Pit - Arrow Follow Ups

[link2702]

As for this thing, don't even focus on the stuff.

grabbed dis little quote from him on aib, if admiral, the guy who spent and wasted more time then anyone else on it has even admitted that arrow looping is a useless/ridiculously situational technique, don't you think that should be a hint? I"m not trying to be mean, i'm just trying to be honest, hell next to admiral i was considered by most who faced both of us to be the 2nd best pit in terms of arrow looping/control, only being beaten out by admiral in it, so we BOTH have alot of experiance using it....and even though admiral still continued to force himself into believing it was useful long after i had finally admitted it wasn't, even HE himself finally agreed, after listening to rogue pit, nike, or sage(can't remember which, maybe all three, regardless, those were the only 3 pit mains who could truely be considered the best ones/ones who pushed him to his limit, sadly rogue has "apparently" retired, and sage did a long time ago before that, now seeming to basicly just troll, or spam alot on aib, and not realy discuss the game anymore, as for nike....he just kinda vanished.....still plays the game, just doesn't post here or on aib anymore....) so honestly, if the two pit mains who spent more time then anyone else trying to "perfect" this "technique" and have had more experiance with it and done alot of the same things you yourself are learning about/doing now in the vid, are even saying its pretty much so ridiculoulsy situational that its not really worth learning, DON'T you think that should be a big enough hint?

I know its obviously something you(and probably alot of others here) don't really want to here, but its the truth, its coming from 2 guys who have wasted ALOT more of their time with pit trying to "perfect" the trick then you have(no offense...) all i'm saying is that we honestly know what we're talking about, we both learned the hard way, that as you get higher up in the game, and start facing tougher oppenents who seriously know what they're doing, you learn that every time, you attempt to use a looped arrow, the oppenent can and WILL take advantage of you cuz of the "pattern" it forces you into, and like admiral said on aib, NO ONE has perfect aim with this trick, its one thing to hit a cpu training dummy that is standing still, its another altogether to try to hit a real player who is going to be predicting it and dodging it, and/or taking advantage of the pattern you put youself into when you were using the arrow loop, plus, like i've said before a loooooooooong time ago, in just about every situation that a looped arrow "might" be effective, a normal arrow WOULD be effective.

Even though i myself don't really take brawl seriously anymore competitivly, i WOULD still like to see the game itself, as well as the character pit, advance farther, rather then both just die off, but unless the other pits seriously start learning what works, and stop with the arrow gimmicks, pit isn't going anywhere.


*inb4themajorflamewar

 

[CYVE]

I suppose you haven´t played Yass yet.
And trust me, I´ve obviously spent more time than you and Admiral Pit on Arrow Loops and I know that Arrow Loops aren´t always usefull.
I myself believe that basics are more important than loops but they aren´t completely futile.

And my vid should mostly entertain and show some POSSIBLE combinations with arrows though most of them aren´t actually feasible in real matches. (Did I say it would be the best using them?)


btw. who the **** are you , never heard of you




kk thx bye

 

[link2702]

i myself started working on arrow looping 1-2 months after brawl was released, as far as i knwo, admiral was probably doing it since the very begining


*shrugs* learn the hard way then, but again, i left ya witht hat one very very improtant message that i really think ya should probably think about.

admiral, the guy who was flat out obsessed with arrow looping more then ANYONE else, and practiced it constantly, even hsa flat out said its useless/too situational to even be remotly useful


only reason i'm actually trying to telll ya this, is cuz chances are you're gonna go down the exact same path that both me and admiral went

waste time trying to "perfect' a useless technique for several monthes...

scratch your head wondering why you just can't seem to improve whatsoever, after a certain point, then finally realise that it was because of all that time you spent wasting on learning a pointless gimmicky move.

drop the gimmick, and watch as you suddenly start to improve finally after the brick wall you hit, all because of a pointless arrow trick.

can i convince you? nope, i can already tell, have i tried explaining it to you, and warned you? yup.

just remember this, even the top pit main, who pushed the character farther then anyone else(rogue pit) has stated that its nothing more then a useless gimmick, he even went and made a huge long blog on aib, about him finally realizing the truth about pit, that pit at the highest level of play, HAS to camp and spam the majority of the time, no fancy arrow tricks, just camp.

regardless, like i said, i know i can't convince ya, so...learn the hardway.


annnnnnd thats why i put the flameshield up.

 

[Katana_koden]

Why is admiral and you supposed to be like top at arrow looping. Retired people are old to me. Underdog discovered it and Yass competes with it.

The flame of arrow looping is old, we know.

 

[Nikenick]

I still play the game and I'm even going to Apex, I just have a busy life but today is my last day of school so I'll have some more spare time. I'll visit these boards a bit more I guess..

To stay on topic:
I think it's amazing to see what Cyve did. These techniques could be helpfull but ONLY if you're really good in arrow looping and if you don't abuse it. You don't want to mess up every time or be too predictable using it. It could be used like Diddy's nanerz, if they get hit you'll be able to follow up and if they shield you'll be able to grab. But, and I say but, I think this is very situational to be actually usefull in tournaments. I myself still don't like arrow looping but I think every Pit should experiment with different styles and techniques. It's just that IF you get ***** because of the technique, then you SHOULD stop using it. Don't be too stubborn to believe that it'll actually work next time, people will adapt to such techniques, but it might work for the first few times because it'll be a big suprise.

TL:DR Might work, but if it doesn't then don't use it.

 

[CYVE]

@ link: Why do you act like you were someone more experienced like me for example?
And I myself started looping since Brawl was released in Europe, so yeah.
It might be that you had some months more than me/other Europeans but this doesn´t mean that you´re better in doing sth.
Do you really think that we ´Arrow Loopers´ gonna stay at one side of a stage and loop senseless arrows in high level play?
We´ll rarely use it, just in moments where they could be best/ to surprise the opponent. (As Nike already mentioned)

Oh,and I totally agree with Katana and Nike

 

[Damien = God]

Wow. That original video was incredible. I know something I need to work on. Hell, I can do it right now. Practice, that is.

 

[C.S. Dinah]

lol @ arrow loop ledge camping. That was pretty beast!

edit: Pit boards...... You'll find a way v__v

 

[dualseeker]

What I don't understand is why the higher level players want to keep discouraging us from using our own way of playing Pit. Just because you stopped using it and got better doesn't mean the rest of us have to stop using it as well.

You all tell us that it isn't worth it and too situational to be utilized. We say that we don't use it everytime, and only when we need it, and at the time we deem that it will surprise the opponent the most.

I just don't understand why you want to discourage us from trying to master Arrow Looping. Maybe, just maybe, we'll find a better way to use Arrow Looping and maybe even better Pit's gameplay. I think the main reason there's such a low fanbase for Arrow Looping is because the top players keep discouraging us from using it, like link has in the last page.

What you guys are doing, in my opinion, is preventing Pit from improving. If you keep trying to limit us like this, Pit isn't going to go anywhere. Countless times, change has brought good and bad things, and change doesn't always have to be bad.

And, no offense, but the best won't always be the best. You even said that we MIGHT go down the same path as you and Admiral Pit, but that doesn't meen we have to stop using it. Anyone who uses Arrow Looping knows that they are potentially leaving themselves wide open for attack, that's why we aren't trying to spam the move and be as unpredictable as we can with it.

I could go on all day on this argument, but I'm gonna stop now. The only thing I can't understand, is why the top players are trying to discourage us from using it. I would love for link or one of the top players to answer this question. Because everytime I see an argument like this, it just seems so... Unnecessary. If you really wanted us to better ourselves with Pit, you would at least try to encourage us with our attempts at bettering him, and not try to discourage us from finding new ways to better him. I think this is one of the main reasons people are afraid to post there findings here, because of the discouragement they might get from top players. If we don't welcome innovation and new ideas in gameplay, then how do people expect us to improve?

And I also agree with everything CYVE, Katana_koden, and Nikenick has said.

 

[Katana_koden]

I think since japan's top pit doesn't arrow loop (much) because he does, that's 1.
Too much concentration + control and or precision. thats 2.
In the past, they failed trying to become too epic with it? That's what I'm getting when they say they had really great control.
Back to the basic, Basics, Basics... Yeah we know

Here is a bit of the basics I learned from arrow looping. Did you know?

1. You don't have to control the arrow 360 degrees with the analog.
- a. only needs like 3 to 4 basic directions at different points.
- a1. can hold NW (up and behind) at the start, the arrow will curve straight up slightly. There is a ring animation that after you shoot your arrow, you hold SW ( down and back) the arrow will be curving around but at this time, you can jab without tilting, jump, etc. SE( down and forward) to finish the loop, here you can also dash forward and do what ever.


2. Arrow rain as of now suck competitively. And most people put down fancy combos the you can pull off in friendlies. Having the time to control 3 to 4 arrows while keeping the pressure is very unlikely. Then to be able to aim from the sky? Therefore as of now it sucks. So I'm sticking to the basic arrow loop.

I think if you learn this style of arrow looping, you become more technical in control
and movement. But at first it definitely feels like a new AT. So train.

If you are good, you know that your WoI cancels knockback momentum of the opponent leaving extra/closer hit stun. Reverse nairs, arrows, lol snake recovery. Great for team defense partner catching. You do the math.


CYVE, if you are interested, maybe you can combine something to show. My video suck cause you can barely see as good, and my video editing.. i haven't tried it.

 

[Nitrix]

People shouldn't tell people NOT to advance their metagame by pushing AT's. Who cares if they are not very applicable, at least you are advancing your character. Plus eventually something is going to be useful.

Nice video

 

[Krystedez]

I really like this!

Also I arrow loop a ton, I love using it to finish a combo or a finisher move. Fsmash, with an arrow coming right after their flying body is so awesome. Plus it makes for some insane mind games.

If you master this, it can put on a ton of pressure. Just know when to use it and when not to. If you use too much and get predictable, you'll leave yourself open. That's about the only downside of it, aside from being a rookie and not being able to do other things while loops (it suits me well because I turn around anyways to bair or something to that effect)