Rate And Discuss Their Chances: Closed

[kisamefishfries]

I just looked up Lloyd Irving. This is probably for tomorrow but he's been voted 5th most popular tales character if it helps. Anyway, giving him a 2.03

It's funny because last I checked #1 was Kratos and #2 was Zelos. They both also came from ToS. Its always fun to see the main character over shadowed in popularity.

 

[Opossum]

Goroh time!

Anyway, Goroh is one of those characters that can add quite a bit. Katana wielder, humorous, anti-hero/rival, and an additional rep for the F-Zero series. Heck, I like him so much that I operate his support thread xD

That being said, Goroh gets a 5 in want from me.

Now, the one thing Goroh has against him is his series' decline. Even then, with the possibility of a revival, it's not too bad. Given all things considered, including his importance to the series and his popularity among Smash fans, Goroh gets a 4.12 in likelihood.

For Lloyd, I predict a 0.91

Wait...I actually won the prediction? Huzzah.

With that, I'll put in x10 for Little Mac.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Want: 2, Liklihood: 2

I'd give him at least a 3 if F-Zero had received a single game since gamcube.

Nominate Sukapon x5

Predict Lord Irving - 3. TBH I'm thinking a tales character might be in with the latest rumor. I'd still rather have pacman

 

[deuxhero]

Want:
5

Likely:
4. Shiggy said F-Zero isn't dead yet, he was considered a favorite for Brawl till he was deconfirmed, but is still quite popular.

Nominate: Yoshimitsu x5

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Maybe it's not dead, but it's in a permanent coma hanging on through life support

 

[MelMoe]

Nominations

ROB x3
IceClimbers x2

Voting & Discussing

Samurai Goroh

Personal Bias: 0.5
Likelihood: 2.28

Samurai Goroh doesn't really interest me at all, I would rather have a new franchise character.

The F-Zero series is nearly dead right now & no plans have been announced for a new game. Mario Kart has taken over Nintendo's racing scene. I don't think F-Zero is a franchise that actually "deserves" a second character. Captain Falcon may have been an "original 12," but that doesn't warrant a new character. F-Zero is fading into obscurity outside of Smash. One positive thing about F-Zero is that it has 6 games (9 counting non-console titles), however the last game was only released in Japan back in 2004. F-Zero really needs a new game to push it forward. The newest form of representation for F-Zero was already in Brawl, they will have to recycle old material for SSB4. Samurai Goroh is the most likely F-Zero newcomer due to his popularity & overall importance in the series. Nintendo needs to work on new games that aren't Mario, Pokemon, or Zelda

Prediction

Lloyd Irving: 1.86

 

[DakotaBonez]

Discuss Goroh

Personally I'd rather see Black Shadow as the second rep for the F-zero franchise,

so I'm giving Goroh... a 3.5 in want.
So long as F-Zero gets another rep I really don't care who it is.

I'm gonna give Goroh a 2.5 in likelihood. It's hard to tell because he was an assist character in Brawl and he might just stay as one. But assist characters might just be removed altogether.

NOMINATIONS

Ness x5

 

[Deleted member]

Updated nominations (nominating Mega Man, Ghirahim, Mii, Lucario, and Toad today)

Less than a hour left before the new day.

@MelMoe: F-zero was never really taken over as Mario Kart was always the bigger racing franchise. It's just that F-zero faded into irrelevance. That said, I am expecting a title for the Wii-U at some point in it's life. I feel as it's overdue for one, especially given how influential it is. Expecting one this gen (or at least hoping for one).

 

[kisamefishfries]

Updated nominations (nominating Mega Man, Ghirahim, Mii, Lucario, and Toad today)

Less than a hour left before the new day.

@MelMoe: F-zero was never really taken over as Mario Kart was always the bigger racing franchise. It's just that F-zero faded into irrelevance. That said, I am expecting a title for the Wii-U at some point in it's life. I feel as it's overdue for one, especially given how influential it is. Expecting one this gen (or at least hoping for one).

If I could can i change my lloyd prediction?
I'd like to change it to 2.3

 

[Deleted member]

If I could can i change my lloyd prediction?
I'd like to change it to 2.3

Yes you can.

 

[Deleted member]

The day went by faster than you could say "Sonic". Many people were excited at the thought of his inclusion in Smash and were very hopeful that he could get in. There were a few doubters here and there as well as a few people who had no interest in him, but there wasn't anyone who swore the death of Samurai Goroh.

Goroh's dream may very well come true, that is, his dream of finally beating Captain Falcon at his own game. He had received a 3.41 in likelihood, a decent score. He also did good with a 3.44 in want, so fan support was obviously there.

He then jump back on his car and quickly went to the nearest corner to finish his most recent race, in which he was winning by a large stretch, only to notice that Captain Falcon had taken the lead again. Poor guy, never getting a break, but at least Opossum got another lucky one as he once again, earned his extra five nominations.

Something unusual then happened. It was a character, but one that most would not expect, a non-popular third-party character. He was Lloyd Irving from the Tales series and the first third-party character up for discussion. This made fans interested and given the difficult nature of third-parties, one must wonder how many more will budge for this game and if Lloyd Irving will be one of those special exceptions...

Day Seventeen has began. Today, you'll rate Lloyd Irving and predict Little Mac's score tomorrow. Day endsd at 10:36 PM CST.

 

[Jhonnykiller45]

Lloyd Irving:
Want- 0
Likelihood- 0

Sakurai will surely not add any characters from Namco, and if he does, I'm 99.9% coinfident that it will be Pac-Man.

Nominations
Roy x3
Black Shadow x2

 

[deuxhero]

Lloyd:

Want: 0
I actively dislike Symphonia
Likely: 1.5, only because the use of Tales of... staff and even then the mention of "it's up to Sakurai" hurts it. He is long past his day.

Nominate: Yoshimitsu x5

 

[shrooby]

Well now I feel stupid, I forgot to give my nominations and prediction after talking about those very things in that same post. Well now I'll make up for it.

Prediction: 4.23 I remember him doing quite well the last time you did this. Hopefully people's opinions haven't changed to much.

Nominations:
Bowser Jr x3
Toad x2

 

[Deleted member]

Lloyd:
Want: 2.5
Again, don't care either way.
Likelihood: 2.5
It all depends on whether Sakurai wants to include a Tales character or not. Yo****o, the developer of the Tales series is very open to having a Tales character, and Lloyd is one of the more well-known ones outside the Tales "fandumb" (sorry for saying that, but I've dealt with a lot of annoying Tales fans).

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Lloyd Irving? Oh boy...

Want: 4
Lloyd is one of 3 Namco characters(the others being Pac-man and Kalas) that have a chance/deserve/make sense to be in Smash. Of those three, he'd be the one I'd be most excited to see.

I haven't played ToS much, but what I did play I really liked. My sister loves it though, so maybe him appearing would get her into Smash and get us to spend more time together, in which case I would be all for him appearing.

Edit: Also, he has a TON of moveset potential thanks to the various techs he uses in ToS.

Likelihood: 3
I feel like he's not super popular, but he does seem to have a number of people pushing for him. Plus, the Tales series director said he'd like to see the series get reps in SSB, so that might count for something. That said, most people seem to assume that Pac-man will be the Namco rep.

Nominatios:
Royx5

Edit: changed my score. I can do that, right?

 

[kisamefishfries]

Well lets see here, I have 5+ ToS hacks on my SD card for Brawl+ atm.
Want: 5 I think he would be a fantastic addition and could really fit in the cast well.
Likeliness: 2.7 That is a kind of generous score but apparently Sakurai thinks highly of Yo****o and he is also pushing for a rep. 2.7 may be generous, but I wouldn't exactly be surprised if Sakurai was ok with this, seeing how he has apparently been working on this project for a few years I'll give the benefit of the doubt.

Little Mac prediction? AWWW YEAH :3.67

Nominations:
Paper Mario x5

 

[Deleted member]

@shrooby: I wouldn't expect opinions on Little Mac to change all that much. He's considered one of the most likely newcomers period for Smash. I'm giving him a 4.13 in prediction.

Now onto this character we're dealing with today...

Lloyd Irving

He has the privilege of being the very first third-party character to be judged on this poll, but much to his misfortune, he has yet again, missed his chance. And this goes for all Tales rep.

First off, why would a Tales rep be in over Pac-Man? Pac-Man is at least the mascot of Namco and the one people want the most. While the chances of us getting a Namco rep is vastly overrated, it's all but assured to be Pac-Man.

And in the slim chance Namco Bandai gets Pac-Man, they will not be getting a second rep. Third-parties spots are going to be extremely precious (one, MAYBE two third-party newcomers at the most) and they will be reserved for the very best choices. Tales character can't and won't cut it for Sakurai because the Tales series don't have any characters that meet that exceptionally high standard.

Also, let's take a look at that quote that supposedly give a Tales rep a glimmer of hope:

Maybe if we beg Sakurai-san, it will happen! I know Higuchi-san would love it, but the decision is Sakurai-san’s. I think it’s still too early to talk about it.

You heard it straight from the horse mouth, it's up to Sakurai to decide whenever or not a Tales character gets in Smash. And since this franchise doesn't meet the high standard Sakurai will propose on additions of potential third-parties, he's out of the race as far as I am concern.

He gets a 0 in likelihood. Want is also a 0 since I have absolutely no interest in a rep and find him unworthy of a spot in Smash.

Nominate Ghirahim, Mega Man, Lucario, Mii, and Toad.

 

[Deleted member]

To question a 3rd Party choice just because there's a choice that "makes more sense" from the same company is kind of unfair, IMO.

After all, if we didn't know Snake was going to be in Brawl, but we did know a Konami character was going to get in, would you honestly expect Snake as the choice, or would you be betting more on someone like Simon Belmont?

 

[Opossum]

Lloyd, huh?

Want: 0. Never heard of him before this or played his games.

Likelihood: 0. Based on that recent interview, Sakurai finds 3rd Parties very exclusive. Not to mention, if a Namco character is added at all, Pac Man has more merit.

Predicting a 3.7 for Little Mac

Wow. I won extra nominations again? Huzzah!

In that case, I'll throw in x10 for Krom

 

[BKupa666]

Unless the Tales creator is some close friend of Sakurai's, Lloyd has little to no chance.

Want: 0
Likelihood: 0.1

I'm glad that Sakurai interview came just in time for this vote to prove how conservative he is with adding in third parties. Snake was included because of his friendship with Kojima, while Sonic got roped in last minute due to his overwhelming fan demand (that led to him winning the unreleased American poll, according to Sakurai). Megaman has a similar, if not -as- insane amount of demand, and is thus a viable newcomer. Pacman has a lesser chance, but is at least the most recognizable gaming figure of all time.

If Namco had no role in the game, we wouldn't even be considering Lloyd. I'm still not sure why we are now.

Nominating Little Mac x3, Bowser Jr. and Dixie x1.

 

[Opossum]

BKupa, you may want to alter your nominations. Little Mac's set for tomorrow. :D

 

[---]

Want: 1
Likeliness: 0.5

Well I like him better than most of the other Namco choices (blame Super Smash Flash), though personally I'd rather there not be any Namco characters at all. As for likeliness, there's more hope for him now with the recent Tales interview, but even then I don't think it means all that much. Pretty much another character riding the Namco and Sakurai slide.

x5 Saki

 

[#HBC | J]

Want: 0
Likeliness: 0

Much prefer other Namco characters than to him. O_o

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Ahhh Talea of Symphonia. I am a fan of the Tales series and a HUGE fan of Symphonia. Lloyd was the character I always enjoyed playing as. I enjoyed his versatility, his attacks, his personality, and importance to the storyline. I would say, concerning all if the Tales characters in Nintendo's history, he is the most popular and iconic. He even appeared in the Soul Caliber Legends game which appeared exclusively on the Wii. Therefore, he is often seen as a Tales Nintendo character.

However, Lloyd runs into several big obstacles. The first is his 3rd party standing which is a special commodity. It is unsure if Smash 4 will recieve any 3rd party characters and all sources point to Sakurai being cautious with adding them. But in his most recent interview, he recognizes that both Sonic and Snake were well recieved and noted the importance of adding 3rd party characters. Secondly, most 3rd party slots goes to thr mascot of that particular company (Sega=Sonic). Therefore, Pacman has the honor of being Namco's rep do to his mascot status for Namco.

Thirdly, Lloyd has only appeared in two Nintendo games and only as a supporting character in the 2nd. While he is seen as a main Tales Nintendo character, he doesn't seem well known in the Nintendo community. He only seems to have popularity from Tales and Lloyd fans as opposed to Nintendo and Smash fans.

However, he is clearly one of the most popular characters in the Tales series. This was most evident as his guest character appearance in Legends. As well, he has potential for a very unique move set and playstyle that is centered around dual blades. Many of his attacks hit around him as opposed to just in front of him. His techniques also fits the Smash special b formula do there is no scrambling to create moves for him. The Tales of Symohonia is full of content that can be used for stages, music, ATs, items, trophies, and stickers.

Despite that, Lloyd is a fairly unlikely character due to: 1) the unpredictability of 3rd party inclusions, 2) Pacmans status of Namco, and 3) unfamiliarity between Nintendo and Smash fans (as seen from how many people they don't know who Lloyd is).

For Lloyd;

Want: 4.5
Likeliness: 1.4

Little Mac's Prediction: 3.9

Nom-Nom-Nominations:

Skull Kid x1
M. Bison x1
Dixie Kong x1
Mach Rider x1
Saki x1

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Any liklihood from Capcom characters, from me, died when Namco was put in charge.

Now it's a Namco character or bust

 

[---]

I'd prefer bust.

 

[Opossum]

I'd prefer bust.

Anna's day already came and went.

...hehehe...

 

[jigglover]

Lloyd, as I've said already, Lloyd has been voted 5th most popular tales character on an older poll, and I've just fund a newer one where he is 7th. It seems that if smash does get a rep from tales, it'd be their most popular character, or one who plays a big role in more than two games.
Want: 0
Likelihood: 0

 

[shrooby]

I'd prefer bust.

Anna's day already came and went.

...hehehe...

Your punny-ness knows no bounds.

 

[N3ON]

Lloyd is a cool character, and one of my favorite Tales characters (granted I'm not super familiar with the series), and I think he could work well and be a casual fan favorite in Smash, but I really do think his chances are fairly poor. Sure he's Namco, and he's got alot of popularity in Japan and some outside it, but I don't see Sakurai thinking that he's "worthy" of a 3rd party slot, nor do the requests for him seem overwhelming. The only shot I see him getting is if Namco asks for him, which based on recent interviews, while they would love to see him in Smash, they will be leaving it up to Sakurai and not ask.

Want: 1
Likelihood: 0.2

Nomz:
x5 Krystal

 

[wildvine47]

Want: 0
Likelyhood: 0.7

Not gonna lie, I've never played the Tales games, but they seem somewhat popular, Lloyd especially. Considering that Lloyd has a full fan-made Brawl character hack for him, he's got the fan support for sure. But with 3rd party slots being as limited as they are, and with Pacman and Megaman being nearly guaranteed to fill up two of those slots, Lloyd's only real chance at playability would be if Sakurai is somehow a secret rabid fan of the game and has told no one. I'm not at all interested in Lloyd being playable either, considering my only experience with him was in Smash Flash. So I basically would like to see Lloyd in Smash 4 as much as I would like to see Mr. Incredible, and that is not at all.

Nominations: All five for Medusa, because I'm genuinely interested to see how people rate her.

 

[DakotaBonez]

Lloyd has a big fanbase, he stars in a couple of smash bros fangames, most notably in the recent Super Smash Flash 2. I personally don't care for him though, and wasn't aware of him until playing Super Smash Flash.

Want: 0

Likelihood: 0.3
Just because he has alot of fans.

NOMINATIONS

Ness x5

 

[Deleted member]

To question a 3rd Party choice just because there's a choice that "makes more sense" from the same company is kind of unfair, IMO.

After all, if we didn't know Snake was going to be in Brawl, but we did know a Konami character was going to get in, would you honestly expect Snake as the choice, or would you be betting more on someone like Simon Belmont?

The latter of course, but the situation here is completely different from Snake's.

Kojima practically begged Snake to get in Melee and by a stroke of luck, Sakurai remembered this and asked Kojima if he wanted Snake in Brawl, which ended up happening. Yo****o is leaving this up for Sakurai; it is highly unlikely that he'll make a push for it and there isn't any incentive for Sakurai to add a Tales rep in Smash.

 

[Deleted member]

Doesn't matter what the situation is.

The point is, if Snake had not been revealed, but a Konami character had been stated to be in, you would not be assuming Snake is the choice.

Just the same, you can't single out Lloyd as it's a similar (not the same, granted) case.

As for Pac-Man, since you want to drag in that Snake was in by personal request, we have nothing to show that Pac-Man is the most likely choice other than personal beliefs.
Personal beliefs were what made the exclusion of characters like Ridley and Mega Man in Brawl all the more painful.
Unlike Snake, we have nothing said about the company that owns him and whether they want him or not, whereas conversely, we know that the Tales director would love to see one his characters in.
Unlike Sonic, we have nothing said about his popularity, to which apparently, Tekken characters have gotten the most notice according to the Tekken director.

Pac-Man may be the most logical choice, but he isn't the most likely. At this point, we cannot determine who is.

 

[BKupa666]

The most helpful factors a third party character can have in their favor are one, a large, loyal fanbase, and two, a develop who has close ties with Sakurai. Because Megaman has the former, I suspect he'll be added early on. We don't yet know if any other characters meet the latter criteria, although it's arguable that no character fulfills the former to the extent that Megaman does. Sure, a developer may -want- a character, but unless they are able to sway Sakurai into adding them, they have little shot. Kojima swayed Sakurai into adding Snake, not an obvious choice in the slightest, but after the 'willy-nilly' interview, it seems unlikely that this will occur with Lloyd, and possibly Pacman as well.

 

[Deleted member]

Mega Man is not that safe either.
Yes, he has a fanbase. Yes, he has requests.

But compare him to Sonic.
Sonic was added at the last minute due to the sheer demand he had, which sarpassed that of any other candidate.
Mega Man may have demand, but his demand pales in comparison.
If Sonic only barely squeaked by, what really makes Mega Man so likely?

And Capcom is pulling the route Namco is doing with their characters; ultimately waiting for Sakurai to decide whether the character gets in or not. That worked out so well for Brawl, right?

This is why I am starting to heavily believe that Snake and Sonic will remain the only 3rd Parties.

 

[---]

Anna's day already came and went.

...hehehe...

Won't lie, this joke took me a second.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Lloyd Irving


I gotta say that I was bit against him before but later on due how much fan support and how he'd make sense to be in Smash, I'm not too much against him to be in. He'd translate in very well with his moveset anyway.

While there's the fact that the producer of Tales-games seems to root for him and some other Nintendo-appeared Tales Of-protagonists, Sakurai though had addressed that he wants to keep the amount of 3rd parties in minimum, checking that the reguirement for them to be included have been shown to be pretty high and looking a lot in the worldwide mascot popularity and relevance. In any case Pacman would be more sure fire-bet to be featured representing Namco which would put Lloyd and other Tales-characters in the inferior place. But I'd be all for Tales Of Symphonia-representation because I'm sure it would let us celebrate another fun part of third party titles linked heavily with Nintendo's systems and fans.

Want: 3.4.

Likelyhood: 0.7

Predicting Little Mac to get 4.1.

Noms:

Lip x5.

 

[Fluttershy]

Lloyd Irving
Want: 4
LH 1.1

Nominations
Krystal (5)