Official MD/VA Power Rankings! Updated March 22nd.

[hot$]

Too bad my name is pronounced more so as Ron.

While people believe it sounds like Ran.

You guys seem like chill people to hang with though. <3

I'm sure Shaeman's willing to drive to Richmond if people from NoVA go.

How far exactly are you from Richmond? For the longest time i used to associate Richmond being down at the bottom of the state, but now i know its ~ in the middle ^__^

 

[rhan]

From where I'm located about an hour. From Shaeman's it's about an hour and 30.

 

[hot$]

From where I'm located about an hour. From Shaeman's it's about an hour and 30.

I gotcha, not too bad i suppose.. about the same as here more or less.. (nova)
But Laijin was right, alot of us Md/Va have never / rarely get to play Sova people. I can say i've never played anyone. I think the only one i played was The Doug during pools at pound haha.
Oh and I always read your name as "ron" and not "ran", maybe it differs per person? =D

We should have an official vote on this IMO.
Only MD/VA players should be able to vote on the poll.

Again, I agree with you.

 

[Wenbobular]

Well they're still pretty clearly the best players in our region, it's just people like Savedge that we can't really rank

I can probably beat him in dittos though [/callout]
:D

 

[Mahone]

i think wenbo would beat savedge in fox and falcon dittos tbh

 

[hot$]

Well they're still pretty clearly the best players in our region, it's just people like Savedge that we can't really rank

I can probably beat him in dittos though [/callout]
:D

I'm not talking about Richmond players. If I'm not mistaken, Richmond players are separate from "SOVA" players, They're not combined. I believe the argument is, "if we are including Richmond players, then we should include SOVA as well". But Yes Richmond players are our top players, but the debate is more so about the inclusion of Sova or not.

Do I have this right Laijin?

 

[Mahone]

nvm... its 8am and im tired

 

[Wenbobular]

I'm 99% sure he's talking about Richmond also

 

[Redd]

I'm 99% sure he's talking about Richmond also

Same. And we can really vote on if you want Laijin, but we all already know the result lol. Maryland/Virginia is a geographical name and thus encompasses all of both states haha.

 

[thumbswayup]

the only thing young links do is rhan away

lmao

Ran is a Kurosawa film, so that is what I'll call you. F ron

I beat Savedge pretty badly in dittos last time I played him. He also got 2-0'd by Clyde in tournament. I'm fairly positive Wenbo would beat him.

 

[Laijin]

I'm not taking many super long drives in my 96 Honda Accord. The car is old LOL.

Richmond is included in SoVA since we literally see them as often as we do tristate and are they in our region? And MD basically 100% never plays with any of south Virginia. I know their all in VA overall, but I'm just trying to wrap the concept of how you guys actually are planning to have a justifiable PR when half the players in the pool you have to choose from have never played each other. Just doesn't make any sort of logical sense to me. How do you honestly determine who is better than who if they have never played/been to the same tournaments even. Its like taking a shot in the dark. And this is just as bad as putting players in there that you only get to play like twice a year.

I mean honestly. Last year after living in MD for about 8 months I didn't even know Tope or Cyrain lived in VA. I did not meet them till I went to a national in FLORIDA. And then I was even more surprised that they lived in VA cause I had never seen them till then.

Anyways yea. Explain how you plan on determining the PR.

 

[hot$]

I'm 99% sure he's talking about Richmond also

Same. And we can really vote on if you want Laijin, but we all already know the result lol. Maryland/Virginia is a geographical name and thus encompasses all of both states haha.

Richmond is included in SoVA since we literally see them as often as we do tristate and are they in our region? And MD basically 100% never plays with any of south Virginia. I know their all in VA overall, but I'm just trying to wrap the concept of how you guys actually are planning to have a justifiable PR when half the players in the pool you have to choose from have never played each other. Just doesn't make any sort of logical sense to me. How do you honestly determine who is better than who if they have never played/been to the same tournaments even. Its like taking a shot in the dark. And this is just as bad as putting players in there that you only get to play like twice a year.

I mean honestly. Last year after living in MD for about 8 months I didn't even know Tope or Cyrain lived in VA. I did not meet them till I went to a national in FLORIDA. And then I was even more surprised that they lived in VA cause I had never seen them till then.

Anyways yea. Explain how you plan on determining the PR.

Okay I miss interpreted, so they are often "bunched together" okay. As for not playing them often, yeah that seems to be the case.

 

[thumbswayup]

Anyone who is good and lives in MD/VA will be on the PR. That means people who enter tournaments and perform well will be on it. If they don't fit into either of those categories they won't be on it. This shouldn't be hard because chu will be added to the list probably

 

[Laijin]

Anyone who is good and lives in MD/VA will be on the PR. That means people who enter tournaments and perform well will be on it. If they don't fit into either of those categories they won't be on it. This shouldn't be hard because chu will be added to the list probably

You can't honestly determine who is good if majority of the people in the pool of players you have to choose from have never played each other. In all fairness, you just simply can't do that. What will end up happening is you will just be like "Well this guy over here is well known and awesome while I have no idea who this guy over here is so he must not be very good. And this guy over here seems pretty good, but he has never played these awesome players that I know very well so theres no way he can be on the PR"

 

[thumbswayup]

Dude it's top TEN not top TWENTY. The people who aren't known aren't known for a reason (no offense). They'd be taken into consideration for a 20, but for 10 it's pretty obvious what the list is going to end up like.

 

[Laijin]

Dude it's top TEN not top TWENTY. The people who aren't known aren't known for a reason (no offense). They'd be taken into consideration for a 20, but for 10 it's pretty obvious what the list is going to end up like.

And once again, like I said.
There is not a shred of fairness at that point.

 

[thumbswayup]

Since when were PRs fair? I think we all disagree with the current list, and someone's always going to not approve of anything in the end. Results speak for themselves. You want to do something about it? Enter and ****, don't sit back and complain if you don't attend anything or don't do well. Nut up or shut up

 

[Laijin]

Example of what I mean be fairness:
I don't think its fair that someone gets to sit at the very top of the PRs when they only show up to local tournaments like..once or twice a year. How in any sense is that accurate in determining who is the best in the region at this exact current moment? Not 6 months ago when they showed up to a local tournament.

Another example:
You can't honestly create the entire tier list just based on people who show up to tournaments and win. I'm fairly sure SOVA has their own set of tournaments and the usual people down there win those. So how do you determine if those people are better than the players who win tournaments in MD? You can't. You literally ****ing can't. Its impossible if they have never played.

 

[Wenbobular]

Well you see
Cyrain got top 10 of Pound 5
Whereas someone here didn't make it out of round 1 pools
Pound 5 was basically a really big local anyways and Cyrain outplaced us all
I don't know how Tope did

 

[thumbswayup]

You mean Tope and Cyrain? They always go to oos tournies and ****. And yes I know they rarely show up to locals but you cannot deny their skill. They STILL play and ENTER tournies, hell they may not be locals but they do. And when they are THAT good you can't place someone mediocre above them, you just can't.

lmao@ wenbo

 

[ChivalRuse]

I knew about Laijin before I knew about Thumbs.

That is all.

 

[Laijin]

Well you see
Cyrain got top 10 of Pound 5
Whereas someone here didn't make it out of round 1 pools
Pound 5 was basically a really big local anyways and Cyrain outplaced us all
I don't know how Tope did

You mean Tope and Cyrain? They always go to oos tournies and ****. And yes I know they rarely show up to locals but you cannot deny their skill. They STILL play and ENTER tournies, hell they may not be locals but they do. And when they are THAT good you can't place someone mediocre above them, you just can't.

lmao@ wenbo

Not to sound like a ****..
But I thought we were comparing our own players within our own region, not our own players compared to the rest of the country. Fairly sure that would belong in a national PR or something lol. OOS tournaments are relevent and count yes, but most importantly its about how they stack up to players in their own region. Like I said before, you can't really compare them to the rest of the players in the region if they never play with them.

This isn't about denying anyones skill. Their good.
But you can't logically make a fair/accurate comparison of them with the rest of the region if they never play the rest of the region. Same goes for SoVA not playing MD/NoVA

Edit: So correct me if I'm wrong, but PRs are about how the players stack up against each other, right?

 

[Bones0]

At this point, I still agree with Laijin, but I don't care enough. Just pin Tope and Cyrain to the top of the PR and let people who've never even played them ignore them. :|

 

[Wenbobular]

I think comparing how we all did at a tournament we all went to is quite accurate ...

 

[Bones0]

I think comparing how we all did at a tournament we all went to is quite accurate ...

But if only the only results taken into account are large nationals because those are the only events they both parties attend, we'd be just as justified putting PP and Mango on the PR. What it comes down to is that power rankings are for regional performance, and regions are inevitably going to be determined more by distance between people than borders of states. Sure, it's called a MD/VA PR, but only because people in MD and VA Smash a lot because they live close. If I lived 10-15 minutes north of where I am now I would be considered PA, but should that automatically exclude me from this region's PR? I don't think it should.

 

[Wenbobular]

Well then you'd be part of PA's power ranking ~_~
What difference does it make anyways haha

 

[thumbswayup]

It wouldn't be a national PR because we all live in MD/VA. How we perform oos is just as important HENCE a POWER RANKING for others to see. What's the point if we're only looking at locals here, why would we even make a list? So the people who play each other all the time can confirm what they already know? Hell no, it's to create a more competitive environment and give incentive for us all to get better SPECIFICALLY to place higher at nationals and oos tournies. Because, quite frankly, the scene here isn't as big as other places. And until we get a lot of oos ers coming back here to our tournies it'll stay that way.

You're making it out to be a list that is only going to be seen and only matters to the people of this region, which isn't true.

 

[Bones0]

Well then you'd be part of PA's power ranking ~_~
What difference does it make anyways haha

Yeah, but just because I attend PA tournaments as well as MD/VA tournaments doesn't mean I should be excluded.

It wouldn't be a national PR because we all live in MD/VA. How we perform oos is just as important HENCE a POWER RANKING for others to see. What's the point if we're only looking at locals here, why would we even make a list? So the people who play each other all the time can confirm what they already know? Hell no, it's to create a more competitive environment and give incentive for us all to get better SPECIFICALLY to place higher at nationals and oos tournies. Because, quite frankly, the scene here isn't as big as other places. And until we get a lot of oos ers coming back here to our tournies it'll stay that way.

You're making it out to be a list that is only going to be seen and only matters to the people of this region, which isn't true.

I agree OOS performances should have a HUGE bearing on PRs, but my point is that the PR should not be ENTIRELY based on nationals. If Sova plays MD as often as Cali (only at nationals), does it really matter that one state is closer than the other?

The only reason anyone is even considering having Sova included in the PR is because the state borders offer an ARBITRARY cut off. All I am arguing is that we are intellectually capable of realizing that tournament attendance is drastically more important in determining what constitutes a "region" than random lines on a map are. If the US had divided Virginia into two states: Vir (north) & Ginia (south), this would not even be an argument. It would be a MD/Vir PR because those are the people that play against each other. Ginia would have their own PR with the people in their region.

If the purpose of PRs is to promote competitiveness amongst a region, I fail to see how including people NOT in our region (state =/= region) who will only be competing against us at nationals will assist in that goal. If Cyrain is considered the best in our region, there is less competition being promoted because the top MD players do not have a CHANCE to compete against his placings except at nationals. If you are mostly worried about calling them MD/VA PRs and leaving out good VA players, then I can understand that, but the solution is to call them MD/NoVA PRs, not include a completely disjointed community.

 

[Wenbobular]

Like I said
I've seen Richmond at Sypher's
Just one sure
But it's not like they're out of reach if we wanted to play them
I mean they're only a bit farther than Graphix is from home for me

 

[Bones0]

If Richmond actually decides to go to Sypher's often enough to earn their rankings, I'd be more than fine with them being on the PR. You would still have to include a cutoff somewhere though because most of SoVA would definitely not be coming up to Sypher's frequently enough to be considered within our region. It'll end up being a MD/NoVA PR list no matter what, unless someone magically starts driving 3-4 hours for regionals.

 

[Omni]

lol @ the complexity of this. it's like u guys have never seen a PR before

if u wanna be better then cyrain then do well. PR's are updated usually every 2 months or so and it fluctuates based on tourny attendance and placement.

saying u cant compete against Cyrain cuz u dont go to the same tourny he does is ridics. that's why there's a panel who can judge how strong a placing at a certain tournament is and use it to figure out where they should be compared to other players

if i go to CA and get 1st, 2nd, and 3rd at 3 tournaments and u guys stay here and someone gets 5th 7th and 9th it's a no brainer.

it's MD/VA. always has been. always will be. no johns.

 

[Laijin]

Hey guys. We might as well add Ultimascout to our PR for consideration since he comes to our tournaments more often than Richmond/SoVA does.

Edit: The only logical reason anyone has given for including all of VA in our PRs is that VA is an entire state and therefore we should include the entire state.
That makes no sense at all if we don't play each other. Like Bones said.

The point you made Omni doesn't add up either.
Sure it matters that you got 1st 2nd and 3rd at some CA tournaments, but it wouldn't matter AT ALL if you didn't play the local players in your own region ever cause you can't possibly 100% accurately say how well you would do against the people in your region if you have not played them in 6 months. Thats a long time period and people can, and have gotten significantly better over that time.

Point is. You can't say Player X beats Player Y if the last time they played was 6+ months ago/never.

 

[Omni]

laijin, you don't have to play against each other in order to rank yourself against each other

power rankings are not based on how well you do against each other head-to-head. it's about how well you perform in tournaments period.

 

[Laijin]

I was under the assumption that power rankings determine who is the best in your region. Logically, the only way to figure that out is to have the region play each other. I'm still not agreeing to OOS tournaments counting 100% on how you actually perform against players in your own region, cause thats basically what you're saying unless im understanding this wrong.

 

[Omni]

power rankings do determine who is the best in your region
having your region play against each other does not automatically define who the best is in the region
best players are defined by their tournament placings overall including in-state and OoS

you have this notion that a Power Rankings thread is based on how well a player does within his own region but it's not limited to just that. it never has been.

 

[Laijin]

power rankings do determine who is the best in your region
having your region play against each other does not automatically define who the best is in the region
best players are defined by their tournament placings overall including in-state and OoS

you have this notion that a Power Rankings thread is based on how well a player does within his own region but it's not limited to just that. it never has been.

Not saying its limited to only in-state tournaments. It is indeed ranked by both instate and OOS.
But specifically in our case, we only have OOS tournaments to compare and rank majority of the players here. My argument is I don't believe this is an accurate way to determine who is the best in the region.

 

[Omni]

yes, but as of now you have to start with what you have. if you're not having enough in-state tournaments you don't suddenly say, "well instead of making it MD/VA it needs to be MD/and some parts of VA". right now you guys are ranked based on a specific amount of results over a certain time period.

what needs to happen is that there is a down-time where tournaments can occur in-state and out of state. once that down-time is over (usually 2 months) you'll have a pool of results hopefully from in-state and out of state. then you update the power rankings as so.

 

[rhan]

I'm with Omni. Tourneys is what determines PR's.Then I believe local players who don't travel but deserve to be on the PR's should have their spot.

 

[CTL17]

Is Steve having another one of those arguments where we actually all agree on something but it's one opinion that's actually what we're arguing about?

In terms of regionals, we never see some people, so I see what Clyde is saying.

 

[BigWenz]

gotta agree wit thumbs on this one. I feel nationals are really good indicator because it truly shows how good you are. Nationals show who is good at adapting quickly to people they have never played before or rarely play. This skill is why the pros are infact the pros. A ranking which just involves us playing each other isnt too helpful considering after a while we pick up on each others play styles and know whats coming. A great part of this game is not knowing what ur opponent likes to do and still getting that great read that leads into a WTFHAX combo and hopefully death.

Point is without taking into account Nationals were we play different people, a PR would not be an accurate reading of who is the best because it isnt a true reading of skill level.