Project M Social Thread

[Skieth]

whats new with sonic? anything will do.





lol. Ignored again.

He has a new fair thats a spike and a new animation for his nair. Probably a lot more I don't know about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWpsZL9gzqU

 

[Stevo]

makes me so sad that people will refuse to play any "2D" version of a game.

no wonder game companies make ****ty games with good graphics these days....

*sigh*

 

[JCaesar]

Yeah, kids these days make me sad. They just don't make games like they used to anymore (i.e. challenging, heartfelt, nonlinear, etc).

 

[Mattnumbers]

There are plenty of challenging games coming out, you just have to dig a little.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Samus is bad under pressure though. She works best when the spacing is neutral or when she has momentum. Honestly her best option OoS is fresh/near fresh nair since it is fast, large, and pretty frame safe. Overall though even Pichu is better under pressure with a +1 Nair on block and a better jump speed. U-Grav and FF, not jump squat frame data.

Non-linear games almost always have terrible level design/enemy placement since levels can't be designed around one route. Not saying linear games can't have terrible enemy placement too, just it's a lot easier to make a static or pre-determined level/path.

/R-Type

 

[JCaesar]

I'm talking general gaming trends. There will always be the random exception like Dark Souls and Cave Story.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

Samus is bad under pressure though. She works best when the spacing is neutral or when she has momentum. Honestly her best option OoS is fresh/near fresh nair since it is fast, large, and pretty frame safe. Overall though even Pichu is better under pressure with a +1 Nair on block and a better jump speed. U-Grav and FF, not jump squat frame data.

Nair OoS is fine, but going into the air with Samus is a big commitment, even if it's only a short hop. I view wavedash OoS as Samus' best overall OoS option because of how uniformly good Samus' wavedash is. Up-B OoS gets points for being fast as hell. I'm not going to obsess over how they stack up against each other overall since they all have their legitimate uses here and there.

 

[MonkUnit]

Samus is bad under pressure though. She works best when the spacing is neutral or when she has momentum. Honestly her best option OoS is fresh/near fresh nair since it is fast, large, and pretty frame safe. Overall though even Pichu is better under pressure with a +1 Nair on block and a better jump speed. U-Grav and FF, not jump squat frame data.

UpB OOS and Nair OOS are her best OOS options.
[collapse=nair/upb oos frame stuff]N-Air
Hit: 5-29
--Strong hit--
Hit lag: 6
Shield stun: 14
Advantage: +1

Screw Attack

--from the ground--
Total: 49
invincible: 1-5

Hit: 4-7, 8-9, 10-11, 12-13, 14-15,
16-17, 18-19, 20-21, 22-23, 24-25,
26-27, 28-29[/collapse]

EDIT: forgot about WD OOS

 

[ph00tbag]

Non-linear games almost always have terrible level design/enemy placement since levels can't be designed around one route. Not saying linear games can't have terrible enemy placement too, just it's a lot easier to make a static or pre-determined level/path.

/R-Type

People always say this in willful ignorance of the fact that a good non-linear game has much, much deeper level design than any linear game can have, because you have to design a gameplay path, and find a way to induce the player to stick to it without making it seem forced. I'm not saying there's no value in linear level design that flows, but it's really unfortunate that so many players refuse to acknowledge the incredible value in a game that requires you to be aware of an entire world at any point in the game, and the astonishing attention to detail that needs to go into the creation of such a game.

If you want an amazing example of nonlinear gameplay, check out Redder. You'll see what I mean.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Something seems contradictory about that but I am having trouble wording why. Either way, I appreciate good nonlinear games, and calling me ignorant for acknowledging their main flaw is kind of silly.

You have to design a gameplay path, and find a way to induce the player to stick to it without making it seem forced.

This part I mean. Like it sounds like "Make a line not look like a line and it becomes nonlinear."

 

[Fly_Amanita]

All I ever play nowadays is Spelunky. Its randomly generated levels provide me with all the variety I need.

 

[Mattnumbers]

Roguelikes in general are awesome

 

[GP&B]

Add Paper Mario 2 to the better-than-CT RPGs. It's so ****ing amazing.

 

[GaretHax]

Really, no love for Morrowind or its predecessors? Unless you are only including 100% turn-based jrpg-ish games it seems kind of odd that they wouldn't be mentioned, especially considering how insanely massive their modding scenes were and are... I mean there are mods to change elderscrolls games from Halo, to Wow, to Middle earth and every concievable tweak to combat, magic, or any other form of mechanic out there! (And most are stupidly customizable) Not to mention vanilla Morrowind was probably the best game I have ever played, gave up on finding old Casius and just wandered Morrowind for 50 or so game hours then slowly beat the main quest naturally logging over 100 hours of play. Hell half of it is probably a generous portion to allocate to quests tbh, I spent most of my time just scraping together a living and seeking out new places, people, and stories. I remember running back and forth from Balmora to Caldera, loaded up like a packmule, scavaging anything I could and running away from just about every fight until I thought I was in a position to win it thus nudging my slow climb to success. Problem really is that the game was given too much tcl and care, with all the handplaced items and objects (pretty much the entire gameworld short of some creature spawns and their corresponding loot) once you play the game thats kind of it reguardless of completion % since everything is back where it started. Honestly even then it is amazing >_>
But to each their own I suppose.
I guess they are notorious for being somewhat weak in terms of actual gameplay/mechanics and can be quite offputting to some gamers, but I have always played them for the experience. I have plenty of other games for the gameplay, and besides I can mod in the gameplay later lol...

 

[Deleted member]

Believe it or not, a high learning curve isn't a weakness. No matter how hard a character is to control, if once you can control them they're completely broken, that's a really stupid character.

I think a high learning curve is a weakness. Difficulty for all practical purposes is equivalent to consistency, in a game where you don't have the luxury of being inconsistent. We can theorize what a character can potentially do, and in many cases it is good to push those limits for the sake of innovation, but it is certainly a bad idea to attempt innovation in a tournament setting. I dare argue that if you can control an extremely difficult character that the character is no longer difficult by definition.

Additionally, nonlinear characters like Fox/Falco strongly encourage sub-optimal decision-making in a match and it is hard to determine the correct choice simply because of the sheer amount of alternatives available. These imperfect decisions lead to momentum shifts and are a great way to get killed in general. DoH once jokingly proded at me with "What's wrong, too many options?" and he scoffed a little but then I said "Actually, yes." and I think he immediately understood what I was getting at.

 

[KingClubber]

He has a new fair thats a spike and a new animation for his nair. Probably a lot more I don't know about.

This is old news, i'm talking about 'This month new'

Also I wanted ask, why is Falco dair, and d-tilt values different from melee's in Demo1?

I know kinda pointless to ask now, i'm concern these values will be the same in demo2.

 

[hotdogturtle]

Because Demo1.

 

[OmegaMuffin]

I would be inclined to agree with you if your post had anything resembling evidence, support, or reasoning, but I am instead inclined to disagree, because Melee's air hammer has a safer hitbox coverage and doesn't take 15000 frames to come out. Melee hammer with bad hit properties even at least had utility instead of being a slower, less useful bair. Kirby is like what, D tier in Brawl? E maybe even? He has some things better in Brawl but he's still really, really, bad. Instead of blindly using his Brawl build we should look at aspects good and bad from all his incarnations and make an actually decent, well rounded character.

Lol I totally just said that out of biased. A lot of endlag, weak hits that have no reward and overall stupidness makes me not like the move. Had the outer part of the melee hammer did something different like it's grounded counterpart then I'd be all for it. Idk, I just like Brawl's better. When you hit someone with it, it doesn't make you think "Why the hell did I just use that move?" It does to me anyway. Whatever, I don't really care to be perfectly honest.

 

[CSDragon]

Let us not forget about Golden Sun.

 

[Deleted member]

Let us not forget about Golden Sun.

Wizard Sheba ftw. I jerk to that game.

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

ok so i want to try to say something but i am not sure how to explain what i am thinking but i am going to give it a try.

First i want to start off by saying i really like how zss looks and what i am going to say is not a suggestion to change her but just a thought i had about her

I sort of feel like she should be a character based off tech chases and resets. I know the problem with this is u cant guarantee resets b/c of teching but i feel like hard knockdowns (not sure but i think this is the right term from the traditional fighting game community) to resets makes sense with her b/c of her d-smash and neutral B. now my only thought on how this would even work would be to have some moves at certain %'s be untechable but have them become techable after a certain %. I almost feel like magic series combos might make sense for her so she could set up into tech chasing and reset opportunities.

(not sure if this made sense, also like i said b4 its not really a suggestion on how to change her. its just an idea i had which i wanted to try to explain. so responding to this is fine but dont be a **** and flame b/c there is no point to that since its not a real suggestion and is boarder line rambling (rambling is need to sleep johns)

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

As far as I know, there have been rather recent advances in our hacking abilities with imports. So, is it possible to use the Wireframe as models for new characters and introduce them into P:M?

 

[Couch]

^ an exciting prospect i am also curious about..

 

[Haloedhero]

Importing new models is not the problem with adding characters to the game. The ability to import models, which is now possible, doesn't help get new characters into the game any more than vertex hacks did. It's just a lot more complicated than you'd think. Sorry.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Wizard Sheba ftw. I jerk to that game.

Who doesn't?

The game was really easy, though.

 

[OmegaMuffin]

Ganon's aerial side-b ground bounce is cute as hell. Just sayin.

 

[JCaesar]

You all should get on the #projectm IRC channel more often so we can talk about how much better old games were and stuff. Oh and Project M I guess.

 

[Stunts]

Good RPGs?
****, there's the Phantasy Star series(including the games before online that the kids these days don't know about), Skies of Arcadia, Lufia, and not to mention, "...p-per...son...a". The list goes on.

 

[Archangel]

Good RPGs?
****, there's the Phantasy Star series(including the games before online that the kids these days don't know about), Skies of Arcadia, Lufia, and not to mention, "...p-per...son...a". The list goes on.

I lost friends over Phantasy star lol. Skies of Arcadia was a good one I forgot all about. I like the Tales series because mainly because the combat system is fun. If someone mentions a Final fantasy game I will kill them. Anyone else play the Suikoden series or just me? Just me? ok.... What about Fire emblem? or la pucelle tactics which played pretty much the same but is alot older. Xenosaga? Xeno gears? Breath of fire games? Radiata stories? Lunar series?

 

[JCaesar]

Take it to the IRC please. Or make a thread about it in the Social forum on Smashmods.

 

[Archangel]

will do...

http://is.gd/9e3ZtO

^ For those of you to lazy to look up...

 

[Anth0ny]

This looks pretty ****ing accurate

Amazing to see how far Brawl hacking has come. From ****ty Mewtwo recolors of Lucario to this. I'm guessing at this point the thing holding Mewtwo back is the fact that Lucario would have to be replaced in the process, right?

 

[Kink-Link5]

And that alloys can't have B moves, grab the ledge, etc.

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

Yo guys i called out skies being awesome yesterday. (Love that game). Super mario and the 7 stars is legit as well

 

[Revven]

This looks pretty ****ing accurate

Amazing to see how far Brawl hacking has come. From ****ty Mewtwo recolors of Lucario to this. I'm guessing at this point the thing holding Mewtwo back is the fact that Lucario would have to be replaced in the process, right?

Those animations still look really unpolished, not up to our standards at all, not to mention hitbox stats, placement, and so on.

What would be holding him back is the polish and lack of creating another slot for him.

 

[Skieth]

This looks pretty ****ing accurate

Amazing to see how far Brawl hacking has come. From ****ty Mewtwo recolors of Lucario to this. I'm guessing at this point the thing holding Mewtwo back is the fact that Lucario would have to be replaced in the process, right?

Looks fantastic. Hopefully we can shove mewtwo over one of the characters not in demo 2 as a temp fix.

 

[Oldeeber]

polish COULD be done tho. is there any chance that some1 will find out how to get the alloys to work so u could put mewtwo in?

 

[`dazrin]

jk- can't come to manifest last minute T_T

perhaps i'll be there sunday, but nothing is certain. maaaaan.

 

[Vigilante]

Well, if poeple want to work on the clone engine, be our guest. We're obviously keeping Lucario there because he's currently one of the most awesome characters in Project M. Still, most of the effort is being put toward characters we know for sure we can release in time. This doesn't mean that we won't make Mewtwo if the opportunity comes up or that we won't try putting him in in say... a DLC or something. However, if we did put him in, he would be much more professionally-made and balanced better too. Still, this is a better PSA than most other Mewtwos I've seen so far and I'll give them credit for making an actually interesting Final Smash. If that was polished further, it could have potential... although we'd probably start from scratch for our Mewtwo anyways if we can ever make on.

 

[Anth0ny]

Those animations still look really unpolished, not up to our standards at all, not to mention hitbox stats, placement, and so on.

What would be holding him back is the polish and lack of creating another slot for him.

According to the Brawl Vault page:

What's new on this Official BETA 1 release?

- A whole NEW revamped Mewtwo moveset!
- Mewtwo Model Import by pikazz, update by M2K (I have permission)
- Melee Mewtwo Sound Effects (Find this on my Vault)
- Melee Mewtwo Animation work (using Melee's exact animation frame data)
- Melee Mewtwo PSA work. (with Melee Mewtwo's Dark GFX)
- Some portraits and other BASIC stuff.

Why isn't this the official final version? well because I still need to fix and revamp some other tiny details on him:

- Revamp: Recovery, stand attacks... etc.
- Create new Melee Cliff Recovery, Attack and Escape moves.
- Make Melee Mewtwo taunt animation, and 2 more customs.
- Make Melee Mewtwo's Win1 Animation, 2 and 3 done.
- Make all of Melee's Damage Animations.
- Add the exact Melee's balancing properties to all moves.
- Get items to work. (you cannot use sword Items in this update, they won't work properly)
- Fix some stuff *there and there*

So it's still getting some work done on it. I thought his normals and specials looked pretty spot on. His throws could use some work, definitely.

Just wanted to bring it up. Imagine a Project M trailer with a really accurate looking Mewtwo... that would get a TON of interest.