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Problems with koing with Falco.

Rubyiris

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
6,033
Location
Tucson, AZ.
I main Falco and Ike. My biggest problem with Falco is getting the KO at high percentages. Being too used to Ike being able to KO from 30~130% depending on situation, and which attack I use, it's become problematic for Falco to KO anything that is from the % range of 70~130%

Anything Below 70% and above 130% is easy to KO by either gimping or saving Uair/Smash. Are there any options regarding koing from the range of 70~120, or is Falco cursed with only being able to KO at low and high percentiles?
 

Vlade

Social Outcast
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Yeah one of falco's flaws its KO-ing. Usmash, fsmash, bair and dair off-stage are your best killing tools.

Just make sure you keep usmash and fmash fresh and only use them for killing, since bair and dair are important to use throughout the match.
 

zamz

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 30, 2008
Messages
291
Get used to building damage quickly with Falco. You'll do a lot better when you stop the mindset of: "Okay, they're now above 100%. I HAVE to get the stock." Just keep playing as you normally do, and keep building damage. Eventually they'll get to the point where pretty much anything you hit them with will kill them.

Learn your weakness. If you struggle to stock an opponent, then don't focus around something you can't do. If you focus the game around the one thing you can't accomplish, then you won't do so well. The best Falco's rarely go into "Need to get KO now" mode. They just keep spammin' lasers and camping regardless of their opponent's damage. They punish mistakes and wait for opportunities to throw an U-Smash or a B-Air. They rarely force a stock, but instead let their opponent fall into a stockable situation.

The main thing to understand is you WON'T consistently kill at insanely low percents. That's something Ike relies on to compete. Falco requires a completely different playstyle. He relies on quick, weak attacks to build damage quickly. In a match against Snake, you'll likely combo your way to 150% damage by the time Snake gets you to 80% damage.

Combo, string lasers, phantasm and always punish ending lag. If they get above 150%...then they get above 150%. They're THAT much easier to stock. It's not a bad thing that Falco lacks early kill moves as long as you can KO your opponent before he can KO you. That's the name of the game: getting the first three stocks and winning.

Over time, you'll find "getting the KO" becomes easier. Opponents make mistakes, and your U-Smash kills relatively early (around 120% depending on the weight). You have a spike, and other tools at your disposal.

EDIT: Basically, Falco doesn't have any reliable way to stock an opponent in the range you're looking for. But don't consider that a weakness. You're trying to use Ike's strategy of "hit hard and kill quickly before you lose" on a character who is quite the opposite.
 

Rubyiris

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
6,033
Location
Tucson, AZ.
Get used to building damage quickly with Falco. You'll do a lot better when you stop the mindset of: "Okay, they're now above 100%. I HAVE to get the stock." Just keep playing as you normally do, and keep building damage. Eventually they'll get to the point where pretty much anything you hit them with will kill them.

Learn your weakness. If you struggle to stock an opponent, then don't focus around something you can't do. If you focus the game around the one thing you can't accomplish, then you won't do so well. The best Falco's rarely go into "Need to get KO now" mode. They just keep spammin' lasers and camping regardless of their opponent's damage. They punish mistakes and wait for opportunities to throw an U-Smash or a B-Air. They rarely force a stock, but instead let their opponent fall into a stockable situation.

The main thing to understand is you WON'T consistently kill at insanely low percents. That's something Ike relies on to compete. Falco requires a completely different playstyle. He relies on quick, weak attacks to build damage quickly. In a match against Snake, you'll likely combo your way to 150% damage by the time Snake gets you to 80% damage.

Combo, string lasers, phantasm and always punish ending lag. If they get above 150%...then they get above 150%. They're THAT much easier to stock. It's not a bad thing that Falco lacks early kill moves as long as you can KO your opponent before he can KO you. That's the name of the game: getting the first three stocks and winning.

Over time, you'll find "getting the KO" becomes easier. Opponents make mistakes, and your U-Smash kills relatively early (around 120% depending on the weight). You have a spike, and other tools at your disposal.

EDIT: Basically, Falco doesn't have any reliable way to stock an opponent in the range you're looking for. But don't consider that a weakness. You're trying to use Ike's strategy of "hit hard and kill quickly before you lose" on a character who is quite the opposite.
Wow. You basically summed up exactly what I do while playing with Falco, and listed why I developed this bad habit. With this epiphany, I think I'll be able to improve, albeit slowly.

Ty. <3
 

King Funk

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Copenhagen, Denmark
The only situation where you can kill at low percentages is by spiking your opponents. So I recommend you to try and dair-gimp your opponent whenever he is off stage. If you succeed, you can gain considerable stock advantage. But first think of who you are trying to spike. For example, it'll be pretty safe to dair a Donkey Kong or a Pit, but very dangerous against a Marth (up-B ****) and Meta Knight. And also don't suicide: you'll lose a valuable stock and look like a total idiot, thus destroying the utter coolness of the character that is Falco.
 

Rubyiris

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Apr 19, 2007
Messages
6,033
Location
Tucson, AZ.
The only situation where you can kill at low percentages is by spiking your opponents. So I recommend you to try and dair-gimp your opponent whenever he is off stage. If you succeed, you can gain considerable stock advantage. But first think of who you are trying to spike. For example, it'll be pretty safe to dair a Donkey Kong or a Pit, but very dangerous against a Marth (up-B ****) and Meta Knight. And also don't suicide: you'll lose a valuable stock and look like a total idiot, thus destroying the utter coolness of the character that is Falco.
Spiking is usually done around 30~60%. This is what I was referring to regarding KOing early, but having troubles with KOing at mid %
 

~PsykoTek~

Smash Cadet
Joined
Dec 27, 2008
Messages
64
Location
Calumet City, IL
Yeah one of falco's flaws its KO-ing. Usmash, fsmash, bair and dair off-stage are your best killing tools.

Just make sure you keep usmash and fmash fresh and only use them for killing, since bair and dair are important to use throughout the match.
lol Falco is one of the heaviest hitters in the game, distance wise, but yeah I suppose he is lacking in the kill move section, I just stick to spiking and F-Smashing, his up smash is equally as good but only at close range or if you DAC, ShortHop BAIR also works, RAR into on and it'll do the same job as an F-Smash
 

Vlade

Social Outcast
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May 30, 2008
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Perth, Western Australia
lol Falco is one of the heaviest hitters in the game, distance wise, but yeah I suppose he is lacking in the kill move section, I just stick to spiking and F-Smashing, his up smash is equally as good but only at close range or if you DAC, ShortHop BAIR also works, RAR into on and it'll do the same job as an F-Smash
You couldn't be more wrong.
 

8AngeL8

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
1,298
Location
Dallas, TX
Completely ignore what PsykoTek said.

Zamz summed up exactly what I came in here to say. Basically, not being able to kill easily is part of playing Falco. Just keep your game going and wait for a mistake.
 

R_Williams

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 30, 2008
Messages
5
Get used to building damage quickly with Falco. You'll do a lot better when you stop the mindset of: "Okay, they're now above 100%. I HAVE to get the stock." Just keep playing as you normally do, and keep building damage. Eventually they'll get to the point where pretty much anything you hit them with will kill them.

Learn your weakness. If you struggle to stock an opponent, then don't focus around something you can't do. If you focus the game around the one thing you can't accomplish, then you won't do so well. The best Falco's rarely go into "Need to get KO now" mode. They just keep spammin' lasers and camping regardless of their opponent's damage. They punish mistakes and wait for opportunities to throw an U-Smash or a B-Air. They rarely force a stock, but instead let their opponent fall into a stockable situation.

The main thing to understand is you WON'T consistently kill at insanely low percents. That's something Ike relies on to compete. Falco requires a completely different playstyle. He relies on quick, weak attacks to build damage quickly. In a match against Snake, you'll likely combo your way to 150% damage by the time Snake gets you to 80% damage.

Combo, string lasers, phantasm and always punish ending lag. If they get above 150%...then they get above 150%. They're THAT much easier to stock. It's not a bad thing that Falco lacks early kill moves as long as you can KO your opponent before he can KO you. That's the name of the game: getting the first three stocks and winning.

Over time, you'll find "getting the KO" becomes easier. Opponents make mistakes, and your U-Smash kills relatively early (around 120% depending on the weight). You have a spike, and other tools at your disposal.

EDIT: Basically, Falco doesn't have any reliable way to stock an opponent in the range you're looking for. But don't consider that a weakness. You're trying to use Ike's strategy of "hit hard and kill quickly before you lose" on a character who is quite the opposite.
Excellent post.
 

YUNq PHR3$H

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
334
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i juss had diss problem 2day wen tryna kill diss rob && ike [ friendlies ]. What i did was basically use falco's jab ONCE, them u-smash. it worked for me a couple of times

 

Teran

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Am I the only one who uses Bair offstage way more than Dair? It's not half bad ya know...
 

Beetle Juice

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New York City
lasers and shine can set up kills for falco. Getting a random smash works too, but its really situational and provides either a mistake or some mindgames. lasers can set set them up for a up-smash if they are in the air trying to reach the ground. Now as for the shine we all know about its tripping properties but I want to throw out a little extra things I have (and so have most of you) would know. When your opponent gets constantly hit with the shine the seem to expect another one right away so they ROLL towards you, so after the shine throwing in a front smash will get them.

Well... it can also depends on your playstyle. When I play with falco I tend to "build a wall" between me and my opponent and just when the think their in, they end up losing a stock because after a while they seem to get desperate after getting constantly grabbed, shot, shined, phantasm. I'm not saying to camp because i don't camp at all unless the are the ones constantly approaching, but keeping yourself distant enough can make them run into one of your ko moves. Also front smash from up close can still work but it depends on which character you are facing.

For example: lets say you are facing a mk, both of you are at a 100% dmg in fd, and he is approaching you (obviously) from the ground and he will either spot dodge right next to you and down smash or he will dash attack or just fair you, while you just laser him then shine him depending how far he is when you land back on the ground. mk knows better to approach you right away in the air because the sets him up for a shdl up smash. The opponent will most likely be scared and approach you with a spot dodge down smash. When a mk appoaches you by running towards you just do a front smash, but hold it a second longer, because being a falco player you have to always expect a spot dodge or shield if you want to prevent from being punished. Up close meta vs falco at high %'s its a spot dodge battle up close, just wait for metaknight to downsmash and front smash (charge it for a second ofcourse) and wait for the spotdodge. Don't make this too predictable by doing it over and over because top notch players will adapt to your kill methods.
 

Teran

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its not bad at all. Its juss the simple question; How could you connect with such a move. It leaves you vunarable inah way = /
I could swear Bair is a jillion times safer than Dair.
 

Beetle Juice

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Joined
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Messages
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New York City
yes back air is safer it has ko pontential and has a better chance of ko'ing than dair when you are struggling to get a spike.
 

zamz

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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Messages
291
I could swear Bair is a jillion times safer than Dair.
You are correct. Competitive Falcos rarely use D-Air off the stage unless they know they'll hit with it. It's predictable, and you shouldn't jump off the stage just to D-Air. Instead, you'll likely be more successful if you wait near the edge of the stage and punish your opponent's recovery.

As a general rule: You'll won't spike an opponent better than you. D-Air is situational, and even if you nail it, an experienced opponent will still survive (depending on the character). B-Air, on the other hand, not only kills at a reasonable percent, but it's spammable, great for spacing and relatively quick. It pings with other vertical aerial attacks unlike D-Air, making it the safer alternative.
 

Light_13

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E-town KY
While on the subject of B-air, How often do you guys usually land a killing B-air, mine usually comes when the opponent is being really dumb and lets go of their shield while I RAR into a short-hopped FALLING b-air(maybe its mindgames IDK I dont see how that would be possible)


OR



I let them approach me with an arial that B-air overprioritizes then RAR and hope I read the priority right.
(I look at characters priority while they're striking the stages, And if I need more time I'll simply act like im changeing my color but observing priority does not take that long) Exe. this wouldnt work on a marth approaching with an F-air obviously, But it would work on a Sonics approaching with an F-air/as rare as that is >.>



Then

theres the simple fastfall D-air/Dbl Jump/B-air which we all know doesnt work(but unfortunate for them they dontXD)

As you can see all these are by chance and I would like different ways to B-air, Rather itd be punishing or whatever.
 

Teran

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I usually kill offstage with Bair, kills nice and early.
 
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