Jem.
Smash Master
Man, Bart just ***** your **** a little brah.
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Oregon Power Rankings: Updated 02/04/08
- Thread starter Balloon
- Start date
- Status
Eh. Carry on.
FoosJr
Smash Ace
so yea i think that this list is just about right but also i'm not a panelist and haven't been to a tourney in a while I just think the list should be a bit longer and I also hear that this was just a really quick thrown together list of people but i definatley think I should be right behind shin. Almost forgot and I think tudios should be higher than what he is. He should be so hi up there he could take a bite out of a star.
At first I thought this thread was a joke thread, and I'm still questioning if it is or not. But if it is, it's been taken too far, and if it's not, then it's in strict contradiction of these rules from the PR Regulatory Rules:
3. There will be only one ranking thread for any given state.
We've been setting up a PR thread, discussed at the current home of the PR thread in the OSM discussion.
4. Threads may only be started by well-respected tournament operators within a region.
This thread was created by Balloon, not by a group of well-respected tournament operators--Balloon has never operated a tournament. And I'm not even sure if it was even discussed by the others claimed as panelists as attested by one of them:
I don't think Jesse had any say in the rest, as he is usually absent from discussions.
The only people who can start a PR list technically would be:
me, t!mmy, Aftermath (OoS now), Tudios, Doc Holiday, and Wikipedia (though it would be up to debate if they're knowledgeable about the metagame)
Here is a list of the rules regarding a PR list. I will address every single rule for both this thread and the OSM thread. I assure you that this is not a joke:
Power Ranking Regulatory Rules
1. Each power ranking thread must have a mission statement.
Mission statements simply state what the panel is attempting to do, and should list the criteria that will be looked at when deciding placement. Mission statements do not need to be unique from others.
2. Ranking threads cannot be below the size of state rankings.
This is to keep "Crew X Power Rankings" or "Small Town Y Rankings" threads from coming up. Anything below that size will be considered as spam and dealt with as such. However, in states with a high density of smashers spread out over a wide enough region, splitting a state up can be considered. As of right now, NorCal and SoCal rankings fit this description. To have a region put up for consideration of this exception, contact me with several valid reasons.
3. There will be only one ranking thread for any given state.
This is to keep rival threads from popping up and to keep the opinions focused. The only exception to this is when a state is split up into regions, as described above.
4. Threads may only be started by well-respected tournament operators within a region.
It is up to these individuals to appoint the rest of a council, as well as decide if they wish to participate in the panel or not. If they do not, they will act as a regional "sponsor", and will be responsible for thread updates and have some say in administrative choices, such as dropping/adding panelists and keeping general control.
5. A panel must consist of at least 3 members.
That would be the bare minimum. Depending on the overall population or competitiveness of a region, 3 may also be too small, and a larger panel will be pushed for. For example, having 3 people to decide the rankings for Maryland would be much too small, given the large population and density. Also, panels made up entirely of members of one crew will not be accepted. Finally, all panelists must be listed somewhere in the first post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rule 1: This thread has a mission statement. The OSM does not. The OSM, until very recently, was only ever a thread giving information on Oregon players and tournaments.
Rule 2: Both threads fit this criteria.
Rule 3: I'll address this below the rest.
Rule 4: I spoke with Omnigamer before the creation of this thread and explained to him that Kenpachi has been the host of successful tournaments in our region. I asked him, then, if it would be okay for me to start the thread with Kenpachi's consent as a sponsor. Omni told me that I could, and that it actually would probably be better considering that Kenpachi doesn't regularly post around here.
Rule 5: This thread has three panelists, and yes, all three of us did meet and discuss the list the night after OSU III. We did not go into extensive discussion regarding the bottom five since we didn't have the records from OSU III or the brackets from SF:E JoshStyle. With those, we could have determined a much more accurate bottom five. Your thread, the OSM, does not have any panelists, let alone a panel. It consists of you, Tommy, and your twin brother Timmy. There was no discussion that took place per the normal style of PR lists, and therefore it does not technically even count as a PR list.
Now to address rule 3: Since the OSM thread is not technically a PR list, we are able to have this one. Since, also, the OSM thread does not encourage discussion over the very inaccurate list of players, it should not remain anything except an Oregon discussion thread. Hell, it doesn't even have our best player, MCS, on it.
I assure you that the top 5 were discussed, however. Minh did take part in it, but again, the bottom five will become much more accurate in the future. This type of thing has long been a need of ours, regardless if you or Timmy disagree.
And yes, technically Kenpachi can start a PR thread. I just did it for him with Omnigamer's prior consent.
This thread is not a joke.
Power Ranking Regulatory Rules
1. Each power ranking thread must have a mission statement.
Mission statements simply state what the panel is attempting to do, and should list the criteria that will be looked at when deciding placement. Mission statements do not need to be unique from others.
2. Ranking threads cannot be below the size of state rankings.
This is to keep "Crew X Power Rankings" or "Small Town Y Rankings" threads from coming up. Anything below that size will be considered as spam and dealt with as such. However, in states with a high density of smashers spread out over a wide enough region, splitting a state up can be considered. As of right now, NorCal and SoCal rankings fit this description. To have a region put up for consideration of this exception, contact me with several valid reasons.
3. There will be only one ranking thread for any given state.
This is to keep rival threads from popping up and to keep the opinions focused. The only exception to this is when a state is split up into regions, as described above.
4. Threads may only be started by well-respected tournament operators within a region.
It is up to these individuals to appoint the rest of a council, as well as decide if they wish to participate in the panel or not. If they do not, they will act as a regional "sponsor", and will be responsible for thread updates and have some say in administrative choices, such as dropping/adding panelists and keeping general control.
5. A panel must consist of at least 3 members.
That would be the bare minimum. Depending on the overall population or competitiveness of a region, 3 may also be too small, and a larger panel will be pushed for. For example, having 3 people to decide the rankings for Maryland would be much too small, given the large population and density. Also, panels made up entirely of members of one crew will not be accepted. Finally, all panelists must be listed somewhere in the first post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rule 1: This thread has a mission statement. The OSM does not. The OSM, until very recently, was only ever a thread giving information on Oregon players and tournaments.
Rule 2: Both threads fit this criteria.
Rule 3: I'll address this below the rest.
Rule 4: I spoke with Omnigamer before the creation of this thread and explained to him that Kenpachi has been the host of successful tournaments in our region. I asked him, then, if it would be okay for me to start the thread with Kenpachi's consent as a sponsor. Omni told me that I could, and that it actually would probably be better considering that Kenpachi doesn't regularly post around here.
Rule 5: This thread has three panelists, and yes, all three of us did meet and discuss the list the night after OSU III. We did not go into extensive discussion regarding the bottom five since we didn't have the records from OSU III or the brackets from SF:E JoshStyle. With those, we could have determined a much more accurate bottom five. Your thread, the OSM, does not have any panelists, let alone a panel. It consists of you, Tommy, and your twin brother Timmy. There was no discussion that took place per the normal style of PR lists, and therefore it does not technically even count as a PR list.
Now to address rule 3: Since the OSM thread is not technically a PR list, we are able to have this one. Since, also, the OSM thread does not encourage discussion over the very inaccurate list of players, it should not remain anything except an Oregon discussion thread. Hell, it doesn't even have our best player, MCS, on it.
I assure you that the top 5 were discussed, however. Minh did take part in it, but again, the bottom five will become much more accurate in the future. This type of thing has long been a need of ours, regardless if you or Timmy disagree.
And yes, technically Kenpachi can start a PR thread. I just did it for him with Omnigamer's prior consent.
This thread is not a joke.
Jem.
Smash Master
I dont see the problem. The Oregon PR is pretty accurate, and will get more people in Oregon to try harder / attend more tournaments / get better. And Bart has a pretty good idea of everyone anyways.
The OSM thread does have a mission statement, it's the first post.
You've taken advantage of the fact Omnigamer has very little information regarding what is going on in Oregon, let alone the West Coast. All he has seen is that you asked if it was ok to start a PR thread, and he's not in a position to deny what he believed to be pertinent information.
Check the OSM replies, we actually asked everyone who the panelists were to be. You were part of this discussion. The only people who accepted were t1mmy, me, and Tudios. Cmin said he would not be a panelist when asked on AIM and said he'd be a "pianist" in our discussion. And the others are still under discussion as to if they are going to be a panelist. So, yes, our thread doescount as a PR list by all technicalities, putting this thread into a spam category because it does not fit an additional region category.
You mention that Minh did take part in the discussion (however brief), and suspiciously enough Jesse is not mentioned. The current home of the PR discussion does encourage discussion on a PR list and I can link to many posts about it. You will also see me tell people to stop spamming the thread and get back on topic, and in addition to that I can link to your posts encouraging the spamming, so don't use the spam to your advantage.
The reason MCS has been absent from our current PR list at the OSM thread is because he did not participate in the PR Tourney, and wasn't even participating in any recent event until this last weekend. What's more, if you wanted him on that list you could have voiced your opinion to those who have actually been doing work on the list instead of just complaining about it later. I haven't checked recently, but MCS probably has been added to the PR list by now (because of last weekends tourney).
Kenpachi has been posting regularly both before and after the OSU III event. There is no reason to get consent from a mod to post for an active player who is consistently posting unless you wanted to bypass some regulations, which is quite obvious that's what you have done.
Either way it's spam, at least if it were a joke it would have been funny to someone.
wow why is oregon so resistant to having a pr lol
Tommy, so far you're the only person opposed to this thread. There's no way for the PR list in the OSM thread to even be changed at all considering your guys' system has absolutely no basis. You had one PR tournament and haven't even talked about any other "PR matches". In fact, I'm pretty sure you and Timmy were the only ones who wanted to do it that way. When I took part in the discussion involving panelists, I was included as one of the candidates (and I must say I'm pretty **** qualified). Of course, you and Timmy both refused to have any sort of accurate rating system (god knows why) and instead wanted to have specific tournaments for a PR list. That's a ridiculous idea and it should not be that way at all. The reason I got consent from a mod is because the regulations stated that the tournament director had to start the thread. It wasn't to bypass anything except that I'm much more regular around here than Kenpachi, meaning I would update such a thing much more often. Also, I did mention Jesse many times. Feel free to contact him and discuss it all with him. The reason I didn't include him in my response is because you somehow overlooked the very first post where I mentioned that he and I discussed all of this.
Also, LMAO @ you guys actually updating the completely baseless PR list in the OSM thread TODAY at 3:00 PM, AFTER all of this took place. In fact, GREAT JOB ON PUTTING T0MMY as fifth in OREGON when he placed very close to LAST, while Lucius isn't even ON there at all. Seriously, you guys have got to be the most biased people in this whole rankings thing I've ever met.
Oh, and way to go adding panelists finally. Hell, you even included Aftermath who isn't even Oregon and never even wanted to be a panelist, let alone have a PR.
Honestly, this is the first update since it was FIRST put together in the summer. You clearly had little intention to change it, seeing as how there were tournaments between now and then.
Also, LMAO @ you guys actually updating the completely baseless PR list in the OSM thread TODAY at 3:00 PM, AFTER all of this took place. In fact, GREAT JOB ON PUTTING T0MMY as fifth in OREGON when he placed very close to LAST, while Lucius isn't even ON there at all. Seriously, you guys have got to be the most biased people in this whole rankings thing I've ever met.
Oh, and way to go adding panelists finally. Hell, you even included Aftermath who isn't even Oregon and never even wanted to be a panelist, let alone have a PR.
Honestly, this is the first update since it was FIRST put together in the summer. You clearly had little intention to change it, seeing as how there were tournaments between now and then.
well ?
How many do you want?
There's been at least three.
Neither does Balloon.
Oh, haha X^D
I updated the Smashwiki one but not the one here. Guess nobody in OR can be panelists because we've all crewed at some point if you want to get that vague.
EDIT: Oh, I get it, that's listing who's in Eugene. And technically, you shouldn't be listed there until you get a sweater.
and they all get quickly shut down because you guys are so opposed to the existance of a pr for some reason.Pichu guy said:
what i said still stands
Eggz
Smash Hero
this PR is like perfectly accurate, whats your problem with it Tommy?
I want this thread to remain open, so...
I'm done arguing about this at this point. If you want to have a discussion over it, contact me via AIM or MSN (in my profile) and we can talk it over with Silent Wolf present, who is probably the best of the mods to have to mediate since, as you've already stated, Omnigamer doesn't know "what's going on" in Oregon. Any other posts that aren't about Oregon players and their rankings should be removed, and I will do my best to make sure that they are removed by a mod.
I'm done arguing about this at this point. If you want to have a discussion over it, contact me via AIM or MSN (in my profile) and we can talk it over with Silent Wolf present, who is probably the best of the mods to have to mediate since, as you've already stated, Omnigamer doesn't know "what's going on" in Oregon. Any other posts that aren't about Oregon players and their rankings should be removed, and I will do my best to make sure that they are removed by a mod.
I'd rather have Silentwolf talk about this, because he'd know more about the community.
It's difficult holding a conversation with me on AIM, because the only reason why I'm online is I'm doing a lot of work with my computer, so I can only post sporadically.
It's difficult holding a conversation with me on AIM, because the only reason why I'm online is I'm doing a lot of work with my computer, so I can only post sporadically.
You're not ranked #1
This post is going to focus on the PR itself that we have. Yes, read the disclaimer that this is just a rough estimation that we quickly threw together to get things started. Who will be on the PR and how big it is we'll decide since we are the panelist. Dont go directly off of this list right now because it is still very crude and new. As time goes people will be definately move up and down. Binx the reason why you were not included in top 10 was not because of how good you are, because we really havent played that much recently, but the actual fact that ronin has consistently beaten you in tournies, and even place higher than you in many of them. I've played you, and i've played Ronin and you guys have a really different play style. Also being able to beat a person does not necessarily make you a better than them.
I believe what Bart, Jesse, and I did was instead of discussing to make a PR with the rest of Oregon, we went through and actually made in where in which the OSM thread failed several times since we just had endless amounts of posts on who should be panelist and what not. So look at it on the bright side, This thread is a a good viable thread and theres no reason to flame it any longer.
I believe what Bart, Jesse, and I did was instead of discussing to make a PR with the rest of Oregon, we went through and actually made in where in which the OSM thread failed several times since we just had endless amounts of posts on who should be panelist and what not. So look at it on the bright side, This thread is a a good viable thread and theres no reason to flame it any longer.
Eggz
Smash Hero
oh you know just how to flatter a girl :embarrass
Read back in our PR discussions, I wasn't the only one who wanted to base it on PR tourney events, quit making assumptions.
You were included as a panelist to represent Grants Pass, but because you did not host any tournaments and didn't attend as many events as others you were one of many people who were dropped, giving us only a handful of panelists and thus no reason to start a thread yet.
I updated the OSM at 3pm because I've been online arguing with you so I updated the events that I posted just before that about the tournament in January and December. There you go with your assumptions again.
Aftermath was put into parenthesis after we found out he went to WA, even though he was a qualified panelist I don't think we can include him as one because he's OoS, but I don't remember if the regulations mention about an OoS move.
I can't help if you never read the first post, it's been updated quite frequently since its conception probably before you were even a member here.
The reason why Lucious wasn't on all of the lists (there are a few of them, we've kept extensive records) is because he's only ever attended ONE TOURNAMENT----that was just a few days ago.
Let's get past all the junk, if this is Kempachi's thread, I'd rather see him post it and the panelists update it. This whole PR list was done without the discussion of the community, unlike the OSM thread in a sudden and almost secret matter. And what's more, I don't like the idea of someone who's been stalking me and harassing me online (but is fairly nice in person) to be in charge of a PR list and conveniently leaves me out of the list. You probably would have gotten my support of this otherwise, but now you've just gone and made a mess of things.
The reason Lucius is included on this PR list is because he has attended the past two tournaments. He is a **** good player. The reason you aren't on it is because you didn't place well at the last event, OSU III, where you purposefully sandbagged and lost your matches. Like I said in the disclaimer, it's based on discussion of players' placings in the past two events, and as much as possible, based on who played whom so as to get a more accurate reading on the players' skill levels. It's not at all that I "conveniently" left you off the list. You did not do well at OSU III, therefore you do not go on the PR list.
Panelists don't just represent single areas of their state. That goes against the whole idea of having state encompassing rankings. Panelists are supposed to discuss. I was never invited to a discussion. I did check the first page of OSM quite frequently. It was never updated with any sort of change in the list. Every time I looked it had the joke "OC George - Best in Oregon" who we all know hasn't been an active player for the past almost year. This alone is enough to disprove that it's any sort of serious list. It isn't an assumption of mine that you just updated it today for the first time because, again, I had checked back often to see if it had been, which it had not. That's part of the reason why I created this, since it was not being updated.
One more thing is that I'm pretty positive the Oregon community never agreed to any of the panelists that you guys came up with. It seems almost as if you guys just did all of this exactly like I did, except you did it in a much more discreet manner since it was just an update in the first post of a 110 + page thread with no change to the title.
And just a quick little refute to the "stalking and harassing" accusement. It's true that I've been replying to posts of yours in other areas of SWF. That hardly constitutes "stalking". I'm as free to go to any of those places as anybody else. I'm also probably "nice" to you in person because I hardly talk to you at all. Did you not notice how I didn't say a word to you after our ridiculous tourney match? Pretty sure I'm known for shaking hands and saying good game to everybody. Sportsmanship FTW.
I don't see how Kenpachi could start the thread and then the panelists update it. We'd need access to his account in order for that to happen, which is why I got Omni's approval in the first place.
Omni - Feel free to remove both this post and the one before it when you get around to checking out this thread.
Panelists don't just represent single areas of their state. That goes against the whole idea of having state encompassing rankings. Panelists are supposed to discuss. I was never invited to a discussion. I did check the first page of OSM quite frequently. It was never updated with any sort of change in the list. Every time I looked it had the joke "OC George - Best in Oregon" who we all know hasn't been an active player for the past almost year. This alone is enough to disprove that it's any sort of serious list. It isn't an assumption of mine that you just updated it today for the first time because, again, I had checked back often to see if it had been, which it had not. That's part of the reason why I created this, since it was not being updated.
One more thing is that I'm pretty positive the Oregon community never agreed to any of the panelists that you guys came up with. It seems almost as if you guys just did all of this exactly like I did, except you did it in a much more discreet manner since it was just an update in the first post of a 110 + page thread with no change to the title.
And just a quick little refute to the "stalking and harassing" accusement. It's true that I've been replying to posts of yours in other areas of SWF. That hardly constitutes "stalking". I'm as free to go to any of those places as anybody else. I'm also probably "nice" to you in person because I hardly talk to you at all. Did you not notice how I didn't say a word to you after our ridiculous tourney match? Pretty sure I'm known for shaking hands and saying good game to everybody. Sportsmanship FTW.
I don't see how Kenpachi could start the thread and then the panelists update it. We'd need access to his account in order for that to happen, which is why I got Omni's approval in the first place.
Omni - Feel free to remove both this post and the one before it when you get around to checking out this thread.
v4p
Smash Apprentice
this > osm.
no bias. srsly
no bias. srsly
So, basically you said the OSM thread was around first, it's updated recently, and this is supposed to support yet another PR thread?
Well, you did say something snide before we played, and, yeah, that's generally how you act with me in a competitive scene, which makes me sandbag more. I didn't even have time to offer you my hand. If you want me to play better that's not the best way to act.
You're free to post wherever you want, however trolling, flaming, and harassing isn't taken too well. I'd like to see it stopped, but I don't want to go so far as to get you banned or anything. That's why you see me "avoiding" your questions or posting silly remarks.
Well, you did say something snide before we played, and, yeah, that's generally how you act with me in a competitive scene, which makes me sandbag more. I didn't even have time to offer you my hand. If you want me to play better that's not the best way to act.
He posts the mission statement on the first post. Panelists update on subsequent. Like the OSM thread.
Doc_Holiday
Smash Ace
How could you put Ronin above me? I'll wreck Ronin.
I don't remember "flaming or harassing" you at all, but if I did I apologize.
I didn't used to act toward you in the way that I currently do though, man. You've always acted how you act and constantly johned about it. That's what sparked the attitude I have when I play against you. I want you to play better, but obviously it's your choice. The way I act shouldn't affect how you play, according to you. Take your own advice and quit worrying so much about what other people do.
If he posts the mission statement in the first post and then I follow it up, why not just have me post it all in the first place? I spoke with him plenty at OSU III about it, and he was completely fine. I couldn't get his AIM or MSN, but I would get him to come and say he endorses the thread if I could. It doesn't make any difference at all whether or not he's the one to post it. This is why I made sure prior to creating the thread that it would be okay, regardless of Oregon's "current state" and if he's "in the know" about it or whatever you want to call it (which, to be honest, I don't even know what you mean by that). I'm pretty sure many areas have PR lists that aren't started by tournament organizers.
mikeHAZE
Smash Legend
...and i thought the socal PR was bad.
mikeHAZE
Smash Legend
BANNER!?
gimpy where are you help me!
(but seriously, you guys need to calm the **** down, lol. Balloon and Tommy need to settle their differences, shut down these PR's until the next major Oregon tournament, and then discuss who should be on the PR, not based on their placement, but on consistency.)
Mike, this was based on consistency the best that it could be, especially moreso than the OSM PR list.
Timmy, I wanted to include you as a panelist, but I didn't think you'd go for it at all. Contact me and we can discuss it though. I don't see how you could be disappointed with how it's done, though. Look at it! It's so pretty! And now with the amazing banner Ronin made xD!
Timmy, I wanted to include you as a panelist, but I didn't think you'd go for it at all. Contact me and we can discuss it though. I don't see how you could be disappointed with how it's done, though. Look at it! It's so pretty! And now with the amazing banner Ronin made xD!
Peach Masta
Smash Lord
Haha so I just read that whole argument. I really don't think this is bad everyone in oregon is fine with this except Tommy so if OR agrees on the PR then this should be the OR PR.
And I liked to see Peach with the gun not duke nukem
And I liked to see Peach with the gun not duke nukem
you know...falco also has a gun and kills aliens too. he is a space animal after all. oh and he can short hop laser. get *****
Ok, this is stupid. I am giving you guys 48 hours to come up with a single power rankings solution that everyone agrees upon. Your solution must be supported by the entire state and must open panelist positions to everyone who is interested and qualified as determined by ME or Silent Wolf. Make it happen, children, or your state will not be allowed to maintain rankings of any form.
I am closing both ranking threads for the next two days.
I am closing both ranking threads for the next two days.
Silent Wolf
...
Bart,
I did not read the arguments in this thread, but I can say this:
If you really think the rankings should be like this, then surely you should be able to back up why. I say you just use Timmy's thread, and add Timmy and/or Tommy as a panelist, seeing as how they run most of the tournaments in Oregon, and have a lot of experience. Maybe even get an accurate PR? If you're really trying to get a good representation of how everyone is ranked, use more than 3 panelists. Seems like this was rushed.
EDIT - Neal posted as I was sitting here posting >_>
I did not read the arguments in this thread, but I can say this:
If you really think the rankings should be like this, then surely you should be able to back up why. I say you just use Timmy's thread, and add Timmy and/or Tommy as a panelist, seeing as how they run most of the tournaments in Oregon, and have a lot of experience. Maybe even get an accurate PR? If you're really trying to get a good representation of how everyone is ranked, use more than 3 panelists. Seems like this was rushed.
EDIT - Neal posted as I was sitting here posting >_>
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