Puzzle League/Panel De Pon General (Former SSB4 Lip Support Thread)

[Souldin]

Welcome to the boards Souldin! I really hope Lip shows up, if not as playable, then at least an AT. Assist Trophies are about to house an All-Star cast as big as the playable characters in means of popularity and fan-favourites, after all.

Also no need to PM, just tag me up, like you just did @ JaidynReiman - Anyway, I added plenty recent supporters up now.

Thanks for that. I also hope that, if Lip doesn't get to feature as a playable character, she at least gets the next best thing by becoming an Assist Trophy. It wouldn't be the first character I wanted who became an Assist Trophy.

In fact, it's rather funny in a way, I got my 3rd most wanted character Little Mac advancing from an Assist Trophy to a smasher... and then see Starfy remain an Assist Trophy and both Ashley and Dillon join the ranks of Assist Trophy.

I agree that Lip has become the #1 pick once Takamaru left the building. Even still, people wondered why Kirby's Block attack in Melee looked the way it did, so people did some research and discovered Panel De Pon.

Then there is Lip's stick in Melee. Tons of people did not know where it came from and were curious enough to look into it.

Those who supported Takamaru to have a Japanese Authentic, or Japanese Cultured, character in Super Smash Brothers will move on to Donbe and Hikari.

I can apparently only add 5 images to my signature, so sadly I couldn't fit my 6th most wanted newcomer's stamp, Hikari & Donbe, onto my signature. Love to see them being mentioned here, and if I don't get my most wanted character, Lip, playable I certainly wouldn't mind it if Hikari & Donbe managed to instead... or I can hope for the miracle of seeing both characters obtain playable roles at once.

Anyway, I love your reasoning for Lip and am glad to see Hikari & Donbe get mentioned.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

I don't.


Yes, Lip has had her series represented since Melee. Yes, Panel De Pon was a bit popular at a time. The question I worry about, though, is "Would today's audience know or care about Lip? Is it worth bringing her back?"

In this installment, Sakurai is pretty clearly focusing on characters that are well known and instantly recognizable by the audience, as well as characters that have been promoted a lot in recent and upcoming games (Rosalina and the Fire Emblem characters are good examples). Lip has too many obstacles in her way to be considered amongst them, I think. She's obscure, she's Japan-only, she's rarely requested even in her home country now days, and worst of all, her series is currently dead. I don't really see Sakurai going out of his way to bring her on to the roster over so many other characters unless IS has any plans to revive Panel De Pon.

Sakurai has added obscure characters as retro reps before, but I'm not sure if Lip even has the same qualifications that previous retro characters have had. Her playstyle could be unique but I don't think it'd be groundbreaking (Ice Climbers), she doesn't have extreme seniority or importance (G&W, ROB), and as far as I can tell Nintendo isn't planning to do anything extra with her (Pit, sort of ROB). She just feels really unlikely when it all adds up.


Please prove me wrong, Sakurai...I want her so badly.

Isn't Sakurai looking for characters that have not been in a fighting game, but would something unique to Super Smash Brothers?

Lip fits those descriptions. Her puzzle based moveset would fit perfectly in terms of uniqueness and fun. She brings something to the table that other characters cannot, Puzzle Based Fighting.

Considering that Takamaru had a huge following and is now an Assist Trophy, that means Lip is the runner up.

 

[Blucas]

I'm still a little pessimistic because of her main weapon being an item and kirby having her garbage block

 

[JaidynReiman]

I don't.


Yes, Lip has had her series represented since Melee. Yes, Panel De Pon was a bit popular at a time. The question I worry about, though, is "Would today's audience know or care about Lip? Is it worth bringing her back?"

In this installment, Sakurai is pretty clearly focusing on characters that are well known and instantly recognizable by the audience, as well as characters that have been promoted a lot in recent and upcoming games (Rosalina and the Fire Emblem characters are good examples). Lip has too many obstacles in her way to be considered amongst them, I think. She's obscure, she's Japan-only, she's rarely requested even in her home country now days, and worst of all, her series is currently dead. I don't really see Sakurai going out of his way to bring her on to the roster over so many other characters unless IS has any plans to revive Panel De Pon.

Sakurai has added obscure characters as retro reps before, but I'm not sure if Lip even has the same qualifications that previous retro characters have had. Her playstyle could be unique but I don't think it'd be groundbreaking (Ice Climbers), she doesn't have extreme seniority or importance (G&W, ROB), and as far as I can tell Nintendo isn't planning to do anything extra with her (Pit, sort of ROB). She just feels really unlikely when it all adds up.


Please prove me wrong, Sakurai...I want her so badly.

I think she has a great chance if we've still got a retro rep in this game. I don't think its likely we're getting a retro rep at all this time, but if we do have a "retro" rep, I think she's the most likely pick.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

I'm still a little pessimistic because of her main weapon being an item and kirby having her garbage block

The only thing that really hurts her is Lip's stick and even that doesn't take away what makes Lip Lip.

Lip would base her fighting around Puzzle Solving, using blocks and shifting them would be part of her moveset. Sure, her main weapon would be based around her Smash attacks and such, but having that as an item does not take away what makes Lip Unique.

I am not sure if Kirby still has Lip's Garbage block as his move; however, Lip's use of the move would not change whether or not Kirby still uses it.

The only thing holding her back is Sakurai wondering if she validates as a fighter. And even then, she fits the role of what Sakurai wants in a fighter.

 

[JaidynReiman]

The only thing that really hurts her is Lip's stick and even that doesn't take away what makes Lip Lip.

Lip would base her fighting around Puzzle Solving, using blocks and shifting them would be part of her moveset. Sure, her main weapon would be based around her Smash attacks and such, but having that as an item does not take away what makes Lip Unique.

I am not sure if Kirby still has Lip's Garbage block as his move; however, Lip's use of the move would not change whether or not Kirby still uses it.

The only thing holding her back is Sakurai wondering if she validates as a fighter. And even then, she fits the role of what Sakurai wants in a fighter.

Yeah. Unfortunately I don't know if that will translate into "let's bring back Lip and make her playable." We don't even know if we're getting an old character being brought back this time. Yes, though, Kirby does use the garbage block (not that I think it matters).

 

[Souldin]

I personally do believe we will be seeing a retro series newcomer. As far as the roster goes, I think we will be getting 2-3 more newcomers, maybe 4 (although that might be pushing it), and that 1 of those newcomers will be a villain and 1 of those newcomers will be a retro series newcomer.

After all, there are plenty of options to choose from even with Takamaru's deconfirmation. I do believe Lip is the most likely of the retro series newcomers, although I will admit there are plenty others who have a chance such as Mach Rider, Bubbles, Hikari & Donbe, and more. If it's worries about whether we will be getting a retro series addition, then I'm pretty sure there is nothing to worry about, we're more likely to get one than not.

 

[N. Onymous]

as far as I can tell Nintendo isn't planning to do anything extra with her (Pit, sort of ROB). She just feels really unlikely when it all adds up.

Nintendo actually wasn't planning to do anything extra with Pit either when Brawl came out. IIRC, Uprising didn't even start as a Kid Icarus game, Sora was in the middle of developing an unrelated shmup when someone basically came up and went "Hey, this would kinda work as a KI sequel."

 

[Oracle_Summon]

For those concerned about Lip think about this:

Melee and Brawl had both an Obscure Character and a Retro Character

For Melee:

We had for Retro and for obscure.

For Brawl:

We had for Retro and for obscure.

Now in SSB4 we have:

obscure rep.

Now for Retros there is a concern when thinking about and .

In this case, we are talking about Retro Nintendo characters.

Little Mac is considered a Retro character, but also has a game that is has been around. Punch Out Wii.

Lip would represent a Retro character from Nintendo and the Puzzle Series.

 

[Blucas]

but the obscure characters are retro too

 

[Oracle_Summon]

but the obscure characters are retro too

Technically they are, but that seems to be the pattern that Sakurai is going so I classified them as such.

 

[Kapus]

Nintendo actually wasn't planning to do anything extra with Pit either when Brawl came out. IIRC, Uprising didn't even start as a Kid Icarus game, Sora was in the middle of developing an unrelated shmup when someone basically came up and went "Hey, this would kinda work as a KI sequel."

So Sakurai simply picked Pit because he liked his character and wanted to revive him?

Well, if he takes the same liking to Lip, I guess there's a chance she could do the same. I'm still pessimistic though.

 

[JaidynReiman]

So Sakurai simply picked Pit because he liked his character and wanted to revive him?

Well, if he takes the same liking to Lip, I guess there's a chance she could do the same. I'm still pessimistic though.

Well, it was both Sakurai liked Pit and also because he WAS a highly requested character to bring back. Sakurai didn't just magically choose him, Pit was highly requested. And yeah, I hate how people keep on saying that Pit was only added for Uprising. Fact is, Uprising was not even considered at all, as was stated in a prior post, because Uprising was considered to be a Star Fox game but they didn't think the gameplay quite worked for Star Fox. Eventually they settled on making it Kid Icarus.

 

[RouffWestie]

So Sakurai simply picked Pit because he liked his character and wanted to revive him?

Well, if he takes the same liking to Lip, I guess there's a chance she could do the same. I'm still pessimistic though.

Does he actually have the rights to do that? I thought the series was owned by the Intelligent Systems, so they would be the only people allowed to make puzzle league games. Sorry if this sounds dumb, I don't know much about first-party second-party such and such.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Does he actually have the rights to do that? I thought the series was owned by the Intelligent Systems, so they would be the only people allowed to make puzzle league games. Sorry if this sounds dumb, I don't know much about first-party second-party such and such.

Intelligent Systems is 100% owned by Nintendo, Nintendo owns everything IS creates. I'm not even sure if IS is a subsidiary company or just a specific development team, but it doesn't matter. If Lip does end up being playable in Smash Bros., there's a great chance Intelligent Systems might bring back Panel de Pon and keep the fairies for a change, but the likelihood is Sakurai wouldn't mess with it because that's IS's thing.

 

[Deleted member]

Well, the Panel de Pon situation wouldn't be any different from Fire Emblem or Famicom/Advance Wars, with being developed by IS and published by Nintendo. And look at how many Fire Emblem characters there are, as well as the infantry Assist Trophy in Brawl.

 

[mistermews]

Alas, I guess I'm a bit too late. Flower is there.... But Lip has always been my secret #2, I've always done bad rants to my friend after he played Tetris attack about appreciating your origin and Lip and all. If it's not too late, I'll support! That is, if she's not disconfirmed the day after I post this.....

 

[N. Onymous]

It's never too late to show your support. : )

 

[Deleted member]

Alright guys, I need to ask a question. What do you think? Too much scenery? Should I tone it doen a bit or any other suggestions maybe?

Spoiler

 

[Luminario]

Alright guys, I need to ask a question. What do you think? Too much scenery? Should I tone it doen a bit or any other suggestions maybe?

Spoiler

It looks wonderful. i assume the characters would fight in the strip without flowers, if so very good detail you mustn't trample them.
It looks really nice and I'd love to fight on a stage like this. GOOD JOB!

 

[N. Onymous]

Alright guys, I need to ask a question. What do you think? Too much scenery? Should I tone it doen a bit or any other suggestions maybe?

Looks fantastic as always, Tai! Keep up the good work!

 

[GM_3826]

Lip is very unlikely now, but I'm just going to drop in and say I support her.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Lip is very unlikely now, but I'm just going to drop in and say I support her.

I actually think she's MORE likely now that she was before... not that she's that much likely, but she is more than before because Takamaru was standing in her way for bringing back old characters.

 

[Deleted member]

Also there aren't too many flowers? Not too much scenery? That's good, I guess.

So, I have a little favor to ask for a little... something (it's a secret, haha). Some people her up for drawing some cute PdP themed pics? Nothing too detailed, just something easy in either 128x128, 256x256 or something that's easy to resize into those dimensions. Any people up for it?

 

[N. Onymous]

So, I have a little favor to ask for a little... something (it's a secret, haha). Some people her up for drawing some cute PdP themed pics? Nothing too detailed, just something easy in either 128x128, 256x256 or something that's easy to resize into those dimensions. Any people up for it?

I'm all for drawing cute PdP pictures, hahah. Sign me up!

 

[Kapus]

How soon do you need these drawings?

 

[Deleted member]

How soon do you need these drawings?

The sooner the better, although it's not urgent.

 

[J04KlM]

Also there aren't too many flowers? Not too much scenery? That's good, I guess.

So, I have a little favor to ask for a little... something (it's a secret, haha). Some people her up for drawing some cute PdP themed pics? Nothing too detailed, just something easy in either 128x128, 256x256 or something that's easy to resize into those dimensions. Any people up for it?

Sign me up!

 

[BluePikmin11]

Her series isn't dead, it's just continuing in smaller installments without her.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Her series isn't dead, it's just continuing in smaller installments without her.

Well, it's been in quite long hiatus now... maybe about 6 years as of today? I wonder how to respark interest towards the series to the developers' eyes.

 

[Deleted member]

Sign me up!

Ah, that's cute, thanks. I'm still gonna wait for a few more. Ideally would be at least four more pics, so one's down already.

 

[N. Onymous]

Well, it's been in quite long hiatus now... maybe about 6 years as of today? I wonder how to respark interest towards the series to the developers' eyes.

Seven, about ten since we've seen the fairy characters.

I don't know what it would take to get IS to revisit Popples. Like most of Nintendo, they seem to be focused on the Western market right now - mostly what they've been putting out is Fire Emblem, Pushmo, and Paper Mario, all of which star or generally star male characters - which would imply they're still in the mindset that resulted in Tetris Attack and Pokemon Puzzle League and possibly resulted in the cancellation of Nintendo Puzzle Collection's localization. Entirely ignoring that the series has a Western market that isn't adult men, of course. (It's a casual game, it sort of does by definition.) One of my friends even compared the art style to the Disney Fairies line.

 

[Deleted member]

Regarding the pictures, if it wouldn't be too much trouble, I'd prefer to have them in a day starting from now.

And speaking of pictures, I completely remade the door and big window, as well as readjusted the small round window.

Spoiler

Old

New

 

[N. Onymous]

Stage is looking as lovely as always, Tai. It's amazing how effective lumping different bits and pieces together can be. ^^

----

Speaking of speaking of pictures, here's mine:

 

[Deleted member]

Alright guys, I changed the foreground and background a bit. For the foreground, I replaced the three heart panels, with one of the six different ones (excluding the metal "!" one) and added a giant rainbow in the background, to make it look less barren. Also I slightly moved the fences around, though that's not really noticeable.

Spoiler

And in case you're wondering why I needed the pictures, I'll show you:

Spoiler

 

[Luminario]

Alright guys, I changed the foreground and background a bit. For the foreground, I replaced the three heart panels, with one of the six different ones (excluding the metal "!" one) and added a giant rainbow in the background, to make it look less barren. Also I slightly moved the fences around, though that's not really noticeable.

Spoiler

And in case you're wondering why I needed the pictures, I'll show you:

Spoiler

Adorable. and I just love what you did with the blocks, it makes them kinda look like building blocks as well. Adding in drawings like that is also a fantastic way to show off Lip's personality.

 

[Deleted member]

Adorable. and I just love what you did with the blocks, it makes them kinda look like building blocks as well. Adding in drawings like that is also a fantastic way to show off Lip's personality.

Thanks, but as for the pictures, I can't take credit for the idea, haha. The whole thing comes from, you guessed it, Captain Rainbow again and like everything from that game, it looks really ugly, hehe:

Spoiler

a flower, a mimin, a piranha flower and an angry Birdo

Lip and Nick

Edit:
I forgot to mention, I also started another stage, so progress on this one will kinda slow down, I fear. But I would consider the main model done as I don't know if there's still anything else to add... Moving plattforms will be made seperately. So I guess, proper textures is all that's left now.

 

[N. Onymous]

Still looks better than most stuff in that game, heheh.

Clever idea by the way, looks like you're taking inspiration from a whole lot of sources. : )

 

[Iko MattOrr]

Alright guys, I changed the foreground and background a bit. For the foreground, I replaced the three heart panels, with one of the six different ones (excluding the metal "!" one) and added a giant rainbow in the background, to make it look less barren. Also I slightly moved the fences around, though that's not really noticeable.

Spoiler

And in case you're wondering why I needed the pictures, I'll show you:

Spoiler

I died of cuteness seeing your second picture XD

 

[Deleted member]

Still looks better than most stuff in that game, heheh.

Sad, but true.

Clever idea by the way, looks like you're taking inspiration from a whole lot of sources. : )

Not so sure about this, the whole background is from the game itself (albeit in 3d), the house comes from official art with a touch of artistic liberties. The Captain Rainbow stuff is negligible, I just found the drawings by chance in the past while looking through the game files and it kinda stuck. So, yeah, not so sure if I would call two sources "a whole lot of sources". But thanks.

I died of cuteness seeing your second picture XD

*Disclaimer: Giry will not be held accountable for potential deaths caused by cute pictures. Please proceed with caution.
Hehe, sorry, I just had to.