Philly Gamers present: SUMMER LEAGUE! First Events are July 6th and 20th!

[pauliedanger]

But you have been a douche, and you have not said anything new for three pages. Let's drop it.

You have made your point, and Steve and I have tried to make ours. Other players have SIX **** pages to decide. We also have six opportunities to get these rules right. I've explained to Steve on the phone. I'm very proprietary about PhillyGamers players. Ask some of our H3 or GH players. I'm always partying up with them online, and if there's anything we can do to help them at another tournament, we do it. So I want to see what happens to these rules with our players. So far everything you've said is theory to me. Until I see what happens at a PhillyGamers tournament it's all speculation. And it may take a tournament or two to dial in our rules. But we'll get there, and at that point we'll be the largest and best tournament promotion in the area.

 

[CT Chia]

can the smashboards community as a whole completely exile inui from everything smash? lolkthxbai

 

[Inui]

So far everything you've said is theory to me. Until I see what happens at a PhillyGamers tournament it's all speculation.

It's pretty darn factual to me since I've both seen and experienced how those stages can be game breaking. So has Steve, so I'm confused at why he has those stages on.

can the smashboards community as a whole completely exile inui from everything smash? lolkthxbai

Good luck with that, Freddy.

 

[Atomsk_92]

he he he G FRED

Ike is a pretty cool guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYdA7yFDmko

 

[dmbrandon]

Paulie, don't give him crap about controlling stages, with Halo as your argument.

MLG put ******** work into banning stages, and I'm pretty sure of the 20 that are playable, 5 are used, bad example.

And I wouldn't challenge inui, scout, I'm fairly sure he'll wreck you.

I've asked inui to calm down, and he did. Paul, you're doing the attacking now. This is a forum, and everyone has the right to post. But, as the Director, you should be taking feedback, instead of calling people *****es.

He's made points, and you're obviously only ignoring him because you don't like his attitude. That's super mature.

I NEVER have someone question my ruleset in NJ/PA, because I run fair things. On the off chance they don't understand, I explain things to them. All you've said is: Well, I think this is right.

We get it, you're a tough guy. It's awesome. I'm impressed. You can talk trash on the internet, and that's a rarity. Seriously, that's not the way a major tournament director should act. You're trying to be serious, I'd really tone it down.

As for Steve's opinions, no offense LK, but he doesn't know the game as well as I do. In fact, not many people do. We've explained why they're gamebreaking, and hopefully, if you leave them on, I can use this garbage to **** my unknowing opponents so bad, they'll not wanna go to the next event.

You're a salesman, trying to sell me your tournament. The only thing your selling to me, is a bad reputation.

 

[teh_spamerer]

I NEVER have someone question my ruleset in NJ/PA, because I run fair things. On the off chance they don't understand, I explain things to them.

I have questioned your ruleset over 9000 times and you have never ever ever directly responded to my points.

We've explained why they're gamebreaking, and hopefully, if you leave them on, I can use this garbage to **** my unknowing opponents so bad, they'll not wanna go to the next event.

I'll MM your Dedede on all of those stages.

 

[Inui]

I'm pretty sure only Steve agrees with your opinions on the stages, Kashif.

As for your second statement, we get it; you main a ton of top tier featherweights. Forcing everyone else to choose from like 4 characters that are good enough to beat Dedede at those stages is not cool.

 

[teh_spamerer]

As for your second statement, we get it; you main a ton of top tier featherweights. Forcing everyone else to choose from like 4 characters that are good enough to beat Dedede at those stages is not cool.

MM me on any of those stages with Dedede please.

Cannot be Chain grabbed:
Fox
Jiggly Puff
Pikachu
Olimar
Zelda
Mr. Game & Watch
Sheik
Kirby
Squirtle
Meta Knight
Falco
Luigi
ZSS

ROB, Snake, and Diddy can all put things on the stage so they can't be chaingrabbed across
Peach can float forever
Charizard and Ivysaur can camp the checkpoint on GHZ or a platform and switch to Squirtle
Samus can do the taunt input to switch to Zero Suit Samus
Link and Toon Link can always hold a bomb in their hand to stop him from chaingrabbing across the whole stage
The second Icy will hit Dedede if he tries to chaingrab

 

[Inui]

I would only consider Fox, Falco, Game and Watch, Squirtle, ZSS, and Meta Knight good enough to win against Dedede on those types of stages without you having to be the much better player. Squirtle has to be attached to trash, though.

Jigglypuff loses her biggest strength vs Dedede, too; the edgeguarding and punishing recoveries. The other characters I just don't think are good enough to handle Dedede properly on those stages. I know you like Zelda on them, but I don't.

 

[teh_spamerer]

Pikachu can outcamp Dedede.
Olimar doesn't have to worry about being gimped.
Sheik can space her fair and bair so that Dedede can't shieldgrab her. She can also switch to Zelda.

Jigglypuff can't edgeguard Dedede that well anyways. He has super armor on the way up on his up b and he'll cancel it into a ledgegrab. All you can do is pray the Dedede is stupid and lands on the stage with an up B so you can get a rest. Luigi now can no longer get gimped off the stage against Dedede. Kirby doesn't beat him anyways so it's not like the gay stages change that.

ROB, Snake, and Diddy all do fine if they get lay stuff on the stage. Dedede's dash attack takes awhile to come out so he can't spam dash attack through them to get them. Toon Link probably does alright if he camps like a complete ***got.

Zelda can run out of waddle dee range and camp Din's Fire.

 

[dmbrandon]

Pika can't camp D3. Power shield to grab. M2k did it to Eggm constantly.

 

[Atomsk_92]

I'm pretty sure only Steve agrees with your opinions on the stages, Kashif.

lol i do too so there

 

[Mew2King]

as much as those stages that are allowed on are good dedede and MK stages, and going against it will be bad for me, I must agree with inui that they are G A Y stages for the most part.

they promote just camping and DDD infiniting the entire game, there is minimal skill comparatively to neutral stages.

 

[dmbrandon]

Corneria is fine.

Onett is ridiculous. It breeds more camping that almost any other stage. A snake on the far left with a c4 on the tree, a mine on the house, and grenade spam. OMG, plz. You could never win. Unless you're d3 and you CG to utilt.

Rob can only have the gyro out if you don't shield it. Then he loses half his projectile game. No glide toss means no approach. Bad news.

 

[CT Chia]

****, m2k's 2000th post was AGREEING with inui lol

 

[dmbrandon]

Hahahahhahaha I Warned You M2k!! Hahahhahaa

 

[Inui]

as much as those stages that are allowed on are good dedede and MK stages, and going against it will be bad for me, I must agree with inui that they are G A Y stages for the most part.

they promote just camping and DDD infiniting the entire game, there is minimal skill comparatively to neutral stages.

There you have it, Steve. Last time I checked, Jason was better than us.

 

[Mew2King]

I'm sorry dm but, corneria is rather gay


this is coming from someone who plays DDD and MK, two characters that are dominant on that stage

playing those characters, or fox, is NOT balanced on corneria

inui plays 2 chars that can be chain grabbed, if he has to fight on a walk off stage or especially a wall stage where the stage does not change then he is going to lose and be way more disadvantaged than he should be. I understand counterpicks are one thing but when it's this extreme I would just ban it if I was the tourney host.

Having corneria for teams is fine because there's almost no time to do that camping stuff or wall infinites stuff. Teams should have a lot more stages available, however for singles, no way should gay stages be allowed. All those stages inui named I would also agree should be banned, but no more than that. The other stages change like delphino and fire emblem and stuff, and if you just stay away for a little bit you will be fine from the gayness just don't be an idiot it's really easy to get around, I prefer metaknight to DDD there usually anyway.

 

[Atomsk_92]

you realise he said the stage list was final at least until the 1st event is over

 

[teh_spamerer]

Onett is ridiculous. It breeds more camping that almost any other stage. A snake on the far left with a c4 on the tree, a mine on the house, and grenade spam. OMG, plz. You could never win. Unless you're d3 and you CG to utilt.

Toon Link and Peach can throw projectiles over the house. Zelda can Din's fire and angle it to under the house.

Rob can only have the gyro out if you don't shield it. Then he loses half his projectile game. No glide toss means no approach. Bad news.

You don't have to throw the gyro at your opponent and this is Brawl, why would you approach?

Pika can't camp D3. Power shield to grab. M2k did it to Eggm constantly.

Pikachu jumps away and sends the thunder jolt at you. How does Dedede grab Pika in the air, even if he does powershield the thunder jolt?

 

[Inui]

You don't have to throw the gyro at your opponent and this is Brawl, why would you approach?

You have to kill your opponent three times to win, remember? When you're losing, you have to approach.

 

[dmbrandon]

Total is so good. And it's good for us too!!

 

[teh_spamerer]

You have to kill your opponent three times to win, remember? When you're losing, you have to approach.

Hahaha this is funny. No, you don't have to approach.

 

[Mew2King]

you will eventually have to approach and you're in a serious disadvantage if you don't, how could you possibly say that spammer unless you wanna get their damage up in projectiles the whole time somehow.

 

[Inui]

He likes disagreeing with what I say even if I'm right, Jason. That must be it for such a dumb statement to come from the amazing Kashif.

 

[pauliedanger]

Brandon, you're right. I got pretty pissed off at Inui. But for the last 5 or 6 pages he's had the same arguement. I hear him, and we're paying attention to the argument. But at this point there seems to be too much debate over the stages, and honestly all I've seen is theory. So let's put it to the test. Steve and I discussed this the other night and we're in total agreement. As I've said, we're experimenting with rules and boards, we will be watching this first tournament to see if there is any cheapness on those questionable levels. And even you, Inui, have to admit that there is a debate on these levels. So let's just decide it in the game rather than on a message board. Inui, I'll cover your venue fee for July 6th, come out and let's settle this on the sticks.

 

[Inui]

I don't think there's anything to debate about those levels, especially Onett, a stage banned in Melee when it was less broken than it is now.

I'll come to the event if I can, but if there's one on the same date with better stage rules, I'll give that one priority.

 

[dmbrandon]

We've already done the experiments. I've been to probably 20 tournaments for Brawl since its release, so has Inui.

But, hey, it's your tourn. I'm going to come regardless. Whether I'll attend the next one, is to be seen! ^_~

 

[pauliedanger]

I don't think there's anything to debate about those levels, especially Onett, a stage banned in Melee when it was less broken than it is now.

I've got seven plus pages of posts that disagree with this statement, my man.

I've got $10 on you. Come out, bring your sticks, and help us prove it for ourselves.

 

[dmbrandon]

I've got seven plus pages of posts that disagree with this statement, my man.

I've got $10 on you. Come out, bring your sticks, and help us prove it for ourselves.

That's a bet I'll take.

 

[Inui]

Only Kashif and Steve disagree, Paulie. Most players agree, including the BEST player.

dmbrandon is right; we've already seen it all. We've hosted many events and have attended many events.

Edit: Screw it. I'm practicing Dedede and Fox for those ridiculous stages.

 

[pauliedanger]

Only Kashif and Steve disagree, Paulie. Most players agree, including the BEST player.

dmbrandon is right; we've already seen it all. We've hosted many events and have attended many events.

Edit: Screw it. I'm practicing Dedede and Fox for those ridiculous stages.

Send me video links.

Steve and I won't object to changing the rules if we see evidence. But right now it's all talk.

 

[dmbrandon]

It's not talk. Its advice.

I PROMISE I will abuse whatever broken **** you leave on.

In fact, leave all this on. I could use the free money.

 

[Inui]

Steve HAS seen the evidence. Steve has EXPERIENCED it himself. That's why I have no clue why he's being like this about the stages.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=BKqJTl3q23M

Dedede can do that to most characters. It works on every stage I want banned. On Mario Circuit and Green Hill Zone, he can just CG you to the side and kill you from 0. Falco can also do that laser lock thing.

 

[teh_spamerer]

you will eventually have to approach and you're in a serious disadvantage if you don't, how could you possibly say that spammer unless you wanna get their damage up in projectiles the whole time somehow.

Hmm...you have to approach when you're losing? http://youtube.com/watch?v=f53aeimv8I0

You know, no matter how many times I watch this match, I never see either player approaching when they are down on percent. I see them continue to camp.

There you have it, Steve. Last time I checked, Jason was better than us.

Hmm, quite interesting how when Jason says "Sheik is the best character in Melee" you disagree with him but when he says anything that you agree with his word instantly becomes fact. Quite interesting indeed.

In fact, leave all this on. I could use the free money.

I'll agree to play you exclusively on those stages if we play in tournament since you're so confident in winning on them.

I don't think there's anything to debate about those levels, especially Onett, a stage banned in Melee when it was less broken than it is now.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL! Onett is 10000x worse in Melee. The cars can kill you, the black car is untechable, Fox can wall infinite you from waveshining, he can laser camp the entire stage, he can run away with ease, and there is an additional ledge on the left house on the right side in Melee, which he can easily exploit.

Steve HAS seen the evidence. Steve has EXPERIENCED it himself. That's why I have no clue why he's being like this about the stages.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=BKqJTl3q23M

Dedede can do that to most characters. It works on every stage I want banned. On Mario Circuit and Green Hill Zone, he can just CG you to the side and kill you from 0. Falco can also do that laser lock thing.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=tztxdBpl-Zw
http://youtube.com/watch?v=9PZWRu7BnZg

I guess FD and Pokemon Stadium should be banned in Melee then

 

[Inui]

No player can infinite with Fox until the clock runs out like any Dedede player can just by pressing Z over and over. Dedede's is easier to start and significantly easier to perform.

 

[teh_spamerer]

No player can infinite with Fox until the clock runs out like any Dedede player can just by pressing Z over and over. Dedede's is easier to start and significantly easier to perform.

You can't wall infinite until the clock runs out on Onett anyways, the cars come and hit you. Fox's infinite racks up the damage much faster than Dedede's and he can kill his opponent by just grabbing them if the black car is coming or end it in an upsmash. He can also choose to end it in a dthrow if they're too low on percent to finish and let the car techchase them. Also, stalling is banned so you can't do the infinite until the time runs out.

 

[Lord Knight]

Lucas, I don't know where you are throwing out these "HE'S EXPERIENCED IT" things. All my tourney matches on Mario Circuit have never been **** in my favor (including against you, except when me and Kashif beat you in teams).

And I've played Corneria, and you know I was the one that discovered the Ike cg stuff. But didn't you actually beat Kashif there too? And that was close. Kashif presented me with a good arguement when I was making the tournament rules, and I couldn't help but agree. Before changing and finalizing the rules for the next five tournaments, I want to see the current state of these levels (Corneria, Onett, Mario Circuit, Green Hill Zone, and Luigi's Mansion). Smashers are generally wah wah crybabies and a lot of things can be avoided and dealt with, but if I truly feel it's not viable, then it will be banned in the rest of the Philly Gamer tournies. You have a personal flaw of immediately crying super gay or banworthy when some strong tactic comes your way (you've even quit MB, called ABA broke, etc). I'd first stand to see more of this in tourney play.

Melee stage ban list reached where it was today by having stages being PLAYED. Onett was on for a very long time before it was banned (and it was still at Smashtality). Mushroom Kingdom was on for a while before it was discovered that you can live forever by smash di'ing the blocks, etc. I'd much prefer having as many stages as possible rather than shutting down the game and banning anything, but I will ban things that should be banned at my tourney.

tl;dr - stop crying, in Melee gay stages used to be on before they were super duper gay, everyone else generally stopped complaining.

As for Steve's opinions, no offense LK, but he doesn't know the game as well as I do. In fact, not many people do. We've explained why they're gamebreaking, and hopefully, if you leave them on, I can use this garbage to **** my unknowing opponents so bad, they'll not wanna go to the next event.

Brandon, this statement shows how much you severly underestimate my mind for Smash. I do play Brawl and place well and learn, and I've played Melee for 2 years. I know the mechanics of Smash and what kind of **** is dumb.

If you want to challenge my skill at all, just money match me, I'll take it in Melee or Brawl.

 

[Inui]

lol

Five bucks on Brandon. No offense, Steve, but you don't play this game enough at all to take out Brandon in a match Dedede gets owned in.

Yes, those gay stages were on in Melee because the metagame knowledge was nothingness. We're actually good ALREADY. No need to digress. Most tournaments are beyond 2002's amount of common sense when it comes to Smash.

Edit: A few months from now when those stages will be universally accepted as unsuitable for competitive play, I'll remind you of this thread. What a glorious day it shall be.

 

[Lord Knight]

For real Lucas? MLG 2006 had Onett ON as a counterpick stage. It wasn't banned until early 07. Do more research (or try to remember) before you throw out uneducated statements like that.

Also, for comparison's sake, here are several other counterpick stage lists at other tournies:

Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Halberd
Pokemon Stadium 2
Castle Siege
Distant Planet --- wut
Pictochat
Delfino Plaza
Frigate Orpheon
Corneria (under debate)
Rainbow Cruise
Brinstar
Hanenbow --- lol

Counterpick Stages:
Luigi's Mansion
Mario Circuit
Halberd
Castle Siege
Distant Planet -- wut
Green Hill Zone
Onett
Corneria
Rainbow Cruise
Green Greens
Brinstar
Jungle Japes - wut
Frigate Orpheon
Delfino Plaza

Note, this tourney also has Pokémon Stadium 1 on.

Delphino Plaza
Frigate Orpheon
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Halberd
Pokemon Stadium 2
Distant Planet
Pictochat
Hanenbow
Rainbow Cruise
Brinstar

Brinstar
Castle Siege (doubles only)
Pokemon Stadium 1
Corneria
Delfino Plaza
Frigate Orpheon
Green Greens
Halberd
Jungle Japes!!!
Luigi's Mansion
Pirate Ship
Rainbow Cruise

This tourney has NO counterpicks, all neutrals

Pokemon Stadium - Melee
Rainbow Cruise - Melee
Delfino Plaza
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Castle Siege
Jungle Japes - Melee
Brinstar - Melee
Distant Planet

Brinstar
Castle Siege
Corneria
Delfino Plaza
Frigate Orpheon
Green Greens
Halberd
Jungle Japes
Pokemon Stadium 1
Rainbow Cruise

Note: Be reminded that WC has had more time with Brawl overall than anyone else in the country.

These lists vary, hrm? Of course at one point we'll have a unified stage ban/counterpick list, but it's far too soon to declare the Montage list perfect. Several of these have Luigi's Mansion on, which I've been thinking about banning. A LOT of them have Distant Planet and Hannenbow on. Like I said before, do some research first - not all tournies are as close to Montage's stage list as you've made it seem.