No items, no Zero-Suit Samus?

[Stuhddabahkz]

Okay, okay. My second thread. So we know enough about the Smash Ball. And we know Samus sheds her armor under certain conditions. In the E3 trailer, Samus did what a lot think is her Final Smash, and after she did it her armor crumbled. If this is all true, then the people who don’t like items might not get to play as ZS Samus.

We still don’t know if that even really was her Final Smash or just something to spice up the trailer, if ZS Samus is a result of a Final Smash, and if the Smash Ball is even a item. Basically, I’m asking should there be some way to start off as ZS Samus? Y’know, similar to starting off as Sheik (Hold A while the stage is loading). And if they do that, should ZS Samus be given her own separate Final Smash? Final Smashes can only be performed once, a player who starts off as ZS Samus shouldn’t be stripped of their Final Smash? Or should that be a consequence, no regular Samus, no Final Smash?

And no, if a person starts as regular Samus and uses their Final Smash, they won’t be able to use it again as ZS Samus. It won’t matter either if Smash Balls come once a fight. But if they happen once a character, then Samus only has one.

Still don’t know if:
- That was Samus’ Final Smash in E3 Trailer
- ZS Samus is a result of Final Smash
- Smash Ball is an item

Just a thought.

 

[Sariku]

I don't hink thats her Final Smash in the Trailor, but I'm also sure Sakuari knows about this.

But you did bring up a good point.

 

[MG-Z]

If a tournament really wants the Final Smash attacks in, they can just turn off all items except for the Smash Ball.

 

[Stuhddabahkz]

If a tournament really wants the Final Smash attacks in, they can just turn off all items except for the Smash Ball.

Uh...hunh? This has nothin' to do with tournaments.

 

[MG-Z]

Wow gj me posting in the wrong thread.

 

[Epok]

me personally i think that she is gonn be like zelda/shiek in the way you have the option of sheding the armor except in this case you might not be able untill you die and respawn. but i dont think that sakurai would make it that hard to get to play zero suit in the game. besides she got more gameplay footage than regular samus. but we'll see

 

[soaz]

i dobt think that you need to use the special attack to use zs i meen who would have recognized her if they wouldnt show the armor first.

 

[The Bino]

OK well look at everyone that does their Final Smash attack, they all glow before they attack, now Samus herself didn't glow before she attack Pit and MetaKnight, so i highly doubt that was to be known as her Final Smash... they can make it that

But to answer Soaz, Metroid Fans would've known it was her if they had just showed her enter and start fighting

And to answer Epok - they showed Zamus to have more gameplay footage than Samus cuz she was a NEWCOMER, yea they showed Mario Link Kirby and Pikachu, but their main focus was that of the NEWCOMERS, and they did that

 

[Bowserlick]

I do not think Sakurai would attach a character to an item. All that development and design time would nearly go to waste if a character was only playable if "items are in the game AND the super ball appears AND samus is a character on the stage at that time AND samus happens to get the ball."

Zamus, I am sure, will be a selectable character. Sakurai says she is not a pure character addition because she is another form of the same character. I bet to get Zamus you have to beat Classic mode with Samus (or Adventures) and then fire a charged shot or a final smash a set amount of times. Only then will the armor fall off (that one time) and unlock the character.

 

[Sariku]

Maybe a time thing... Now that I think of it, they said after a certain amount of time, Wario can use his Wario Waft. Maybe after a certain amount of time, you can change into Zamus, but after that, you can't change back.

 

[Xsyven]

Samus and ZSS are completely different characters-- like Link and Young link.

They've already said this in Nintendo Power.

 

[Lemon Drop]

What if in order to activate Samus you do what they did with Zelda/Shiek, where as soon as the battle starts, you transform into the other? (I don't remember how to do it, been so long as I played as her)

 

[GreenMamba]

Samus and ZSS are completely different characters-- like Link and Young link.

They've already said this in Nintendo Power.

Except they didn't, they just regurgitated the same information that was said on the old website (that she sheds her suit under certain conditions). Not to mention the staff of Nintendo Power doesn't know any more about this game than we do.

 

[drewdizzal]

I do not think Sakurai would attach a character to an item. All that development and design time would nearly go to waste if a character was only playable if "items are in the game AND the super ball appears AND samus is a character on the stage at that time AND samus happens to get the ball."

****, thats alot of conditions to meet just to play Zamus. Yea, Im pretty sure you don't have to get the final smash ball just to get Zamus. I like your idea of how you only have to meet the condition to get Zamus once, then she becomes a selectable character.

 

[Xsyven]

If ZSS And Samus were the same character, they wouldn't call ZSS, ZSS. They'd call her Samus. Simple logic.

 

[Red Exodus]

This forces them to do one of two things, make ZSS a normal selectable character or make her a transformation a la Shiek and Zelda.

 

[Takalth]

Bowserlick's post makes the most sense. From an intelligent game design perspective, Sakurai would just be shooting himself if he made her that hard to get.

 

[Stuhddabahkz]

I do not think Sakurai would attach a character to an item. All that development and design time would nearly go to waste if a character was only playable if "items are in the game AND the super ball appears AND samus is a character on the stage at that time AND samus happens to get the ball."

That's why I said have there be a way to start as ZS Samus, like with Sheik, so the Smash Ball wouldn't be necessary to play as her.

I'm willin' to bet ZS Samus won't be a selectable character.

 

[Takalth]

I guess that would work, too. The only problem left would be that if you want to stay as armored Samus, you wouldn't get to use your super attack.

 

[Stuhddabahkz]

I guess that would work, too. The only problem left would be that if you want to stay as armored Samus, you wouldn't get to use your super attack.

Oh yeah, never thought of people wantin' to stay as normal Samus. Well then, I guess you couldn't use your Final Smash. Or...there be a way to stay in your armor afterwards, but it'd have some nasty side effect, or just a super-duper lag. Like, after you do your Final Smash, L-cancel and your armor stays on, but you're open to attack for a few seconds. Meh, I'unno. All this does is complicate gameplay, which is a no-no for Smash.

Just ideas, I...have no say-so, so shut the f--- up and stop complainin'. >_> j/k

 

[The Bino]

If ZSS And Samus were the same character, they wouldn't call ZSS, ZSS. They'd call her Samus. Simple logic.

OK so ur to tell me that the reason why Sheik and Zelda have different names is because they aren't the same character, that's not a smart logic then, being how they are the same character

Please please please play and beat Metroid Zero Mission you will learn a lot from that game on Zamus, being the fact that they call her in Brawl Zer Suit Samus is because its the suit she was wearing in Zero Mission hence Zero Suit Samus, makes perfect sense to me...

Spoiler

and in the game she takes off her armor to fly the ship cuz she thinks the mission is over when in fact it really was, but Space Pirates shot her ship down and she wasn't wearing her armor and had to evacuate her ship since it was falling to the ground... then you continued the game to find your Armor and then that's it game over basically

 

[9Kplus1]

I really think that Samus' Final Smash wasn't that, why? Because that wasn't part of the real gameplay I think that ZSS will be unlocked by doing something in adventure mode, if there is one.

 

[Bowserlick]

Samus's special move might very be one of her other projectile attacks. Ice missle, plasma (whatever she uses, I don't remember). She has so many moves that making her final smash a BIGGER chargable ball is a little unnecessary.

I think the movie where her suit crumbles off was merely a way to introduce her. Rather then her just walking out with her whip (some people wouldn't recognize her).

I am sure that Zamus is a fixed replacement for Sheik (quick, combo fighting style), but I do not think she is a replacement for the morph technique. (I do not think that morphing will come back, since it forces two separate characters to combine on one selection screen. Turned out to be an unfavorable idea, but maybe because it was done wrong. The only way I see morphing coming back is through a tag team mechanic like Diddy and Dixie)

 

[Paranoid_Android]

If ZSS And Samus were the same character, they wouldn't call ZSS, ZSS. They'd call her Samus. Simple logic.

Yeah, like how they call Zelda and Shiek the same thing since they're the same person...

... Oh... Wait...

 

[mooseproduce]

You do know that the trailer wasn't necessarily gameplay footage? And by "wasn't necessarily" I mean "that shot of Samus was pre-rendered and had nothing to do with actual gameplay"?

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

Idea: The final Smash is simply how you unlock ZSSamus.

Once she's been unlocked, she's a separate character.

 

[The Bino]

You do know that the trailer wasn't necessarily gameplay footage? And by "wasn't necessarily" I mean "that shot of Samus was pre-rendered and had nothing to do with actual gameplay"?

Yea the 1st trailer wasn't gameplay, but the 2nd trailer was gameplay

 

[Conker1]

WELL, remember how in SSBM, you could start as Shiek by holding down+b before the match started? If they do use the Super Smash to do the transformation then you could get around it like that.

 

[The Bino]

Actually to play as Sheik in the beginning of a match you just hold down A

 

[Walgreens Pharmacist]

i think your taking that part of the trailer a little too seriously.....
i'm sure you won't need the final smash to use Z-Samus

 

[Walgreens Pharmacist]

plz delete double posted xD

 

[Stryks]

She wont be a separate character, why do u think sakurai mentioned "... Samus will transform into zamus UNDER SPECIAL CONDITIONS..." I doubt that special condition is selecting her in the select screen >.>

 

[Walgreens Pharmacist]

She wont be a separate character, why do u think sakurai mentioned "... Samus will transform into zamus UNDER SPECIAL CONDITIONS..." I doubt that special condition is selecting her in the select screen >.>

that would eliminate an entire character from tournament play...
they obviously wouldn't do that, unless she's THAT unbalanced

 

[Stryks]

No im guessin the only way u can use zamus is by using samus, u choose samus, battle, and then SOMEHOW (the special condition) samus loses the suit and transforms into zamus, believe me I doubt special condition means puting the P1 disc thingy over zamus icon...

 

[Keto]

If she's a transformation like Sheik then maybe if you have the Smash Ball activated you can only use ZSS by using the Final Smash, but if you have the Smash Ball deactivated then you can transform from Samus at will.

 

[Neiteio]

Samus can now hold B to charge up her beam twice as much as before, for the "super blast" seen in the first trailer. It's much like how if Roy charged up his sword long enough, he could unleash a one-hit KO. Same here with the "super beam;" if Samus can charge it long enough and hit her target, it'll be an instant knockout.

And then, at that point, the armor sheds and Zero Suit Samus emerges. These are the special conditions.

Juuust a hunch.

- Neiteio

 

[Bowserlick]

A special condition to take off her suit, could very well just mean a special way of unlocking Zamus, a secret character. Remember translations from Sakurai are going to sound a little weird in English.

But even though I think Zamus will be a selectable character, I like Neiteio's idea the most (out of the transforming options).

 

[Paranoid_Android]

She wont be a separate character, why do u think sakurai mentioned "... Samus will transform into zamus UNDER SPECIAL CONDITIONS..." I doubt that special condition is selecting her in the select screen >.>

He could have been referring to the games from which he took ZS Samus. To elaborate, he might have meant, "In the Metroid games, under special conditions, Samus would shed her suit and turn into 'Zero Suit Samus'." My point is: the game he's referring to is vague, and now it no longer exists for us to quote in full context, so we might as well wait for more information rather than debating the meaning of a couple lines.

 

[mooseproduce]

The bottom line is that special conditions suck. If an entire character is to be added into a game, then add the character and be done with it. If the designers try any bullcrap like "feed $5 to Nintendo in realtime through VISA to turn into Zsuit Samus" or something, I'm going to punch... something. At random. Maybe a traffic cone or a small bush, you never know.

I even hate unlocking characters. Like... getting Ness in the original Smash? Who wants to play single-player mode getting points when you could be playing VS mode as Ness taking names and kicking ***?

 

[MarsBitrona]

The move we saw Samus do in the trailer could easily be her new neutral-B charge shot. Maybe you can fully charge a shot to a certain point to do an SSBM style shot, or you can charge it up to another level where it shoots a larger beam and turns you into Zero Suit Samus. You can't just assume every big move you see is a Final Smash, especially in the first trailer, which was clearly not gameplay footage.

The bottom line is that special conditions suck. If an entire character is to be added into a game, then add the character and be done with it. If the designers try any bullcrap like "feed $5 to Nintendo in realtime through VISA to turn into Zsuit Samus" or something, I'm going to punch... something. At random. Maybe a traffic cone or a small bush, you never know.

Are you even vaguely familiar with any of Nintendo's policies or ideals? After they lost money last generation because they insisted on not doing online play until it was easy and free, I doubt they're going to squeezing money out of players for stuff that's already in the game.

You can't just go on about how much you hate "special conditions" when you have absolutely no idea what they are. I'm quite certain it will be something easy and natural that will perfectly match the flow of the game. If you need proof, just look at SSBM. They added a ridiculous amount of new character ideas, like Ice Climbers and Zelda/Sheik, and they were all flawlessly integrated. Why should Brawl, being made by the exact same team, be at all different?