Olimar's Matchup Thread (Old thread)

[koken]

Ryu has NOTHING to do against Olimar, believe me. Yesterday I played against like ... 5 or 8 and the metagame or the knowledge on the character is so low, that the only one who defeated me was the first one because I didn't know how Ryu worked.
Until now, no one can truly use Ryu trough his potential and even so, I don't see him like a bad MU for us.
RIP Ryu u.u ... at least against us xD.

 

[-The Gucci Fairy-]

Ryu has NOTHING to do against Olimar, believe me. Yesterday I played against like ... 5 or 8 and the metagame or the knowledge on the character is so low, that the only one who defeated me was the first one because I didn't know how Ryu worked.
Until now, no one can truly use Ryu trough his potential and even so, I don't see him like a bad MU for us.
RIP Ryu u.u ... at least against us xD.

Well...its only the 2nd day hes out..watch someone like Nairo use him to his potential give it a month and we will really see.

 

[koken]

Well...its only the 2nd day hes out..watch someone like Nairo use him to his potential give it a month and we will really see.

Totally agree, perhaps my comment was a little bit in a hurry but I think is doable anyway.
Sorry for the hurry on comment.

You could post some link though.

 

[Angbad]

Totally agree, perhaps my comment was a little bit in a hurry but I think is doable anyway.
Sorry for the hurry on comment.

You could post some link though.

I'd be really surprised if any of the dlc characters had more than an even MU against us. We can just camp ryu and roy to death.

 

[Myran]

Lucas seems to have a little poke with zair and pk fire, but even then it isn't much to get in on us.

 

[Freezie KO]

And none of them have reflectors! Rejoice!

 

[-The Gucci Fairy-]

Isn't lucas's bat (his fsmash) technically a reflector, pretty sure it is

 

[Freezie KO]

Isn't lucas's bat (his fsmash) technically a reflector, pretty sure it is

Oh no! I forgot!!!!

 

[DavemanCozy]

Can a brave explorer help me find my way to my ship? I crash landed and can't find my Airwing.
/ vs

While you guide me, please discuss this matchup by clicking on this link here.

 

[Macchiato]

Zelda can't do much against us and the same thing with Paletuna.

 

[-The Gucci Fairy-]

Zelda can't do much against us and the same thing with Paletuna.

All they really need to do is bait out our smashes then use their respective reflector. Palutena especially can spam the reflector like nothing and her down throw combos are really good for propping us up into the air and dmg as well as her upsmash light thing with its range. Zelda though i agree it would be hard to go in agains't oli since she doesn't have the best of options besides her vanish thing and her nayru's love reflector shenanigans. Keeping these all in mind,they prolly are the best options anyhow from the few times I came across these characters,not counting customs. However with customs,I believe Palutena is a significantly menacing threat with her increased mobility, although I personally have yet to look upon such things yet.

 

[Mr Moosebones]

I don't think I've ever written a message in here yet, so hi, I'm moose and I'm mostly known for my bjr play here in Ontario. I've picked up Olimar recently and while I feel like he's got a great overall MU spread, specific character and playstyle combinations have me frustrated.

Most notable is aggressive Yoshi. I play Yoshi as well so I'm not unaware of his options and what is and isn't punishable; not exactly a lack of MU knowledge on my part. I honestly have no idea what I should be doing vs this playstyle. I lost handedly to a Yoshi decidedly below my skill level that I'm certain I could have trashed with my bjr (but Yoshi is one of BJr's harder MUs so I didn't want to panic switch due to character johns). It honestly felt like everything I had was outprioritized and the rushdown and juggling were way too much to handle. I managed to whistle armour through a bunch of spikes so I felt good about that but it wasn't enough.

I know the yoshi MU has been discussed already, but it mostly covers how to deal with egg camp; that's not the issue I'm having. Yoshi's nair into landing options seems to just stomp most of my options as Olimar and I'm not sure how to beat him out without just being substantially better and making hard reads.

TL;DR how does Olimar deal with heavy rushdown vs characters with incredible priority?

EDIT: The beauty of having more than one character is that I don't necessarily need to rely on Olimar for situations like this; the game isn't complex enough that juggling multiple characters is difficult at all, but knowledge is power and I'm sure I can learn something here.

 

[Myran]

Run away a lot. Pivot grab if he keeps coming at you, and doesn't wanna abuse his projectiles. Try to have a Pikmin on him as well since if he hits it when attack he's stuck in extra hitlag and becomes punishable. Not sure if you know this, but Pikmin have no priority normally so you have to find ways around this. If a move hits a Pikmin before your attack, say a Pikmin attached onto them before you hit their attack with fsmash you'll win. (I believe this works on all moves if done correctly, need to do specific testing) Olimar eats aggression up unless it's incredibly precise and only on certain characters. Just abuse pivot attacks and use jab/dtilt/utilt to cover up close options since they're your fastest moves. Also keep purples handy to knock people away. Main thing is to keep respecting the opponents hitboxes since you'll lose normal trades.

 

[Mr Moosebones]

I appreciate the quick response! Most of what you said is stuff I try to do by default, but having it repeated by someone else is going to help me internalize it. Much thanks!

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

Thoughts on the Wario MU?

 

[Soulimar]

Thoughts on the Wario MU?

I have played against one wario one time. I think Olimar does pretty well in this matchup though. The main thing about the matchup, in my experience, is respecting everything that wario has. Wario has 93 kill moves which you all need to be careful of. In a 2 stock meta especially, the waft + rage makes it so even at almost an entire stock advantage, the game is even and you need to watch out for his bike frame traps into the waft. One of wario's strongest tools in every matchup is his chomp. The chomp covers many defensive options against many characters (Shield, Spotdodge), as well as covering offensive smash attacks from Olimar. Pick up on the bite habits from the Wario player as I think most land with it more than they should. In almost every situation when wario is in the air (which is the majority of the match), I like just dashing away and punishing the landing with a pivot grab so I dont get bit through my shield or out prioritized with his nair. Being used to brawl, I had trouble adapting to the new bike. It legitimately always has a hitbox and you cant grab wario out of it like you could in brawl. Just respect it and shield but be cautious if wario jumps and quickly chomps you. Although Wario has 93 kills moves, several of these are very very laggy and can actually be OoS up-smashed. Another thing worth noting is that Wario mains are great at mindgaming with the bike when edgeguarding, wanting you to roll into an up smash or something. Keeping an eye on the warios movement when you're recovering can help you know if its safe enough to just sit on the ledge and wait for his bike to stop bouncing. Spacing and zoning him out in the neutral is huge as it is in every matchup as Olimar.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNxEGNPa3oo This video can help you get at least a brief understanding of the matchup. Just ignore game 1 That one was for data

 

[Blue Banana]

Being used to brawl, I had trouble adapting to the new bike. It legitimately always has a hitbox and you cant grab wario out of it like you could in brawl. Just respect it and shield but be cautious if wario jumps and quickly chomps you.

Even though you can't grab Wario off of the bike like in Brawl, I do remember one time playing a Wario on For Glory that you can still knock him off with a Fsmash or purple side B.

 

[Freezie KO]

I don't think I've ever written a message in here yet, so hi, I'm moose and I'm mostly known for my bjr play here in Ontario. I've picked up Olimar recently and while I feel like he's got a great overall MU spread, specific character and playstyle combinations have me frustrated.

Most notable is aggressive Yoshi. I play Yoshi as well so I'm not unaware of his options and what is and isn't punishable; not exactly a lack of MU knowledge on my part. I honestly have no idea what I should be doing vs this playstyle. I lost handedly to a Yoshi decidedly below my skill level that I'm certain I could have trashed with my bjr (but Yoshi is one of BJr's harder MUs so I didn't want to panic switch due to character johns). It honestly felt like everything I had was outprioritized and the rushdown and juggling were way too much to handle. I managed to whistle armour through a bunch of spikes so I felt good about that but it wasn't enough.

I know the yoshi MU has been discussed already, but it mostly covers how to deal with egg camp; that's not the issue I'm having. Yoshi's nair into landing options seems to just stomp most of my options as Olimar and I'm not sure how to beat him out without just being substantially better and making hard reads.

TL;DR how does Olimar deal with heavy rushdown vs characters with incredible priority?

EDIT: The beauty of having more than one character is that I don't necessarily need to rely on Olimar for situations like this; the game isn't complex enough that juggling multiple characters is difficult at all, but knowledge is power and I'm sure I can learn something here.

Myran covered this well, but I just want to say that I used to have a lot of trouble with Yoshi until I started abusing pivot f-smash. It didn't suddenly become an easy matchup, but aggressive Yoshi's will usually come in somewhat predictably with nair (or dair sometimes). Olimar can space himself just outside Yoshi's landing by just running away, then a few frames before they touch the ground, pivot and fsmash them. The fsmash will connect with their landing, which is one of the few times Yoshi isn't throwing out some invulnerable quick-frame-data attack.

Also, Yoshi will wreck your pikmin pretty easily as you throw them on him. Don't worry about this. Aside from the cries of the dead, this can actually be a good thing as he's helping you rotate through pikmin to get to a purple pikmin. While purples are worse for the pivot fsmash (due to range), they're very good against Yoshi's that try to spam cross-up dash attacks.

 

[koken]

I have played against one wario one time. I think Olimar does pretty well in this matchup though. The main thing about the matchup, in my experience, is respecting everything that wario has. Wario has 93 kill moves which you all need to be careful of. In a 2 stock meta especially, the waft + rage makes it so even at almost an entire stock advantage, the game is even and you need to watch out for his bike frame traps into the waft. One of wario's strongest tools in every matchup is his chomp. The chomp covers many defensive options against many characters (Shield, Spotdodge), as well as covering offensive smash attacks from Olimar. Pick up on the bite habits from the Wario player as I think most land with it more than they should. In almost every situation when wario is in the air (which is the majority of the match), I like just dashing away and punishing the landing with a pivot grab so I dont get bit through my shield or out prioritized with his nair. Being used to brawl, I had trouble adapting to the new bike. It legitimately always has a hitbox and you cant grab wario out of it like you could in brawl. Just respect it and shield but be cautious if wario jumps and quickly chomps you. Although Wario has 93 kills moves, several of these are very very laggy and can actually be OoS up-smashed. Another thing worth noting is that Wario mains are great at mindgaming with the bike when edgeguarding, wanting you to roll into an up smash or something. Keeping an eye on the warios movement when you're recovering can help you know if its safe enough to just sit on the ledge and wait for his bike to stop bouncing. Spacing and zoning him out in the neutral is huge as it is in every matchup as Olimar.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNxEGNPa3oo This video can help you get at least a brief understanding of the matchup. Just ignore game 1 That one was for data

Even though Soulimar (which is a great player by the way) covered almost everything, I want to add:

When Wario is approaching with bike, and you have enough timing, prefer a Bair to his face over the front wheel whenever you can.

 

[Myran]

To add on to the other players methods of punish bike, you can jump with an up air to read their jump from it. Alternatively if you don't feel comfortable with throwing out a faster single hit move like fair/bair you can throw out a nair right above the bike, and let him run into it.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

Thanks for the response on the Wario MU. I thought I had a handle on the MU. But when I used Oli for the first time in tourney it didn't go well at all. It actually destroyed my confidence in my Olimar. But there's a pretty large skill gap and he knew the MU a lot better than I did and I couldn't really establish any type of stage control and those bites.... But I'm going to put more work into Oli and try him a bit more.

 

[Mr Moosebones]

Yeah I've found that just following his bike movement and making the uair read is pretty substantial in the MU. Wario is one of those characters that preys on his opponent's lack of MU knowledge. He's still got a really strong moveset outside the intrinsic gimmicks of his movement though. I wouldn't give up on Olimar just because you had issues with a particularly complicated MU.

 

[Blue Banana]

Any advice on the (Dr.) Mario matchup? I played a couple of Doctors--one a few months ago and one recently today on Anther's. The trajectory of the pills mess me up moreso than any other projectile so far, Super Sheet kills the Pikmin too quickly to build up damage in neutral and just threatens me in mid-/close range, and his frame data is too fast to find openings on him. I would think this would also apply to help on the Plumber matchup also, with faster movement speed and F.L.U.D.D. over Tornado.

 

[Myran]

Any advice on the (Dr.) Mario matchup? I played a couple of Doctors--one a few months ago and one recently today on Anther's. The trajectory of the pills mess me up moreso than any other projectile so far, Super Sheet kills the Pikmin too quickly to build up damage in neutral and just threatens me in mid-/close range, and his frame data is too fast to find openings on him. I would think this would also apply to help on the Plumber matchup also, with faster movement speed and F.L.U.D.D. over Tornado.

Pivot grab a lot, throw out some early smashes to get them into caping then punish with side-b's, jabs, aerials, and dtilt. Grabs will be your main killing method though. Gotta respect like everything they do.

 

[WispBae]

Howdy there, tiny invaders! The Doggy boards are discussing this MU, and would love your input on it!

Click on this picture of this DAMN OLIMAR INPERSONATOR to go right to the thread!

 

[Planty]

How do you feel about the Megaman matchup? I feel like it's incredibly easy. If a pikmin latches onto Megaman, he loses his projectiles.....And if it attaches to his upper body, his only option to get them off is uptilt or upsmash. Do I have to say anything else?

But I just don't feel like it's that easy for some reason... Are there any projectiles he could still use with pikmin on him? Or does he have better ways to get them off of his upper body? Or does he have ANYTHING???

 

[Blue Banana]

How do you feel about the Megaman matchup? I feel like it's incredibly easy. If a pikmin latches onto Megaman, he loses his projectiles.....And if it attaches to his upper body, his only option to get them off is uptilt or upsmash. Do I have to say anything else?

But I just don't feel like it's that easy for some reason... Are there any projectiles he could still use with pikmin on him? Or does he have better ways to get them off of his upper body? Or does he have ANYTHING???

The matchup against Megaman is basically a test of patience between both players. Megaman will be constantly throwing out Metal Blades and Crash Bombers at you at neutral, so you'll need to watch if Megaman is mixing up throwing them out and protect yourself accordingly. SideB will stuff Crash Bombers while Fsmash and purple sideB clanks out Metal Blades. The only projectile that becomes ineffective if a pikmin is latched onto Mega is Charge Shot (Fsmash), so you want to get a pikmin on him often to minimize the threat of Charge Shot. Jab/nair can kill Pikmin easily, though. Pellets are the only projectile that I don't know what to do with yet (if it's possible), but it is only limited at mid-range.

Watch for his approaches. Mega will probably go for a grab if you get hit by a Metal Blade or with Leaf Shield active. If you catch Mega setting up Leaf Shield, you can grab him if you're fast enough. Dash attacks are punishable as long as you're playing safe. Watch for any glide toss approaches with Metal Blade. Be careful and play safe at close range; Utilt/Dsmash can KO you early if Mega catches on a mistake but is punishable if whiffed.

Recover low offstage; Uair makes recovering high risky. Be careful of Hard Knuckle spikes.

 

[Planty]

I remember that I faced a megaman once and he couldn't throw ANYTHING with the Pikmin on him. Was it just really perfect positioning of the Pikmin or something?

But, Olimar is the campiest character in the game, meaning he forces Megaman to approach. And megaman isnt known for his approach...

 

[Blue Banana]

As long as Olimar can keep up with Mega's projectiles, the only thing that could make Mega not approach are pellets, because they're the only projectiles that completely stop Pikmin. Even if Fsmash/purple side B clanks through one pellet, the second or so pellet will still stop them.

 

[-The Gucci Fairy-]

I remember that I faced a megaman once and he couldn't throw ANYTHING with the Pikmin on him. Was it just really perfect positioning of the Pikmin or something?

But, Olimar is the campiest character in the game, meaning he forces Megaman to approach. And megaman isnt known for his approach...

Lol catch a good MK with a lead he'll time u out with all those jumps,teleports and recoveries he'll be camping for days ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

[Mr Moosebones]

Good mega mens are a pain in the ass. I'd say the MU is probably even, but due to the nature of the matchup you need to stop yourself from getting frustrated and keep your cool or else you'll lose it.

 

[Soulimar]

Any custom villager advice?

 

[Freezie KO]

Just dropping in to complain about the Mario matchup. I believe it to be our worst. He can out camp us, has one of the best reflectors, has insane aerial mobility to cross us up, easily kills pikmin with nair, has easy bake combos, and has better frame data on every single move.

Ugh. It'd still be unbearable without the degenerative design decision of making everything Olimar does a projectile, but we can't even have that.

 

[Blue Banana]

Just dropping in to complain about the Mario matchup. I believe it to be our worst. He can out camp us, has one of the best reflectors, has insane aerial mobility to cross us up, easily kills pikmin with nair, has easy bake combos, and has better frame data on every single move.

Ugh. It'd still be unbearable without the degenerative design decision of making everything Olimar does a projectile, but we can't even have that.

Pivot grab a lot, throw out some early smashes to get them into caping then punish with side-b's, jabs, aerials, and dtilt. Grabs will be your main killing method though. Gotta respect like everything they do.

I'm not sure if you already read this, but this is the advice that I got for the Mario matchup a few days ago.

Is there a specific part of the matchup that you feel like you're having the most trouble with? Do the Mario players that you fight against have some sort of pattern that you can identify (attack, dodge, attack, dodge, etc.)?

 

[Freezie KO]

I'm not sure if you already read this, but this is the advice that I got for the Mario matchup a few days ago.

Is there a specific part of the matchup that you feel like you're having the most trouble with? Do the Mario players that you fight against have some sort of pattern that you can identify (attack, dodge, attack, dodge, etc.)?

There are two "patterns" I struggle with. The first is relentless aerial approach. By approaching with nair or that spinning move (dair), they're either at point blank range or behind me. If they land behind my shield, I will get grabbed or hit. If they land point blank, I feel like even my jab loses to whatever their option is. And forget about grabbing because Olimar's grab whiffs at point blank range. If they land in fsmash range, I either fsmash (which clanks with nair) or Mario is on the ground and I can get reflected. Then when I grab (and maybe this is only online) I sometimes get hit out of my grab from moves like dsmash.

The other pattern, if they're not in my face, they're full hopping and throwing fireballs. If I contest fireballs with pikmin, I eventually run out of "active" pikmin, and he runs in. If I jump over the fireballs, he can get to me faster than I can get back to the ground and reestablish some sort of zone control. And if a fireball hit confirms, he's right there to follow up.

I try to pivot fsmash through fireballs, but it either clanks with nair (or anything really) or Mario can run faster than me and cape it. He can cape anything on reaction because anything I throw out can be caped. Pivot grabs usually get me hit by fireballs. And pivoting anything, while great, always cedes stage control if the best I can hope for is a clank.

Going to the air isn't an option because Olimar's aerials clank with everything Mario throws out and approaching with aerials is just asking to get shield grabbed. Our nair is beaten by everything, but worst by Mario's invincible up smash because we're just an approaching hurtbox.

I'd rather play against Sheik. :/

 

[Flawlessh]

@ F Freezie KO

Im pretty sure our dtilt clanks if not beats mario's sourspot nair, dair and fireball. And if he approaching, what I do for every character in the cast, if they are airborne is i pivot fsmash, wait till there close to you or about to land, and pivot out of there range of grab, tilt, nair, or whatever. and if you space correctly, even if he capes your pivot smash, the pikmin will still be out of range of hitting yourself. And if there approaching from the ground, just pivot grab and if you whiff, then spam jab / dtilt.

I also saw yesterday at CEO, whenever myran whiffed an fsmash and then the opponent rushed in to punish, he just dtilt'd, as its fast, and has good priority over other attacks.

 

[Freezie KO]

@ F Freezie KO

Im pretty sure our dtilt clanks if not beats mario's sourspot nair, dair and fireball. And if he approaching, what I do for every character in the cast, if they are airborne is i pivot fsmash, wait till there close to you or about to land, and pivot out of there range of grab, tilt, nair, or whatever. and if you space correctly, even if he capes your pivot smash, the pikmin will still be out of range of hitting yourself. And if there approaching from the ground, just pivot grab and if you whiff, then spam jab / dtilt.

I also saw yesterday at CEO, whenever myran whiffed an fsmash and then the opponent rushed in to punish, he just dtilt'd, as its fast, and has good priority over other attacks.

I guess I have to get better at pivot-fsmash. I feel like I always end up clanking with nair (if Mario is in air) or fearing the cape. Dtilt is something I should try more for sure. That's good advice. Thanks.

 

[Flawlessh]

I guess I have to get better at pivot-fsmash. I feel like I always end up clanking with nair (if Mario is in air) or fearing the cape. Dtilt is something I should try more for sure. That's good advice. Thanks.

to get better at pivot fsmash, the new option added into controls, a+b = smash, USE THAT. it makes pivot smashing insanely easy its like doing a pivot f-tilt, except u press b at the same time (just use your thumb to press both buttons if your using a gc controller, its really lenient on giving you both buttons)

 

[Formaldehyde]

Hey guys, I just attended my very first tournament this weekend and I tried my luck with Alph. I did pretty solid against most of the competition but when I came across a Sonic main I had to change to Rosilina, as I could get the sonic very close to finishing, but never quite closed the match, he was just too fast for me to get a reliable grab on and his up airs kept me from landing safley for quite a while. I managed to disrupt some of his homing attacks with my pikmin but other than that it was a fairly hard MU for me, I really want to be able to stick with Alph as where I'm from there's very little (that I know of) experienced Olimar Players.

TLDR: Any advice on the Sonic MU?

 

[Mr Moosebones]

Throwing a pikmin on him puts him in consistent hitlag if he tries to side/down b at you. Double fsmash is really good vs him as well because the first fsmash will clank his approach and then you can attack with the second fsmash for free since you're not stuck in the clank animation. It doesn't feel that tricky to me honestly.