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Oasis Mafia - Over!

LaserGuy

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In Quarantine
BoomFrog:

This one is a lot harder for me. BoomFrog's content isn't as comprehensive on Sabrar and I feel like I rely a lot more on tone and meta to read BoomFrog than his actual content. Especially in D1.
-Little to comment on before #173. I generally like this post, though it's very light on detail.
-The change on Jackrito at #194 is weird as has been discussed before. Especially considering how close these posts are in time. Jack posted a couple of times in the interim but I'm surprised how quickly Boom backs down here.
-Fell on the side of Ninja being Town. His reasoning on the situation is plausible.
-I don't really like #639 where Boom "parses" UP's quotes. But the simplified version in #706 is reasonable.
-Big jump to 3DS scum in #1000. Jackrito also moved up here. I feel like Boom kind of ran out of scumreads at this stage. I have seen this happen to Town occasionally, but I do feel it happens a bit more often to scum who are less assertive.
-#1108 is really hard to evaluate without meta. There is no way this case will ever go anywhere. I have to imagine BoomFrog would know this.
-#1265. Eventually votes 3DS. I do feel like Boom was unhappy with the 3DS lynch but realized he couldn't do better.
-Starts pushing back on UP in D2 when he shows up. Appears to resolve his differences with Sabrar
-

There's not a lot there that I feel really strongly about one way or the other. The interaction with Jackrito in #173/#194 doesn't make a lot of sense to me, and Boom never really comes back to Jackrito in a substantial way. I could see a plausible narrative around #1000 that BoomFrog, being low on time and having trouble keeping up on the thread, couldn't, as scum, dig around enough to make up some decent scumreads and had to go back on his 3DS-Town push. I'd probably mark him down as a scum lean. I can also see how you might arrive at the conclusion that Boom and Sabrar are scum putting on a show, FWIW.
 

LaserGuy

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In a world of Boom/Sabrar team #1108 simply never happens because Boom would have told me what points to make (and have LaserGuy back me up), instead of waiting on LG and then making a case on me.
And lucky for you this can never be proven unless Boom saved the link to our scum-chat in Crossover.
I don't think I can say anything that definitive here, honestly. I don't recall how detailed you two were in coaching each other on at the level of answering a particular question directed from a third party. I think as scum you are probably more careful answering a question about a buddy than what you provided here, but I think scum!Boom 100% busses you if that's all you gave him to work with.

If you go to quicktopic.com, you should be able to see all of your old chats.
 

Xivii

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Vote Count 2.2.1


Boom (3) - Wisp. Ran, UP [L-2]


Laser (2) - Z25, Jack


UP (1) - Boom


Jack (1) - Laser


Not Voting (2)
Sabrar, Pokechu
P33-P38
UP #Z25
Wisp #Boom
Boom #UP
Ran #Boom
Laser #Jack
Z25 #Laser
Jack #Laser
Ran #Unv

P39-P40
Ran #Boom
UP #Boom
Up #Unv
Up #Boom

Notes
It's not necessary to unvote before voting again.

Players and Events
Link

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to execute!

Day 2 Ends: Tuesday, April 28, 2020, 11:59 pm
 

Wiisp

Smash Lord
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1,783
Cool. Not surprising.

Z25 Z25 You never answered my question. Why did you essentially claim vannila town? You should know VT claiming is bad for powertown.

ranmaru ranmaru Why are you following one of your top scum reads on a bandwagon?

Wiisp Wiisp What happened to Exlight must be the same alignment as you or the game is broken?

UtopianPoyzin UtopianPoyzin So you have an explanation now for voting me D1, but didn't have one when I asked D1. Without the use of sarcastic capitalization. convince me that you didn't just make up the reason today.
well in a world of 2 or 3 its not unlikely we can the same alignment
but I thought about it
also mechanics don't outweigh analytics

I wonder if the wolves seriously thought I was an easy target?
Jackrito Jackrito
they must not know that I don't get mislynched
 

Wiisp

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1,783
I mean it was good
It helps me read him
but I don't see why it should change my read on you or boom?

I mean you are fine? Boom should die today, and based on what he flips, mafia or town
I will still make sure to do my due diligence in regards to you and UP
but I really can't see myself turning on ZDS/Ranmaru/Jack
 

ranmaru

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Yeah, I think I'm wrong on Laser. Those were good responses too. UP and Boom I can see together, because of their interaction Day 1. Sabrar I'm not as confident, since UP was his main push. LaserGuy LaserGuy Is Sabrar usually a busser as scum from the get go?
 

Wiisp

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I am going to work
but I would like Pokechu Pokechu
to give me thoughts on my team and w/e else he can
my read on him depends on consistency
 

ranmaru

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#290 and #469 is the awkward interaction between UP and Boom. UP notices Boom doesn't have any real targets, so UP votes him so he can omgus.
 

ranmaru

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Pokechu views multiple times but rarely has anything to say.
 

Sabrar

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Pokechu views multiple times but rarely has anything to say.
Why are you always concerned by that? I also view the thread a lot of times during work just to see what was posted, but don't have the time to do any research and make big posts.
 

ranmaru

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That is understandable, yet you post actively. I pinged Pokechu last night, and he viewed as well.
 

Jackrito

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well in a world of 2 or 3 its not unlikely we can the same alignment
but I thought about it
also mechanics don't outweigh analytics

I wonder if the wolves seriously thought I was an easy target?
Jackrito Jackrito
they must not know that I don't get mislynched
Well how much exp do you have with people here.
 

Jackrito

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I still agree with Z25 on laser, but I can settle on Boom since he is my other main scum read, but time to reread.
 

ranmaru

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Looking forward to your reread. We can talk reads when you are done, Jack.
 

Jackrito

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Looking forward to your reread. We can talk reads when you are done, Jack.
I doubt it will change much, I'm mainly focusing on the people I don't see as town atm, which would be Laser Boom, Sabar and Pokechu. I feel semi confident everyone else is town for different reasons. UP is the biggest ? in my town side.
 

Pokechu

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I am going to work
but I would like Pokechu Pokechu
to give me thoughts on my team and w/e else he can
my read on him depends on consistency
I've been tagged a couple times so I'll pop in for a sec, I'm working on a couple of assignments so I haven't been able to post. I've been reading the thread so I know the happenings, I can't believe I didn't catch #1515!
this feels like a buddy talking to a buddy
and lets no even talk about the second quote where you talk about Sabrar being town, but put him in your wolf leans anyways
Talk to me about that
but I'm going to try to come in later toDay with more posts. Wasn't expecting to have to replace in tbh so I let myself slack a little

I haven't voted yet because I'm honestly more worried about getting more content out there than having a vote out right now. I'd feel a bit dirty only having ten posts but I'm handing out votes LMAO

If I had a vote out right now it'd probably be on Boom or Jack/Sabrar. Would want to vote Z but not worth the time.
I've asked before and everyone brushed me off. Can you show my one post by UP where he actually tries to do something to help town and not just himself?
This post I found kind of gross because I feel like you could say that about most people in any game. Like unless they're top town carry or doing gambits really all anyone has for them is their commentary. Like that's the game we chose to play, right? Even Boom himself, what does he have that's objectively "helping town?" UP vs. Sabrar is interesting I'd say and I think that lets us see where both minds are at for instance.

Z I feel like his push on me was weird because it wasn't using much evidence from my own slot (not like there's anything to really use yet LOL), even Boom said that while he's not keen on my slot, it's not really fair as I've had no chance to prove myself
UP and Maven/Pokechu are by far my strongest scum reads by PoE. I haven't seen anything from Pokechu to change my mind. That's not quite fair, and I'd like to give him more time to prove himself before seriously considering exing him.
So Z's attention on me feels a little preemptive. He's allowed his thoughts on my slot but I think he was too quick initially. I'd want to vote him after Boom out of pettiness but it'd be better to focus on one of Jack and Sabrar and vote there. Would lean towards voting Jack because I like Sabrar's recent posts (questioning me on how I forgot posts of his that I liked was one of them, that's a good catch)

Wiisp brought up Pythag being the NK and I think Sabrar discussed Pythag's reads but I thought Pythag would've been killed for accuracy.
I know man, I'm sorry. I got a Valorant beta key I've been playing that a lot. Like a lot a lot.

Updated reads currently, though it's a little mushy, because like ran suggested, I'm having trouble.

Town
Ran - pretty obv to me
Z25 - I've chased this rabbit down, and I'm feeling better about the slot.
Boom - I feel pretty good about this slot actually. I like his argumentation, and thoughts
Wiisp - he's funny, I don't totally understand his aversion to being read D1, nor do I understand his abject desire to not even touch Jack on D1

Where things get murkier :
3DS - noob town or scum? idk, there's a lot more
Sab - due to flavor claims I really don't know what to do with this slot.

Up - has gone down due to lack of activity. Ran made a good point of "he's cleared town and now not showing up"
Maven - also not even close to being here.
Jack - I feel like he's been doing exactly what he's been calling me scummy for.
3DS flipped town, I know I'm town, so that leaves the bottom three Sabrar/UP/Jack. What confuses me is why kill Pythag if there's only two scum. Like if Boom is scum, Pythag was townreading him, so even if it's Boom/Jack I feel like there's better candidates for a night kill. Especially considering that Pythag wasn't really hard carrying us or anything LOL killing Pythag makes a lot of sense if the scum team is Sab/Jack but considering Boom's recent posts I think the team has to have him.

Makes me think Wiisp's right and they did it to avoid a doctor but I feel like there were still better candidates... doesn't mean much overall, it's just usually my first step to look at the NK's reads but it's just weird with a Two!Scum and a Scum!Boom world. Makes me believe there's three scum.

In a world of Boom/Sabrar team #1108 simply never happens because Boom would have told me what points to make (and have LaserGuy back me up), instead of waiting on LG and then making a case on me.
And lucky for you this can never be proven unless Boom saved the link to our scum-chat in Crossover.
I'm actually going to believe this though because you stated in Flavorless that you usually don't bus your scummates
I can't show you my games on the previous site but the only time I bus is if actual Cop checked my buddy and even then there have been times where I tried to save them.
Also, I would have never agreed to Pokechu claiming what he did.
I think ranmaru ranmaru asked whether you'd bus in this situation so I'm pinging him here. Or maybe I imagined that post from him. I remember someone asked someone whether they'd bus

Pokechu views multiple times but rarely has anything to say.
Why are you always concerned by that? I also view the thread a lot of times during work just to see what was posted, but don't have the time to do any research and make big posts.
That is understandable, yet you post actively. I pinged Pokechu last night, and he viewed as well.
dammmmmmmnn yall really dont gimme a chance!!!!!!! LOL thank you sabrar, that's exactly what happened! yall really ASKING for me to turn my activity off :joyful:
Looking at Pokechu's spoilers and such. I like the list as a whole, pretty townie imo and lines up with the things that I've been tossing around. However, I'm not impressed in their confidence in me and Wiisp being town based on their evidence presented. Like Wiisp is the strongest town read, but you only quoted two posts? And those posts weren't even that significant imo. Also, the Wiisp read feels like a double standard in comparison to his LG read, when they are separated by a whole tier on the readslist while the rationale was the same, being "nothing in particular pinged me, which is good and bad". Pokechu Pokechu , could you potentially compare and contrast Wiisp and LG in this game in terms of your opinion of their alignment?

Also not a fan of you saying that I've done some "really bad stuff" at the end of your analysis of me, yet I appear to be really high on your reads list? I would've thought that the presence my "bad stuff" would have weighed into your decision making, and I don't think me "doing something similar" in Flavorless makes up for it.

But besides that, the order looks pretty solid, but I already expected Maven to flip town. My read remains at the status quo for this slot.
yeah wiisp's my strongest townread. His recent flurry of posts was super good but before that he was just providing really solid commentary, and I don't think it's really necessary to quote a post and randomly label it townie, if it is just normal commentary. He wasn't at the forefront but definitely was putting out good content.

With Laser it's just flat OUT I couldn't remember anything he's said. Even now I can't so that's why I said I would reread him. Wiisp has a couple good hits, really liking where his head is at, but Laser's content is forgettable imo. Wiisp seems more invested in trying to scumhunt and make heads of things, he's willing to draw attention and heat. But like others mentioned LG hadn't really used what he gained from doing the gambit. Wiisp's posts are likelier to come from a town than Laser's are imo, like I could see scum!Laser pulling off the gambit. But I couldn't see scum!Wiisp getting frustrated about the thread not moving along D1 and saying "if you want me out vote now cause you can't get me out tomorrow" LOL

The "really bad stuff" you did includes disappearing for the latter half of D1 and that one observation I made about your reads list. You explained the latter, the first is still pretty bad imo but I'm not one to talk considering I need to be posting much more lmao
 

ranmaru

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I asked Laser about Sabrar bussing. So Pokechu, what is your updated read of me now that I cleared up your misunderstanding about my slot in your catch up?
 

Z25

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Any reason you don't have any comments about me specifically here?



I'll try.

Sabrar:
-First couple of posts are fairly uninteresting. Even pretending I don't know his meta, I still see his first two posts as in the joke category and don't buy UP's early comments on this. #98 he defends BoomFrog. #102 he gut reads that 3DS more likely Town.
-#227 feels very forced and nitpicky. I hate arguments like this.
-#309 reads feel very reasonable, as are his questions to me in #318/332. Reads on #326/332 are fine. 3DS remarkably strong Town.
-#338 is interesting. Sabrar said he doesn't expect BoomFrog to read him correctly D1.
-Pushes hard on UP leading up to #707 and #708. Especially in D1, I usually see these sort of hyper detailed, borderline nitpicky cases coming from Town, even if I don't necessarily agree with them. I can't say that this is universal because I have seen scum do it as well, but I feel like it comes much more often from Town early in the game.
-Doesn't seem too interested in the 3DS lynch.
-#1120 is curious because here Sabrar says he expects BoomFrog should find him townie on D1 when he's Town, even though he said the opposite in #338 above. This pings me.
-Settles on 3DS over BoomFrog. Doesn't seem to really have a good reason for going for 3DS beyond that he doesn't like the weirdness there, but as far as I can see, his read hasn't changed significantly.
-Argues a lot with BoomFrog, but not with a huge amount of substance.
-D2 more arguing with UP and BoomFrog. Nothing really stands out too strongly.

Overall, I think his push on UP is more likely to be coming from Town. I've seen scum that tunnel D1, but it's somewhat rare. His move to vote 3DS doesn't seem super well motivated as he was reading him pretty strongly as Town and seemed to settle on the slot only when nothing better came up. There's a particular weird inconsistency between #338 and #1120 in how he expects BoomFrog to evaluate him: In #338 he doesn't think BoomFrog can read him in D1; in #1120 he expects that he can. His tone is often aggressive and abrasive, but he does seem to be working hard to evaluate a lot of players and ask questions of things he finds interesting. Kind of a mixed bag in terms of things I like and things I don't.
I thought it was self explanatory as I’ve commented on it here and there but:

I agree with Ran’s points in their last read lists, but the things that bother me most are the emoji gambit( its to similar to Star Wars mafia and concerns me), but Also the boom distancing feels odd like pointed out, or I guess it could be sabrar distancing but the former is likelier as scum could paint scum sabrar as town easier then scum boom as town.
 

Pokechu

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I asked Laser about Sabrar bussing. So Pokechu, what is your updated read of me now that I cleared up your misunderstanding about my slot in your catch up?
I like your slot! I liked it from the start, you obviously are doing a lot for the town. If you are a wolf you deserve to win the game. I'd let you win to be honest because you've earned it. Your #1080 helped but just reading the first post (think it was like #1077 or something) and it not explaining within, that's what bothered me. But while sipping my soda I saw the next. For #1080 which is here
Note that Wisp and Jack were the only players to cast doubt on my slot after swapping from Ninja to Boom. Then Wisp is doing the same in his #955. Trying to cast doubt on Sabrar, who has a good position in town.
I think it's in character for Wisp but a bad look for Jack. Jack's whole post reads like one of those memes, makes it kind of weird

"What if we put our beds next to each other in Minecraft? Hahaha just kidding.... unless?"

"Ranmaru is town, he has a controlling presence and definitely the most proactive.... unless?"

like it just feels like an empty post to me. Like laying out the framework for him going against you. Wiisp's seems more like a genuine reaction and just him getting mad that you weren't staying still LOL didn't he say you were playing hot potato at some point D1?

With regards to your Jack vote my main thing was that you were talking with Sabrar (who was on the Laser wagon) and but didn't have anything to say when Jack hopped on. I found that post from Jack bad so seeing you interact with someone on the wagon but not calling out Jack was weird to me. You aren't obligated to talk about everything of course but it just felt like a scum ignoring their scumbuddy's vote. It's not that serious though since I doubt you're actually scum

You're in the same place as before, third-most town. Like I'm pretty confident you won't flip scum. Only change is probably Boom switching with Sabrar but I really need to reread/ISO since 30 pages all at once was not good
 

Wiisp

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This might be pre-emptive, but I think in light of a few other people's thoughts,

In a world of two I can definitely see just UP/Boom
 

Wiisp

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Ya I am like 99.8% sure the wolves are all in sabrar/boom/UP

My preferred order would be Boom
And then UP, then if we are in a world of 3
We need to take our tome
 

LaserGuy

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In a world of Boom/Sabrar team #1108 simply never happens because Boom would have told me what points to make (and have LaserGuy back me up), instead of waiting on LG and then making a case on me.
And lucky for you this can never be proven unless Boom saved the link to our scum-chat in Crossover.
I found the scumchat for Unlikely Supervillains where you were buddies with Boom. It doesn't feel to me like you guys go out of your way to coordinate.

Yeah, I think I'm wrong on Laser. Those were good responses too. UP and Boom I can see together, because of their interaction Day 1. Sabrar I'm not as confident, since UP was his main push. LaserGuy LaserGuy Is Sabrar usually a busser as scum from the get go?
Not really. From the game above (post 99):
Sabrar in Unlikely Superheroes said:
I don't like to bus. Most of the time it is a bad idea, as you just make your team weaker. Especially in this case where we lose 50% of our kill-power, plus BoomFrog's passive ability might have been useful in order to create confusion and conflicting claims/results, while mine is just bad for us in every scenario imaginable.
Given another day I possibly could have influenced people to lynch SJ instead. This rule of 48 hours to mod-prod and then another 48 hours to make a post is just unreasonable, if a game-day lasts only a week then technically you can get by with a single post somewhere in the middle, without any repercussion.
This is a game where the main tool to judge others is by their posts (especially on D1) and lurking simply deprives everyone of that possibility. It goes against the spirit of the game and defeats the purpose.
 

ranmaru

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Scum is Boom / UP / Pokechu. You are welcome Wisp.
 

Wiisp

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Hmm ok well we have a lot of time to evaluate Pikachu anyways

Can't you specifically tell me what makes you feel that way?
 

ranmaru

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Simply their read order; UP giving Maven a high yellow read without explanation makes sense now.
 

ranmaru

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No, and re-reading I think we should be lynching you.
 

Z25

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This might be pre-emptive, but I think in light of a few other people's thoughts,

In a world of two I can definitely see just UP/Boom
I could honestly see this team. But Up himself is still odd, between those reads yesterday and insomniac is just a skill that could go either way.
Simply their read order; UP giving Maven a high yellow read without explanation makes sense now.
This was my biggest problem yesterday. Listing Maven above so many slots made no sense and I couldn’t see what could logically lead to that conclusion.
 

Z25

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No, and re-reading I think we should be lynching you.
What makes Boom back to being priority and why do you think order matters? Is it because of the info that could be gained from the flip?
 

ranmaru

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I think we should remember that Pythag flipped Ninja, which would usually be a scum role. I think we shouldn't base roles with alignment this game. (or ever) I think looking at the players day play is important too.
 

Sabrar

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Could you touch on this? I'll provide rationale for my readslist if you do :b:
This is from #1493. BF replied immediately but you haven't given your rationale despite having multiple posts after that.
Also, I'm still waiting on your reply to my #1422.
 
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