Not a Tier List: Montage's Character ratings: New Info: Meta, Sonic, Snake, Lucario

[fadam]

Hey guys, I haven't played the game but I've watched a whole lot of videos so I'm going to go ahead and tell the TC that he's a lying jerk Yoshi 4 life.

No seriously. I've played the game and even if I didn't agree with you at first on some things, I've ended up agreeing you after trying it out again.

Keep up the good work son.

 

[dmbrandon]

I'm so confused about what the above poster just said.

yayuhz.

 

[verditude]

Toon Link can 0-death people? How? Is it inescapable once the 1st hit connects?

 

[Gum]

From what I've seen in about a week of solid play, youur rankings aren't the most accurate.

The best 4 seem to be, without a doubt, Zelda, Marth, Olimar and Lucas... even if this turns out not to be the case witht the official teirs, they should certainly ALL be near the top.

As fort he worst... thus far I'm saying sonic, metaknight, yoshi and peach... but that could change. I'm not as set on those...

Also ZSS is superior to Power Suit Samus by everything I've seen... I have no idea why you would rank her higher at all... much less by so much

I definatly would not say ZSS was SUPERIOR to PSS. different as hell, but not superior. I think ZSS is really good, but samus got a huge boost in her adaptability, especially since her forward air isnt useless anymore. And did anyone notice that PSS can still double missile cancel?? This makes her still very awesome. Check out this video from 6:17 to 6:21 and watch samus. she does a perfect double missile cancel with a power missile followed by a homing one. too awesome.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=oGcvQqUFN7U

 

[JhMS]

Captain Falcon is that bad?Geez,I watched a Gympy video and he looked quite decent.
Sucks if thats true...

 

[Luteyi]

I think you're ratings for pit and meta knight are wrong. Aren't they like supposed to be two sides same coin, or w/e?

 

[Smashruler]

I'm glad to see all the positive feedback on Fox. Thanks alot!

 

[KmezzLIGHTNING]

I'd have to argue with the rankings yoshi's been put in, his moves have higher priority than in melee, though his range was a set back a little, without wave dashing, his forward a smash seems to be more useful now, and his recovery had been greatly upgraded. Alot of his previous flaws have been covered.

Also, i'm scared for Olimar, I truly think he's the best in the game, I play him myself, I just don't want to see him turn into fox and have everyone using pikmin.

 

[Tanea]

look

i think that you should take a good look at this then if youn want to kee yoshis' recovery at 3 then you 're being ignorant

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mMgTZpW71E




credit goes to hum dam

 

[dmbrandon]

i think that you should take a good look at this then if youn want to kee yoshis' recovery at 3 then you 're being ignorant

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mMgTZpW71E




credit goes to hum dam

Yoshi get's a Bair, from any of about 30 characters while double jumping, and that's it for that stock.

I don't care how far someone COULD go, I care about if it's worth anything

 

[Endless Nightmares]

No more super armor during second jump?

I took advantage of that SO much in Melee lol

 

[Tanea]

Yoshi get's a Bair, from any of about 30 characters while double jumping, and that's it for that stock.

I don't care how far someone COULD go, I care about if it's worth anything

^ who sait that his super armor is gone?

you are missing the point it is not anoiut how far but is recovery and if you really didn't care then why is it a trait on the character raitings the proof is right there

 

[dmbrandon]

No more super armor during second jump?

I took advantage of that SO much in Melee lol

You can knock him out of it with one GOOD hit. Every character has one GOOD air attack.

 

[MetalGearLink]

well, at last they are more balanced, in melee fox would have been rated 10, and mewtwo 2 XD

 

[mindlesstom]

dm, I'm sorry if I come off as a bit snobbish here. And know that I really really care too much about the Pikachu and Metaknight and that I'm just trying to make a point, but:

The fact that you didn't even mention Metaknight's Fowardsmash as a VERY EASY kill move to land, and the fact that you say Pika's DownB could be spammed like hell leads me to believe that you're really not paying much attention to the diminishing knockback aspect of the game now.

Yes, fowardsmash as Metaknight is a good ender to alot of his combos and is just a good move in general, but it shouldn't be spammed. He really does need that for killing. Replay Metaknight and never use your fowardsmash until around 120% and tell me if it's difficult to kill as him.

And about Pikachu, the tests done on his downB on Mario killed him at 76%(without DI, but still) from the middle of final D. His Uptilt and UpAir combos lead directly into DownB too. But again, shouldn't...be...spammed...ever. My friend's pikachu could kill Pit(average weight) at around 60% after leading him into a Upair > Upair > Down B combo.

Again I'm not trying to sound like a smarta$s, but I think you should replay alot of your characters more throughly and use this 'save your kill moves' aspect more openly.

STEP BY STEP, LET'S BREAK IT ON DOWN.

1. Meta's Fsmash is garb. The hitbox is terrible, and it takes almost a full second to startup. It's a terrible move that , from what I've seen, has little use in competitive play.

2. I was using the spamming of DB as a general observation to those upset it was so nerfed. And you UairUairDB combo is a melee combo. You could kill someone at 25%, given the situation.

3. The only characters I really need to replay, are Bowser, Ness, and Lucario. I've been playing meta and pika a lot, and as of now, those rankings are set.

well, at last they are more balanced, in melee fox would have been rated 10, and mewtwo 2 XD

Depends. Really, Fox has a bunch of ratings in melee. 10 overall, but only 7 against marth. Maybe 11 against link. It's all matchups.

This is diem!

 

[soulz]

According to this guy (http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=143397), you can do some grab combos for IC's, but probably need more confirmation.
Hopefully IC's are better in brawl, maybe people just need to tap into their potential. I mained them in melee (don't have brawl) but hopefully they are just as good, even though different than the melee counterparts.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I swear... I wrote a long critique of everything that I disagreed with about the first page... but the dang hacker hacked while I was doing that and my half hour-hour of work never got posted.... sadness.

Main changes were:
-mario is better in brawl than in melee, and FLUDD recovery is impractical if not useless.
-Zamus is better than Samus... and by more than just a little
-Zelda may be the best... sheik is good, but not that close to zelda
-Metaknight is bad. He's not the worst.... but he's bad... same with sonic but moreso.
-peach isn't near as good as she was in melee... it's a big neg (no double jump. weak turnips, weak dsmash)
-Spasce animals are good, but not top teir material... that space is probably reserved for Olimar, Zelda, Marth and/or Lucas... all are great

 

[Endless Nightmares]

lol @ lack of dsmash making peach worse than melee

Brawl Peach >= Melee Peach

 

[slimpyman]

haha this list is interesting, but is more opinionated. i am going to play with falcon

 

[Red&Silver]

i dont like your character ratings > my favorite characters got low ratings and the ones that i truely hate(toon link for example) got a super high one </3

 

[SeventhSage]

I know this is not a tier list but this is what is posted on the first post of this thread.
If any change happen it would be great to read about it.

10.0

9.5
TOON LINK

9.0
WOLF
DIDDY

8.5
FALCO
MARTH
FOX

8.0
PIT
DEDEDE
SAMUS
OLIMAR
LUCAS
ROBOT

7.5
ZELDA
PIKACHU
SQUIRTLE
IKE
NESS

7.0
SHEIK
IVYSAUR
LUIGI
PEACH

6.5
CHARIZARD
GANONDORF
METAKNIGHT
DONKEY KONG
MR GAME&WATCH

6.0
LUCARIO
MARIO
WARIO
JIGGLYPUFF

5.5
ZERO SAMUS

5.0
LINK
BOWSER
ICE CLIMBERS

4.5
CAPTAIN FALCON

4.0
YOSHI

???
KIRBY
SONIC
SNAKE

 

[Big Burn]

thats really to bad about falcon

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

well... like I said... this thread is only one side of the story and isn't the idea held by a lot of us who've played it...

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

So what's the verdict on Ganon's Side B? Techable or not?

 

[Magus420]

Unless there's like some ultra tiny window to do it then it's not techable. I've specifically tested it myself along with 2 others many times when I was at his place before.

 

[MetalMetaKnight]

Metaknight:
Man, he looks cool. Keyword: looks. He's fast, and his combos are nuts, but he lacks the ability to KO. Only his Dsmash, Glide attack, and UB seem to get it done, and they're hard to land. One of the best teammates, hands down. His B moves all send him into falling state, which harms him greatly. Plays like 64 jiggz a bit, but without the rest.
Edit 1: UB cancels into glide which cancels into glide attack which cancels into ftilt which cancels into fair which can lead to UB. See where I'm going with this? +1.0
Power: 6
Combo ability: 9
Speed: 7
Knockback: 3
Weight: 3
Recovery: 7
Rating: 6.5/10 <-------WTF!?!?!?!?!

Ima prove the rating is wrong once i get Brawl, mark my words:smiliegor

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

Unless there's like some ultra tiny window to do it then it's not techable. I've specifically tested it myself along with 2 others many times when I was at his place before.

This is very good to know. I would hate for this move to be flawed like Mewtwo's confusion was.

Did you try it in slow-mo in training mode?

 

[Magus420]

Nah we didn't. Going off the regular 1/3 sec teching window, I tried while still being held, in the air between release and landing, and just as I landed. I'm fairly positive you can't do anything about it through normal teching means.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Metaknight:
Man, he looks cool. Keyword: looks. He's fast, and his combos are nuts, but he lacks the ability to KO. Only his Dsmash, Glide attack, and UB seem to get it done, and they're hard to land. One of the best teammates, hands down. His B moves all send him into falling state, which harms him greatly. Plays like 64 jiggz a bit, but without the rest.
Edit 1: UB cancels into glide which cancels into glide attack which cancels into ftilt which cancels into fair which can lead to UB. See where I'm going with this? +1.0
Power: 6
Combo ability: 9
Speed: 7
Knockback: 3
Weight: 3
Recovery: 7
Rating: 6.5/10 <-------WTF!?!?!?!?!

Ima prove the rating is wrong once i get Brawl, mark my words:smiliegor

you're absolutely right... he doesn't deserve a six point five.... he's worse... sadly... he just can't kill easily... he's incredibly lightweight, and he has neither projectile, nor antiprojectile moves

 

[fadam]

Guy with the Tails avatar:

I honestly don't see how you could possibly think Zelda is the best in the game. Sure, she's a lot better, but she still has several glaring weaknesses. Her recovery stinks, and against anyone smaller than Mario, she's going to have a hard time hitting with anything packing a major punch.

I also don't see how Olimar/Lucas outclass any of the space animals.

I have the game too, and like I said before, dmBrandon is pretty much spot on for most of his analysis.

 

[Mama]

you're absolutely right... he doesn't deserve a six point five.... he's worse... sadly... he just can't kill easily... he's incredibly lightweight, and he has neither projectile, nor antiprojectile moves

Well Metaknights lack of kill ability may be something that can be considered terrible for now. But how good does your killing move have to be if you can just follow someone off the edge and gimp their attempts to recover? If you only use his jumps for recovery then you don't deserve to rate anyone. If you use them to kill people rather than edgeguard Melee style then you're on the right track.

Its too early for tier lists. Take this one with a very large grain of salt.

 

[Chexr]

Shove this in your "Im not playing Kirby" attitude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oA8J6II5Cxc

Also you know that a tier list is the exact same as character ratings right?

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

That was an awesome Kirby...and he was only using half his moveset, lol.

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

That was an awesome Kirby...and he was only using half his moveset, lol.

 

[homie_rot]

Shove this in your "Im not playing Kirby" attitude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oA8J6II5Cxc

Also you know that a tier list is the exact same as character ratings right?

I always thought Kirby would be low tier, but that video changed my mind completely. I would even put him in high tier. Great job!

 

[LaughterIsDeadly]

Edit 1: No combos! Slow, and the approach is just AWFUL! Viable for worst, right now. -1.0

but still 5/10 lol


btw, that kirby wasn't bad, but that crew he fought was terrible...

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

Some nice things to know:

Wolf's f-tilt can reflect projectiles.

Ganon's side B attack can be combod from with a jab, meaning this attack can do around 16% if it hits, guaranteed.

Lucas and Ness have a much easier time reflecting projectiles with their F-smash than Ness did in Melee.

Every hit of Fox's laser helps recharge his stale moves.

I can see why Ganon is getting a 6.5, but I still think Lucario should be 7.

Also, just rate Kirby an 8 or 8.5, he really is that good.

 

[Losnar]

but still 5/10 lol


btw, that kirby wasn't bad, but that crew he fought was terrible...

Yes, that crew was horrible. Don't know what that luigi fighter was doing, it almost looked like a lvl 3 Computer player.

 

[Staco]

one misstake
you gave metaknight one more point, but you didnt make him 7.5 points

oh, and look the kirby player
if you play metaknight this way, too, he will get more points, too
look, kirby used no standard killing move, he uses edgeguarding
you have to play MK this way udn he will be very good

 

[Mama]

one misstake
you gave metaknight one more point, but you didnt make him 7.5 points

oh, and look the kirby player
if you play metaknight this way, too, he will get more points, too
look, kirby used no standard killing move, he uses edgeguarding
you have to play MK this way udn he will be very good

Thats exactly my point hehe. I don't even plan on playing MK or Kirby (though I'm sort of interested in Kirby) but aggressive edge guarding is the way to go. Follow them off and use moves to prevent their recovery. Don't just sit there and F-smash hoping they wont come back. Don't try to hang onto the edge if they can just go over you. Jump off and hit them.