool
11) Dixie
12) Shulk
13) Chorus Kids
14) Marshal
15) Ghirahim
16) Tetra
17) Impa
18) Paper Mario
19) Bowser Jr.
20) Captain Toad
21) Bandana Dee
22) Snake
23) Hades
24) Dark Pit
25) Medusa
26) Black Shadow
27) Louie
28) Jeff
29) Duster
30) Porky
31) Masked Man
32) Sceptile
33) Blaziken
34) Pachirisu
34) Andy
35) Sami
36) Rhythm Monkey
37) Karate Joe
38) Rhythm Wrestler
39) Rhythm Girl
40) Roy
41) Mach Rider
42) Slippy
43) Cranky Kong
44) Duck Hunt Dog
45) Excitebiker
46) Isaac <--- Sorry, don't know how I forgot him @_@
47) Felix
48) Donbe and Hikari
49) Chibi-Robo
50) Krystal

Heck, I'm pretty sure I forgot a lot of big hitters ... can't notice who ... eh, no big deal.
Still, point is, even though a lot of those characters I don't find likely, I still see them as more likely than Krystal. And thus my score. And yes, I was bored, and I figure we're probably not rating characters we rate now again.

Excitebiker
Chance - 5%
Well, he WAS in that previous list, so I think he's more likely than Krystal at the least. But I'm unsure about his odds and I think the series is best repped by stages/music/ATs. Also, if there was a fighter that was on their bike the whole time, I feel Mach Rider would be more likely.

Want - 50%
Indifference I suppose

Predictions
Thing #1 - 23.4%
Thing #2 - 6.231%

No, I don't remember them, and probably won't have time to edit tomorrow. And too lazy to scroll up and look.

Nominations
x5 Use your own Villager and Robin
Your bias is overshadowing the logic of the situation.

If we were talking about which franchise deserves more reps, you would say Mother?
It's a well received franchise that I respect, but it's is nowhere near the level of success of Star Fox has.
Star Fox has more entries, more acclaim, and most importantly, more sales than Mother.

Even if you're biased to Mother and believe that it deserves more reps and Star Fox doesn't, you should at least realize that Mother will never be able to reach Star Fox's level.

I'm sure you probably know this already, but it's still weird to believe that a franchise as small as mother deserves more than the reps than Star Fox, a franchise that isn't even small in the first place.
 

Cheezey Bites

Slime Knight
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Mehbiker: 0.1%
All the front runners have fallen down in the retro race, and created quite the pile-up.

Want: 0%
Ya, no thanks.


Krystal: 12%
I don't see Star Fox getting a fourth character, but when Fire Emblem can... who knows?

Want: 0%
Star Fox is over repped anyway, and she wouldn't even be a quick Lucina-like inclusion. Spend that time elsewhere please Sakurai...



Not Even My final Form: 0.17%
Haruka Amami: 0.03%



Dr. Agon's Quest *5
 

XenothiumX

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 27, 2013
Messages
418
Krystal
Likelihood: 33.33%
I think she's less than likely but still has a good shot!

Want: 100%
My most wanted character who has yet to get into smash!

Excitebiker
Likelihood: 1%

Want: 10%
 

Smasher 101

Smash Lord
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The Extra Nominations post has been updated.

Krystal's chances: 5% - If there was a new Star Fox character, it would be her, no question. That said, I think the series dropping back to just Fox and Falco is more likely than it receiving a new character.
Want: 0% - I'm a fan of Star Fox but I think it's perfectly represented as is. Additionally I don't particularly like Krystal and I wouldn't pick her if I did have to choose a newcomer for the series.

Excitebiker's chances: 5% - He's a pretty notable retro, but with Takamaru out of the running I'm beginning to doubt one. Additionally he has competition from Mach Rider in the biker category. I also believe that he's been shot down before, though it's possible for Sakurai to change his mind
Want: 50% - I'd prefer Mach Rider as a retro biker, but I wouldn't mind this either.

Shulk AT x5
 

Ghirahilda

♥Smash Beauty♥
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Krystal

Chance: 50%

If Fire Emblem can get four reps, I don't see why Star Fox can't...
Krystal deserves to be here more than Falco... I can see a case scenario that we will get 3 Star Fox characters but Falco or Wolf wlli get the cut....

Also, she have a thing that everybody can't see and they think they are the Gods of speculation: uniqueness. It's a Robin case here if you are intelligent enough to understand what I'm trying to say. There is NO competition in Star Fox universe for Krystal

The ONLY thing that impedes her is that Star Fox already have 3 reps. But reps per franchise is no questioning against Sakurai's unpredictable nature.
The fact of people saying that Star Fox is irrelevant now is just a desperate way to detract her
The fact of people trying to make her the excuse of Star Fox's dark time is idiot


Want: 100 %
She is part of my forbidden trio: Ghirahim, Paper Mario and Krystal.

I don't want to vote for Excitebiker. I don't know anything about it

Nominate Adeleine x5
 
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Joe D.

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Krystal

Chance: 50%

If Fire Emblem can get four reps, I don't see why Star Fox can't...
Krystal deserves to be here more than Falco... I can see a case scenario that we will get 3 Star Fox characters but Falco or Wolf wii get the cut....

Also, she have a thing that everybody can't see and they think they are the Gods of speculation: uniqueness. It's a Robin case here if you are intelligent enough to understand what I'm trying to say. There is NO competition in Star Fox unoverse for Krystal

The ONLY thing that impeds her is that Star Fox already have 3 reps. But reps per franchise is no questioning against Sakurai's unpredictable nature.
The fact of people saying that Star Fox is irrelevant now is just a desperate way to detract her
The fact of people trying to make her the excuse of Star Fox's dark time is idiot


Want: 100 %
She is part of my forbidden trio: Ghirahim, Paper Mario and Krystal.

I don't want to vote for Excitebiker. I don't know anything about it

Nominate Adeleine x5
I agree.

Also, your signature is terrifying.
 

Gene

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Plus I'm pretty sure the great fox reveal was a hint (Seriously sakurai saying I wonder what missions it will conduct while it's leaving fichinia on it's way to sauria can't be a coincidence)
Sakurai's comment on that PotD went more like this:

Sakurai said:
Here's the Great Fox from Star Fox: Assault. I wonder what missions it will conduct. It'll probably have fighters running around on top of it without the pilot's consent.

I will also nominate Adeleine x5
 
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WeirdChillFever

Smash Hero
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Messages
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OK, so I promised not to do this, but I still need to say this.

Normal situation:
*Competition deconfirmed*
*Other newcomer's chances raise*

This:
*Competition deconfirmed*
"Takamaru was the only chance on a retro, why do you think it's different, just because there are plenty of other viable options doesn't mean Takamaru isn't the only one with a chance MUH FAN DEMAND IS THE ONLY THING WHAT MATTERS IN RETRO HURR DURR"

Retro rep is still livin' guys and it's probably Excitebiker.

(Man I sound like Diddy Kong and his Imparade. May Groose end this day to end my madness)
 

Hippopotasauce

Smash Lord
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Hippopotasauce
Krystal Likelihood: 8%
Want: 20%

Excite Biker Likelihood: 2%
Want: 40%

4+ more newcomers x5
 

Capybara Gaming

Just Vibing
Joined
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Messages
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Excitebiker:
Chance: 0.0001% - He wasn't in Melee for a reason.
Want: 0% - Stay an Assist pls.

Krystal:
Chance: 5% - I'm pretty sure Wolf is getting cut at this point. He wouldn't be replaced by her.
Want: 50% - Indifferent.

Abstaining from Predictions

Noms:
Kirby Triple Deluxe Stage x5
 
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