Fogel
Smash Lord
Call me cheap or a whiner or whatever but I don't think I'll bother playing Brawl singles for $3. I may do doubles still though 
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Ottawa Ontario Canada
- Thread starter Krilj
- Start date
- Status
PND
Smash Champion
I still think $1 is the best fee, but I'm willing to pay $3
eternalgamer
Smash Apprentice
I believe that $1 was a good price to just have fun. If you want something more serious than I'd suggest a smaller organized tourney.
And to make things interesting I think we should mix up the teams a bit. Partner with someone you haven't partnered with before? I think that would spice things up, create more of a unpredictability factor and get us to work with other people. I was partnered with Harold's brother at ToS5 and by the end of the 2nd or 3rd match we started to mesh and find out some new strats. Seeing how the Bi-weeklies aren't completely serious I think this would be a need way to learn and have fun. Mixing skill levels and characters, you know?
And to make things interesting I think we should mix up the teams a bit. Partner with someone you haven't partnered with before? I think that would spice things up, create more of a unpredictability factor and get us to work with other people. I was partnered with Harold's brother at ToS5 and by the end of the 2nd or 3rd match we started to mesh and find out some new strats. Seeing how the Bi-weeklies aren't completely serious I think this would be a need way to learn and have fun. Mixing skill levels and characters, you know?
jan
Smash Cadet
I don't really see what everyone is complaining about... hardly anyone in Ottawa uses MetaSnake anyway.
I'm fine with singles costing $3, since that's more what I care about. Maybe at $3 we'll see people playing more seriously. Don't really care about doubles that much, but at $5 per team, the pot would be that much more tempting.
I'm fine with singles costing $3, since that's more what I care about. Maybe at $3 we'll see people playing more seriously. Don't really care about doubles that much, but at $5 per team, the pot would be that much more tempting.
Runawayfire
Smash Lord
$3 destroying your wallets?
Things must be serious in Ottawa.... dayum...
You need people to get their hands off your bread.
Things must be serious in Ottawa.... dayum...
You need people to get their hands off your bread.
flash7
Smash Journeyman
Never gonna give you up .
.Suo
Smash Apprentice
I would definitely be interested, I'm pretty decent in 3rd Strike, but have played barely any SFII, I really wanna get more into SFII tho, learn a little bit more about zoning.
I prolly sound like a broken record, but I'm just finishing up my last credit, prolly about 4 more days, then I'll be more free for Smashfests and the like.
eternalgamer
Smash Apprentice
IvanEva
Smash Ace
Arsenic speaking here:
3$ is killing my wallet, unlike GTA where Smash is serious business, I like to spend my money on triple ****ed hookers and booze.
PND
Smash Champion
As far as making the biweeklies more competetive, what about setting them up on AiB every other week? I'd be more than willing to put the effort in to get it up and running.
Why I suggest this:
- Character top 8 results directly start influencing character tourney results and thus tiers (We can finally get Jiggs, Yoshi, Old Mannondorf, and Lucas some wins! And no Metaknights!)
- Winners get shiny trophys to display on their profile
Downsides:
For the benefits you'd need an AiB account
I mean, it's not much, but it's a start. And it avoids the impending Smashflation of the markets.
EDIT: Also, what about starting up a Power Rankings list for Ottawa? It won't be instantaneous, but it might motivate us a bit more.
Why I suggest this:
- Character top 8 results directly start influencing character tourney results and thus tiers (We can finally get Jiggs, Yoshi, Old Mannondorf, and Lucas some wins! And no Metaknights!)
- Winners get shiny trophys to display on their profile
Downsides:
For the benefits you'd need an AiB account
I mean, it's not much, but it's a start. And it avoids the impending Smashflation of the markets.
EDIT: Also, what about starting up a Power Rankings list for Ottawa? It won't be instantaneous, but it might motivate us a bit more.
Damax
Smash Lord
1. what's the ****in point? there's no freaking link there you ***got. SF sucks hardcore, SF:T sucks. and yes it do suck, you guys get all warmed up because alot of people love it so you have to love it but I'm sur you prolly never ever played competitively or someone who did. it sucks because as a newbie I could beat some guys that play regulary in an hour after he told me what to do... quite the learning curve if only melee was like that, oh wait that'd be brawl.
2. you must really suck at smash melee. cause if all you did was laser to shine pillars with fox/falco chances are you got 2-3 stocked by me and 4 stocked by the elites. also go play Mortal kombat, those 3 d fighters where you do not always do the same moves, I'm serious Mortal kombat (except for the third one) is kinda good on that part, no broken tiers. Tekken seemed alot of bait and random things, not 3 moves spam. Tekken tag was AWESOME for the random part, too bad there was such tiers (some character would just be too weak or slow)
3. you are the one claiming to own everyone with lucas. go ahead and waste your time on that char, that'll never give you anything on a competitive level. SO my mewtwo versus your marth at melee? 300$ I'm in.
Cbone
Smash Journeyman
I'm going to be very forward with this. I'm against an ottawa PR for the following reasons:
*Gives EC PR thread link*
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=90855
gg no re....please for the love of god.
PND
Smash Champion
First: Why so angry?
Second: If this match goes down, I'd love to be present, or at least watch a video of it.
IvanEva
Smash Ace
Damax: Street Fighter is still being played to this day and will definitely outlive any and all Smashes, Mortal Kombats, Tekkens, etc. I just brought it up to point out that your views on fighting games can be rather questionable. A steep learning curve is usually an indication of poor design. "Easy to learn, hard to master" is what games should be going for.
My initial money match comment was just to bring to light that just switching to Metaknight or Snake alone isn't going to change the outcome of how we fare in comparison to each other at Cameron's Smashfests. At least, that's my hypothesis. As for you, I'd be up for a money match between MY Marth and YOUR Lucas. Brawl. I don't play Melee.
Lastly, the "you ***got" line is a bit much. Far too many of your posts have too much scorn to them, and not just here in this thread either. For a guy who was relatively quiet and polite at ToS5, you sure go nuts online.
PNDMike: I was lightly thinking about something like Power Rankings but after seeing all the drama that went down with Niko's I'd have to agree with Ian that it's a very bad idea overall. However, I can still see some merit in them as motivators and/or indicators of progress. I think they'd be best kept private though as people don't like to see themselves ranked at a different spot than where they believe themselves to be. I think a big problem with Power Rankings is that they go by list instead of group. It's just too hard to tell which of two similar players is "better", which is what causes so much of the conflicts. Power Rankings should be by groups.
Either way, they're usually pretty obvious when we play. For example, I've noticed that the gap between myself and Jan has been steadily shrinking. Jan, if you could just stop suiciding I think we could be pretty evenly matched. Of course, practicing all that aerial stuff and spikes, even if you die a bunch while in the learning process, can pay off big time later on. I remember a time when Orlando couldn't parry in Third Stike and got constantly beaten as he kept trying to learn... Ah, the good old days of Remi dominating... but once Orlando learned how...
Remi is still MIA.
Here, I'll make a condensed version of the Smashfest rankings:
Top:
- SAUS
Middle:
- everybody but SAUS and I
Low:
- Me, for losing to Old Manondorf countless times today/last night.
My initial money match comment was just to bring to light that just switching to Metaknight or Snake alone isn't going to change the outcome of how we fare in comparison to each other at Cameron's Smashfests. At least, that's my hypothesis. As for you, I'd be up for a money match between MY Marth and YOUR Lucas. Brawl. I don't play Melee.
Lastly, the "you ***got" line is a bit much. Far too many of your posts have too much scorn to them, and not just here in this thread either. For a guy who was relatively quiet and polite at ToS5, you sure go nuts online.
PNDMike: I was lightly thinking about something like Power Rankings but after seeing all the drama that went down with Niko's I'd have to agree with Ian that it's a very bad idea overall. However, I can still see some merit in them as motivators and/or indicators of progress. I think they'd be best kept private though as people don't like to see themselves ranked at a different spot than where they believe themselves to be. I think a big problem with Power Rankings is that they go by list instead of group. It's just too hard to tell which of two similar players is "better", which is what causes so much of the conflicts. Power Rankings should be by groups.
Either way, they're usually pretty obvious when we play. For example, I've noticed that the gap between myself and Jan has been steadily shrinking. Jan, if you could just stop suiciding I think we could be pretty evenly matched. Of course, practicing all that aerial stuff and spikes, even if you die a bunch while in the learning process, can pay off big time later on. I remember a time when Orlando couldn't parry in Third Stike and got constantly beaten as he kept trying to learn... Ah, the good old days of Remi dominating... but once Orlando learned how...
Remi is still MIA.Here, I'll make a condensed version of the Smashfest rankings:
Top:
- SAUS
Middle:
- everybody but SAUS and I
Low:
- Me, for losing to Old Manondorf countless times today/last night.
flash7
Smash Journeyman
Ill miss parrying in SF4, but I think the style of the game is starting to grow on me now. Im actually looking forward to playing it. Looks like I might have to give in to getting a 360 ughh.
Can't we all just get along?
Can't we all just get along?
Retlaf
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2007
- Messages
- 140
Right, I forgot to continue my attempts at making everyone else realize the best possible fighter for us to collectively play at the moment:
Scarlet Weather Rhapsody
Increasing font size is the best possible thing at this point.
If this is getting annoying, let me know, and I'll realize it's starting to work.
Scarlet Weather Rhapsody
Increasing font size is the best possible thing at this point.
If this is getting annoying, let me know, and I'll realize it's starting to work.
Damax
Smash Lord
I don't money match at brawl since noobs could own me out of randomness by spamming rolls and smash.
I was talking about mastery too, SF needs none, unless you play some specific characters but for Ken or Ryu for exemple, I'd beat you anyday no matter how much time you'd play that game.
I don't go crazy at tournies cause people gives me weird looks so I try to make myself approachable to trick em into knowing me better so I can become crazy again, its all a trap!
Also vwins hold the beast within me with his tourbillon!
PND
Smash Champion
So, the smashfest is still going on tonight, correct? What time?
IvanEva
Smash Ace
Orlando: Don't cave just yet (although with HD remix AND IV, I might cave as well - I did, after all, get a PS2 JUST for Third Strike), it's also coming on PC, which is what I hope to get.
Retlaf: Scarlet Weather Rhapsody looked pretty fun... but I refuse to play a game where I have to play as boring, generic anime school girls! What's that you say? Arcana Hearts? Nope, that's different, in Arcana Hearts I play as a big mutating blob of goo. That the blob has some dinky school girl riding it is of no consequence. I play as the Zangief Blob!
Damax: If your Street Fighter analysis was true, the same champions (Daigo, Justin Wong, Alex Valle) wouldn't keep winning as they do. I know the feeling that you're talking about though, it's called beginner's luck, where some button mashing newbie beats a much better player. That only works once or twice though.
Retlaf: Scarlet Weather Rhapsody looked pretty fun... but I refuse to play a game where I have to play as boring, generic anime school girls! What's that you say? Arcana Hearts? Nope, that's different, in Arcana Hearts I play as a big mutating blob of goo. That the blob has some dinky school girl riding it is of no consequence. I play as the Zangief Blob!
Damax: If your Street Fighter analysis was true, the same champions (Daigo, Justin Wong, Alex Valle) wouldn't keep winning as they do. I know the feeling that you're talking about though, it's called beginner's luck, where some button mashing newbie beats a much better player. That only works once or twice though.
flash7
Smash Journeyman
Yeah I know its coming out for pc but mine is 2 years old (4 generations old atleast) so I dont know if itll run good. That and for some reason I just dont believe in playing console games on the pc unless its a FPS. Although Id rather not spend 300 on a 360 for a few games. Ill wait to play it first.
PND
Smash Champion
Hey, I've got some Wii points saved up and I was wondering:
Which version of Street Fighter 2 would you guys recommend? I have the original kicking around, so no need to get that one, but should I get Super Street Fighter 2: The new challengers
or Street Fighter 2 Turbo: Hyper fighting? Which one is more balanced, and better and stuff? I know New Challengers has more characters, but I've heard a lot of debate over the two. It's more about gameplay to me, anyway.
Or should I just stick with my original World Warrior copy and get other VC games?
Which version of Street Fighter 2 would you guys recommend? I have the original kicking around, so no need to get that one, but should I get Super Street Fighter 2: The new challengers
or Street Fighter 2 Turbo: Hyper fighting? Which one is more balanced, and better and stuff? I know New Challengers has more characters, but I've heard a lot of debate over the two. It's more about gameplay to me, anyway.
Or should I just stick with my original World Warrior copy and get other VC games?
BC AL
Smash Journeyman
fogel is there smashfest today?
why are ppl talkin bout street fighter? wheres our love for smash? haha jk street fighters a sick game
why are ppl talkin bout street fighter? wheres our love for smash? haha jk street fighters a sick game
IvanEva
Smash Ace
PNDMike: Don't buy either of them. The Wii is not a place to play Street Fighter. Neither controller would be good for it. Plus, both versions are inferior to Super Turbo, which won't be on Virtual Console. Your best bet would be to get an arcade emulator and Super Turbo (although I hear that they've finally got Third Strike running as well now) on your computer.
I'd save the Wii points for more Wii-specific titles. I myself would like to give that Lost Winds game a try...
I'd save the Wii points for more Wii-specific titles. I myself would like to give that Lost Winds game a try...
arsenic41
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Jul 31, 2007
- Messages
- 807
After some thought about what we said tonight, I'm planning on making a O-Town Power Ranking for the lulz (I wish I was joking). We think that no one in Ottawa is douche bag enough to cause as much E-Drama as the EC PR or the GTA PR, and it JUST might motivate other each other to do better at bi-weeklies and spark the interest of on going passers of the ottawa thread. Any HAET coming from the other regions will be ignored and such, so this will be strictly Ottawa based.
Who wants to be a panelist?
Who wants to be a panelist?
IvanEva
Smash Ace
Panelism seems to be where the drama comes from. Just take the reigns and do a "Randy's Ottawa Power Rankings" so that you get that whole "it's just my opinion" shield going for you.
Retlaf
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2007
- Messages
- 140
I'm not entirely sure how the power rankings are going to work, but we might want to consider doing something like simplified tourney results? As in, we just tally how many times X player has placed where.
Upon looking at that, if everyone has placed first to third at least once or twice, we can conclude that we're all pretty equally skilled.
Might not work, though. But yeah, I don't mind making Randy the sole panelist.
Oh, and that comment about how Scarlet Weather Rhapsody character designs are just generic school girls, we are no longer friends.
Upon looking at that, if everyone has placed first to third at least once or twice, we can conclude that we're all pretty equally skilled.
Might not work, though. But yeah, I don't mind making Randy the sole panelist.
Oh, and that comment about how Scarlet Weather Rhapsody character designs are just generic school girls, we are no longer friends.
Fogel
Smash Lord
Random people sure like trolling us lately.
Sorry to those asking if there was a smashfest or not, I didn't have time to go online for the past couple of days so I couldn't respond. Generally, assume there is one unless I post otherwise.
As we already talked about IRL, I'm against a PR due to all the e-drama and whining PRs cause.
Sorry to those asking if there was a smashfest or not, I didn't have time to go online for the past couple of days so I couldn't respond. Generally, assume there is one unless I post otherwise.
As we already talked about IRL, I'm against a PR due to all the e-drama and whining PRs cause.
IvanEva
Smash Ace
Yup. We definitly are. I propose that, if Randy goes ahead with Power Rankings or something, that the people that are just about equal be listed together, tier-wise, like:
1. Chun-Li, Ken, Makoto, Yun.
2. Necro, Oro, Ryu
3. Sean
ThatGuy
Smash Master
Put me on that ****ing PR.
Jazriel
Smash Ace
Oops.
10 kinds of people in the world. Binary ftw!
10 kinds of people in the world. Binary ftw!
Jazriel
Smash Ace
Rawr! I've just read 20 pages of random crap! Woo hoo!
Still some time until I'm back, but I thought I would comment on a few things:
-Realize why you play Brawl. This is a point I think people need to seriously start considering. Do you play fighting games to win tournaments or do you play fighting games in the attempt to beat your friends? Both require that one plays at a "high" level, but the tourney-winning-mindset is such that one must accept a game completely, flaws and all.
I can't think of how to word this, but what I'm trying to say is that if we enjoy playing Brawl, even if it's just in an isolated, artificial environment, we could always *ban* MK/Snake/Spamming. Yes yes, I'm familiar with Akuma. Yes, I know Sirlin said sitting in place for 2:59 seconds is the best tactic destroys the metagame, still. Sometimes a game will allow things that completely destroy the game (Wall-walking in Mechassault 2 for instance) so the members of the community need to decide what to do about it. Sirlin has a large article about Roll-cancelling :D.
If the purpose of the "smashfest" is merely to play games, then the ultimate objective is for all of "us" to find a game that we can enjoy playing against each other as well as individually. This inherently lends itself to the idea that there can be no allegiance to any game in particular, as games are always changing and the community's idea of a "good"/"worthy" game to play is generally constantly fluctuating.
So, (kinda losing my train of thought here), with the argument of whether Brawl is a worthy game to be played, it's like I've said since the very beginning: Only extensive testing can reveal all permutations of a software's variables. Once one understands and is familiar with those permutations, can one make a truly informed decision as to whether the game is worth their time.
So, yeah. I've completely lost my train of thought now, but I think I'm trying to say that people should stfu about whether Brawl "sucks" or not because the game is still young. People should stop discrediting other games merely because they think they suck (I'm looking at you Damax). And we should all play Halo: CE for the Xbox and get ***** by me :D
P.S. When I do get back, I want to play Melee/Brawl/DotA/SF:3S/SF2:HDTR/AH/whatever.
And I just thought of something EPIC. We should throw everything thing away, go buy some Xbox's, and get Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow so I can **** you all 1v3 style on Cinema! gg no re
P.P.S. And the PR thing sounds like a waste of time to me.
Still some time until I'm back, but I thought I would comment on a few things:
-Realize why you play Brawl. This is a point I think people need to seriously start considering. Do you play fighting games to win tournaments or do you play fighting games in the attempt to beat your friends? Both require that one plays at a "high" level, but the tourney-winning-mindset is such that one must accept a game completely, flaws and all.
I can't think of how to word this, but what I'm trying to say is that if we enjoy playing Brawl, even if it's just in an isolated, artificial environment, we could always *ban* MK/Snake/Spamming. Yes yes, I'm familiar with Akuma. Yes, I know Sirlin said sitting in place for 2:59 seconds is the best tactic destroys the metagame, still. Sometimes a game will allow things that completely destroy the game (Wall-walking in Mechassault 2 for instance) so the members of the community need to decide what to do about it. Sirlin has a large article about Roll-cancelling :D.
If the purpose of the "smashfest" is merely to play games, then the ultimate objective is for all of "us" to find a game that we can enjoy playing against each other as well as individually. This inherently lends itself to the idea that there can be no allegiance to any game in particular, as games are always changing and the community's idea of a "good"/"worthy" game to play is generally constantly fluctuating.
So, (kinda losing my train of thought here
), with the argument of whether Brawl is a worthy game to be played, it's like I've said since the very beginning: Only extensive testing can reveal all permutations of a software's variables. Once one understands and is familiar with those permutations, can one make a truly informed decision as to whether the game is worth their time.So, yeah. I've completely lost my train of thought now, but I think I'm trying to say that people should stfu about whether Brawl "sucks" or not because the game is still young. People should stop discrediting other games merely because they think they suck (I'm looking at you Damax). And we should all play Halo: CE for the Xbox and get ***** by me :D
P.S. When I do get back, I want to play Melee/Brawl/DotA/SF:3S/SF2:HDTR/AH/whatever.
And I just thought of something EPIC. We should throw everything thing away, go buy some Xbox's, and get Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow so I can **** you all 1v3 style on Cinema! gg no re
P.P.S. And the PR thing sounds like a waste of time to me.
PND
Smash Champion
Do you guys have any thoughts on the AiB listing of the biweekly results? We're far from the only biweeklies on there, and I'll put the effort in to get the results up every other week. Also, I won't be able to make it next week, so I'm gonna fall behind in the PR! Oh no! But the other 3 guys might. Up to them, I guess. I can't really speak for them.
On Friday I will be in the Niagara area, fighting for Ottawa's honor.
On the PR front, are we going to start with everyone on an equal footing, or use previous results (biweeklies, ToS5) as a bearing for initial placement? Not that I care, I just don't want that Level 1 CPU from a few biweeklies back above Randy and I. Although we should be afraid. Level 1 CPU is terrifying and will quickly rise to the top..
Also: Thanks Harold. I already have Lost Winds, and although a great concept I found it fairly, well, unimmersive. I just can't really get into it. I can pick it up and play it for like 20 minutes, then I've had enough and feel no motivation to go back to it. I'm seemingly the only person with these issues though (the internetz loves it) so I don't know. Maybe I haven't given it enough of a chance. If I ever have a day off from work maybe I'll sit down and force myself to beat it in a sitting.
Any other VC/Wiiware recommendations? I have 2200 points, and quite a few games I want but can't prioritize, so basically if someone lists a game I want I'll get it.
For the record, I have:
Starfox 64
Mariokart 64
Harvest Moon (Nostalgia!)
My Life as King
Lost Winds
Also, by the next Smashfest Soul Calibur *4* will be out, and I'll bring it and my (new) 360 if desired. I basically bought it for SC4 and SF4.
On Friday I will be in the Niagara area, fighting for Ottawa's honor.
On the PR front, are we going to start with everyone on an equal footing, or use previous results (biweeklies, ToS5) as a bearing for initial placement? Not that I care, I just don't want that Level 1 CPU from a few biweeklies back above Randy and I.
Although we should be afraid. Level 1 CPU is terrifying and will quickly rise to the top..Also: Thanks Harold. I already have Lost Winds, and although a great concept I found it fairly, well, unimmersive. I just can't really get into it. I can pick it up and play it for like 20 minutes, then I've had enough and feel no motivation to go back to it. I'm seemingly the only person with these issues though (the internetz loves it) so I don't know. Maybe I haven't given it enough of a chance. If I ever have a day off from work maybe I'll sit down and force myself to beat it in a sitting.
Any other VC/Wiiware recommendations? I have 2200 points, and quite a few games I want but can't prioritize, so basically if someone lists a game I want I'll get it.
For the record, I have:
Starfox 64
Mariokart 64
Harvest Moon (Nostalgia!)
My Life as King
Lost Winds
Also, by the next Smashfest Soul Calibur *4* will be out, and I'll bring it and my (new) 360 if desired. I basically bought it for SC4 and SF4.
Damax
Smash Lord
I hope you meant ''Also, by the next smashfest Soul Calibur 4 will be out...'' cause if you just realised the 3 was out, you are late on the news.
PND
Smash Champion
Good catch, thanks!
Fogel
Smash Lord
H2YL Brawl tier list, seems pretty accurate to me:
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=183918
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=183918
I don't think they're at the point where they should just be banned outright; both are tough matchups for pretty much anyone but right now I think we should wait a couple of months to see if anyone develops any reliable anti-MK/Snake strategies.
flash7
Smash Journeyman
Poor Captain Falcon. Hes always at the bottom .
Right now it seems that only MK is in position for banning as Snake seems to have some counters. Although MK is still beatable so banning isnt necessary. We might need some more MK and snake players though, itll be the only way to learn to beat them. For inspiration I recommend watching some king ace vids. <3 <3
Dice: Where can I find out more about this guy and his sticks?
.Right now it seems that only MK is in position for banning as Snake seems to have some counters. Although MK is still beatable so banning isnt necessary. We might need some more MK and snake players though, itll be the only way to learn to beat them. For inspiration I recommend watching some king ace vids.
<3 <3Dice: Where can I find out more about this guy and his sticks?
PND
Smash Champion
Metaknight counters: DK (I believe hsi ftilt goes through everything Metaknight has) and I've heard Marth and Snake, although apparently their advantages are getting worse amd worse
Snake counters: Falco, DDD, Zelda, and surprisingly Jiggs. (She rips through his recovery, and the first hit of the ftilt usually hits her far enough away for safety. Utilt is amazing on her though)
The tier list is pretty accurate, but I still think Sonic and Samus are too high. And it's probably bias, but I beleive Jiggs is too low. Let's look at who mains her. . . Bowyer, tehrexxor, Little England, and me, haha. Jiggs has one of the smallest userbases of any character, and I think she has potential to move up to low tier (High standards, eh?) Especially with her new infinite. Semi difficult to set up (though easier than laser locking) but to the same effect and works on every character. It's believed to be completey inescapable at this point in time. Just avoid a G&W, Falco, or a Metaknight (harder than it sounds) and she's pretty good against the upper tiered characters.
But I'm a fanboy, take what I say with a grain of salt. And what's the worst scenario? I play a bottom tiered character, and thus get automatic johns.
Snake counters: Falco, DDD, Zelda, and surprisingly Jiggs. (She rips through his recovery, and the first hit of the ftilt usually hits her far enough away for safety. Utilt is amazing on her though)
The tier list is pretty accurate, but I still think Sonic and Samus are too high. And it's probably bias, but I beleive Jiggs is too low. Let's look at who mains her. . . Bowyer, tehrexxor, Little England, and me, haha. Jiggs has one of the smallest userbases of any character, and I think she has potential to move up to low tier (High standards, eh?) Especially with her new infinite. Semi difficult to set up (though easier than laser locking) but to the same effect and works on every character. It's believed to be completey inescapable at this point in time. Just avoid a G&W, Falco, or a Metaknight (harder than it sounds) and she's pretty good against the upper tiered characters.
But I'm a fanboy, take what I say with a grain of salt. And what's the worst scenario? I play a bottom tiered character, and thus get automatic johns.
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