Puzzle League/Panel De Pon General (Former SSB4 Lip Support Thread)

[TCRhade]

Nice BG land!

And yeah. I'll need that model to make "2.5D" sprites with it.

The rig? I haven't heard from the guy in a while. And I hope it's not cancelled, I need the rig for my game too.

 

[smashkirby]

K. I'm beginning preliminary development on a SSB fan-game and Lip is playable in it. She'll need a home stage.

Can I see it please?

 

[TCRhade]

Can I see it please?

It's nowhere near playable, right now. I'm just coding the engine, putting the soundtrack together, composing the main theme, and whipping up my debug menu and master debug sound test. But rest assured, Lip is in my roster as an unlockable character.

Devlog: http://smashbrosfeud.tumblr.com/

Screenshot of debug main menu:

 

[Furil]

Woah, a lot happens when you're away.

@Taigiry
The stage is looking good! Looks like you put a lot of work into it, and I'm sure all of us appreciate it :3

@ TCRhade
Is it going to be a 3d fangame? That would be so neat. I support anything that includes Lip. Good luck!

To keep the Lip support going, I started making a sprite for Lip. I would like to just make a few animations and stuff for how I think she would attack.
But I got stuck on the head. I just can't get satisfied, so I thought I'd ask fellow fans.(Ignore the bottom one)

 

[TCRhade]

Woah, a lot happens when you're away.

@Taigiry
The stage is looking good! Looks like you put a lot of work into it, and I'm sure all of us appreciate it :3

@ TCRhade
Is it going to be a 3d fangame? That would be so neat. I support anything that includes Lip. Good luck!

To keep the Lip support going, I started making a sprite for Lip. I would like to just make a few animations and stuff for how I think she would attack.
But I got stuck on the head. I just can't get satisfied, so I thought I'd ask fellow fans.(Ignore the bottom one)

Not exactly. It's 2.5 D, like Donkey Kong Country on SNES, kinda. Sprites that look like 3D

 

[Deleted member]

As I promised, now that I'm here again, I have more to show to you guys.

Spoiler

Don't mind the crappy textures, these are just placeholders (obviously) and the whole thing is still far from finished.

The rig? I haven't heard from the guy in a while. And I hope it's not cancelled, I need the rig for my game too.

Ah well, that kinda sucks. I'm a bit worried now.

@Taigiry
The stage is looking good! Looks like you put a lot of work into it, and I'm sure all of us appreciate it :3

Thanks.

To keep the Lip support going, I started making a sprite for Lip. I would like to just make a few animations and stuff for how I think she would attack.
But I got stuck on the head. I just can't get satisfied, so I thought I'd ask fellow fans.(Ignore the bottom one)

I'd say the left head looks far better. Something about the right one just seems off.

 

[N. Onymous]

Hmm... given the choice I'd take the first one, but there are some weird spots on both of them. Here's something I whipped up based on yours:

 

[Furil]

Oh, I drew her facing left, so it was backwards flipped. I also tried to change the hair up, but I guess it works better sticking to the original. Thanks for the help!

I made more adjustments and changed the stick to be open.
Since it was backwards, should I put the Lip stick in her other hand? It's easier to see, but Lip is right-handed.

Now that I look at it again, the hair still bothers me... I can't really figure out why.
The pose probably needs to be altered too, but I do that when animating.

 

[N. Onymous]

The hair probably looks a bit weird because, if you notice, Lip is never actually drawn facing to the right without her sprite being flipped in-game. When I draw/sprite her from that angle, I have to guess how it would work in 3D. Basically, if you're going to draw her facing to the left you'll have to redraw her hair.

Most people hold things they're going to use in their dominant hand, so the bottom sprite is probably the best.

 

[TCRhade]

I like the sprite. But I wish my friend would at least give me news about that Lip rig...

 

[Kapus]

Taking a look at the spritework..

I like the posture and posing, but the face looks a bit off to me. The position of her nose feels very odd given the rest of her face and the sprite's perspective, for one. Her ear also looks a tad bit too small, and it bothers me greatly that the back of her head isn't any bit visible. Makes her head look very thin.

I lead much better by example when it comes to spriting, so I took the sprites and started tampering with them.

I tried working a slight neck into the first sprite, as it looked a bit awkward to me otherwise. I'm not sure what kind of palette you're using (if any) but I advise against using solid black for outlines when creating sprites like this (unless you're going for an NES 8 bit style of some kind). The face still bothers me a little, but I dunno what to do about it at the moment. I think it just looks a bit unfocused. Maybe I'll take another look when I'm not feeling sick.

 

[Deleted member]

This reminds me, I also made Lip sprites before starting on the stage. I wanted to do something Mario World related, but with Lip's model (hopefully) being rigged and imported, I put that on hold and started to work on the stage instead.

As you see, the spritesheet is still messy to this day, but at least the sprites are done, just ignore the Cirno and Mario sprites, haha. So here ya go, a SMW styled Lip sprite sheet.

Also I'll probably have more to show of the stage later, but I still wanna do some stuff before doing so.

But I wish my friend would at least give me news about that Lip rig...

Can't you shoot him a message and ask?

 

[N. Onymous]

Coincidentally, I happen to be working on a PDP-themed Mario World hack of my own! Only three stages (out of at least forty) are done yet, though. I get level designer's block depressingly easily. I still plan to finish it one day, though.

 

[Furil]

Taking a look at the spritework..

I like the posture and posing, but the face looks a bit off to me. The position of her nose feels very odd given the rest of her face and the sprite's perspective, for one. Her ear also looks a tad bit too small, and it bothers me greatly that the back of her head isn't any bit visible. Makes her head look very thin.

I lead much better by example when it comes to spriting, so I took the sprites and started tampering with them.

I actually think your edit is a tad more awkward in places, but we're getting there. The thing about Lip's neck is, it's not shown in any of her art. It's implied to be covered up by her top. So emulating that in sprite form was a tad difficult and resulted in that weird head position.

Taking a look at the spritework..
I tried working a slight neck into the first sprite, as it looked a bit awkward to me otherwise. I'm not sure what kind of palette you're using (if any) but I advise against using solid black for outlines when creating sprites like this (unless you're going for an NES 8 bit style of some kind). The face still bothers me a little, but I dunno what to do about it at the moment. I think it just looks a bit unfocused. Maybe I'll take another look when I'm not feeling sick.

The palette is from SSF2, as that is the style I planned to make it in. (Even though it is kinda ugly and full of style clashing) I was hoping once expansions started up, she could have a chance at that. And yeah, the face continues to look awkward. I'll take another crack at fixing it. Hope you feel better.

People in this thread of really helpful and productive. Horray for Lip fans!

Edit:
After some plastic surgery, I managed to make her face actually look somewhat right.

Not I'm worried that it's a bit too cluttered. Any more suggestions?

 

[smashkirby]

You know what? Ever since Super Smash Flash 2's latest demo (v0.9b) came out, I was actually thinking Lip could be playable in Super Smash Flash 2. The developers of that game are very talented, I have to give them props on that, and at least, I now have great hope for her since that game now has both Chibi-Robo (with his best friend, Telly-Vision at his side, no less!) AND "The Golden Earth-Shaking Adept" himself, Isaac from Golden Sun, as PLAYABLE CHARACTERS! (Granted, I'm disappointed that one of my most wanted for SSB4, Bandana Dee, of the Kirby series, is an AT, but these two definitely make up for it.) I now have hope for more Nintendo characters that have not shown up in a Smash game yet, to show up in SSF2 and Lip is no exception to that, so here's to hoping for her!

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

You know what? Ever since Super Smash Flash 2's latest demo (v0.9b) came out, I was actually thinking Lip could be playable in Super Smash Flash 2. The developers of that game are very talented, I have to give them props on that, and at least, I now have great hope for her since that game now has both Chibi-Robo (with his best friend, Telly-Vision at his side, no less!) AND "The Golden Earth-Shaking Adept" himself, Isaac from Golden Sun, as PLAYABLE CHARACTERS! (Granted, I'm disappointed that one of my most wanted for SSB4, Bandana Dee, of the Kirby series, is an AT, but these two definitely make up for it.) I now have hope for more Nintendo characters that have not shown up in a Smash game yet, to show up in SSF2 and Lip is no exception to that, so here's to hoping for her!

You know, that reminded me of this one poll in SSB Crusade-forums that had people vote for characters put into a set. I think Lip was one of 'em, but she didn't get much votes.

I think one of the best ways to ever see her in Smash would be finding a masterful spriter, come up a moveset for her, sprite it up and pitch it to any of the current devs in Super Smash Fangames.

 

[smashkirby]

You know, that reminded me of this one poll in SSB Crusade-forums that had people vote for characters put into a set. I think Lip was one of 'em, but she didn't get much votes.

I think one of the best ways to ever see her in Smash would be finding a masterful spriter, come up a moveset for her, sprite it up and pitch it to any of the current devs in Super Smash Fangames.

You know what? That could actually work! So........know any really good, high-quality spriters who could do Lip and pitch that to the dev team?

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

You know what? That could actually work! So........know any really good, high-quality spriters who could do Lip and pitch that to the dev team?

Nah.

Plus, these kind of things are quick to write as "easy" or "feasible" but with no support and good reasoning to get through the hard work (because SPRITING IS HARD), nothing will be produced. And I bet can't / even shouldn't if it's all solely on the spriter. I suggest to not go looking for one just like that and thus disregard their situations or viewpoints.

In general, it's just a possibility, but to execute that asks for a plenty.

 

[Deleted member]

And another update. Am I too fast? Should I slow down? Ah well, whatever, here it is, hehe:

Spoiler

Background's nearly done now, only the faces on the mountains and hills are left and afterwards a few touch ups on various things. Kinda sad, making the background was more fun than I thought at first.

Coincidentally, I happen to be working on a PDP-themed Mario World hack of my own! Only three stages (out of at least forty) are done yet, though. I get level designer's block depressingly easily. I still plan to finish it one day, though.

Oh, I'd love to see some pictures of it.

 

[Furil]

I made a quick animation.

That hair is going to be a challenge. Also, should the outline be darker?

 

[BluePikmin11]

You know what? Ever since Super Smash Flash 2's latest demo (v0.9b) came out, I was actually thinking Lip could be playable in Super Smash Flash 2. The developers of that game are very talented, I have to give them props on that, and at least, I now have great hope for her since that game now has both Chibi-Robo (with his best friend, Telly-Vision at his side, no less!) AND "The Golden Earth-Shaking Adept" himself, Isaac from Golden Sun, as PLAYABLE CHARACTERS! (Granted, I'm disappointed that one of my most wanted for SSB4, Bandana Dee, of the Kirby series, is an AT, but these two definitely make up for it.) I now have hope for more Nintendo characters that have not shown up in a Smash game yet, to show up in SSF2 and Lip is no exception to that, so here's to hoping for her!

Wait Bandanna Dee is deconfirmed? When, where, source, how?

 

[JaidynReiman]

Wait Bandanna Dee is deconfirmed? When, where, source, how?

Bandana Dee is an Assist Trophy in Super Smash Flash 2.

 

[smashkirby]

Wait Bandanna Dee is deconfirmed? When, where, source, how?

http://ssfdojo.mcleodgaming.com/items/assist-trophies/bandana-dee

 

[BluePikmin11]

http://ssfdojo.mcleodgaming.com/items/assist-trophies/bandana-dee

Ahhh, I see, the SSF2 dev team seems to really focus on unique movesets more than ever, they have rejected the idea of Pac-Man being playable before, maybe that's why Dee isn't playable, and why it will probably have Lip.

 

[smashkirby]

Ahhh, I see, the SSF2 dev team seems to really focus on unique movesets more than ever, they have rejected the idea of Pac-Man being playable before, maybe that's why Dee isn't playable, and why it will probably have Lip.

Well, if it makes you feel at least a little bit better, B.D. was added to SSF2 v0.7 as an AT, about two (or three?) weeks before his confirmation to be playable in Kirby Returns to Dream Land. Maybe if the devs had seen him in action in that game, they'd reconsider and make him playable. As for Pac-Man, I believe the same would have applied for him....in 3-4 years time. SSB4 announced Pac-Man playable at E3 2014, SSF2 v0.7 had him as an AT in 2011. And as for Lip.....Yes, I do believe now she may have a chance at being playable. As a matter of fact, I asked one of the devs why they had picked Chibi-Robo and Isaac to be playable in SSF2, and how do they pick their playable characters, Nintendo and other companies included.

This was the answer I got from one of them: Fan demand is important, but representation and moveset potentional also play a big role (the biggest, argueably). Take Chibi-Robo for example; he's not a widely known, let alone requested, character. Yet, we immeditaly saw that it'd be extremely fun to work out a character that uses cleaning tools to fight. It added diversity to the roster and we felt that conceptually he felt right at home in Smash.

So I guess their mindset is similar to that of Sakurai himself. This also makes me feel at ease about who I requested to be playable for SSF2. The list goes as follows, and mind you, this is not ALL the people I want, since I have a LARGE amount of characters I want, and this list is just characters who I feel have a chance now, and/or primarily want, or I think the dev team can make them work: Lark (Pilot Wings), Andy (Advance Wars), Prince Sable (For the Frog The Bell Tolls), Lip (Panel de Pon), Ray MK III (Custom Robo Arena), Jill (Drill Dozer), Waluigi (Hey, if Sakurai won't do it, someone should.), Takamaru, Bubbles (Clu Clu Land) Atumi Tachibana (Famicom Detective Club), Sukapon (Joy Mech Fight), and Exictebiker/Mach Rider.

 

[N. Onymous]

I think one of the best ways to ever see her in Smash would be finding a masterful spriter, come up a moveset for her, sprite it up and pitch it to any of the current devs in Super Smash Fangames.

I like this idea, but the concept behind Super Smash Flash is kind of tainted by the presence of non-video game characters for no good reason (InuYasha? Mr. Incredible? Ichigo? Goku?) and original character do not steal. I think it's going to take a lot for people to see it as more than "just another fangame". Again, we'd probably have more luck with Project M. (Vote for Lip!)

Oh, I'd love to see some pictures of it.

Here's some straight from the SMW Central thread:

Spoiler

(title graphics will be changed)

 

[BluePikmin11]

Well, if it makes you feel at least a little bit better, B.D. was added to SSF2 v0.7 as an AT, about two (or three?) weeks before his confirmation to be playable in Kirby Returns to Dream Land. Maybe if the devs had seen him in action in that game, they'd reconsider and make him playable. As for Pac-Man, I believe the same would have applied for him....in 3-4 years time. SSB4 announced Pac-Man playable at E3 2014, SSF2 v0.7 had him as an AT in 2011. And as for Lip.....Yes, I do believe now she may have a chance at being playable. As a matter of fact, I asked one of the devs why they had picked Chibi-Robo and Isaac to be playable in SSF2, and how do they pick their playable characters, Nintendo and other companies included.

This was the answer I got from one of them: Fan demand is important, but representation and moveset potentional also play a big role (the biggest, argueably). Take Chibi-Robo for example; he's not a widely known, let alone requested, character. Yet, we immeditaly saw that it'd be extremely fun to work out a character that uses cleaning tools to fight. It added diversity to the roster and we felt that conceptually he felt right at home in Smash.

So I guess their mindset is similar to that of Sakurai himself. This also makes me feel at ease about who I requested to be playable for SSF2. The list goes as follows, and mind you, this is not ALL the people I want, since I have a LARGE amount of characters I want, and this list is just characters who I feel have a chance now, and/or primarily want, or I think the dev team can make them work: Lark (Pilot Wings), Andy (Advance Wars), Prince Sable (For the Frog The Bell Tolls), Lip (Panel de Pon), Ray MK III (Custom Robo Arena), Jill (Drill Dozer), Waluigi (Hey, if Sakurai won't do it, someone should.), Takamaru, Bubbles (Clu Clu Land) Atumi Tachibana (Famicom Detective Club), Sukapon (Joy Mech Fight), and Exictebiker/Mach Rider.

Well going by the quote of the devs:

Fan demand is important, but representation and moveset potentional also play a big role (the biggest, argueably). Take Chibi-Robo for example; he's not a widely known, let alone requested, character. Yet, we immeditaly saw that it'd be extremely fun to work out a character that uses cleaning tools to fight. It added diversity to the roster and we felt that conceptually he felt right at home in Smash.

I think Andy, Sable (Which I doubt personally, but he is relatively unique), Lip, Ray MK, Waluigi (Though not as much diversity is provided, his personality brings out a fresh moveset), Bubbles, Ayumi (Who I also doubt will happen), and Excitebiker and Mach Rider.
The others don't feel like they have the big potential Isaac and Chibi have.
By the way, do you have a link to this quote?

 

[smashkirby]

Well going by the quote of the devs:

I think Andy, Sable (Which I doubt personally, but he is relatively unique), Lip, Ray MK, Waluigi (Though not as much diversity is provided, his personality brings out a fresh moveset), Bubbles, Ayumi (Who I also doubt will happen), and Excitebiker and Mach Rider.
The others don't feel like they have the big potential Isaac and Chibi have.
By the way, do you have a link to this quote?

I'm sorry, but which characters specifically do you feel don't have great potential like Chibi-Robo and Isaac?

 

[BluePikmin11]

I'm sorry, but which characters specifically do you feel don't have great potential like Chibi-Robo and Isaac?

Well the ones I didn't list, though I could add Jill there too.

 

[Itty Bit]

So uh, on the subject of Smash 4, I think I've finally hit my point where I'm pretty confident she's not gonna be in, unfortunately... What, with the announcement of Takamaru's game coming to Virtual Console, and the direct being on the same day.

But with that being said, I don't really feel all that defeated, considering what all of you guys are doing. From Fangames to making a custom level for her (which looks awesome so far, btw) To all of the support of getting her in Project M, I still have a lot of confidence that we will see Lip in some way, shape or form... Just maybe not in this game.

 

[BluePikmin11]

She was never a retro character from the beginning just so you know, she has had releases in the form of eShop games, it's just not starring her.

So uh, on the subject of Smash 4, I think I've finally hit my point where I'm pretty confident she's not gonna be in, unfortunately... What, with the announcement of Takamaru's game coming to Virtual Console, and the direct being on the same day.

But with that being said, I don't really feel all that defeated, considering what all of you guys are doing. From Fangames to making a custom level for her (which looks awesome so far, btw) To all of the support of getting her in Project M, I still have a lot of confidence that we will see Lip in some way, shape or form... Just maybe not in this game.

SSF2 is the way to go.

 

[N. Onymous]

Good news: I've found a Panel de Pon fan game called "Puzzle League Art Style", and it keeps the puzzle gameplay! Bad news: it's based on the awful characterless presentation of Planet Puzzle League... If you want to support the fairy characters, don't waste your time.

So uh, on the subject of Smash 4, I think I've finally hit my point where I'm pretty confident she's not gonna be in, unfortunately... What, with the announcement of Takamaru's game coming to Virtual Console, and the direct being on the same day.

Okay. Here's what I don't understand. How could anyone, most of all Team Sakurai, think yet another effing swordsman would POSSIBLY add more to SSB4 than Lip? How could they think Takamaru could have a unique moveset but Lip couldn't? How?

Uggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

SSF2 is the way to go.

No, it's really not. Even if Project M weren't bigger in every conceivable way - like I said before, Super Smash Flash's reputation has already been tainted by Mr. Incredible, Naruto, InuYasha, et al. (and that's without mentioning the pointless inclusion of the authors' crappy Sonic fan characters in the first game). P:M or bust.

 

[JaidynReiman]

She was never a retro character from the beginning just so you know, she has had releases in the form of eShop games, it's just not starring her.

Same thing, really. Lip herself has not appeared in a Panel de Pon game since the very first one, she's a retro character. It doesn't matter if the franchises got games later on, Lip herself hasn't appeared.

 

[N. Onymous]

Same thing, really. Lip herself has not appeared in a Panel de Pon game since the very first one, she's a retro character. It doesn't matter if the franchises got games later on, Lip herself hasn't appeared.

Lip, Furil, either's good really. I just want to see the fairies again, even if not in a puzzle game. Too much to ask though, apparently.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

So I guess their mindset is similar to that of Sakurai himself. This also makes me feel at ease about who I requested to be playable for SSF2. The list goes as follows, and mind you, this is not ALL the people I want, since I have a LARGE amount of characters I want, and this list is just characters who I feel have a chance now, and/or primarily want, or I think the dev team can make them work: Lark (Pilot Wings), Andy (Advance Wars), Prince Sable (For the Frog The Bell Tolls), Lip (Panel de Pon), Ray MK III (Custom Robo Arena), Jill (Drill Dozer), Waluigi (Hey, if Sakurai won't do it, someone should.), Takamaru, Bubbles (Clu Clu Land) Atumi Tachibana (Famicom Detective Club), Sukapon (Joy Mech Fight), and Exictebiker/Mach Rider.

To make matters worse, only the SSF2 team will be making expansion characters and instead of letting spriters make their own characters for the game. That alone will make the wait for such characters to be much more painful and boring. (Where the hell is Dedede and Little Mac?)

 

[Deleted member]

Just dropping by to say that, due to lack of infos regarding the state of Lip's import and me not knowing what to add to the stage to improve it, as well as still unsure about the battlefiels layout, I've decided to cancel the whole thing. Surprise~

Here's some straight from the SMW Central thread:

Spoiler

(title graphics will be changed)

Oh that, I saw that quite some time ago, thought it was canceled considering the last post in the SMWC thread was over a year ago and there never was a response to a question someone asked.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Just dropping by to say that, due to lack of infos regarding the state of Lip's import and me not knowing what to add to the stage to improve it, as well as still unsure about the battlefiels layout, I've decided to cancel the whole thing. Surprise~

Oh that, I saw that quite some time ago, thought it was canceled considering the last post in the SMWC thread was over a year ago and there never was a response to a question someone asked.

WHAAAAA---

But it was progressing so well!

 

[Furil]

Just dropping by to say that, due to lack of infos regarding the state of Lip's import and me not knowing what to add to the stage to improve it, as well as still unsure about the battlefiels layout, I've decided to cancel the whole thing. Surprise~

Oh that, I saw that quite some time ago, thought it was canceled considering the last post in the SMWC thread was over a year ago and there never was a response to a question someone asked.

Aww, that's really disappointing... but it's your decision.
Would you mind posting the WIP file? I'm sure someone else would take over. You did a lot of it and it's a shame to see it all go to waste. Heck, I would like to just have it to look at o_o

 

[TCRhade]

@Taigiry: Can I have your WIP if you're gonna cancel it? Or at least, pics of the backgound and main platform as separate PNG's? I'd enlist you as a modeler, but it looks like that's not the best idea, huh?

 

[N. Onymous]

Just dropping by to say that, due to lack of infos regarding the state of Lip's import and me not knowing what to add to the stage to improve it, as well as still unsure about the battlefiels layout, I've decided to cancel the whole thing. Surprise~

That was abrupt.

When in doubt, base it off Battlefield. I think what you have with two to four platforms symmetrically dotted about the stage would suffice.