Perfect Shield Parry and Reverals

[Bakuryu]

I though of a couple ideas that I wanted to run by the community and see what they though.

The first is Perfect Shield Parry. This one is simple really its turning perfect shield into a more viable option, basically just tweak the PS so the time is SLIGHTLY less strict, and I mean slightly I'm sure we can find a happy medium. What I think is this ability should be more skill based then luck. Yes I know you could train yourself to time it, but you want to pull it off every time and especially times when you need it. (Under pressure)

And example of something that would be awesome and maybe not to this degree is shown in this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4HvhIPOz4I Right at the beginning the CPU PS all of Snakes A Combo. Now imagine both had high dmg percentages and its the last stock for each and the Link brings it back by PS and going in with his own combo?

My second suggestion is kinda crazy really I don't expect it to catch, but figured I would try. Reversal as some of you know in Street Fighter are sometimes when your on the floor and as you get up you pull off a move during your invincibility frames to surprise an opponent who is standing near you. I think this would be a cool option to have. Right now we have you either roll away, sit there and recover, or try a get up attack. The get up attack has its limits mainly an aerial attack.

As you can imagine these suggestions are very much influenced by Street Fighter, but I feel they add depth to the game.

In closing I will say these are absolutely not necessary and are meant to be a suggestion for when and if we can fit more lines of code. Right now I just wish for input on what you guys think and maybe some suggestions of your own of how we can make it work, or why you think it wont work. Please do not make this a debate thank you.

 

[leafgreen386]

Powershielding is already a very powerful mechanic which we made the timing on stricter because it was too easy for it to happen "randomly" and unfairly benefit the defender when all they were counting on was a regular shield. The only way it would be viable to use a higher window for PSing would be if we separated the shield and PS commands. I've suggested moving this command to the taunt button before, as it is the only button that is not currently used for something important in combat. The first few frames would be PS frames and would cause the taunt animation to end if you successfully guarded, and some number of frames later, you would be able to cancel the animation with something else if you failed the PS. You would be unable to attempt a PS within a certain window of a failed PS to prevent PS spamming. Although I think this would add more depth, it ultimately isn't necessary, and was received poorly by the community.

For reversals... I don't see why we should incorporate something like that. The techchasing and get-up games are already quite deep, and it seems like something that could easily become OP if we didn't implement it carefully.

 

[Bakuryu]

I think the parry idea should be at least attempted before passing definite judgment, and by this I mean way down the road, but like someone said in another post right now as it stands Brawl+ doesn't have any technical skills. I think the button personally should be which every jump button you don't use, I don't use X. Trying to use the taunt (aka the D pad? or is the cross shaped one something else?) seem to much of a stretch to be useful.

 

[Problem2]

Parrying and Reversal are already sort of implemented in Brawl, just not exactly as how Street Fighter has them. The get up attack is more or less a reversal.

 

[Bakuryu]

Yea the more and more I look at it I guess its already there, also apparently even at 2 frames PS is easy, I need to test this myself, if anything maybe we could try 3? Get up attacks are only good as reveals on the floor is my only grip. Problem is it would be a ***** to balance some kinda of aerial, the only thing I can think of is being able to use your up b from the floor, which kinda matches with the reversals of other games as in the fact that if it whiffs they are open for attack. Also not everyone up b is viable for this options then again in SF not all characters could do it. So really what I suggest is maybe slightly more invincibility frames on get up to use it to your advantage, this would be also only if you don't do a get up attack of course.

 

[Dark Sonic]

^^Marth's/Samus's/Bowser's up Bs would make that completely broken (especially Bowser's since it would be so hard to bait and punish).

Then you've got Sonic an Game and watch's "get away for free card."

So no....up B from the ground is a very bad idea.

 

[ShortFuse]

I think it can be left at 2 frames. I can powershield at will. After training, it's cake on normal Brawl. I remember I went back to Melee for old times sake and could powershield there. Then again, I've been playing since N64 days and competitively since 2003.
But it's not random at 2 frames. If you make it easier I think I would **** even more with Marth.

What you consider "under pressure" my friends call Beast Mode. It always "activates" my last stock. I have some video somewhere of me true powershielding (tapping shield, not holding down) like 7 straight attacks and ripping on my friend's Lucario. 2 frames seems fine enough to pull off but a bit riskier. vBrawl was too easy

As for the reversals, I don't know. I think powershielding alone is fine

 

[goodoldganon]

What about throw reversal or instant throw breaks? *shrug* I'm bored.

 

[SCOTU]

recap:

powershielding is really easy in brawl, they made it harder in brawl+.

It's cricitcal in smash that the wakeup attack has limited range. Unlike in traditional fighters, w/ extremely limited options on hitting the ground, in smash you have tech in place, tech towards, tech away, stand up, wakeup attack, wakeup roll towards, and wakeup roll away. the last 4 can be done w/ variable timing. There are a lot of options the tech chaser has to keep track of already, and smash probably has the deepest tech chasing game of any fighter. Adding in a wakeup DP would only just make it significantly more in favor of the grounded over the tech chaser, something which is currently relatively well balanced.

Also, if you wanted codes for either of those, try the stickeyd code request thread. If you wanted to suggest some of that for brawl+, use a brawl+ thread