Q&A Pikachu Q&A Thread (Ask a Quick Question, Get a Quick Answer)

[Angiance]

So, essentially, you're paraphrasing what I've already said about using Quick Attack for defense and mobility-good for you

A general offense is D.Tilt/U.Tilt-y'know, something you can throw out consistently to guard yourself. Quick Attack is for defense and positioning. If you see something you can counter with Quick Attack, such as Bowser's flame breath, then it is what I consider to be defensive because you are *countering something* not throwing it out frequently as you would with D.Tilt/U.Tilt

 

[Lomogoto]

Has it been confirmed that rar thunder can cover up throw DI? Or is it too slow?

 

[Uncle Honey]

Has it been confirmed that rar thunder can cover up throw DI? Or is it too slow?

Hasn't been confirmed. I've personally tested it extensively, but it doesn't seem to work on most of the cast. The determining factor seems to be weight class and hurtbox size.

 

[Angiance]

Let's talk about how amazing D.Throw > Thunder is by the ledge

 

[Noro~]

It's quite amazing since most people auto-DI towards the stage when they are near the ledge at higher percent. However, I'm not sure if this will work more than once against an opponent, if at all. Reason being that nothing we can do in that specific situation (grab near the ledge facing the blastzone) encourages the opponent to DI in (if they have a decent recovery). Fthrow doesn't kill, even when DIing out. Also, DIing out means no Upthrow Thunder depending on how near to the ledge you are.
Though thinking about it, can we cloudspike the opponent into the lower blastzone if they DI out on the Upthrow near the ledge?

 

[Armistice]

Though thinking about it, can we cloudspike the opponent into the lower blastzone if they DI out on the Upthrow near the ledge?

I get this kill waaaaaaaaaay more than I would expect

I don't know why people DI out when I upthrow near the ledge but when they do its instant death

 

[Lomogoto]

Hasn't been confirmed. I've personally tested it extensively, but it doesn't seem to work on most of the cast. The determining factor seems to be weight class and hurtbox size.

Ok well follow up question then:
Ive tested this with my friend playing captain falcon and backfliping instead of RARing hits before he can air dodge. Ive posted this idea a few times but am wondering where is the best place to spread this information? Backfliping stops your momentum and seems faster than RARing. It also often looks like a B-reverse but the backflip jump is the important part.

 

[Uncle Honey]

Ok well follow up question then:
Ive tested this with my friend playing captain falcon and backfliping instead of RARing hits before he can air dodge. Ive posted this idea a few times but am wondering where is the best place to spread this information? Backfliping stops your momentum and seems faster than RARing. It also often looks like a B-reverse but the backflip jump is the important part.

I'm not sure what the inputs your referring to are, but the best way is to make a video of it and spread it around. But before you do, try it with a mid and light weight character, a nonfast-faller, and a character with a 2-frame airdodge. Testing combos on heavies/fast fallers are good for proof of concept, but things don't get real until we can nail it on the majority of the cast. If you reply with inputs, i can try it myself.

 

[Armistice]

Ok well follow up question then:
Ive tested this with my friend playing captain falcon and backfliping instead of RARing hits before he can air dodge. Ive posted this idea a few times but am wondering where is the best place to spread this information? Backfliping stops your momentum and seems faster than RARing. It also often looks like a B-reverse but the backflip jump is the important part.

So you mean just like, if they DI in front of you, turn around and then just jump (backflips) towards them? That cancels momentum?

 

[Pikabunz]

I think he means running then jumping back and thunder, but that doesn't sound faster at all.

 

[Coro_]

Hey guys, I'd really appreciate it if some people could help me out with this~
I played a bunch of matches against one of my local Shulks, won some, lost more. I think partly it's the matchup, but partly also I think my fundamentals are lacking in some areas.
If at all possible, could someone help me take a look at what I should be improving?

 

[Uncle Honey]

Why do people keep saying fsmash is safe?

 

[iVoltage]

Why do people keep saying fsmash is safe?

They mean safe on shield due to the new engine changes. There are threads about it to which I can't link you to because my phone is dumb

 

[Uncle Honey]

They mean safe on shield due to the new engine changes. There are threads about it to which I can't link you to because my phone is dumb

I ask this because I spaced a fsmash on a fox's shield and ate an usmash. Maybe on characters with slower punishes? Or perhaps I didn't space as well as I thought.

 

[Noro~]

Hey guys, I'd really appreciate it if some people could help me out with this~
I played a bunch of matches against one of my local Shulks, won some, lost more. I think partly it's the matchup, but partly also I think my fundamentals are lacking in some areas.
If at all possible, could someone help me take a look at what I should be improving?

I watched a few of your battles and here are some observations I made:
Your approach game is kinda... lacking.
On the ground you primarily use your Dashgrab. Often following a Jolt. This isn't bad, but mixing up what you do after a Jolt is important.
In the air, you seem to use ff Fair way too much. It can lead to follow ups in mid percent but it is way too risky, especially when you become predictable with it. Instead, try to shorthop autocancel Fair. If you hit their shield, retreat right after the last hit of Fair. This way it is safe on shield (except maybe against Shulks speed Monado?). If Fair hits them you can push forward, leading to followups and an advantageous situation for you.

Also, you use Smashes in low percent, which isn't something you should do.

I don't want to make this post all too long. If you want more infos on specific situations, you can PM me.

 

[Coro_]

Alright, hit the lab and practice sh ac fair; practice more stuff so I don't go for dashgrab on reflex, got it~
Thanks for the advice~

Also yeah pretty much everything is unsafe against Speed Shulk, not even fh jolt on the other side of the stage (that's why I never used jolt when he's onstage in Speed mode)

 

[Uncle Honey]

Let's talk about how amazing D.Throw > Thunder is by the ledge

Ty for mentioning this. I had a weekly today and tried this out and it landed more than I expected it to.

 

[Angiance]

In fact, I've thought of a decent way to gimp opponents

First you F.Throw them offstage, then you try and F.Air them; if the F.Air connects, you fastfall after the final hit knocks them away and aim for Thunder, because F.Air actually sets up pretty nicely for Thunder in that instance :3

 

[Gibbs]

I ask this because I spaced a fsmash on a fox's shield and ate an usmash. Maybe on characters with slower punishes? Or perhaps I didn't space as well as I thought.

The sweet spot on fsmash is actually the middle hitbox. This hit ends at frame 20 so with a FAF of 49, that's ~30 frames of end lag.

At 18 base damage the sweet spot should have about 12 frames of shield stun, at max charge it has 16 frames of shield stun. adding the 7 frames to drop shield, plus 2-7 to dash (based on spacing), 1 to JC, and 8 for the up smash to come out, fox should be able to get out the first hit of upsmash somewhere between 30-39 frames after you sweet spot f-smash. The max space sour spot will be -2 of hit stun, but maybe those frames are recovered in dash time? not sure about that.

So shield should always beat usmash punishes and unless you're opponent is frame perfect (actually not that hard with buffering) it should be safe. Fox has moderately high traction and outrageous ground mobility, the fact that this move isn't perfectly safe on block against him isn't much of a surprise.

 

[phili]

Hey guys, 2 questions here.

1) Is the pseudo chain grab that Pikachu can do on sheik (and possibly other characters) escapable by air dodge or a fast attack? If you don't know what I'm talking about, it's (at low percents) dthrow > uair > FF fair > regrab. You can regrab sheik 3 times with this from 0 at training mode and it does about 60% damage. It looks pretty legit, but of course the AI in training mode doesn't DI or mash air dodge during combos.

2) This one kinda ties in with the first question, but how do you guys test if a combo works when you don't have someone else available to help you test out each DI and other ways to escape the combo? I find it nearly impossible to do while trying to operate 2 controllers at once, and as I said earlier, AI's don't DI in this game.

 

[Angiance]

phili
I highly doubt that combo is guaranteed-and really, this game doesn't really have many standard comboes; this game's form of comboes is mainly frame traps/advantages or extensions/resets

 

[Ritronaut]

1) Is the pseudo chain grab that Pikachu can do on sheik (and possibly other characters) escapable by air dodge or a fast attack? If you don't know what I'm talking about, it's (at low percents) dthrow > uair > FF fair > regrab. You can regrab sheik 3 times with this from 0 at training mode and it does about 60% damage. It looks pretty legit, but of course the AI in training mode doesn't DI or mash air dodge during combos.

You could probably do one, two if your opponent is stupid, DI can escape it, it's not true, but sometimes it works at least once.

2) This one kinda ties in with the first question, but how do you guys test if a combo works when you don't have someone else available to help you test out each DI and other ways to escape the combo?

You don't

 

[phili]

Thanks for the fast replies. I only ask because I've seen esam get two regrabs once on phuzix (i think). But thanks for the advice guys

 

[Lomogoto]

I think he means running then jumping back and thunder, but that doesn't sound faster at all.

If you jump backward out of a dash you will go straight up, as opposed to at a diagonal from a normal jump. Then buffer a down B. You get the rising thunder that connects with you and kills.

 

[Gibbs]

Hey guys, 2 questions here.

1) Is the pseudo chain grab that Pikachu can do on sheik (and possibly other characters) escapable by air dodge or a fast attack? If you don't know what I'm talking about, it's (at low percents) dthrow > uair > FF fair > regrab. You can regrab sheik 3 times with this from 0 at training mode and it does about 60% damage. It looks pretty legit, but of course the AI in training mode doesn't DI or mash air dodge during combos.

Down throw and up throw both link into rising full jump uair. Only mashing air dodge and DI in beats the link from rising upair to fair. If they di in we land 2 more uairs, no di and di away allows for fair to set up for regrab if they don't airdodge, if they do air dodge you should get another free upair or nair after fair (provided you don't fastfall too early).

All in all even if it isn't "true" this combo/string has very tight timings and pika takes little to no risk trying to land it, since I'm almost 100% sure frame 3 nairs can't beat it. There's a reason ESAM landed this on Zero multiple times.

 

[Angiance]

I disagree with that-the best follow-up after U.Air is N.Air in all honesty

 

[Gibbs]

I disagree with that-the best follow-up after U.Air is N.Air in all honesty

This is an extremely % specific combo that only works on fast fallers. Sure the nair is usually %100 sure, but this low commitment regrab set up can take an opponent from %16~%50 off of one grab. Risk reward is way way in this combos favor. Watch ESAM's games with Zero on FD, or the ESAM v Phuzix match on ESAM's youtube channel. This combo is pretty optimal on sheik.

 

[Angiance]

Well, if you perform the combo the way I stated the opponent is actually left airborn after the N.Air, which puts you in a very strong position to catch their landing or go for U.Air again-which, in my opinion, is far more damaging in the long run since N.Air deals it's full damage from a single hit...and as for fastfalling F.Air-I highly disagree with fastfalling in that circumstance; if the F.Air connects in that scenario, I higly recommend not fastfalling, rather fall normally allowing it to autocancel, this way you get the full damage and you also get a pretty good setup

 

[M15t3R E]

Following up after uair > nair is okay at just the right percent to not send the opponent too far, allowing for more aerials to connect. But uair > dragging FF fair is fruitful at a wider range of damage, allowing you to reset the string.

 

[Angiance]

I'd much rather be on the ground ready to catch their landing with D.Tilt or U.Tilt than risk FF F.Air not dragging them down...y'know, even if it connects it has a slight chance of being countered, right?

I don't want that in my fighting style-I want there to be no chance for my opponent to strike back, which is why I encourage N.Air at all times as a finish to U.Air

There is one exception however, and that is the U.Air x3 > Cloud at low percent

 

[Pikabunz]

Bair isn't a bad finisher either after a chain of uairs.

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

Pikabunz is Pika really THAT hard to edge guard? Sometimes people say its impossible, which can't be the case, but is it hard to attack him because of how unpredictable he can be?
Like what should I do to try and hit him if he were to for instead QA to the ledge, is his hurtbox big enough to possibly hit him before he snaps to the ledge?

 

[Pikabunz]

Yeah, it's the speed and unpredictability of it that makes it so hard to edge guard. Playing on a stages with platforms can make it even more difficult since it's giving him more spots to land his QA on and potentially cancel it. It's very possible to hit him before he grabs the ledge. I've been hit by things like Sonic's fsmash, Falcon's dtilt, and other moves that can reach below the ledge. If you think he's going to recover by QAing past you onto the stage, then I'd say the best option is to throw out an attack with a big or long lasting hitbox.

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

Thank you, now I see

 

[Soul.]

I mostly use NAir after UAir. I mean, is there ever a time where I'd want to use BAir instead?

 

[Angiance]

Soul.
You'd want to use B.Air in any instance where N.Air won't connect, since U.Air will sometimes knock them too far away...but, oh, I believe U.Air can combo into D.Air past a certain percent-but I still prefer N.Air in that case-F.Air if N.Air won't reach

D.Throw > Thunder seems to be better than U.Throw > Thunder, given that with D.Throw the opponent can't DI behind you like they can with U.Throw, meaning you have a much better idea of where they will go-which makes dashing in and doing a fh rar Thunder less of a guess and more of a direct followup...it's interesting because if the opponent tries to DI behind they, of course, go straight up hahahah

 

[Ritronaut]

D.Throw > Thunder seems to be better than U.Throw > Thunder, given that with D.Throw the opponent can't DI behind you like they can with U.Throw, meaning you have a much better idea of where they will go-which makes dashing in and doing a fh rar Thunder less of a guess and more of a direct followup...it's interesting because if the opponent tries to DI behind they, of course, go straight up hahahah

But If they DI forward it's pretty much a lost cause though. If it ends up that up throw thunder is guaranteed with whatever DI and one masters it, I think that up throw will be the better option.

 

[Underhill]

I don't know if this question can answer, but I'll go ahead and say it.

If any of you Pikachu players have good experience against Samus, not Zero suit Samus, then please let me know and I'll do my best to improve. I just faced a really good Samus player and had fun, but I had a lot of trouble against Samus. Approaching her was the biggest problem because I keep getting wall out by her aerials, charge shots, and missiles. I tried being aggressive against her and put out pressure, but it didn't work because I keep having a difficult time reading her aerials which is hard to punish. I got in a few times, but I end up getting baited a couple of times and get charge shot at. Jiggling her is difficult thanks to her down-b. Well, that's all I have so I hope that your advice helps so I can get better with the MU as Pikachu.

 

[Angiance]

I dunno, I still feel better about D.Throw because at the very least I know EXACTLY where they will go

Underhill
Samus is SUPER VULNERABILE to F.Air because of how she is a giant-but the projectiles shouldn't be an issue as long as you don't FEAR them-the very moment you start to fear them she has, essentially, won the match

 

[Pikabunz]

Uthrow is better because it's faster making it harder to react to with DI and it has less recovery which makes it less likely they'll dodge a guarantee thunder follow up.

And bair can be used the same way as nair as a follow up after uairs. They both have similar damage, knockback, and speed. There isn't much of a difference between them as a finsher except you can't use bair near the ground because you won't get all the hits. I guess if you don't want to stale one then use the other. But which move is better to keep fresh?